canon 5ds at www.imaging-resource.com

[Stu_bert]

Still not sure I completely agree with you. The same sensor is in the Nikon 8xx vs the Sony A7r, yet the results from the Nikon are generally considered superior based on what Nikon do with the sensor data, and the AF in the Nikon 4s is nigh on the same as the 1Dx (bearing in mind the latter took a few ideas from the D3/s when they overhauled the AF from the III/IV series). And Pro's moved from Canon to Nikon in significant numbers during the III focusing debacle - sure the sensor played a big part in that also.

I would suspect Nikon & Canon make more from their glass then they do their bodies, margin wise, but Sony as you say are not there yet, and do a lot in partnership with Zeiss I thought. Kind of like Nikon do with Sony on the sensor.

I think Sony have a longer term view which is the camera market is shrinking full stop. Their presence in it makes a profit but is also a huge marketing opportunity in terms of selling sensors in other markets, be that smartphones, automobiles and security. The camera market is important, but I dont think long-term will offer much revenue.

Sony coming later to the "party" and having a broader set of markets to address meant they did not have the legacy which Canon had with their fabs from the start of the 21st century. And since Canon has not been that interested in being an OEM, never got into these other markets which would have helped fund new fabs. In that respect, well done Sony for the foresight. Samsung is in an even better position based on how broad it's markets are developing CPUs, memory, storage etc - and look at their 28MP APS-C sensor as a good example - probably ahead of Canon and comparable to Sony.

But again, I think Samsung and Sony will continue in the camera market for the prestige and the leverage they get from being well recognised in the quality end of sensor development, and the opportunities that offers them in bigger markets. If the numbers stack up might either of them buy Nikon? Sure. Could Nikon survive in the same #2 slot if Sony with-held their sensors. I believe so also.

+1 I think you nailed it.


I agree, I don't think Nikon would fail if Sony pulled their sensors, but, as you say, it seems illogical for them to do so, as that's really their market: sensors. I also believe your dead on about lens sales. Especially with lenses being upgraded...that gives established users in addition to new users reason to spend more money on newer, sharper lenses.


Both Sony and Samsung have some very intriguing parts at extremely attractive prices. I've been encouraging friends who like photography to buy better cameras. I've been taking them to local camera stores, putting the latest entry-level Canon & Nikon DSLRs and the Sony A6000 in front of them and telling them only: "Pick up each one, see how it feels in your hands, how it fits, how it works. Ergonomics is one of the most important things about a camera."


So far, everyone has chosen the Sony A6000, usually after proclamations about how heavy the Canon Rebels are, how large and bulky both the Rebel and Nikon Dxxxx series are, and how much they like the small, light weight lenses and features of the Sony. The only push I've given any of them is simply to put the A6000 down there instead of some other Sony camera. ;P The features packed into that thing are incredible, and it's difficult to get anyone interested in a more expensive Canon or Nikon when they have this tiny, light weight camera with tiny, ultra light weight lenses in their hands. Outside of that, the rest is up to them. I think Sony NAILED it with the A6000.


I am looking forward to renting the Samsung NX1 from LensRentals soon here to actually give it a try. I was going to adapt it to my 600mm lens, but now I want to actually give some Samsung lenses a try as well. Having used the A6000 now, though, and seeing how small and light the lenses are (amazingly so...you could put a couple in your pocket and forget they were there), I think the NX1 will have a lot of competition for anyone except those looking for a well-priced wildlife and birding mirrorless (especially once the Samsung 300mm f/2.8 lens hits.) Both cameras seem exceptional on the features and capabilities front, with 11fps and 15fps, topping (by far) anything else in their price ranges. The only thing I haven't yet been impressed with are the EVFs...but, I haven't used Samsung's yet, and it sounds pretty good.

I think anyone who has no investment in cameras Jon has great opportunities today, and frankly as has been said a number of times, if you cant make a good picture with any brand today then the problem is alas with you and not the equipment - I'm not trying to re-ignite previous discussions on DR, lol. I remember seeing a bunch of BIFs from a photographer using a 20D and the 100-400mm. For him he did not need 90% hit rate he just needed 1. And if I was starting out from scratch with only a little knowledge about cameras, would I want something big and heavy (relatively)? Probably not.

I think many people here are looking an options, I think the challenge is sharing that information with others in a way which doesn't get people defending their previous investment. I've no hands on experience of the NX1 or the A6000 but would be interested in your findings, especially on the AF - spookily enough a friend at work has ditched the A6000 because of the AF (coming from a Pentax K dslr), another ditched the 5D III and went Fuji XT based on weight, and a 3rd has all but stop using his Nikon for Fuji XT also for weight.

It'll also be interesting to see what's coming next in terms of taking pictures - I think smartphones are starting to level out (Google glass or the equivalent ? ) - personally I only use the smartphone as a mobile computer which is internet connected. Occasionally I use it to capture a location, but the whole mode of operation - looking at a screen with your arms outstretched - fine for a tripod, but not for everything else. So I'll replace the Iphone 4 when it finally dies, but less and less the need to replace it is compelling. They're (smartphones) almost ubiquitous and for me the features they offer are levelling out. I've seen Apple have some patents recently all focused on improving the camera features - because other than refinements on OS, battery life, screen quality and speed (games), what else is there? But even then, I think that smartphones have cornered those who want to capture a moment in their lives, as opposed to want to make a picture - and I dont mean that offensively.


Same with tablet. They (Apple, Samsung etc) face the same challenges as Canon, Nikon etc convincing people to change to the latest model when the step-changes are not there. I think that's why Sony is looking at sensors in cars and the like, as there's a equally large market there, and of course security devices which Canon has just bought into. All signs that for the sort of equipment that people here buy & use, that market is shrinking rapidly. I agree a lot with Tom Hogan when he identifies shortcomings in workflow / integration, I just dont think Canon & Nikon have the capability in SW dev - not really their forte. They're gonna stick to their bread n butter. Fortunately, there aren't a huge amount of lenses left that Canon need to replace for my needs, and as you say the ability to put them onto other bodies is appealing. I think the only remaining challenge on lenses is how to make them "built like a tank", but really light. DO is interesting, but not quite the step-change required. (As an aside, I'm always puzzled as to why Nikon has not followed Canon into the film industry. My only guess would be cash-flow, and the investment required is significant... )

Guess we'll get to spend more time using our equipment as the opportunity to entice us to change or upgrade to something will reduce.

Let us all know how you fare with the NX1, I think objective and quantitative information when presented in a non-inciting manner is always welcome here.

 

[Trevster]

I put in an order for the 5DS R, and one of the things that I plan to do is use it hand-held at 1600 iso to take photos of paintings in museums (so I can zoom in on detail, like how an eye was painted, etc). I'm also a painter.

Is it unreasonable to think that I could get photos as sharp as I do with a hand held 7D with a 24-70mm f/2.8L II lens? Or does the increased mp also demand a tripod (which is something that can't be used, at say, the MET). Reading about the new mirror vibration control system is making me think that maybe it will be very hard to use this hand held indoors.

Would a slight shake be magnified as mp increase?

- Trevor

 

[lintoni]

I put in an order for the 5DS R, and one of the things that I plan to do is use it hand-held at 1600 iso to take photos of paintings in museums (so I can zoom in on detail, like how an eye was painted, etc). I'm also a painter.

Is it unreasonable to think that I could get photos as sharp as I do with a hand held 7D with a 24-70mm f/2.8L II lens? Or does the increased mp also demand a tripod (which is something that can't be used, at say, the MET). Reading about the new mirror vibration control system is making me think that maybe it will be very hard to use this hand held indoors.

Would a slight shake be magnified as mp increase?

- Trevor

There's a discussion on this elsewhere on CR that you may be interested in -

http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=25707.0

 

[privatebydesign]

I put in an order for the 5DS R, and one of the things that I plan to do is use it hand-held at 1600 iso to take photos of paintings in museums (so I can zoom in on detail, like how an eye was painted, etc). I'm also a painter.

Is it unreasonable to think that I could get photos as sharp as I do with a hand held 7D with a 24-70mm f/2.8L II lens? Or does the increased mp also demand a tripod (which is something that can't be used, at say, the MET). Reading about the new mirror vibration control system is making me think that maybe it will be very hard to use this hand held indoors.

Would a slight shake be magnified as mp increase?

- Trevor

If you had a doppelganger and you both stood next to each other, you with the 5DSR and your twin a 7D MkII and you both take the same framed shot from the same distance and use equivalence to normalise focal length, shutter speed, dof and noise, the resultant images, when viewed the same size will have the same amount of blur.

If you view them at 100% the FF camera will appear to have more blur but that is simply because you are making the picture bigger.

So, for example:

5DSR and 100mm L IS macro, f5.6, iso 400, and 1/60 sec,
7D MkII and 60mm EF-S macro, f4, iso 200, and 1/60 sec,

Both images will have practically identical image characteristics (noise, dof, movement blur, etc) when viewed at the same image size (not percent).

 

[Trevster]

I put in an order for the 5DS R, and one of the things that I plan to do is use it hand-held at 1600 iso to take photos of paintings in museums (so I can zoom in on detail, like how an eye was painted, etc). I'm also a painter.

Is it unreasonable to think that I could get photos as sharp as I do with a hand held 7D with a 24-70mm f/2.8L II lens? Or does the increased mp also demand a tripod (which is something that can't be used, at say, the MET). Reading about the new mirror vibration control system is making me think that maybe it will be very hard to use this hand held indoors.

Would a slight shake be magnified as mp increase?

- Trevor

There's a discussion on this elsewhere on CR that you may be interested in -

http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=25707.0

Many thanks!

 

[jrista]

I think anyone who has no investment in cameras Jon has great opportunities today, and frankly as has been said a number of times, if you cant make a good picture with any brand today then the problem is alas with you and not the equipment - I'm not trying to re-ignite previous discussions on DR, lol. I remember seeing a bunch of BIFs from a photographer using a 20D and the 100-400mm. For him he did not need 90% hit rate he just needed 1. And if I was starting out from scratch with only a little knowledge about cameras, would I want something big and heavy (relatively)? Probably not.

I dunno. I used to think the same way, but I've come to the conclusion that diversity is great. I want an A6000 myself, if for some reason the NX1 doesn't pan out. I may get one even IF the NX1 pans out, as it's just so small, light, and...cost effective! I was pretty hard-core Canon in the past, but I like not limiting myself in my equipment choices.

I think many people here are looking an options, I think the challenge is sharing that information with others in a way which doesn't get people defending their previous investment. I've no hands on experience of the NX1 or the A6000 but would be interested in your findings, especially on the AF - spookily enough a friend at work has ditched the A6000 because of the AF (coming from a Pentax K dslr), another ditched the 5D III and went Fuji XT based on weight, and a 3rd has all but stop using his Nikon for Fuji XT also for weight.

Regarding AF performance, just as with any camera brand AF performance is often dependent on the lenses. Not every lens is equal in that respect...the same is true of Sony. Some lenses are better than others. I was experimenting with their 60mm macro last...that thing is tiny, ultra light, and snaps to focus in a heartbeat. The AF system is pretty sweet on the A6000, but it is a little complicated...about as complicated as a 5D III or 7D II. Takes some time to learn how to use it effectively.


I think if you give yourself time to get used to a system, you can use any system effectively. Sony's system isn't without it's flaws...for sure. However, neither is Canon's. Having used the 5D III for a year now, while it's better in most respects than my 7D, both the 5D III and the 600mm lens have their quirky, fidgity moments that cost me shots. One of the things that drives me nuts about it is the way it hunts for focus...it always hunts in towards the photographer first, then out away. When your trying to lock onto a bird in flight after photographing another bird on the ground or on a tree in the foreground, that usually costs you the shot. Being at f/4, the hunt is slower as well, and even when it should lock onto the bird when it finally gets there, sometimes it just misses. I try to manually snap focus to infinity whenever I switch target types like that, but it doesn't always help.


Every AF system has it's flaws, just as every AF system has it's strengths. You just learn to work within the limitations. I love most of the things my Canon AF system does, despite the hunting issue.

It'll also be interesting to see what's coming next in terms of taking pictures - I think smartphones are starting to level out (Google glass or the equivalent ? ) - personally I only use the smartphone as a mobile computer which is internet connected. Occasionally I use it to capture a location, but the whole mode of operation - looking at a screen with your arms outstretched - fine for a tripod, but not for everything else. So I'll replace the Iphone 4 when it finally dies, but less and less the need to replace it is compelling. They're (smartphones) almost ubiquitous and for me the features they offer are levelling out. I've seen Apple have some patents recently all focused on improving the camera features - because other than refinements on OS, battery life, screen quality and speed (games), what else is there? But even then, I think that smartphones have cornered those who want to capture a moment in their lives, as opposed to want to make a picture - and I dont mean that offensively.

As my 450D was my first camera, I never had a P&S before that, and the only other cameras I'd used prior to that were film cameras, I've never enjoyed images from camera phones. Even the great Lumia 1020 camera, which has a GREAT sensor, just lacks any kind of focus control, no thin depth of field, nothing that lends itself to creativity. There are some third-party lens addons that you can get for iPhones...they bring some additional capabilities, but...it's still a camera phone.


I don't really even use my smartphone for snapshots. That's one of the reasons I want something like the A6000 and NX1...I want a CAMERA, something I can still take great photos with, but which is very light and will fit in a pocket. The NX1 may double as that, but I get the feeling it will be a little too big. Plus, the Sony lenses are incredibly light...I love em.


I'd love to see something like that from Canon. A LOT of the time these days, I wish I had a decent camera with me when I see something amazing, but don't have my $25,000+ Canon DSLR kit with me. I just can't lug that much value around with me all the time. Something smaller that I can always keep on me is becoming significantly more appealing. I can't count how many times in the last 4 months on my drive home that I've seen some amazing shot...and didn't have my gear with me. I always race home, grab my gear, and head back out...but a moment is a moment, it's gone in seconds. You might be able to find another, but it's rare.


Canon has nothing to compete in this space. The EOS M...well, while I know a lot of people are frustrated with Canon North America for not bringing the EOS M 3 to the states, I actually think they are right. Canon just doesn't have anything that compete in this space at the moment. If two friends go to the local camera store, and one puts an EOS M and the A6000 on the table, then starts talking about their capabilities...it's just no contest. If your average customer goes in and asks the guy behind the counter what they could get for less than a grand that would give them the best photos...it's a tossup whether they even bring an EOS M out, assuming they have any in stock. I don't think Canon, Nikon, not really even Olympus or Pentax have anything at a $550 price point that competes with something like the A6000. Neither the bodies & firmware nor the lenses compete well enough.


Three times now, I've taken friends who have told me they want a DSLR to the local camera store, pulled out a Canon, Nikon, and the A6000. The only thing I tell them is that ergonomics are a critical factor, so pick the camera that feels best. The Canon is out in a heartbeat because of it's weight (the Rebels are actually pretty heavy, surprised me; none of the stores seem to have the SL1, which might be a better contender), and the Nikon is out because of it's bulk. Everyone gravitates towards the small, light, handy A6000 and it's tiny yet rather high quality lenses. When Canon can compete head to head with that, both body and lenses as well as extensive feature set, at the same price point (lately that's been $548 for the body, $699 for body+lens), then I think they will have a mirrorless offering that can compete in the US. Then I'll be able to put two competitive mirrorless cameras on the table and tell my young padawans the same thing, and maybe have a real contest on my hands.


Anyway, I could pick up the A6000 and two lenses (16-55 and 50-200 I think they are) for under a grand. The IQ is phenomenal, you get 11fps, the AF system is awesome...I think it's as good as Canon or Nikon AF systems, once you get a handle on it, it's ultra light, super small, as are the lenses. It's a pocket camera. It's APS-C, so the 50-200 is really like a 75-300 on FF. I can do a lot with that kind of focal length, for birds and wildlife. And I could have it on me every single day. I would feel much better lugging around <$1000 worth of gear than lugging around >$25,000 worth of gear...and I'd stop missing moments.


The newer Sony cameras also have a very intriguing feature for the humming bird and songbird flight photographers around. They paired a smartphone app with their cameras, that uses the wifi feature to allow full wireless remote control of the camera. You could pop the A6000 on a tripod, set it in front of a trumpet vine setup or something like that, and snap photos of hummingbirds all day long. You wouldn't need to lug around a large laptop, or even a tablet. There are innovations out there that neither Canon nor Nikon have touched yet, and they really need to. If Canon could bring a product like this to market, people in the states would gobble it up in a heartbeat. Maybe they will...they did enter into that patent sharing agreement with Microsoft...maybe there is something in the works. If so, I would love to see it, and soon.

Same with tablet. They (Apple, Samsung etc) face the same challenges as Canon, Nikon etc convincing people to change to the latest model when the step-changes are not there. I think that's why Sony is looking at sensors in cars and the like, as there's a equally large market there, and of course security devices which Canon has just bought into. All signs that for the sort of equipment that people here buy & use, that market is shrinking rapidly. I agree a lot with Tom Hogan when he identifies shortcomings in workflow / integration, I just dont think Canon & Nikon have the capability in SW dev - not really their forte. They're gonna stick to their bread n butter.

Aye, I think this is dead on as well. That's an area where Samsung probably has the best legs to stand on, as they do know software fairly well. At least they know Android. I think my new Samsung TV, which has a bunch of apps build in, is also Android. It's rock solid. I never even plugged it into cable...I canceled that ages ago. I just plugged in a power cord, and connected it to my WiFi. I use NetFlix, Amazon Prime, HBO Go, etc. for all my entertainment. It's been amazing ditching the old ball and chain that is Cable TV. Such a drag paying, what, $80 a month for 900 channels you don't want, five hundred hours a month worth of commercials...and three channels you actually are interested in? Archaic. I get all my entertainment on demand, in 4k most of the time now or at least Super HD, and it's been flawless. Tough to say that about many devices these days.


The NX1 has that programmable hardware, which is one of the things I'm most intrigued by. I don't even think Sony could compete with Samsung on that front at the moment, although they are starting to do interesting things on the software front. Like that WiFi control app for the phone. I think that's going to become a staple in the future...direct app-accessibility of camera functionality. Preferably without any wires. Nikon and Canon both need to get on the ball on that front. I can't wait for the day I could control not only a camera, but a host of wireless flashes, in that same hummingbird setup. With a 4k (I think one of these has already hit the shelves) smartphone. Now THAT would be the day. I no longer care so much who does it, although I don't expect Canon to be the first one there. I figure I'll own Canon, Sony and Samsung, both bodies and lenses, soon enough here.

Fortunately, there aren't a huge amount of lenses left that Canon need to replace for my needs, and as you say the ability to put them onto other bodies is appealing. I think the only remaining challenge on lenses is how to make them "built like a tank", but really light. DO is interesting, but not quite the step-change required. (As an aside, I'm always puzzled as to why Nikon has not followed Canon into the film industry. My only guess would be cash-flow, and the investment required is significant... )

Yeah, not sure how "tank" and "light weight" will go together. I wouldn't say that Sony lenses are tanks...they are light, but, they do kind of feel fragile. They are so light, however, that if I dropped one a foot or two, I wouldn't really be concerned...but I wouldn't call them rugged. My Canon L series lenses, on the other hand, are definitely rugged. With weather sealed lenses, I've taken my Canon gear through every kind of weather and precipitation there is, with the exception of a hurricane, and they've come out fine. They've been drenched in rain driven by 40mph winds, hailed on, snowed on, sleeted on, dropped in the mud, blasted by wind. I'd say Canon lenses are definitely tanks. That's why I stick with them for my serious bird and wildlife photography. I'm hoping the 5D IV has some seriously improved high ISO IQ as well...the 5D III is feeling a bit long in the tooth. Its decent, but it's also over three years old, and this technology moves pretty fast. While I don't expect it to score well on the DR front, the 5Ds does have a recognizable improvement in overall IQ at low ISO, as does the 7D II at higher ISO. If the 5D IV can bring that kind of IQ improvement to the table, then I'd be satisfied replacing my 5D III with it.


Plus, there is something to be said about a large aperture. I don't mean relative aperture, I mean physical aperture. The larger the diameter of a lens, the greater it's potential to resolve detail. Wide open you can look down the front of my 600mm and the opening in the diaphragm is HUGE. Not enough diffraction there to cause any problems, and the CA is very well controlled. There simply doesn't exist any kind of 600mm lens that is naively built for most mirrorless systems, and capable of high speed AF, definitely not Sony or Samsung.

 

[zlatko]

I put in an order for the 5DS R, and one of the things that I plan to do is use it hand-held at 1600 iso to take photos of paintings in museums (so I can zoom in on detail, like how an eye was painted, etc). I'm also a painter.

Is it unreasonable to think that I could get photos as sharp as I do with a hand held 7D with a 24-70mm f/2.8L II lens? Or does the increased mp also demand a tripod (which is something that can't be used, at say, the MET). Reading about the new mirror vibration control system is making me think that maybe it will be very hard to use this hand held indoors.

Would a slight shake be magnified as mp increase?

- Trevor

Increased mp never demands greater steadiness. Mp doesn't increase the degree of blur that results from unsteadiness. However, increased enlargement demands greater steadiness. So the question is whether you will be making bigger prints or viewing the images larger.

 

[Stu_bert]

I dunno. I used to think the same way, but I've come to the conclusion that diversity is great. I want an A6000 myself, if for some reason the NX1 doesn't pan out. I may get one even IF the NX1 pans out, as it's just so small, light, and...cost effective! I was pretty hard-core Canon in the past, but I like not limiting myself in my equipment choices.

I want to produce pictures that please me. I'm happy with most of my Canon kit, but it's not an exclusive relationship

Regarding AF performance, just as with any camera brand AF performance is often dependent on the lenses. Not every lens is equal in that respect...the same is true of Sony. Some lenses are better than others. I was experimenting with their 60mm macro last...that thing is tiny, ultra light, and snaps to focus in a heartbeat. The AF system is pretty sweet on the A6000, but it is a little complicated...about as complicated as a 5D III or 7D II. Takes some time to learn how to use it effectively.


I think if you give yourself time to get used to a system, you can use any system effectively. Sony's system isn't without it's flaws...for sure. However, neither is Canon's. Having used the 5D III for a year now, while it's better in most respects than my 7D, both the 5D III and the 600mm lens have their quirky, fidgity moments that cost me shots. One of the things that drives me nuts about it is the way it hunts for focus...it always hunts in towards the photographer first, then out away. When your trying to lock onto a bird in flight after photographing another bird on the ground or on a tree in the foreground, that usually costs you the shot. Being at f/4, the hunt is slower as well, and even when it should lock onto the bird when it finally gets there, sometimes it just misses. I try to manually snap focus to infinity whenever I switch target types like that, but it doesn't always help.


Every AF system has it's flaws, just as every AF system has it's strengths. You just learn to work within the limitations. I love most of the things my Canon AF system does, despite the hunting issue.

Agree... the 1DX also does the same. In fact until v2 of the firmware it would sometimes stop focusing properly near infinity and never lock on. Which is somewhat annoying :

As my 450D was my first camera, I never had a P&S before that, and the only other cameras I'd used prior to that were film cameras, I've never enjoyed images from camera phones. Even the great Lumia 1020 camera, which has a GREAT sensor, just lacks any kind of focus control, no thin depth of field, nothing that lends itself to creativity. There are some third-party lens addons that you can get for iPhones...they bring some additional capabilities, but...it's still a camera phone.


I don't really even use my smartphone for snapshots. That's one of the reasons I want something like the A6000 and NX1...I want a CAMERA, something I can still take great photos with, but which is very light and will fit in a pocket. The NX1 may double as that, but I get the feeling it will be a little too big. Plus, the Sony lenses are incredibly light...I love em.

I got a GX1 for that purpose, but the lens disappoints me. Not sure a NX1 as you say, will be that size. It's funny, when I am travelling and therefore doing photography I am happy to walk around with two bodies all day, and I'm rarely bothered by it. Ok, a little bit But I agree with your sentiments. When I used to drive to work I had a body, lens & tripod in the car. For casual stuff at some stage I will get a replacement for the GX1, just not sure what form it will be.

The newer Sony cameras also have a very intriguing feature for the humming bird and songbird flight photographers around. They paired a smartphone app with their cameras, that uses the wifi feature to allow full wireless remote control of the camera. You could pop the A6000 on a tripod, set it in front of a trumpet vine setup or something like that, and snap photos of hummingbirds all day long. You wouldn't need to lug around a large laptop, or even a tablet. There are innovations out there that neither Canon nor Nikon have touched yet, and they really need to. If Canon could bring a product like this to market, people in the states would gobble it up in a heartbeat. Maybe they will...they did enter into that patent sharing agreement with Microsoft...maybe there is something in the works. If so, I would love to see it, and soon.

Yeah I have to use camranger for that purpose... and of course it's not free. I think you're right, both Samsung and Sony understand the sw better, and will show that...

Aye, I think this is dead on as well. That's an area where Samsung probably has the best legs to stand on, as they do know software fairly well. At least they know Android. I think my new Samsung TV, which has a bunch of apps build in, is also Android. It's rock solid. I never even plugged it into cable...I canceled that ages ago. I just plugged in a power cord, and connected it to my WiFi. I use NetFlix, Amazon Prime, HBO Go, etc. for all my entertainment. It's been amazing ditching the old ball and chain that is Cable TV. Such a drag paying, what, $80 a month for 900 channels you don't want, five hundred hours a month worth of commercials...and three channels you actually are interested in? Archaic. I get all my entertainment on demand, in 4k most of the time now or at least Super HD, and it's been flawless. Tough to say that about many devices these days.

I have a Samsung BR player and as you say, they're great for Apps. I use the iplayer (being a brit), Plex client etc and indeed the cable box stays off. On demand streaming is the way to go, but it will be interesting to see if the price is much cheaper. In the UK you can get netflix & amazon, but they're not that cheap in comparison...

The NX1 has that programmable hardware, which is one of the things I'm most intrigued by. I don't even think Sony could compete with Samsung on that front at the moment, although they are starting to do interesting things on the software front. Like that WiFi control app for the phone. I think that's going to become a staple in the future...direct app-accessibility of camera functionality. Preferably without any wires. Nikon and Canon both need to get on the ball on that front. I can't wait for the day I could control not only a camera, but a host of wireless flashes, in that same hummingbird setup. With a 4k (I think one of these has already hit the shelves) smartphone. Now THAT would be the day. I no longer care so much who does it, although I don't expect Canon to be the first one there. I figure I'll own Canon, Sony and Samsung, both bodies and lenses, soon enough here.

Agree completely. Canon and Nikon dont seem to have the right focus, which is a shame. Sony & Samsung both do 4K smartphones I believe.

Yeah, not sure how "tank" and "light weight" will go together. I wouldn't say that Sony lenses are tanks...they are light, but, they do kind of feel fragile. They are so light, however, that if I dropped one a foot or two, I wouldn't really be concerned...but I wouldn't call them rugged. My Canon L series lenses, on the other hand, are definitely rugged. With weather sealed lenses, I've taken my Canon gear through every kind of weather and precipitation there is, with the exception of a hurricane, and they've come out fine. They've been drenched in rain driven by 40mph winds, hailed on, snowed on, sleeted on, dropped in the mud, blasted by wind. I'd say Canon lenses are definitely tanks. That's why I stick with them for my serious bird and wildlife photography.

I think there will be materials in the 10 years time which will replace the shell of the lens, and maybe even the glass with lighter but equally strong materials. And that will probably be the only thing that makes me change any of my lenses again. I've dunked myself, the body and the lens in a stream before. Dried them all out and they all worked fine

I'm hoping the 5D IV has some seriously improved high ISO IQ as well...the 5D III is feeling a bit long in the tooth. Its decent, but it's also over three years old, and this technology moves pretty fast. While I don't expect it to score well on the DR front, the 5Ds does have a recognizable improvement in overall IQ at low ISO, as does the 7D II at higher ISO. If the 5D IV can bring that kind of IQ improvement to the table, then I'd be satisfied replacing my 5D III with it.


Plus, there is something to be said about a large aperture. I don't mean relative aperture, I mean physical aperture. The larger the diameter of a lens, the greater it's potential to resolve detail. Wide open you can look down the front of my 600mm and the opening in the diaphragm is HUGE. Not enough diffraction there to cause any problems, and the CA is very well controlled. There simply doesn't exist any kind of 600mm lens that is naively built for most mirrorless systems, and capable of high speed AF, definitely not Sony or Samsung.

Completely open to see what happens later in the year, but open to other manufacturers (if I can retain my Canon glass). For now, I'm pretty content with what I have, just need to find the time to do more with it. Have fun with the NX1....

 

[weixing]

I put in an order for the 5DS R, and one of the things that I plan to do is use it hand-held at 1600 iso to take photos of paintings in museums (so I can zoom in on detail, like how an eye was painted, etc). I'm also a painter.

Is it unreasonable to think that I could get photos as sharp as I do with a hand held 7D with a 24-70mm f/2.8L II lens? Or does the increased mp also demand a tripod (which is something that can't be used, at say, the MET). Reading about the new mirror vibration control system is making me think that maybe it will be very hard to use this hand held indoors.

Would a slight shake be magnified as mp increase?

- Trevor

Increased mp never demands greater steadiness. Mp doesn't increase the degree of blur that results from unsteadiness. However, increased enlargement demands greater steadiness. So the question is whether you will be making bigger prints or viewing the images larger.

Hi,
High MP will make unsteadiness more obvious especially there is a button call "100%"... :'(

Have a nice day.

 

[9VIII]

I put in an order for the 5DS R, and one of the things that I plan to do is use it hand-held at 1600 iso to take photos of paintings in museums (so I can zoom in on detail, like how an eye was painted, etc). I'm also a painter.

Is it unreasonable to think that I could get photos as sharp as I do with a hand held 7D with a 24-70mm f/2.8L II lens? Or does the increased mp also demand a tripod (which is something that can't be used, at say, the MET). Reading about the new mirror vibration control system is making me think that maybe it will be very hard to use this hand held indoors.

Would a slight shake be magnified as mp increase?

- Trevor

Increased mp never demands greater steadiness. Mp doesn't increase the degree of blur that results from unsteadiness. However, increased enlargement demands greater steadiness. So the question is whether you will be making bigger prints or viewing the images larger.

Hi,
High MP will make unsteadiness more obvious especially there is a button call "100%"... :'(

Have a nice day.

The amount that you need to increase stability is proportional to pixel pitch. An easy way to think about it is imagine you're shooting on crop and adjust your shutter speed accordingly.
So a 50mm lens may have been sharp at 1/50sec before, but pretending you're shooting on crop you would want 1/80sec.
You can get tack sharp images of hummingbirds flapping their wings at 1/2000sec, worst case you can just crank up the shutter speed and forget about technique, everyone is different though so the better you are at stability the lower you'll be able to get your shutter speed.
Last week I got some handheld shots with my 400f5.6 (640mm equivalent on crop) reasonably sharp at 1/350sec, I was sitting on the ground resting the camera on my knee, but I didn't need a tripod to deal with fading light.

 

[privatebydesign]

The newer Sony cameras also have a very intriguing feature for the humming bird and songbird flight photographers around. They paired a smartphone app with their cameras, that uses the wifi feature to allow full wireless remote control of the camera. You could pop the A6000 on a tripod, set it in front of a trumpet vine setup or something like that, and snap photos of hummingbirds all day long. You wouldn't need to lug around a large laptop, or even a tablet. There are innovations out there that neither Canon nor Nikon have touched yet, and they really need to. If Canon could bring a product like this to market, people in the states would gobble it up in a heartbeat. Maybe they will...they did enter into that patent sharing agreement with Microsoft...maybe there is something in the works. If so, I would love to see it, and soon.

Yeah I have to use camranger for that purpose... and of course it's not free. I think you're right, both Samsung and Sony understand the sw better, and will show that...

Yeh, Sony are really innovative for that :

http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/standard_display/EOS_app

P.S. In case anybody missed the irony tags I should probably point out the above linked Canon App came out in 2012 and works on several Canon cameras.

 

[privatebydesign]

I put in an order for the 5DS R, and one of the things that I plan to do is use it hand-held at 1600 iso to take photos of paintings in museums (so I can zoom in on detail, like how an eye was painted, etc). I'm also a painter.

Is it unreasonable to think that I could get photos as sharp as I do with a hand held 7D with a 24-70mm f/2.8L II lens? Or does the increased mp also demand a tripod (which is something that can't be used, at say, the MET). Reading about the new mirror vibration control system is making me think that maybe it will be very hard to use this hand held indoors.

Would a slight shake be magnified as mp increase?

- Trevor

Increased mp never demands greater steadiness. Mp doesn't increase the degree of blur that results from unsteadiness. However, increased enlargement demands greater steadiness. So the question is whether you will be making bigger prints or viewing the images larger.

Hi,
High MP will make unsteadiness more obvious especially there is a button call "100%"... :'(

Have a nice day.

The amount that you need to increase stability is proportional to pixel pitch.

Only if you are going to view at unequal magnifications, if you view both outputs at the same subject size (which you should) there is no difference.