September 19, 2014, 04:05:15 AM

Author Topic: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?  (Read 1532 times)

JohanCruyff

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Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« on: July 23, 2014, 08:47:26 AM »
I recently installed Magic Lantern on my M and appreciated the improved ability of manual focussing, thanks to the focus peaking feature.
 
At almost-macro distance, the 100mm IS Macro L plus focus peaking gave me better result than using autofocus, so now I'm more confident about manual focus and I wonder whether an investment in "old" lenses (plus adapter) is worth or not.
 
With regard to one popular FD lens, I think that it is not worth to spend some 50 €/$ for an old FD 50mm F/1.8, because I can buy a new EF 50mm F/1.8 (which I could borrow to my daughter's 1100D/T3 or to my own 5D) for 90/100 €/$... but I'm almost sure that there are ancient lenses with better value for money than the 50mm F/1.8, or with unique features.
 
 
I don't own any legacy gear, but please feel free to post in this thread not only suggestions on possible purchases you made, but also your esperiences with lenses that you already owned and that woke up due to the arrival of a mirrorless body.
 
 
Thank you in advance for your advice, fellow friends from Canonrumors Forum! :)
Italian amateur. Gear: i) 5d Classic, 17-40 F/4 L, 24-105mm F/4 IS L, 100mm F/2.8 IS L, 70-200 F/4 IS L. & EOS M, 22 F/2, 18-55 + Mount Adapter, 55-250 F/4-5.6 IS STM
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Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« on: July 23, 2014, 08:47:26 AM »

noncho

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #1 on: July 23, 2014, 10:23:08 AM »
You seems to have good lenses, so if you look at old film lenses should be something really unique.
I have Canon 40 2.8 pancake and even with adapter is small enough for M.
You can also wait for native 50mm lens for M.

sdsr

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2014, 02:44:05 PM »
It depends on what you mean by "worth it".  As you may have noticed, lots of vintage manual lenses are cheap, and lots of those can be very good to superb; it's an inexpensive way to play around with a variety of lenses.  Given the tiny size of the M you'll likely want small lenses.  If so, Pentax is perhaps the best place to start - a few weeks ago a bought a Pentax Super-Takumar 50mm 1.4 for c. $100 which makes excellent images, and an even smaller Pentax-M 50mm 1.7 for less than half that.  Check out the pentax forum for vast numbers of user reviews.  Your 100L is a marvelous lens, of course, but you might rather use something a lot smaller, such as the superb Nikon 55mm 2.8 macro (if you want to get close) or the Nikon E series 100mm 2.8, which looks tiny next to a 100L.  I recently bought both those lenses in excellent shape for c. $120 each (and could have paid less if I had tried harder).  With the right adapters, the range to choose from is vast.  (I use them on my Olympus M43 and Sony a7r & a6000, but I don't see why they wouldn't work at least as well on an EOS-M.)

Rocky

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2014, 03:35:17 PM »
I recently installed Magic Lantern on my M and appreciated the improved ability of manual focussing, thanks to the focus peaking feature.
 

What is your impression on the Magic Lantern?? Did you see any  problem?? Which built day did you used? I am thinking about installing magic Lantern on my EOS-M. But I have also read that there are problems with the shutter release.  Thanks for the advice in advance.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2014, 04:30:09 PM by Rocky »

JohanCruyff

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #4 on: July 24, 2014, 05:03:51 AM »
You seems to have good lenses, so if you look at old film lenses should be something really unique.
I have Canon 40 2.8 pancake and even with adapter is small enough for M.
You can also wait for native 50mm lens for M.
Thank you.
 
It depends on what you mean by "worth it".  As you may have noticed, lots of vintage manual lenses are cheap, and lots of those can be very good to superb; it's an inexpensive way to play around with a variety of lenses.  Given the tiny size of the M you'll likely want small lenses.  If so, Pentax is perhaps the best place to start - a few weeks ago a bought a Pentax Super-Takumar 50mm 1.4 for c. $100 which makes excellent images, and an even smaller Pentax-M 50mm 1.7 for less than half that.  Check out the pentax forum for vast numbers of user reviews.  Your 100L is a marvelous lens, of course, but you might rather use something a lot smaller, such as the superb Nikon 55mm 2.8 macro (if you want to get close) or the Nikon E series 100mm 2.8, which looks tiny next to a 100L.  I recently bought both those lenses in excellent shape for c. $120 each (and could have paid less if I had tried harder).  With the right adapters, the range to choose from is vast.  (I use them on my Olympus M43 and Sony a7r & a6000, but I don't see why they wouldn't work at least as well on an EOS-M.)

Thanks for your suggestions. You're right, I would like to try a light/small lens on my M.
I also have to consider that a new 50mm Canon (F/1.8 IS?) could (will eventually) be delivered, so I'm not sure about having (in the future) two prime lenses with the same focal lenght.
Maybe something different (the 100mms you mentioned, or a good 35mm...).
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
I recently installed Magic Lantern on my M and appreciated the improved ability of manual focussing, thanks to the focus peaking feature.
 

What is your impression on the Magic Lantern?? Did you see any  problem?? Which built day did you used? I am thinking about installing magic Lantern on my EOS-M. But I have also read that there are problems with the shutter release.  Thanks for the advice in advance.

No problems so far, but I just played with it two hours, so I'm not (yet) a reliable tester.
Italian amateur. Gear: i) 5d Classic, 17-40 F/4 L, 24-105mm F/4 IS L, 100mm F/2.8 IS L, 70-200 F/4 IS L. & EOS M, 22 F/2, 18-55 + Mount Adapter, 55-250 F/4-5.6 IS STM
ii) Wife: Canon G12
iii) First Daughter: Canon 1100D, 18-55 IS iv) Son: Canon A1000IS v) Second Daughter: Nikon L21

ecka

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #5 on: July 24, 2014, 09:49:50 AM »
I also have to consider that a new 50mm Canon (F/1.8 IS?) could (will eventually) be delivered, so I'm not sure about having (in the future) two prime lenses with the same focal lenght.
Maybe something different (the 100mms you mentioned, or a good 35mm...).

You may also have to consider that a new 50mm f/1.8 IS will cost $300-$400 and still won't deliver the umph. If I was looking for a really small manual lens for my mirrorless camera, I would consider something like Leica Summicron-C 40mm f/2 (I think it is $500-$800 used).
FF + primes !

Rocky

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #6 on: July 24, 2014, 01:31:42 PM »
I also have to consider that a new 50mm Canon (F/1.8 IS?) could (will eventually) be delivered, so I'm not sure about having (in the future) two prime lenses with the same focal lenght.
Maybe something different (the 100mms you mentioned, or a good 35mm...).

You may also have to consider that a new 50mm f/1.8 IS will cost $300-$400 and still won't deliver the umph. If I was looking for a really small manual lens for my mirrorless camera, I would consider something like Leica Summicron-C 40mm f/2 (I think it is $500-$800 used).
40mm on crop will be 64mm angle of view in 35mm. It may be too narrow. If you  want to go to the route of Leica  lens. 35mm f 2.0 (Summicron) will be a better choice. It is about the same size of the 40mm f 2.0. If the price is too high, then you may try the 35mm f2.8 Summaron.

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #6 on: July 24, 2014, 01:31:42 PM »

ecka

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #7 on: July 24, 2014, 06:13:10 PM »
I also have to consider that a new 50mm Canon (F/1.8 IS?) could (will eventually) be delivered, so I'm not sure about having (in the future) two prime lenses with the same focal lenght.
Maybe something different (the 100mms you mentioned, or a good 35mm...).

You may also have to consider that a new 50mm f/1.8 IS will cost $300-$400 and still won't deliver the umph. If I was looking for a really small manual lens for my mirrorless camera, I would consider something like Leica Summicron-C 40mm f/2 (I think it is $500-$800 used).

40mm on crop will be 64mm angle of view in 35mm. It may be too narrow. If you  want to go to the route of Leica  lens. 35mm f 2.0 (Summicron) will be a better choice. It is about the same size of the 40mm f 2.0. If the price is too high, then you may try the 35mm f2.8 Summaron.

Well, 50mm isn't any less narrow than 40mm :). There are some interesting Voigtlander lenses too - 21/1.8 Ultron, 35/1.2 Nokton, not cheap though.
FF + primes !

Rocky

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #8 on: July 24, 2014, 08:49:37 PM »
My Leica-M to EOS-M adapter came in today. I have been playing with a 35/2 Summicron from my 45 years old Leica collection. The 35/2 Summicron is my favorite lens.  It is sharp and contrasy when stopped down to f 4.0 in the film application. Tripod and manual focusing  was used ( with 10X magnification) for both indoor and outdoor shots. Outdoor is just shooting down the street with the center of interest 60 ft away and 150 feet away. Indoor target is a unframed (no glass) fine painting with a lot of detail (Flash is used to avoid hand shaking). F2.0 to F8.0 was used to eliminate focusing error for all indoor and out door shots..
Result : It is shocking. As a pixel peeper, the Canon 22mm f 2.0 beats the Summicron in both contrast and sharpness.
Conclusion: It is fun to play with the old lens. I suppose the old lens was not built for 18 MP resolution Bayer sensor with AA filter ( may be that is why Leica digital M is not using AA filter). Is it worthwhile to use old lens on the EOS-M??

Update: Tried the Voigtland 25/4 after diner (indoor) it is worst than the Summicron.
              Tried the Elmar 50/2.8. It is a touch better than the  Summicron. But still below the Canon22mm 2.0
                             Elmar 50/2.8 is a very sharp lens at its time. It it so sharp that it was double duty as a 
                                        macro lens with the proper attachment

Final verdict: I give up, I do not even  want to try the Elmar 90/4 or the Hector 135/4.5. These two are too big and too heavy for the EOS-M anyway.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2014, 01:27:22 AM by Rocky »

ecka

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2014, 09:38:08 AM »
My Leica-M to EOS-M adapter came in today. I have been playing with a 35/2 Summicron from my 45 years old Leica collection. The 35/2 Summicron is my favorite lens.  It is sharp and contrasy when stopped down to f 4.0 in the film application. Tripod and manual focusing  was used ( with 10X magnification) for both indoor and outdoor shots. Outdoor is just shooting down the street with the center of interest 60 ft away and 150 feet away. Indoor target is a unframed (no glass) fine painting with a lot of detail (Flash is used to avoid hand shaking). F2.0 to F8.0 was used to eliminate focusing error for all indoor and out door shots..
Result : It is shocking. As a pixel peeper, the Canon 22mm f 2.0 beats the Summicron in both contrast and sharpness.
Conclusion: It is fun to play with the old lens. I suppose the old lens was not built for 18 MP resolution Bayer sensor with AA filter ( may be that is why Leica digital M is not using AA filter). Is it worthwhile to use old lens on the EOS-M??

Update: Tried the Voigtland 25/4 after diner (indoor) it is worst than the Summicron.
              Tried the Elmar 50/2.8. It is a touch better than the  Summicron. But still below the Canon22mm 2.0
                             Elmar 50/2.8 is a very sharp lens at its time. It it so sharp that it was double duty as a 
                                        macro lens with the proper attachment

Final verdict: I give up, I do not even  want to try the Elmar 90/4 or the Hector 135/4.5. These two are too big and too heavy for the EOS-M anyway.

There are plenty of modern lenses that are not good enough for 18MP resolution Bayer sensor with AA filter or without one. Sharpness is not all that matters. Every lens is a compromise between sharpness, aberrations, bokeh, build, focus features and price. I never was a huge fan of adapting old luxury lenses, because all the decent ones just cost too much and I feel the same about overpriced modern crop optics (like m4/3). Nice and small f/5.6 zoom on FF makes a lot more sense to me.
The EF-M 22/2 STM is nice, no need for replacing it with an old junk (there is nothing better or even similar in its price range). I hope more is coming.
FF + primes !

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #10 on: July 25, 2014, 10:28:53 AM »
Adapting old FD or FL lenses is fine if they are free, but don't pay a overpriced amount for them.  I often find a old Camera with one for $5.00.  I have never been able to find a old FD "L" lens or any one that was valuable.

The 50mm f/1.8 is the best wide aperture lens for the $$, its just not particularly durable.

If you are going to adapt a old lens, there are some that are supposed to be pretty good from Olympus, I have almost every brand, but I don't adapt them to use, I test them and then pass them on along with a matching body to photography students or film enthusiasts.  I'm spoiled by having a bunch of "L" lenses.

Rocky

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #11 on: July 25, 2014, 12:26:28 PM »
My intention is to use my "good old lens" along side with the 22/2.0 and the 18-55mm  for the EOS-M. Never have any thought of replace them and going back to "stone age".With the Summiron, I will have a 56/2.0 ( 35mmm equivalent). With the Elmar, I will have a 80/2.8 ( 2 stops faster than the zoom). Together, with an adapter on each lens it will only take up 3.5 inches of space. Leica have a ring that allows you to put two lenses together in back to back position. The Elmar is collapsible. That will make a very small travel outfit. I do not even need to buy the two lenses.  Another reason is the Bokeh on both lenses are excellent due to the perfectly round aperture with 10 0r 12 blades.

Too bad this idea does not plan out.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2014, 01:35:04 PM by Rocky »

ecka

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2014, 02:46:06 PM »
My intention is to use my "good old lens" along side with the 22/2.0 and the 18-55mm  for the EOS-M. Never have any thought of replace them and going back to "stone age".With the Summiron, I will have a 56/2.0 ( 35mmm equivalent). With the Elmar, I will have a 80/2.8 ( 2 stops faster than the zoom). Together, with an adapter on each lens it will only take up 3.5 inches of space. Leica have a ring that allows you to put two lenses together in back to back position. The Elmar is collapsible. That will make a very small travel outfit. I do not even need to buy the two lenses.  Another reason is the Bokeh on both lenses are excellent due to the perfectly round aperture with 10 0r 12 blades.

Too bad this idea does not plan out.

That would be a nice "stone age" travel kit :).
Actually, you have 56/3.2 with the Summicron on EOS-M, and 80/4.5 with the Elmar. The bokeh would still be nice, but nothing like FF. That's the price of the crop.
FF + primes !

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2014, 02:46:06 PM »

Rocky

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #13 on: July 25, 2014, 04:14:30 PM »
My intention is to use my "good old lens" along side with the 22/2.0 and the 18-55mm  for the EOS-M. Never have any thought of replace them and going back to "stone age".With the Summiron, I will have a 56/2.0 ( 35mmm equivalent). With the Elmar, I will have a 80/2.8 ( 2 stops faster than the zoom). Together, with an adapter on each lens it will only take up 3.5 inches of space. Leica have a ring that allows you to put two lenses together in back to back position. The Elmar is collapsible. That will make a very small travel outfit. I do not even need to buy the two lenses.  Another reason is the Bokeh on both lenses are excellent due to the perfectly round aperture with 10 0r 12 blades.

Too bad this idea does not plan out.

That would be a nice "stone age" travel kit :).
Actually, you have 56/3.2 with the Summicron on EOS-M, and 80/4.5 with the Elmar. The bokeh would still be nice, but nothing like FF. That's the price of the crop.
56/2.0 and 80/2.8 is from light gathering point of view, not background burling effect. that is the same reason why Canon call the 22mm  as 2.0 not 3.2.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2014, 04:17:45 PM by Rocky »

ecka

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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #14 on: July 25, 2014, 04:37:37 PM »
My intention is to use my "good old lens" along side with the 22/2.0 and the 18-55mm  for the EOS-M. Never have any thought of replace them and going back to "stone age".With the Summiron, I will have a 56/2.0 ( 35mmm equivalent). With the Elmar, I will have a 80/2.8 ( 2 stops faster than the zoom). Together, with an adapter on each lens it will only take up 3.5 inches of space. Leica have a ring that allows you to put two lenses together in back to back position. The Elmar is collapsible. That will make a very small travel outfit. I do not even need to buy the two lenses.  Another reason is the Bokeh on both lenses are excellent due to the perfectly round aperture with 10 0r 12 blades.

Too bad this idea does not plan out.

That would be a nice "stone age" travel kit :).
Actually, you have 56/3.2 with the Summicron on EOS-M, and 80/4.5 with the Elmar. The bokeh would still be nice, but nothing like FF. That's the price of the crop.
56/2.0 and 80/2.8 is from light gathering point of view, not background burling effect. that is the same reason why Canon call the 22mm  as 2.0 not 3.2.

Not really. There is no "point of view" for it to be 56/2 and 80/2.8, it doesn't work that way. Crop is affecting everything - the light (1.6x APS-C gathers 2.5 times less light, simply because it has 2.5 times smaller sensor area), the bokeh and perspective (because of the longer distance) and overall image quality (stronger aberrations, diffraction and noise; less sharpness and contrast).
Canon calls it 22/2 because it is 22/2, but its FF equivalent is 35/3.2, not 35/2.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2014, 05:33:46 PM by ecka »
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Re: Adapters + legacy lenses on the EOS M: any advice?
« Reply #14 on: July 25, 2014, 04:37:37 PM »