Canon 7D mk11 is this for real or just hype

[lb]

I was reading on the internet, I usually don't bother but this really caught my eye, are we that far behind these days.?

 

[DominoDude]

I was reading on the internet, I usually don't bother but this really caught my eye, are we that far behind these days.?

What do you think yourself about this? Did you just look at the fancy picture with some numbers on, or did you dig deeper to find out more?

 

[Loswr]

Yeah, dude...the 7DII is a piece of magnesium alloyed crap. Don't even look at it twice, move on. You already know how crappy the 5DIII is:

I agree fully dump the idea of a out-dated Canon 5D111 body and go for the upmarket Sony body and adaptor

 

[jrista]

I was reading on the internet, I usually don't bother but this really caught my eye, are we that far behind these days.?

No, were not as far behind as DXO indicates. The 7D II "SCORES" poorly on DXO because it hasn't gained anything on the low ISO or color depth front. DXO scores are a very bad way to compare cameras, always have been, always will be.


Ignore DXO scores. Look at the measurements. Look at the ISO chart, and compare it with the original 7D chart (the likely upgraders to the 7D II). What do you see? Has anything improved?


The 7D II did gain about 2/3rds of a stop improvement at higher and very high ISO settings over the 7D. It did not gain at low ISO as it still has roughly the same read noise, and it barely gained on the color fidelity front. Until Canon does something about their readout system, I wouldn't expect the low ISO or color accuracy performance to improve. Canon has a distributed system...the sensor is only one part, there are additional off-die components involved, and I believe it is those off-die components that are really holding them back (and, if the information is correct, those components are not even manufactured by Canon, they are relatively cheap third party components). That's low ISO, though, just low ISO.


(Personally, I was really hoping Canon would do something special with the 7D II sensor, something way out of "normal park" for themselves...but they did not. It would have been nice to see Canon show some real out-of-the-box innovation on the sensor front, but as far as low ISO performance goes, it's pretty run of the mill for Canon. I found that quite disappointing when the 7D II was first released, but in the grand scheme of things...they improved the sensor where it mattered for the 7D II's primary use case.)


The 7D II DID make gains at high ISO, and they are very reasonable gains. The 7D II sensor Q.E. has improved, the total sensor size also increased a little bit (the 7D II has more of a 1.55x crop at 336mm^2 rather than the classic Canon 1.6x crop at 330mm^2...slightly more total sensor area, better high ISO performance), and the FWC increased (by almost 10ke- over the 7D, which is quite considerable, and even 4ke- over the 70D. So, despite the fact that the 7D II barely gained much in terms of total DR at ISO 100, the increased charge capacity of the pixels is still going to mean lower photon shot noise, which is going to mean an improvement in IQ at midtones and highlights.)


Those improvements at ISO 100 ultimately trickle down to the higher ISO settings, allowing more charge at each setting, which is probably where most of Canon's high ISO improvement comes from: more light, less gain, lower noise.


Are the gains as much as many of us hoped? No. Are they reasonable gains for the intended use case for the camera? Yes. Plus, throw in all the rest of the improved features...65 cross type AF points. Unless the new AF system has the same jitter issues that the 7D had, that should be a winner.

 

[2n10]

I was reading on the internet, I usually don't bother but this really caught my eye, are we that far behind these days.?

No, were not as far behind as DXO indicates. The 7D II "SCORES" poorly on DXO because it hasn't gained anything on the low ISO or color depth front. DXO scores are a very bad way to compare cameras, always have been, always will be.


Ignore DXO scores. Look at the measurements. Look at the ISO chart, and compare it with the original 7D chart (the likely upgraders to the 7D II). What do you see? Has anything improved?


The 7D II did gain about 2/3rds of a stop improvement at higher and very high ISO settings over the 7D. It did not gain at low ISO as it still has roughly the same read noise, and it barely gained on the color fidelity front. Until Canon does something about their readout system, I wouldn't expect the low ISO or color accuracy performance to improve. Canon has a distributed system...the sensor is only one part, there are additional off-die components involved, and I believe it is those off-die components that are really holding them back (and, if the information is correct, those components are not even manufactured by Canon, they are relatively cheap third party components). That's low ISO, though, just low ISO.


(Personally, I was really hoping Canon would do something special with the 7D II sensor, something way out of "normal park" for themselves...but they did not. It would have been nice to see Canon show some real out-of-the-box innovation on the sensor front, but as far as low ISO performance goes, it's pretty run of the mill for Canon. I found that quite disappointing when the 7D II was first released, but in the grand scheme of things...they improved the sensor where it mattered for the 7D II's primary use case.)


The 7D II DID make gains at high ISO, and they are very reasonable gains. The 7D II sensor Q.E. has improved, the total sensor size also increased a little bit (the 7D II has more of a 1.55x crop at 336mm^2 rather than the classic Canon 1.6x crop at 330mm^2...slightly more total sensor area, better high ISO performance), and the FWC increased (by almost 10ke- over the 7D, which is quite considerable, and even 4ke- over the 70D. So, despite the fact that the 7D II barely gained much in terms of total DR at ISO 100, the increased charge capacity of the pixels is still going to mean lower photon shot noise, which is going to mean an improvement in IQ at midtones and highlights.)


Those improvements at ISO 100 ultimately trickle down to the higher ISO settings, allowing more charge at each setting, which is probably where most of Canon's high ISO improvement comes from: more light, less gain, lower noise.


Are the gains as much as many of us hoped? No. Are they reasonable gains for the intended use case for the camera? Yes. Plus, throw in all the rest of the improved features...65 cross type AF points. Unless the new AF system has the same jitter issues that the 7D had, that should be a winner.

Great description. I haven't noticed any jitter like the 7D yet on the 7D2 but I have only had one day with it. Metering is much better, focus stays on much better and recovers faster if it is lost, focus is quicker if you have good contrast. Everything seems improved from the 7D.