Let’s talk Canon EOS R1, the flagship of flagships?

[AlanF]

Would anyone mind explaining Global Shutter and QPAF to a noobie? Also perhaps how those features would be beneficial to a bird photographer? Thank you in advance

When I don't know something, I Google it. So, I did it for you. Here's the explanation of the first: https://www.e-consystems.com/blog/c...-to-choose-the-one-that-fits-the-application/
And this for the second: https://www.dpreview.com/articles/4...at-they-are-how-they-work-and-how-they-differ You should get from the first why they could be useful.

 

[Loswr]

Would anyone mind explaining Global Shutter and QPAF to a noobie? Also perhaps how those features would be beneficial to a bird photographer? Thank you in advance

Current sensors are read in lines as opposed to all at once. With a mechanical shutter, that started and ended the exposure. With electronic shutter that allows today’s high frame rates useful for flying birds, it’s the the sensor itself taking the place of the mechanical shutter. That means regular shapes like lines and circles in fast-moving subjects can be distorted with an electronic shutter, i.e., balls look oval, golf clubs look bent. Global shutter eliminates those artifacts.

DSLRs use line-type and cross-type AF points, the former are sensitive to only one orientation, the latter to both. So far, Canon mirrorless have only dual pixel AF (DPAF) which is line-type for all pixels. They can’t focus on purely horizontal lines. QPAF will fix that by being cross-type for all pixels (or they’ll use alternating orientations in rows of dual pixels.

 

[unfocused]

I think Canon's designers like to try out new things. The EOS R's multifunction bar is an example, as is the R7's quick control dial placement at the top of the camera back. If they're well-received they will be used on future cameras, and if not they won't.

Reminds me, one of the features that I still think was a good idea was the 7DII Auto Focus Area Selection Lever which allowed for quick changes in the autofocus selection area. Never understood why that was not incorporated into other bodies.

 

[AnthonyHayzen]

Reminds me, one of the features that I still think was a good idea was the 7DII Auto Focus Area Selection Lever which allowed for quick changes in the autofocus selection area. Never understood why that was not incorporated into other bodies.

I have programmed the control ring on the RF lenses to select focus area.

 

[Deepboy]

I have programmed the control ring on the RF lenses to select focus area.

I did the same programming with the M-Fn button, it directly toggles the AF areas, which are already reduced via menu; so I have just three areas on R6, direct 1-button-press change, and two areas on R10, where I have to also rotate a dial, as there's no direct 1-button-switch function for AF area selecion.

(Or, actually there is also on R10, but is so buried in the menus that even the Canon engineers doesn't know about that, just me...problem is that the only button that can be programmed to do that is the worst button available for that purpose. I wrote to Canon "why TF this is working this way; fix it in the next fw update", but I only got a "we'll pass your suggestion to the development team" answer, which means "we don't give a sh*t about your suggestion")

 

[SwissFrank]

Would $7k be better spent on a new-er used big white? Or a kahuna body like this? If I had that kind of money once in my life, which way would I go? I'll have some fun pondering that.

I think your question is just posed as a fun thought experiment, but someone with funds for only one or the other should in fact put in their retirement savings instead. People live a very long time these days and you'll need the money.

Otherwise, of course it's a question of what you find yourself wanting or doing that your current outfit doesn't let you do. If you don't have 100 photos with a 100-500/4.5-7.1 all at the long end that you think would be far more valuable commercially or to yourself if they had far less DOF or a lower ISO, then a 600/4 would fulfill an actual need. If you've never found a problem with a lack of global shutter, then global shutter wouldn't be a selling point.

There's also the question of actual cost of ownership. This equipment doesn't cost the purchase price, it costs the purchase price minus the sale price. If you find yourself needing a 150mm aperture's bokeh, then get a 600/4, but get for instance the EF 600/4 IS MkI, which isn't significantly worse imagery than the newer ones, but can be had for $4000, far less than its new price and even farther less than the RF model. The EF600 isn't going to drop in price at this point, which means after 1, 5, 10 years you'll be able to sell it for what you paid, and I'd even expect it'd go up roughly in line with inflation. It's main shortcoming is weight, but you can shoot a EF MkI basically for free. So try it, and only if you find you just can't shoot it due to the weight should you then consider trading up. So back to your thought experiment: you're debating a big white, which can be had basically free, vs. a brand new piece of consumer electronics, whose value will drop 90% or more in 15 years. So nothing against the R1, but simply due to its novelty and ensured quick obsolescence, it would not be my choice.

 

[SnowMiku]

Would anyone mind explaining Global Shutter and QPAF to a noobie? Also perhaps how those features would be beneficial to a bird photographer? Thank you in advance

If you use the Mechanical shutter or Electronic First Curtain on your still photos then you don't have to worry about Rolling Shutter. If you use the Electronic Shutter option it most likely has the Rolling Shutter effect. Notice how in the bottom of the video the helicopter blades look bent, that's what Rolling Shutter is.

A Global Shutter dosn't have that bending effect, so it would be good for fast birds in flight.

Here is a good example of a Rolling Shutter vs Global Shutter.

 

[unfocused]

I have programmed the control ring on the RF lenses to select focus area.

Of course there are always alternatives. My point is simply that 1) @neuroanatomist is correct that Canon often tweaks their designs to get real world feedback on features and 2) I thought the selection lever on the 7D II was a neat addition and was surprised it never got implemented on other models. For that matter a programable lever would have been quite handy as an additional option.

 

[Loswr]

For that matter a programable lever would have been quite handy as an additional option.

Several cameras have a stills/video lever, I think the 7DII does, as well. Not sure if it’s generally customizable, but it is on the R3 and I use it to toggle silent shooting.

 

[Canon Rumors]

Is PCIe4 support for CFexpress a 'proper' standard or just something card vendors are doing? https://compactflash.org/industry-standards/ only mentions 1.0 and 2.0, both of those specify PCIe3.

The R5 seems to top out at 400Mbyte/s write speed for CFe, so there is still a lot of headroom for the Digic X to get faster without having to resort to PCIe4. A 1600MByte/s write speed is within reach for recent high end CFe cards, which is a lots of fps

I actually don't know, that's a bit above my paygrade. However, I have a meeting with a memory card maker on Monday.... probably not a meeting, more like an educational workshop. I'd like to know all there is to know from the consumer side of things.

 

[scyrene]

I think Canon's designers like to try out new things. The EOS R's multifunction bar is an example, as is the R7's quick control dial placement at the top of the camera back. If they're well-received they will be used on future cameras, and if not they won't.

Agreed; and I guess it's not a problem for the vast majority of users, who only have one body.

 

[Canon Rumors]

Exactly. The Leica M11 only has 64 GB, which is nice. But the Hasselblad x2d has 1 TB. Which is really starting to be something.

I would assume internal storage could be optimized for the camera, dedicated heat sink and the potential for faster write speeds. This may be a bit of dreaming that Canon would put top notch SSD into the body, but I generally see internal SSDs with faster write speeds than external.

I have an M11 and it has turned out to be a pain to use the internal storage. They updated the app recently, now that isn't working for me (multiple phones). plugging in the camera to get the photos off works.... half the time. (Multiple computes.. windows and macos). So I end up just copying to the sd card and using a reader. Now I don't use the internal storage at all. I'm not sure what it is like for the Hasselblad folks.

As for storage size, 64gb is fine in the M11 since it doesn't shoot video. I would have rather had a second sd slot.

I think I'm back on the "internal storage is pointless, and creates issues without really solving anything" train.

 

[EDGERIDER]

The only thing I would love to see and that would really crown the R1 as the « absolute king of the jungle » would be to bring back a true 1/500s flash sync or even better 1/800s or 1/1000s , as it would really change the game in flash usage with fast lens.
A photographer that would have the ability to shoot at 200iso f2.8, 1/500 when others have to shoot ambiant light at 6400 iso , will bring absolutely different pictures… all cameras can shoot 8fps at 6400 iso now…
What I care in a professional camera is the ability to create image that amateur camera just can’t do technically, otherwise just use a iPhone.

 

[Loswr]

The only thing I would love to see and that would really crown the R1 as the « absolute king of the jungle » would be to bring back a true 1/500s flash sync or even better 1/800s or 1/1000s , as it would really change the game in flash usage with fast lens.

HSS? If power loss is an issue, use multiple flashes or a monolight.

On the other side of that, 1/64000 s shutter speed is useful in some situations, where previously multiple flashes at a low power setting were needed.

 

[DBounce]

I have no issues paying $10,000 if the camera is so amazing that it can justify that price tag. For me that means:

Global shutter
15 stops of dynamic range at a SN of 2
40 fps still
14- bit Raw video
Opengate recording
Built in EVND… the body is large enough to support this and is one feature, a tiny Sony Alpha body will not have anytime soon.
A fully articulated flip tilt screen like the new Sony and Panasonic S1H.
Options for full video features, shutter angle, waveform, anamorphic desqueeze with custom aspect ratios etc…

Give it these features and I’ll preorder immediately.

 

[DBounce]

The only thing I would love to see and that would really crown the R1 as the « absolute king of the jungle » would be to bring back a true 1/500s flash sync or even better 1/800s or 1/1000s , as it would really change the game in flash usage with fast lens.
A photographer that would have the ability to shoot at 200iso f2.8, 1/500 when others have to shoot ambiant light at 6400 iso , will bring absolutely different pictures… all cameras can shoot 8fps at 6400 iso now…
What I care in a professional camera is the ability to create image that amateur camera just can’t do technically, otherwise just use a iPhone.

My Leica Q3 has 1/2000 flash sync, as does the Hasselblad bodies. To get these kind of speeds you need to use a leaf shutter. Though I supposed a global shutter could also make such high speed sync possible. Honestly, higher flash sync speed is probably the best argument for global shutter from a Canon perspective.

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

I have an M11 and it has turned out to be a pain to use the internal storage. They updated the app recently, now that isn't working for me (multiple phones). plugging in the camera to get the photos off works.... half the time. (Multiple computes.. windows and macos). So I end up just copying to the sd card and using a reader. Now I don't use the internal storage at all. I'm not sure what it is like for the Hasselblad folks.

As for storage size, 64gb is fine in the M11 since it doesn't shoot video. I would have rather had a second sd slot.

I think I'm back on the "internal storage is pointless, and creates issues without really solving anything" train.

I've had a few cameras with internal storage. Its a pain. If they made wi-fi that actually works to get images off, that might be different. All my wi-fi enabled cameras are flakey about connecting to my wi-fi and transferring images. I think its the tiny antenna in the camera that is susceptible to orientation. I have a very strong wi-fi signal but the connection is unreliable and transfer difficult to get started. Even so, Canon seems to work better than others.

 

[Czardoom]

Let's be real, cameras never live up to the rumored hype, ecspecially Canon. Canon has a way about making a camera that is almost good enough with a purposeful dificiency that one of their other cameras makes up for. The larger rear display if true might indicate better video capabilities, just what we all need, another video camera.

Having been on forums for almost 10 years, your comment is the typical Canon bashing comment that is...well...full of crap. The rumored specs are almost always underwhelming (compared to Sony, let's say) and people are complaining and moaning. Then, after the camera is released and people use it, they suddenly realize how good it is.

 

[deebatman316]

HSS? If power loss is an issue, use multiple flashes or a monolight.

On the other side of that, 1/64000 s shutter speed is useful in some situations, where previously multiple flashes at a low power setting were needed.

That's one sacrifice with HSS. Reduced flash output because the speedlite has to pulse rapidly to prevent the shutter curtains from being visible in the picture. Unless the X-sync speed is higher than the usual 1/200th or 1/250th X-sync. @neuroanatomist do you think we would see a 1/500th sec X-sync in the R1 or the usual 1/250th. It could be even higher what do you think. I know that the R3 has an X-sync of 1/180th which is slower than than the usual 1/200th or 1/250th sec.

 

[Lt Colonel]

That's my personal guess.

I tend to agree. Unless they make an updated R3 as the R1 lite for overheated enthusiasts like me, and from a marketing standpoint I don't. An updated R3 could distract from R1 sales.
I really like my R3. I shoot mainly wildlife and find the AF and many programmable buttons the top notch. If I had improvements, it would be dual CFe cards and about `10-15 more megapixels. Otherwise, since I generally don't make money with my photos, I really enjoy the most expensive camera I've ever purchased. What dear? No it really wasn't that expensive!.........