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Author Topic: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More  (Read 112883 times)

hgraf

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #75 on: January 07, 2014, 11:00:10 AM »
I know this thread has been exclusively about the 50mm, but I had a question about the 18-200. Why in the world do third party manufacturers go to 6.3 on the long end? Not being able to AF after 5.6 seems like a deal killer for anyone in the target market. What am I missing?  :o

There are many third party zooms that go beyond 5.6, and they focus fine. Why? They lie to the camera and say they are at 5.6 for focusing even though they aren't.

I do wonder if the zooms that SAY they only go down to 5.6 actually don't also go a little further and lie to the camera. I've always had that suspicion of one of my lenses. It just seems a little dark fully zoomed then 5.6 should be to my eyes. Maybe I'm wrong.

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #75 on: January 07, 2014, 11:00:10 AM »

Slyham

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #76 on: January 07, 2014, 11:10:09 AM »
Thanks neuro and hgraf. Does AF suffer because the AF point is expecting 5.6 but getting 6.3?

ahsanford

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #77 on: January 07, 2014, 11:16:15 AM »
Canon should be ashamed to offer (in the future) non-L 50 mm 1.8 IS....

Respectfully disagree.  Each of the non-L IS refresh lenses are terrific.

I think it will be a battle of IS + small design (Canon) vs. speed + larger design.  I'm guessing both will have excellent IQ.

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YuengLinger

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #78 on: January 07, 2014, 11:17:40 AM »
"I see pros still using the old Canon 50 F/1.4 at weddings, concerts, etc. because the 1.2 lens isn't for them."

+1  So do I, as I've been lucky enough to assist a $10k wedding photographer, and she uses the 50mm 1.4 often for posed environmental shots of bride, groom, and other key participants individually. 

My only personal gripe with my copy is just too soft below 1.8; however, I find its AF quick, almost equal to my 24-105mm in lower light.


"The thing is, even New Sigma struggles a lot with AF..."

-1!  Don't know if this statement is based on personal experience or web echoes, but my Sigma 35mm 1.4 is another great AF performer, center spot or outer, indoors or out.  I usually use it from two feet to twelve feet away from subject, people walking quickly towards me or past me, no problem nailing AF on the eyes or face.  I have several of Canon's best AF lenses to compare to, and see no problem at all with this Sigma.

I had what was likely a good copy of the Canon ef 35mm 1.4L, but it was too soft wide open and had too much purple fringing, noticeable even at 5.6 in a few shots.  Why do I say good copy?  Because I sent it to CPS and they sent it back saying it was "well with in specifications."  (I have sent lenses to them with complaints, e.g. a kit 24-105mm having strange contrast issues and dodgy IS, and had the lenses serviced and returned wonderfully improved.  So I did TRY to give my ef 35mm 1.4 a fair chance.)  To be fair to the Canon, for the occasional landscape shot (on a tripod), it was astoundingly sharp for middle and far distance.  Incredible even.

I love sample images I see online from the Canon ef 50mm 1.2L, and I've gone out for location portraits with a local photography professor who uses practically nothing else and gets consistently great shots, but the pro I mentioned above, and some thoughtful reviews online convinced me to save my money on this one, putting it instead towards my favorite portrait lens, the ef 85mm 1.2L.

Cheers to Sigma for cranking up the competition!  If I ever have to replace my ef 50mm 1.4, I hope the Sigma reviews well!
« Last Edit: January 07, 2014, 11:30:06 AM by YuengLinger »

neuroanatomist

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #79 on: January 07, 2014, 11:27:53 AM »
I do wonder if the zooms that SAY they only go down to 5.6 actually don't also go a little further and lie to the camera. I've always had that suspicion of one of my lenses. It just seems a little dark fully zoomed then 5.6 should be to my eyes. Maybe I'm wrong.

You're not wrong, for two reasons. 

The first is rounding - if you look at the patents, the 70-300L is f/5.85 at the long end, for example.  That's not just true for variable aperture zooms, either - for example, the 24-70/2.8L II is really f/2.91, and the 200-400/4 + 1.4x is actually f/4.12 without the TC and f/5.77 with the TC.  Different "f/5.6" lenses have different real apertures.

The second is that the f/number is calculated, not measured (and the real f/number differs from the canonical stop increments because the lens' focal length isn't quite as long as stated, or the iris diaphragm diameter isn't quite as big, or more likely both).  But it's still a calculated number, stated in f-stops.  If you actually measure the light transmission, that's T-stops, and you always find that some light is lost (mostly due to internal reflection of light - antireflective coatings aren't perfect, so more elements usually means a lower T-stop).  For example, the 24-70/2.8L II and 16-35/2.8L II are both f/2.8 lenses, but the 24-70 has a T-stop of 3.0 (meaning 0.2-stops are lost), while the 16-35 has a T-stop of 3.3, so at 24mm f/2.8 it's 1/3-stop darker than the 24-70 at f/2.8.  If you're shooting in an autoexposure mode, the camera will compensate if the difference is big enough.

Thanks neuro and hgraf. Does AF suffer because the AF point is expecting 5.6 but getting 6.3?

Theoretically, the accuracy would be slightly less.  Practically, it probably makes no difference (or at least, any difference is insignificant compared to the AF issues that result from the 3rd party lens makers needing to reverse-engineer the AF protocols).
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mrsfotografie

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #80 on: January 07, 2014, 11:30:02 AM »
I made a ahem paper "replica" to get my head around the size. Seems about the same size and thickness as an average coffee mug.

Observe.

Without comparing like for like, that is a big lens. In that sense I think I prefer my current Sigma 1.4, just for its size (and it is also not a very small lens)...
5D3, 5D2, G5X, G16 | SY14/2.8, V20/3.5, 28/2.8 IS, Ʃ35/1.4, 50/1.8, 50/1.8 STM, Ʃ50/1.4 EX, 100/2.8L IS Macro, 16-35/4L IS, 24-105/4L IS, 70-200/2.8L IS II, 1.4x II, 2.0x III, 70-300L IS, Ʃ150-600 OS HSM S

ahsanford

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #81 on: January 07, 2014, 11:35:21 AM »
I made a ahem paper "replica" to get my head around the size. Seems about the same size and thickness as an average coffee mug.

Observe.

Without comparing like for like, that is a big lens. In that sense I think I prefer my current Sigma 1.4, just for its size (and it is also not a very small lens)...

The coffee mug cracks me up - nice work. 

I checked the listed specs and compared them to TDP's database.  The new Sigma lens is as big as the recent Canon 24-70 F/4L IS (fully closed / widest FL).  The hood will undoubtedly be bigger for the Sigma, as the small petal hood of the Canon zoom is made for the 24mm FL, I believe.

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #81 on: January 07, 2014, 11:35:21 AM »

mrsfotografie

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #82 on: January 07, 2014, 11:41:46 AM »

Good for lens collectors, but I imagine many people in the field would rather take the 35mm and do some cropping. That's what I'd do, at least.

Shoot a subject against any background with the subject being the same size with both 35 and 50 and you'll see just how different it looks. A 35 and 50 are different beasts.

I'm not saying that a 35mm replaces EVERY 50mm. I'm saying that, for me at least, it replaces a 50mm with the same characteristics and optical signature. I'd rather invest the money in something that really lets me do something different or at least in a different way.

Always in my opinion, of course, 50mm is a useless FL unless the lens you're using is really special (and I found a little gem in the CV Nokton 58mm). It's usually too long for a walkaround and too short for portraits. I'd rather have with me a 35mm and a 85mm instead of a 35mm and a 50mm - again, especially if both lenses have similar characteristics.

This time of year (when it's generally dark and glum) I find I carry both the 35 and the 50 a lot of the time. These focal lengths really are very different and have their specific uses although they can both perform as a general purpose lens depending on ones preference. Aside from the angle of view, the perspective is much more important. It took me a while to understand the 35, but in certain situations it offers me the ability to create pictures with more 'drama' to them.
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jhanken

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #83 on: January 07, 2014, 11:42:16 AM »
I have the 35mm Art and the previous 50mm Sigmas, both of which I love. This is a killer development, but I love my current 50mm and probably won't be tempted to trade up.  The lens I am really waiting for is the 85mm Art, now THAT lens I will scoop up in a second to replace the Canon 85mm 1.8.  The Canon is a fine lens, but that half a stop make a difference in low light.

Keep 'em coming, Sigma! This is great for us gear heads.
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zlatko

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #84 on: January 07, 2014, 11:44:26 AM »
When I said Canon has been sleeping "here"...I was referring to 50mm focal length.  This is the NORMAL focal length for FF and the Canon offerings have been in my mind disrespectful of photography.  I think Canon should be offering something solid, reliable and competent in this BASIC staple. The do not, as far as I am concerned. I bought the old Sigma 50mm f/1.4 (not without its own problems...but apparently I bought a good copy), because the canon offerings were so anemic...and the price on the L lens for what it offers is embarrassing. Also, if they ever do come to bat on this situation, (a 50mm f/2.0 IS is NOT addressing this BASIC issue) you can bet the pricing will suck the air out of the room.  Whatever is going on over at Sigma Corp. I for one hope that they keep sending lots of it our way. Hope this new Sigma busts the 50mm situation wide open.  We will see. (fingers crossed).

Canon offers five flavors of standard lens (40/2.8, 50/2.5, 50/1.8, 50/1.4, 50/1.2).  Four of them are very affordable.  I would not call that "disrespectful of photography".  Each of them offers some advantages, and each has found many buyers, and each has made many fine photos.  Your old Sigma 50/1.4 is about $500 or about 25% more than Canon's 50/1.4, so it should be better at least in some way.  Now Sigma offers a $900 version of a 50mm, which is much less affordable than four of Canon's offerings.  And it's not weather-sealed.  Should Canon have offered a $900 large-sized non-weather-sealed 50mm lens?  That would be nice, but can you really blame Canon for not filling every possible price niche.  And I disagree about a 50mm f/2 IS.  That would be a "basic staple".  A 50/2 has been a basic staple in the photography world for generations.  Adding IS would make it even more attractive, especially for video.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2014, 11:46:08 AM by zlatko »

AcutancePhotography

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #85 on: January 07, 2014, 11:53:37 AM »
I'd rather have with me a 35mm and a 85mm instead of a 35mm and a 50mm - again, especially if both lenses have similar characteristics.

That was my thought process when I started rebuilding my lens kit.  I am usually of the mindset of either 35 or 50 but not both.   But with this new Sigma 35mm A lens, it is tempting to add a 50 to stick between my 35 and 85.
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ahsanford

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #86 on: January 07, 2014, 11:55:13 AM »
When I said Canon has been sleeping "here"...I was referring to 50mm focal length.  This is the NORMAL focal length for FF and the Canon offerings have been in my mind disrespectful of photography.  I think Canon should be offering something solid, reliable and competent in this BASIC staple. The do not, as far as I am concerned. I bought the old Sigma 50mm f/1.4 (not without its own problems...but apparently I bought a good copy), because the canon offerings were so anemic...and the price on the L lens for what it offers is embarrassing. Also, if they ever do come to bat on this situation, (a 50mm f/2.0 IS is NOT addressing this BASIC issue) you can bet the pricing will suck the air out of the room.  Whatever is going on over at Sigma Corp. I for one hope that they keep sending lots of it our way. Hope this new Sigma busts the 50mm situation wide open.  We will see. (fingers crossed).


Canon offers five flavors of standard lens (40/2.8, 50/2.5, 50/1.8, 50/1.4, 50/1.2).  Four of them are very affordable.  I would not call that "disrespectful of photography".  Each of them offers some advantages, and each has found many buyers, and each has made many fine photos.  Your old Sigma 50/1.4 is about $500 or about 25% more than Canon's 50/1.4, so it should be better at least in some way.  Now Sigma offers a $900 version of a 50mm, which is much less affordable than four of Canon's offerings.  And it's not weather-sealed.  Should Canon have offered a $900 large-sized non-weather-sealed 50mm lens?  That would be nice, but can you really blame Canon for not filling every possible price niche.  And I disagree about a 50mm f/2 IS.  That would be a "basic staple".  A 50/2 has been a basic staple in the photography world for generations.  Adding IS would make it even more attractive, especially for video.

Agree.  This forum seems to prefer the prospect of a large F/1.4 lens, but many, many photogs would snap up an F/2 IS with all the modern niceties of the 24/28/35 non-L refreshes.

F/1.4 glass creates unique images -- uniquely soft images everywhere other than the center.  Those aren't the shots I want to take.  I still think this new Sigma will be sharper when equivalently stopped down than the new Canon 50mm F/'something' IS (we still don't know the max aperture yet), but not by so much that I don't want IS and a much smaller lens.

My mind's not made up by any means -- let's see the reviews!  But my 'overall lens sensibilities' / 'best lens for what I shoot' spidey sense remains pretty firmly in the 'small + IS is better' camp.

- A

zlatko

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #87 on: January 07, 2014, 11:58:12 AM »
By the way, all of the problems of the 50/1.2L didn't stop this guy from putting it to good use:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/petezelewski/

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #87 on: January 07, 2014, 11:58:12 AM »

candyman

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #88 on: January 07, 2014, 12:04:16 PM »
I'm very happy with my current f/1.4 Sigma - but did anyone notice the maximum magnification ratio of 1:5.6?  The MMR of the current model is only 1:7.4, something I stumble into when I do museums with this lens.


I used to own the 50mm f/1.4 and used it on a 550D and 7D. Great lens for museums.
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Viggo

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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #89 on: January 07, 2014, 12:28:15 PM »
By the way, all of the problems of the 50/1.2L didn't stop this guy from putting it to good use:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/petezelewski/

Absolutely, but they are pretty much all dead center, and it doesn't appear to be that much shots wide open. Awesome portraits though, and it has nothing to do with the lens, or at least very little. Light and subject and balancing ambient and flash is done soo right.
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Re: Sigma Announces the 50 f/1.4 Art Lens & More
« Reply #89 on: January 07, 2014, 12:28:15 PM »