first pic of canon mirrorless?

[gmrza]

Lets face it. A mirrorless camera that respects legacy users. Olympus PEN (not OM) Nikon 1(Not F) Sony NEX (Not MAF) Samsung (Not K) Pentax Q (not K) if the canon can take a fully functional EF lens, even via an adaptor then it is ahead of everybody else (Sony get close, but no cigar)

That summarises what I'd like - I'm looking for something compact, that can act as a second body to a 5DII/III or 7D, and also is an option for traveling light, which I can mount on a gorillapod. My wishlist is: manual mode, RAW, connection for cable release, EF/EF-S adapter, compatibility with E-TTL II Speedlites. A *** would be a nice-to-have feature. The lack of external controls is a little bit of a concern, but I can probably live with that - given that this camera would always play second fiddle to a DSLR. I'm still in two minds about the apparent lack of an optional EVF.

I have come to terms with the fact that the sensor will be no better than what the current crop of APS-C Canons can offer. I think Canon is holding back its new sensor technology.

 

[mjbehnke]

I do see one thing I like about the lens that I wish Canon would do to all the lenses...... Did you notice the Lens cap? Has the squeeze grips like Tamron.

 

[kapanak]

Lets face it. A mirrorless camera that respects legacy users. Olympus PEN (not OM) Nikon 1(Not F) Sony NEX (Not MAF) Samsung (Not K) Pentax Q (not K) if the canon can take a fully functional EF lens, even via an adaptor then it is ahead of everybody else (Sony get close, but no cigar)

Could you clarify what is wrong with Sony's solution to adapting A-mount lenses?
They providers adapters, the second of which comes with PDAF SLT.

 

[c.d.embrey]

I do see one thing I like about the lens that I wish Canon would do to all the lenses...... Did you notice the Lens cap? Has the squeeze grips like Tamron.

Don't you mean like Nikon and Sony ??? All the lenses I've bought for my Nikon and Sony cameras have come with squeeze grips

 

[Hillsilly]

Who is this camera geared towards? Point and shooters that want to feel like they have a small dsrl?

If the pricing is acceptable, it autofocuses with EF lenses and it has an EVF, I bet most buyers will be current Canon DSLR users who want something smaller and unobtrusive (but high IQ) when going to parties, the beach, pubs, mountain biking etc etc. It will be the people on this forum that snap them up.

And I think Canon got it right by releasing the budget model first. Right now, few people are going to drop $2500 for a mirrorless FF when they've just bought (or are saving up towards) a feature packed 5Diii. But if there's an APS-C one for around $400-$600, most of us will consider it very tempting. Very, very tempting.

I currently use a Olympus PEN when my Mamiya medium format or 1Ds aren't really appropriate. (And I know many other use Sony's for the same reason). I love my little Olympus, but I'd drop it in a flash if the new Canon satisfies my criteria (reasonable price, EF compatibility and EVF).

 

[peederj]

I am fully in agreement with those (e.g. Mr. Reid) that say that mirrorless is a strictly high-end opportunity and is not something for the consumer crowd. Because it is not pocketable, and changing lenses is just a pain and expense...for what? The consumer can't tell the difference in image quality, and if they did care so much about that, they would...go high end.

So the whole experiment with "prosumer" mirrorless compacts has run its course and what would be interesting is high-end offerings that are a bit lighter and more compact than the full-on DSLRs without sacrificing too much in the way of IQ. Canon did not grasp this in time it is clear. I doubt they will sell many EOS M's or EF-M lenses; the entire R&D investment might not even be recouped. The Sony RX100 already is far more interesting to me, and if it did 24p I would have ordered one already (especially if it was waterproof). I may order one yet just for slo-mo. But the expense stops there...no more lenses or anything else, it just is what it is.

So scrap the compact mount, scrap STM, just focus on getting high-end IQ and video features down in size and price running off EF and EF-S native mounts. Give this peanut gallery a camera it will genuinely love...price included...from day 1. Give away razors, sell blades...a camera that's truly great will generate a lot of high-end lens sales to pay off its R&D. Hoping for us to be so stupid as to buy a bunch of redundant cheapo lenses to run on a new mini mount ain't gonna work.

At least they can tell the shareholders they tried to climb on the sputtering bandwagon (albeit late and half-heartedly).

 

[Flake]

I have to agree that this camera is not going to be for enthusiasts of any sort, and those of us wanting such are going to have to wait for a later model which has been mentioned in the rumours.

This camera is going to have to be cheap to sell in any numbers, the G1X is a fine camera with a very good lens, it's highly doubtful that the M camera will better it, and as it requires accessories such as a flash it's not going to be as flexible.

Who will buy this camera? The ignorant with too much money? not many of them around now, and I can see a colossal flop A La Nikon V1 which alas they appear to have copied. I would be waiting until a higher end model comes along, but Canon have made such a hash of this that they may well decide this market is not for them, and never release a better model.

 

[paul13walnut5]

@kapanak

Could you clarify what is wrong with Sony's solution to adapting A-mount lenses?
They providers adapters, the second of which comes with PDAF SLT.

Caveats and operational issues on first versions, lousy AF based on adapted cameras on subsequent editions.
Obviously we have yet to see Canon's implementation, if indeed there is one, but I can only hope it's a bit better than Sony's, which was, as I previously stated 'close, but no cigar'

The on chip phase detection AF present on the 650 t4i might be the saviour, if implemented here. Whats the point of adapting your nice fast USM primes or ring type L's if you lose the focus speed?

@DarkKnightNine

Dude are you just here to pick on anyone who doesn't like this camera?
It sure seems like it.
People wanted and expected more from Canon's entry. It's as simple as that. Don't know why you can't seem to get your thick head wrapped around that concept. Stop picking on people, you're becoming very annoying, even trollish.

Dude yourself pal! the discussion is about the merits of the camera as leaked. It's really funny because we know next to nothing about it yet and are discussing hypotheticals. I have one opinion, others have different opinions. To debase the discussion by accusing me of being a troll is immature. I'm standing my ground.

As the debate about using a M mount on a canon camera is entirely hypothetical I am confident others won't take my critique personally. Reading back, those with contrary opinions seem to be holding their own without your stepping in.

Read my posts and re-assess if you think I like this camera... I don't. I think it's potentially a first step in the right direction, but the controls are either going to be touch screen (urghhhh, didn't like on Panasonic GF2 or 3) or simply not going to be there at all (I can see canons logic, but I would hope for a more serious mirrorless camera to come in the future)

Your comment:

Canon skates over the lines that other players have already skated in search for the puck, yet they want to charge a premium because they simply stamped a Canon badge on retreaded tech.

Is either historically ignorant, or is painting with a very very fine brush to suit a single arguement. It is not my experience of using Canons EOS system. Canon don't always get it right. I am not a fanboy. Where somebody else makes something better I'll buy that (Currently debating a c300 or a sony f700)

You also resort to insults:

You also seem to pick up your paychecks from Canon. Blind fanboyism has never helped any company make better products.

I wish. But you have absolutely no basis to make this remark. This is a canon forum. The clue is in the title.
You may meet other folk who use canon's gear here and quite like using it and perhaps even like talking about using it. If you make factually incorrect and inflamatory comments some of us may correct or defend.

So before we even go down that road, NO I AM NOT an Apple fanboy but at least I see them trying to innovate (even today).

My recent experience with Apple has been poor. The main USP for me using a mac was FCP software, which I've used for 10 years. Apple dump it. I like the Mac OS, I like the mac platform, so what are my options?
Can I run Production Suite on a mac? Well, yes, but to run it properly (with a cuda card) I'll need a MacPro tower (even with recent revisions about 3 years behind PC's, no USB3, no bluray, no sandybridge) with another grand spent on top for the compatable card. So from my perspective, spending my cash on something that I can work with... Apple have let me down.

The iphone is great. My Macbook plods on after 6 years and can still be used for offlining in the field. I don't really get the ipad, but lots of folk do, great. I've never been a mac fanboy, but I have enjoyed using their products. That your user experience is different from mine is the nature of the beast. It doesn't make you a fanboy or me a troll.

Finally...

Don't know why you can't seem to get your thick head wrapped around that concept.

Is that really called for? That kind of insult really undermines anything else you've said. Adults disagree. Adults discuss. Stop throwing your toys out the pram. The person resorting to insults here is you, that is troll-ish.

 

[zim]

scabby auld 7D

;D ;D ;D That gave me a laugh wonder if that translated across the pond

 

[DarkKnightNine]

I'm certainly with you on that. Not so sure about the M mount, but the rest of the specs are dead on to what I would also like to see from a large optical company like Canon. Especially since they had years to evaluate the market and produce something truly fantastic. This camera is just ridiculous as an entry to an already well established market.

Exactly! It is really about time, Canon comes out with a truly innovative and absolutely amazing camera.

Not gong to happen.

Canon is a/the market leader.

All that Canon is interested in doing is the minimum required to stay on top.

Sad but seemingly true. It's always the guys in 2nd, 3rd or no place doing all of the innovating within any given market. Canon just sits on top raking in all of our cash at inflated prices with their legion of fanboys to shield them from any real criticism. At times I can be one of them as they do get a lot of things right and I happen to love their lens selection above all others.

 

[DarkKnightNine]

@kapanak

Could you clarify what is wrong with Sony's solution to adapting A-mount lenses?
They providers adapters, the second of which comes with PDAF SLT.

Caveats and operational issues on first versions, lousy AF based on adapted cameras on subsequent editions.
Obviously we have yet to see Canon's implementation, if indeed there is one, but I can only hope it's a bit better than Sony's, which was, as I previously stated 'close, but no cigar'

The on chip phase detection AF present on the 650 t4i might be the saviour, if implemented here. Whats the point of adapting your nice fast USM primes or ring type L's if you lose the focus speed?

@DarkKnightNine

Dude are you just here to pick on anyone who doesn't like this camera?
It sure seems like it.
People wanted and expected more from Canon's entry. It's as simple as that. Don't know why you can't seem to get your thick head wrapped around that concept. Stop picking on people, you're becoming very annoying, even trollish.

Dude yourself pal! the discussion is about the merits of the camera as leaked. It's really funny because we know next to nothing about it yet and are discussing hypotheticals. I have one opinion, others have different opinions. To debase the discussion by accusing me of being a troll is immature. I'm standing my ground.

As the debate about using a M mount on a canon camera is entirely hypothetical I am confident others won't take my critique personally. Reading back, those with contrary opinions seem to be holding their own without your stepping in.

Read my posts and re-assess if you think I like this camera... I don't. I think it's potentially a first step in the right direction, but the controls are either going to be touch screen (urghhhh, didn't like on Panasonic GF2 or 3) or simply not going to be there at all (I can see canons logic, but I would hope for a more serious mirrorless camera to come in the future)

Your comment:

Canon skates over the lines that other players have already skated in search for the puck, yet they want to charge a premium because they simply stamped a Canon badge on retreaded tech.

Is either historically ignorant, or is painting with a very very fine brush to suit a single arguement. It is not my experience of using Canons EOS system. Canon don't always get it right. I am not a fanboy. Where somebody else makes something better I'll buy that (Currently debating a c300 or a sony f700)

You also resort to insults:

You also seem to pick up your paychecks from Canon. Blind fanboyism has never helped any company make better products.

I wish. But you have absolutely no basis to make this remark. This is a canon forum. The clue is in the title.
You may meet other folk who use canon's gear here and quite like using it and perhaps even like talking about using it. If you make factually incorrect and inflamatory comments some of us may correct or defend.

So before we even go down that road, NO I AM NOT an Apple fanboy but at least I see them trying to innovate (even today).

My recent experience with Apple has been poor. The main USP for me using a mac was FCP software, which I've used for 10 years. Apple dump it. I like the Mac OS, I like the mac platform, so what are my options?
Can I run Production Suite on a mac? Well, yes, but to run it properly (with a cuda card) I'll need a MacPro tower (even with recent revisions about 3 years behind PC's, no USB3, no bluray, no sandybridge) with another grand spent on top for the compatable card. So from my perspective, spending my cash on something that I can work with... Apple have let me down.

The iphone is great. My Macbook plods on after 6 years and can still be used for offlining in the field. I don't really get the ipad, but lots of folk do, great. I've never been a mac fanboy, but I have enjoyed using their products. That your user experience is different from mine is the nature of the beast. It doesn't make you a fanboy or me a troll.

Finally...

Don't know why you can't seem to get your thick head wrapped around that concept.

Is that really called for? That kind of insult really undermines anything else you've said. Adults disagree. Adults discuss. Stop throwing your toys out the pram. The person resorting to insults here is you, that is troll-ish.

I agree with a lot of your assements about Apple and I too feel let down by their blatant disregard for their "Pro" market, but I still feel like they at least make attempts to innovate whenever, wherever they can. If they enter a new market, they attempt to turn it on it's ear rather than just doing the bare minimum to be profitable.


My apologies for my personal attack. Perhaps I was just having a bad day and of course you are very much entitled to your own opinions. It just seemed like you were being overly defensive about this product whenever anyone had anything negative to say about it. Anyways, like you said this is a forum and we should be able to discuss our opinions without personal attacks and for that, I was in the wrong. So I offer my apology to you Sir.

 

[paul13walnut5]

@DarkKnightNine

Accepted.

 

[AvTvM]

I definitely enjoyed the exchange of opinions we had in this thread! Also glad to see, that we are back in "civilized discussion territrory".

Now that the specs are "inoffically" out, we can all move over to the new thread:
http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=8162.msg149456#new