Interview with Canon Executives at CP+

[Random Orbits]

I think that CANON doesn't have the required CPU and CMOS to handle heat properly in consumer level. What do I mean by that? I think that consumers have to get an idiot-proof camera, where everything happens. We all know that heat is a major problem for Canon at the moment. Even from the manual of 5D4 it is obvious.

totally agree with that.

for the XC10, canon had to include fans and a vented case.

that would simply not be practical for a DSLR.

@Diko, not just Canon.

They could have taken Sony's a7 approach and just let the camera overheat and shut down... Or the Nikon D5 approach and limited 4K recording time to 3 min clips.

except that's bad engineering, electronics MTBF decreases by half every 10C of ambient temperature.

Well, I guess it's good that Sony comes out with replacement models every 1-2 years : ;D

 

[AvTvM]

in real life not much of an issue. Friends of mine have A7 1st series since they came out, no probs. Still work and capture pictures. Anecdotal of course. But first hand.

heat is no issue as long as you don't capture looooong booooring videos with stills cameras.

 

[privatebydesign]

why bigot? I am used to you delusional S___. but now bigot too ... righteous Neuro? ;D

Calling people from Japan "-aps" is the very definition of bigot.

 

[neuroanatomist]

why bigot? I am used to you delusional S___. but now bigot too ... righteous Neuro? ;D

bigot \ˈbi-gət\ noun
A person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

It may more technically correct, based on your earlier post in this thread, to state that you are a:

racist ˈrāsəst/ noun
A person who shows or feels discrimination or prejudice against people of other races, or who believes that a particular race is superior to another.

But since racism and bigotry go hand-in-hand, either term is likely applicable...and either way, those behaviors and attitudes make you an utterly reprehensible, deplorable, pathetic excuse for a human being.

 

[dak723]

why bigot? I am used to you delusional S___. but now bigot too ... righteous Neuro? ;D

Calling people from Japan "-aps" is the very definition of bigot.

Not to mention the insinuation that a person who is 81 can not be innovative or is unable to be an effective CEO.

 

[dak723]

Whether you agree Canon have put enough effort into designing the video (or certain other functions) is a different issue - my point is that they will not install what is for them a half-baked functionality merely to satisfy the specification-hungry technofreaks.

I agree completely. And Canon should be commended for this rather than ridiculed and destroyed by the critics who love specs. When Sony came out with a high MP A7R, most reviewers commented on how you needed a tripod for the higher MP count to be noticeable. Without a tripod, you essentially were getting the detail and resolution of a 24 MP camera. Canon, on the other hand, didn't come out with their high MP models until they were able to incorporate a firmer tripod mount and various other anti-shake improvements. So, according to the spec lovers and Canon bashers, they were way behind Sony. But for photographers who actually wanted USABLE higher MPs, waiting for a company to get it right rather than just pushing out a less than ideal spec was probably quite worth the wait. I'm sure the same thing is happening with 4K. Plus, just because one company has a feature, that doesn't mean every other company can institute it equally. There are patents. Sometimes a company can not make something work because they need to come up with another technology or solution.

I've said it before and I'll say it again having owned Canon, Olympus and Sony cameras. I'd rather have a camera that is tried and true and reliable rather than one that is all about innovations that may not be ready yet.

 

[AvTvM]

why bigot? I am used to you delusional S___. but now bigot too ... righteous Neuro? ;D

Calling people from Japan "-aps" is the very definition of bigot.

Not to mention the insinuation that a person who is 81 can not be innovative or is unable to be an effective CEO.

yes. I do hold that belief. strongly.

 

[IglooEater]

yes. I do hold that belief. strongly.

LOL

Btw, To work one's way out of a hole, it's commonly considered a good idea to start by stopping digging.

 

[IglooEater]

When Sony came out with a high MP A7R, most reviewers commented on how you needed a tripod for the higher MP count to be noticeable. Without a tripod, you essentially were getting the detail and resolution of a 24 MP camera. Canon, on the other hand, didn't come out with their high MP models until they were able to incorporate a firmer tripod mount and various other anti-shake improvements.

I agree with where your conclusion, just not your argument ...
Putting the Sony on a tripod works just as well as for the Canon. A loss of resolution would be seen in the Canon just as much as the Sony given similar hand-held conditions. Arguably, the main reason the 5Ds even needed a reinforced mount was the mirrorshock, so Sony is not to be criticized for not incorporating a feature that would not have been helpful for their device.

However I do agree that Canon has a nack for making an entire device that is incredibly well thought through in which all the features come together seamlessly.

 

[goldenhusky]

"We obviously have to look at the technical feasibility of it, cost-wise, as well as [the challenge of power consumption]. Those factors will tell us how we will introduce 4K technologies going forward.

That is the most ignorant answer anyone can expect from an executive of top photography equipment designer and manufaccturer in the world and the first company to implement 4k video shooting in a DSLR form (1DC) and especailly after 4 of their competitors (I know, I know, per canon and some people here there is no competition for the "Industry leader") offering 4K video capability in low cost consumer model cameras for a few years now.
He was talking about introducing 4K into every model. Not sure why his comment was 'ignorant' - or wsa it that it did not given the information you would like to have heard?


"We obviously have to look at the technical feasibility of it"
What technical feasibility they are talking about? Like I said before Canon was the first company to record proper 4K (4096*2160) video in a DSLR (1DC) body almost 5 years ago without any heating issues. They did nothing in next 5 long years after that to try to bring the 4K recording to other consumer cameras. There are 3 other manufacturers (obviously I am excluding the coffee warmers here) that I am aware of are recording 4k in their cameras without any issues for a few years now. Look at the GH5 it records 4k@60fps and they even removed the recording time limit on it. Where are Canon's innovations? Given the above facts above saying "we obviously have to look at the technical feasibility" is being ignorant. Having it in one of their own products clearly says it is technically feasible

"the challenge of power consumption"

increase the battery size dumb asses and give us a kick ass camera. Some people will complain about the size and weight once they start using it all those complaints will vanish without a trace
So we hane you saying 'put in a bigger battery and AvTvM saying cameras have to be smaller or the company will go bust. I'llleave you two to swing your handbags... Meanwhile in the real world do you not think Canon have already thought of that problem


Didn't I address that also? "Some people will complain about the size and weight once they start using it all those complaints will vanish without a trace"

"We will continue to challenge and overcome these technical hurdles"

I wonder what the hell is that technical hurdle they are talking about in 2017
Try and find an interview that asks those questions instead of merely berating the extec.

"4K should compliment, rather than hinder"

Now it is up to this lunatics to figure out the 4K implementation in 1dxii and 5D4 is the hindrance or compliment
He made a statement of fact but your comment is coming across as a criticism - so what exactly are you criticising?

"4K should complement, rather than hinder" is like saying "Sun rises in the east" yes that is a statement of fact and the whole world knows that. That is not expected from a top executive of a Company when talking about their product line and feature set.

When asked about why no 4K HDMI out on the 5D4 canon's response was their design engineers did not had access to the HDMI 2.0 hardware when they designed the camera. It is as ignorant as the answers we have got now.
Why is that an 'ignorant answer'? He gave an honest qanswer so please tell me why it is ignorant

HDMI 2.0 was defined in 2013 and most electronics companies (Yamaha, Marantz, Samsung, LG, Sony, Panasonic and many more) already implemented the technology in their various product lines. If 5D4 had the HDMI 2.0 and 4K out some semi-pro videographers at least can use an external recording device and make use of it. Even for a enthusiast like me it makes a lot of sense to buy something like "Video Devices PIX-E5" instead of buying into another system like Sony just for video. My investment in to Sony is already more than $2.5k. So Even canon releases a 2k - 2.5k camera with proper 4K recording and 120fps@1080p I would buy that immediately and sell my entire Sony gear.


"4K should complement, rather than hinder" is like saying "Sun rises in the east" yes that is a statement of fact and the whole world knows that. That is not expected from a top executive of a Company when talking about their product line and feature set.

So I guess there are not enough 4K displays is a lame argument at this point.
You guess it is bad business to pile manufacturing costs into a functionality that only a small minority of people have the capability of using, not evn cosidering that the number who even care is even less.
Wow....just, wow...!

Let it be small minority (while I do not believe so) but there is a user base for that feature and there are people jumping ship because canon wouldn't give them the features they wanted it.

 

[goldenhusky]

OLED TV is great I own LG 65EF9500 and love it. I agree with you at least to my eyes there is not much difference between high end Samsung's SUHD range (I own 55JS8500 as well. 2015 line I believe) and LG OLED. I am sure there is difference, I am talking about the part how much my eyes can differentiate. If at all you are going the LG route a word of caution, is their quality control is worst than Sony. There were some banding issues in so many TVs of the same model I got. People complained about it a lot on few AV forums. So if possible buy it locally or from a reputable dealer just in case if there are any issues you can return it without losing lot of money.

There are about 7,000,000,000 (That's 7 b, b, b, BILLION) people on the Earth. 48 million 4k televisions sold globally last year isn't significant.

If the cable company isn't broadcasting 4K, it doesn't matter anyway.

True, but when I go into Costco, more and more of the low priced TV sets are 4k, down into the under $500 level now. They may not be wonderful, but they claim 4K.

I've been looking at the LG OLED sets, they start at about $2,000 in our local stores. The reviews rate them highly, but I likely could not tell you which was which if you put $2,000 sets from Samsung and LG in front of me.

 

[goldenhusky]

I use to have that impression until I saw Dual Pixel RAW was advertised as a feature in 5D4. Most of us know how that turned out ;D

One thing that Canon seem to favour is deciding on behalf of the client what quality the client will accept. The first example I cam across was putting a Kenko 1.4 extender on my 70-300 f5.6 and finding that AF was hesitant at best and hunted interminably at worst. Canon took the view that the AF is either reliable or it is not so their tcs have software that blocks AF if it detects and effective f8 or greater - whether you prefer to have the option is irrelevant to Canon, Canon decided it wasn't good enough to be reliable so they blocked it.
That seems to a consistent factor in their design in that they would rather not incorporate a function than put it in and risk getting get poor comments. Sometimes they may well take this approach too far and I suspect that (and I say 'suspect' because I don't shoot video so a relying on internet hearsay) be 4K and overheating in the Sony and my guess is Canon would rather limit the film time or install a more basic video functionality than put one out that is unreliable.
Whether you agree Canon have put enough effort into designing the video (or certain other functions) is a different issue - my point is that they will not install what is for them a half-baked functionality merely to satisfy the specification-hungry technofreaks.

 

[neuroanatomist]

Not to mention the insinuation that a person who is 81 can not be innovative or is unable to be an effective CEO.

Someone should tell 86 year old Warren Buffett that he's an ineffective CEO. :

 

[Ozarker]

yes. I do hold that belief. strongly.

LOL

Btw, To work one's way out of a hole, it's commonly considered a good idea to start by stopping digging.

He doesn't know how to stop digging. He just goes deeper, and deeper still. Darkness is his happy place. Same with all bigoted, racist, trolls. AvTvM has no concept of remorse. His high public opinion of himself masks his self loathing.

If Plato's "Allegory of the Cave" ... well, let's just say AvTvM is chained up in it.

 

[douglaurent]

"it is important to keep in mind that we don’t want to harm the original inherent concept of these products. 4K should compliment, rather than hinder."

I am so glad Canon is taking care of us. All those cameras except the 5D4 and 1DX2 would be completely unusable and way to confusing, if one video menu tab would give a 4k option alongside the 1080p option.

 

[rrcphoto]

"it is important to keep in mind that we don’t want to harm the original inherent concept of these products. 4K should compliment, rather than hinder."

I am so glad Canon is taking care of us. All those cameras except the 5D4 and 1DX2 would be completely unusable and way to confusing, if one video menu tab would give a 4k option alongside the 1080p option.

here ya go.

 

[Mikehit]

I use to have that impression until I saw Dual Pixel RAW was advertised as a feature in 5D4. Most of us know how that turned out ;D

As I understand it, dual pixel was a focusing mechanism first and foremost. They then realised they could use the technology to tweak focusing in post-processing in the same manner as Lytro. To be fair, this is not really a camera functionality (which merely records the data) as a software capability (which uses the data).
At the time I thought Canon underplayed it and IMO it was the techno-nerds who got overly excited and their hullabaloo was never going to be realised in practice.

 

[AvTvM]

yes. I do hold that belief. strongly.

LOL

Btw, To work one's way out of a hole, it's commonly considered a good idea to start by stopping digging.

i dont give a shit.

 

[ExodistPhotography]

....... But playing the video is the simplest part. A 4K video workflow is still not cheap - besides the monitor people should check the storage required for high-quality video files, and the processing power required to edit them. Then there's the issue to stream them if not stored locally.

Forget streaming. I am going to go out on a limb here and say 99% of the 4k content that would be broadcast would almost never come from a DSLR anyway.. Most of the content recorded on DSLR in 4k would come from indie cinematographers, wedding, event, corporate or youtube-type video creators. Which would be put on DVD for sharing or uploaded to streaming solution like Youtube or Vimeo. I just do not see the next season of Vikings or the next Avengers movie being filmed on a 5D or even a 1D anyway.. But even that said, you can always down sample a video on the fly for streaming. You can never correctly up sample and hold the proper resolution..

Now as far as hardware. Almost any machine built in the past 5 years can render 4k video. It does not take a hugely priced machine to edit it unless your trying to use the most horrid free or cheap software you can find. Even my 2012 i7 Mac Mini with 8GB RAM and only the iGPU HD4000 can render it in Final Cut without driving you mad. Even Premier Pro is on a entry level media PC can do 4k.. All machines under $1000 dollars.. Also storage is cheap these days and plentiful.

IMHO anyway.. - Joe

 

[Orangutan]

yes. I do hold that belief. strongly.

LOL

Btw, To work one's way out of a hole, it's commonly considered a good idea to start by stopping digging.

i dont give a S___.

You should care -- you've lost any credibility you had left.