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Messages - Marsu42

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It is NOT our business! In fact Canon is a nice business (no pun intended!). What we can do is buy or not buy their products...

Canon cares not only about market share, but most likely more about revenue. And here they are falling into the "more of the same" trap: If something doesn't work/sell as expected, re-release the stuff (5d2->6d), start the big marketing machine and raise the price. Market share in a tiny sector of the Canon enterprise might get smaller, i.e. the enthusiast's market, but revenue stays the same and no one gets fired. Unless they run out of breath.

Btw to multiple posters: It has been discussed that it's absolutely legit to care if one has invested not in Canon shares, but in Canon products. If some people feel the discussion should end with the decision to buy a product or not, a rumors site maybe isn't for you.

EOS Bodies / Re: POLL: With what features would you consider the 6d?
« on: September 18, 2012, 06:03:57 PM »
I said many times before: Put the 5D3 (or 1DX) sensor in a cardboard box, 1 AF point, and price it at $1200 and i'd buy one.
I still stand by that.

Obviously Canon is not prepared to to that and wants any ff camera to be more expensive than the top crop one, so the question for most people is what features should have been added - if Canon marketing would ask anyone besides themselves.

The Magic Lantern devs are the one and UNPAID asset Canon has vs Nikon - unbelievable Canon is in no way interested in supporting them. If ml ran on the 7d two years ago I'd have bought it over the 60d.

EOS Bodies / Re: POLL: With what features would you consider the 6d?
« on: September 18, 2012, 05:44:57 PM »
you forgot 100% viewfinder  ;)

... added, thanks - it's hard to remember all the things Canon has cut from the 6d :-p

EOS Bodies / POLL: With what features would you consider the 6d?
« on: September 18, 2012, 05:34:33 PM »
General opinion seems to be that the 6d is too little, too late. In my opinion Canon should at least have added all the latest gimmicks of the rebels like af with all cross-points, swivel/touch-screen and build-in flash to make it a "ff rebel" - but they fell even short of that.

So what's your opinion, what's missing from the 6d that prevents you from buying it? Please tick only the features you really expect at $2000+, the 6d obviously cannot be a just a cheaper 5d3.

Btw: if I've forgotten something I can still add it to the list.

EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: Canon Announces the Canon EOS 6D DSLR
« on: September 18, 2012, 05:25:30 PM »
In fact, Canon's global Japan site places the 6D BEHIND the 7D in it's pecking order...check it out...1D series, 5D, 7D and THEN 6D....then 60D.

This probably means that you will get less cps points (US) or only cps silver (Europe) for the 6d as its not "professional". But this is mostly marketing and doesn't necessarily mean the 6d is worse than 7d/5d2.

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon EOS 6D Official Specs
« on: September 18, 2012, 07:33:49 AM »
That would mean that the cross is composed by 3 lines (2 working a 5.6 and one at 2.8), but I find no back-up on Canon website for that assumption. How can you say that?

You've got to ask the op (see my link), but Dr. Neuro usually is 100% reliable concerning this type of information and the specs as I understand them match his explanation.

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon EOS 6D Official Specs
« on: September 18, 2012, 06:42:05 AM »
As far as I understand it

Nope, a lot of people got that the center point wrong including me, here's the explanation:

... concerning the non-cross points on the 6d, we'll probably have to wait for real hardware reviews to know how they perform for one shot or servo af.

I check their website and they state they have 5+ units in stock.

I checked the local retailers in Berlin. But if some budget online shop says "5+ units in stock" it doesn't mean anything since it cannot be disproven, a common business model to attract customers. That's why there's such a high fee for payment on delivery in contrast to up front...

EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: Canon Announces the Canon EOS 6D DSLR
« on: September 18, 2012, 06:10:55 AM »
The 6D center point has an f/5.6 cross in a '+' shape with a single f/2.8 horizontal line '-' superimposed. It behaves like the first type (5DII etc.) with an f/2.8 or faster lens, but is better in that it remains cross type down to f/5.6.

Thx for the explanation - so at least it's no regression in comparison to the 5d2 after all. Why do you think Canon did this and didn't add a dual cross type sensor - any possible tech reasons like the -3ev sensitivity, except protecting the more expensive 5d3?

Don't know if anyone's interested but the 5D3 is on sale here in Finland at 2799eur including and extra battery pack.

Though my finnish is past its prime :-p this sounds quite interesting - if there aren't any hidden catches like €100 shipping costs or a waiting time of 1 month until delivery when all other shops sell it @€2800 too.

Btw: Everywhere else the 5d3 AND 5d2 price jumped up €100 after the 6d announcement, and the 5d3 is often out of stock :-(

EOS Bodies / Re: 6D or 5D Mk II
« on: September 18, 2012, 05:08:14 AM »
When was the last time a digital camera went up in price because it was discontinued, it's not a collectable, it will go down in price.
Not sure about bodies but the used price of the 24-70mm mk i seems to have risen since the release of the mk ii...

If the 6d af is at least "acceptable" and the 5d3 price continues to sink, I don't think the 5d2 will rise in price - though it might stick where it is now. The price 24-70 mk1 is ridiculously high atm, but imho that's just because the mk2 is not on the shelves in numbers and the used mk1 market is thinned by the long mk2 delay.

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon EOS 6D Official Specs
« on: September 18, 2012, 04:23:47 AM »
Namely, just the 11 points of af and the 1/180th flash sync.   How the 60d has 1/250th flash sync and the 5d mark iii has 1/200th and the 6d has 1/180th is just mindboggling.

Doesn't really matter except for 2nd curtain, just use hss - the 6d has no pop-up flash so all your external flashes will likely support it. And 1/180s x-sync is not that much slower than 1/200s - full frame curtains are larger and thus 1/250s is easier achieved on crop. But of course the 1d 1/300s x-sync is made to differentiate it from the "budget" 5d3/5d2.

no touchscreen and price to remain the same? or at least could have a swivel one!

I guess the 6d components are derived from the 5d3 production line, thus no swivel/touchscreen. Would certainly have been nice and added a feature that would make the $2099 price more realistic... so why no built-in flash, Canon?

Canon General / Re: Loving Canon right now.
« on: September 18, 2012, 04:17:30 AM »
Reading through recent forum posts on here, I get the impression that most people have gotten really fed up with the company and their products...

Because Canon a) shamelessly exploits brand loyalties (misplaced as they may be, but I've been shooting Canon for two decades) and b) deliberately cripple "lesser" cameras to make users upgrade (60d vs 50d: no afma = 7d upgrade; 6d vs 5d2: no true center cross sensor @f2.8 = 5d3 upgrade).

let's compare the 7D with the 60D...
launch price: 7D $1699 ; 60D $1099. The price difference between the cameras is $600.
the specs difference is huge; many of us know them, but let me remind them:
7D features over 60D

But when the 60d was released, the 7d hadn't dropped in price as much as the 5d3 now - and paying $1100->$1700 is different than $2100->$2800, no matter the absolute difference. I think Canon expects the 6d to drop in price very fast, that's why they set a high start point.

Btw: we'll have to see about the real world af and sensor performance of the 6d, because the 60d (also?) has better iq than the 7d due to less banding and it also added some gimmicks (60d: swivel screen, 6d: wifi/gps). The most important thing about the 6d is that it most likely will run Magic Lantern :-)

EOS Bodies / Re: 6D or 5D Mk II
« on: September 18, 2012, 03:50:32 AM »
Since the 6D is post-600EX-RT, I assume there would be some advantage to having a 6D over a 5DII for HSS off-camera, though I know some people are not feeling limited by the 5DII in that regard.

While Canon says otherwise, it has been confirmed by multiple users that hss & x-sync works just fine with 600rt + 5d2. You won't get the in-camera menus and the new option flash groups, though.

The real advantage would have been if the 6d had a rf-controller next to gps/wifi - would certainly have been possible since it's not full metal.

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