May 22, 2013, 05:42:12 AM

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Messages - jrista

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16
Yes the 300/2.8mk2  from  canon looks very good in the MTF lab and Hasselblads measurements

and much more importantly it works well when you use it to take real photographs.  ::)

Had a good time with mine today. 8)

Do you use it with the 2x converter at times?

Also im close to ordering the 500 lens foot to put on the 300 for comfort!, i hope that it will fit....
Since the 500 comes with both a small and big foot , and the small one looks identical to the 300 foot I am kinda anticipating it will!

Will provide a bit more comfort for handholding with my hands

I've used the 2x TC with the EF 300mm f/2.8 L II, and the IQ is phenomenal. Even with the 2x TC, it is still one of the sharpest lenses on earth. Sharper than my 100-400mm at is BEST, by a long shot. Background blur is also dependent upon the ENTRANCE pupil, so even with a 2x TC, your background blur is effectively the same as an f/2.8 lens...so it is a fantastic combination. You really couldn't go wrong with it.

17
Luckily we have ankorwatt to correct Nikon's statements

Mmm, yes...such an extremely lucky happenstance...

Thanks for the analysis! I do wish Nikon would use thinner lines in their MTF charts. The thick bold lines make it difficult to tell exactly where the MTF plot lines lie relative to Canon's...Canon uses much thinner lines these days as the MTFs are all stacking up on 1.0, which makes it easier to see exactly how close to 1.0 the MTF approaches.

18
Because they get similar results with theirs  ED glass

Similar results, but still not as good. You can't forget the weight savings that can be had with fluorite elements as well...it is a lighter material, and often allows FEWER lens elements to be used in the overall design, thus further reducing weight and improving IQ (as every additional lens element has it's own impact on IQ.)

19
I have a friend I shoot with some times. He has the Nikon 500 VR II and the D4. With and without t.c.'s that is an excellent lens. Optics are superb. I shoot with Canon and love it. But in the field I cannot tell a difference between the two in sharpness? And the price is 2K cheaper. This is shooting birds only. My views anyway.

Just for clarity, the argument is not that Nikon's lenses are not good lenses. They definitely are...in fact, some of the best in the world, and better than Canon's older generation of telephoto great whites. Canon has a number of superior factors that just make them a bit better. Fluorite is a valuable material in that it offers superior CA control over UD/SuperUD/ED/SuperED (not by a huge margin, but by enough of a margin), but also because it is a little lighter in weight, and in the case of Canon's newer lenses...it allowed them to eliminate an element (600mm f/4 L had 17 elements in 13 groups, two UD one fluorite; 600mm f/4 L II has 16 elements in 12 groups, two fluorite.) The new Canon 600mm II is 8.6 pounds (3920 grams), vs. the Nikon 600mm which is 11.2 pounds (5060 grams).

The other benefit is tighter matching of firmware between Canon's newer generation of lenses and their newer bodies. The 1D X, 5D III, and probably 7D II all have better firmware feedback for IS and AF (particularly AF). People have been getting at least 5 stops if hand-holdability improvement with IS and newer bodies (sourced from TDP, DPR and other review sites). When it comes to AF, phase-detect AF is as good and consistent as contrast-detect live view AF when a new Mark II lens is paired with a new body (1D X or 5D III; sourced from LensRentals Blog.) AF is also extremely snappy with Canon equipment, something that has NOT been demonstrated even with the top of the line D800 and D4. Overall, the improved IS and AF functionality, along with considerably lighter weight and top notch optical design, lead to overall better real-world IQ with the new Mark II Canon lenses, even though the MTFs are similar (both are similar in the center, Nikon loses out a bit more as you reach the corner.)

20
can anyone tell if those were the Flourite elements that broke in digitalrevTv's real 300mm F4 L lens cup video? the first two front elements seem fine World's First Canon 300mm L Lens Cup (real L lens!)


The EF 300mm f/4 L IS does not use Fluorite. It has two UD elements, the rest are standard optical glass:


21
I have a friend that shoots only Zeiss glass.  I have shot with him multiple times using both Nikon and Canon glass.  My photographs are better than his because he sucks as a photographer.  What a waste of Zeiss glass.  I shoot Canon because in the mid 2000s, they had better autofocus lenses than Nikon.  Now I am committed to Canon because of my lens investment.  However, the next lens I buy will be a Zeiss 21mm f/2.8.  From a historical perspective, Canon has always excelled in long lenses.  Zeiss had better contrast (t* coating) and Leitz made great wide angle lenses.  Their long lenses were lacking.  At least compared to Canon.  The reality is that skill and timing are often the most important deciders.  I honestly believe that once in a lifetime photos depend on what you have at the time the event occurs.  I shoot Canon because I had to make a choice.  Since when I committed they had better af lenses.  If I do not need af (21mm for example) I will buy Zeiss.  I cannot afford Leica so that is not an option.  Now I wish I was better at Photoshop, but I get better every time I use it and there you go... 8)

Factually, Ziess' T* coating is a multicoating, similar to Canon's older SuperSpectra Multicoating. Today, Canon also has SWC, or SubWavelength Coating, which is a nanocoating...and vastly superior to any multicoating. In that respect, modern Canon lenses released over the last few years, the vast majority of which use SWC on the most critical inner elements) have considerably superior microcontrast relative to Zeiss, who has yet to introduce ANY lenses that use a nanocoating. Nikon also has lenses with better microcontrast than Zeiss, as they too use nanocoating on internal lens elements.

TDP also has some reviews of Zeiss lenses. In every comparison, flare and loss of contrast is much worse on all the Zeiss lenses when compared to Canon lenses. Hell, even my older EF 16-35mm f/2.8 L II lens has VASTLY superior flare control compared to the relative Zeiss EF mount lenses. So, sorry...but T* is NOT a Zeiss strength these days...it's holding them back.

A few years back, maybe 2005-2006 era, I'd have said Zeiss made better lenses. From a lens construction standpoint, they DO make very solid lenses that can really take a beating...but they tend to be considerably heavier than any Canon lens. Today, I believe Canon, thanks to a variety of advanced materials and technologies, makes a better DSLR photographic lens than Zeiss. Nanocoating definitely improves their lens' transmission and microcontrast, fluorite elements improve their wide-open lens performance (requiring fewer elements, which is always better than more) and help to greatly reduce weight, titanium and magnesium alloy lens barrels which are both very strong and very light weight. One cannot forget the technological improvements as well. Canon's newer lenses include advanced IS and AF technologies paired with high speed firmware, allowing them to operate very responsively when paired with a new Canon body.

22
Pricewatch Deals / Re: Preorder the EF 200-400 f/4L IS 1.4x TC
« on: May 15, 2013, 09:23:29 AM »
I'm still going to hold out for a 600mm f/4 L IS II. Its only $1200 more, for 2.25x more subject magnification.

A 7d and a 300/4 for even less is an option, kinda.  I'm not a wildlife shooter, but if you're birding do you really need to zoom back to 200mm on a $11799 lens?  It seems most wildlife shooters I see are toting a 600/4 and TCs combination.  I've used my 200/2 on the odd bird if I'm out shooting kid pics, and I can tell you 200 is too short for any bird in the wild, works well for tame deer, but useless for timid tiny birds.

Most professional bird photographers use either a 600mm f/4 or 800mm f/5.6. Art Morris frequently uses his 600mm f/4 L IS II with the 2x TC III on a 1D X. With a 7D, I'd probably use the 600mm with the 1.4x TC III, as it would be similar in focal length (1344mm vs. 1200mm). The big reason to get as much focal length as you can is for birds out on water...Grebes, Ducks, Loons, etc. They can often be quite a ways off shore, and filling the frame is tough.

23
Pricewatch Deals / Re: Preorder the EF 200-400 f/4L IS 1.4x TC
« on: May 14, 2013, 07:27:45 PM »
WOWZERS! $11,799! That is one hell of a hefty price for a mere 200-400mm lens. I understand this baby was highly anticipated, and the Nikon version is highly prized by wildlife shooters...but nearly twelve grand? OUCH.

This puppy damn well better perform like a sun of a gun (and, according to Andy Rouse, it DOES) for that price. I'm still going to hold out for a 600mm f/4 L IS II. Its only $1200 more, for 2.25x more subject magnification.

24
The graphs from the picture shows the MTF at 10cykler per mm a frequency that shows the contrast, super telen as for example 500mm has high contrast but lower MTF values ​​around 40cykler per mm compared with shorter telen,  , therefore all super tele lenses are measured  at 10 cykler per mm , other questions you can  email christian.nilsson@aller.se  technical chief Foto Magazine
All info are in the picture above, you can translate the text

If you want people to believe you, you can't put the burden of doing all the heavy duty work of actually figuring out what the hell the test is, how it was done, with what equipment, and to what methodology and phylosophy to them. YOU are on the hook to PROVE YOUR point. I'm not going to try to manually type in a bunch of test from a photo into a translator to figure out what it says, especially when I am fairly certain the information I want is not included in it. Ankorwatt, YOU need to provide the evidence I've asked for if you want me, or anyone else for that matter, to believe you. Why are the tests of that particular magazine more reputable than any others...such as TDP? At least with TDP, I know exactly how he performs his tests, his methodology, and I have the ability to do direct comparisons myself using his wonderful database.

25
REGARDING  TESTPICTURES I have seen he's test pictures before, http://www.the-digital-picture.com, totally out of control  and no declaration in how many meters etc to the test  target, different combos are optimized for different distance.Different super telephoto lenses are optimized for different distances


Sorry, but your just flat out wrong there. Bryan of TDP is very meticulous. He has also provided a page detailing how he does his ISO chart tests here:

http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Help/ISO-12233.aspx

According to his explanation, every shot of the test chart is sampled at least 10 times, often 15-20 times. The best shot out of all the samples is used to produce the samples he puts up on his site. Ten to twenty shots is more than enough to get a good reading on how well a lens performs.


So here are a real measurements from real MTF test, and by Hasselblads MTF lab IN GOTHENBURG  and for  the magazine  Foto here in Sweden. They conclude , there are no difference between for example 400/2.8 , 500/4  600/4 FROM NIKON AND CANON,   (sorry Krille you can sue me for showing this sides from your excellent Photo magazine FOTO)
THE 4 TESTED LENSES ARE EQUAL  NOW you  can believe in what you want regarding one or others companies sovereignty and about  for example  fluorite glass and there are a lot more companies than Nikon, Canon  how can build decent lenses . example Zeiss.Leitz, Sigma,Pentax, Tokina,Tamron  etc etc
Im sorry that Im  erasing yet another myth
And if Jrista or Neuro  want to discuss Hasselblad credibility in their measurements, I suggest that they directly address Per Nordlund  via e-mail, he is the lens expert  expert at Hasselblad

pictures taken from the magazine with a iPhone


What "real" readings? You have provided no link, no concrete information whatsoever, that explains how they did their test. There is nothing "real" about your anecdote here...its just that, an anecdote. The sample test charts need an explanation about how they were performed...that is missing.

26
Nikon claims that fluorite cracks more easily than glass, and is more susceptible to heat

Both are true.  However, do those facts have any practical relevance in terms of lens use in the field?  A 10 M solution of sulfuric acid is more acidic than an eqimolar solution of hydrochloric acid - but if you annoy someone to the point where they push you into a vat of either there no practical difference - you'd be just as dead either way.  ;)

Wow...I guess I won't ever be messing with Nero in the future... :o

27
Animal Kingdom / Re: Show your Bird Portraits
« on: May 14, 2013, 12:00:53 AM »
Last 3 of 6:

Phenomenal shots, Serendipity. It must feel good to have a little wild friend, eh?

28
EOS Bodies / Re: No 7D Mark II in 2013? [CR2]
« on: May 13, 2013, 11:59:36 PM »
A great shot is a great shot. Weither its from an a1400 or a 1Dx. It's more convienent to get the shot with a 1Dx but If you got it with a a1400, both would be great shots. That's the principle and has nothing to do with equipment.

A great photo is a great photo. It's irrelevant what equipment was used.

Basic failure of logic.  A great photo can be taken with any camera, but it does not follow that every great photo can be taken with any camera.

No one is contesting the former, the latter assumption is where you're incorrect.

This is a rare opportunity to prove that Neuro is wrong....

Let us examine the red squirrel, which will run away if you get too close. Since equipment has nothing to do with how great your shot is, I chose a GoPro and a 60D with a 400mm lens. My goal is to take a picture of a red squirrel for my community newspaper... Both pictures were taken a few minutes ago from the same location.

Picture 1 is the GoPro, Picture 2 is the crop of the squirrel on the GoPro, Picture 3 is the 60D, Picture 4 is the crop  of the 60D. I think we can all agree that there is no difference in quality between the GoPro squirrel crop and the 60D squirrel crop, and I think we can all agree that even if I had a 1DX and a 600F4 lens that the image would still be comparable to the GoPro. Sorry Neuro, there is no noticeable difference between images from the two cameras...

Haha, love that second image man! Superior quality in every respect, no doubt about it!  ;D

29
Some of you are dreaming and living in a Canon market dreamworld, I shall ask if I can get Hasselblads measurements of  super telen  and show them here

Fluorite has advantage and disadvantage  and have been used  100years in different lenses in for example microscope, this is not a Canon concept  or patent if any one thinks that. Synthetically-grown fluorite has done that larger surface/element can be produced. It is just a design choice whether to use fluorite or other ultra low dispersion material. Nikon claims that fluorite cracks more easily than glass, and is more susceptible to heat , and claim their ED glass performs as well. .

Canon was not the first to use fluorite in a lens, however they were the first to use artificially grown fluorite in lenses (1960s). Canon was also the first to create an ultralow dispersion (UD) glass element for camera lenses (1970, identical to ED elements from Nikon ca. 1975), as well as the first to develop SuperUD elements (1990s, identical to SuperED from Nikon, same timeframe). Furthermore, Canon was the first, and only, company to develop viable diffractive optics using a diffraction grating lens (again, 1990s). Canon was the first to utilize multiple large diameter fluorite lenses in an photography lens (2000s). I suspect Canon will be the first to develop viable particle dispersion diffractive optics (2010s?)

When it comes to glass, Canon has definitely been on the edge, and been the first to either develop or employ new optical technologies in their photographic lenses. Canon was a laughing stock for decades at their insistence that a diffraction grating could be used in a photographic lens to increase refraction while controlling dispersion better than any plain optical glass ever could...yet, despite strong arguments that viable diffractive optics were literally "impossible", they persisted, and are now the only company in the world with diffractive optics (a technology they seem to be developing in earnest, with more than half a dozen lens patents based on the technology produced over the last several years...makes me VERY curious what we might see from Canon in the next decade...a whole new era in photographic lenses?) I give a hell of a lot of credit to Canon for continually pushing the envelope when it comes to optics.

One concession to be made to Nikon is their development of a nanocoating, a superior coating to multicoating. Canon developed their own design which operates on the same principal with a different approach, a year later (mid 2000s...although I believe both approaches were based on a paper written by an independent about the technological applications of moth eye design a number of years earlier, not sure if I have a link.) Nikon's "Nano Crystal Coat" was a significant development, and improved overall lens transmission to around 99.95% from the mid 90% range or less, by avoiding reflection entirely (vs. multicoating, which simply aims to cancel out as much reflection as possible...thus still costing in overall transmission because light IS still reflected.) Canon SubWavelength Structure Coating (SWC) is similar and achieves the same 99.95% transmission ratio, but the initial development of the technique still goes to Nikon.

There is no question that fluorite is a softer material than optical glass. Fluorite elements are never used for the front or back elements of a lens due to their greater succeptibility to scratching. That does not diminish their superiority for dispersion control as inner lens elements, however. From what I've gathered from Canon's information on their artificially grown fluorite, it has a more uniform structure, lacking the impurities of natural fluorite, which improves its strength over what was probably used in lenses nearly 100 years ago. I know that the EF 500mm and 600mm f/4 L IS II lens is a favorite of bird and wildlife photographers, most of whom usually have to tromp through the wilderness to get to good wildlife and birding locations...always risking a trip and a fall (which does happen). I've seen photos of people who've had their cameras mauled and chewed on by bears...and the majority of the time, aside from some cosmetic horror, the equipment usually comes out functioning perfectly.

So I have little worry that a fluorite element would actually crack under normal usage, and for all other cases...well, if you don't have insurance on ten thousand dollar equipment, you deserve whatever disaster becomes you. ;)

30
EOS Bodies / Re: No 7D Mark II in 2013? [CR2]
« on: May 13, 2013, 10:57:37 PM »
Wow based on this topic it seems there are a lot of pent up demand for the new 7D

Indeed, Indeed! I really can't wait...especially if its 24mp and 61pt AF. *DROOL*  ;D

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