July 21, 2018, 03:42:22 PM

Author Topic: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax  (Read 3562 times)

unfocused

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I missed this story. Before people start ranting keep in mind that in most states buyers always owed the taxes, some companies just didn’t collect them.

https://photorumors.com/2018/06/21/buying-tax-free-photo-gear-in-the-us-could-be-over-after-supreme-court-decision/

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stevelee

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #1 on: June 23, 2018, 11:52:53 PM »
That shouldn’t be too much of a burden on companies of that size, just a little more bookkeeping overhead. And the good news for them is that they won’t need to avoid expanding physical presence into other states to preserve the tax break that is no longer there.

The real losers will be small online retailers who depended upon the competitive advantage of price, who on top of losing that, will have proportionally more overhead keeping up with the tax. Many of them will be OK in SD because of the $100,000 limit there, but other states may not follow suit.

I’ve never heard the constitutional issue addressed of what amounts to a cross-border tariff.

Mt Spokane Photography

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2018, 12:13:20 AM »
That shouldn’t be too much of a burden on companies of that size, just a little more bookkeeping overhead. And the good news for them is that they won’t need to avoid expanding physical presence into other states to preserve the tax break that is no longer there.

The real losers will be small online retailers who depended upon the competitive advantage of price, who on top of losing that, will have proportionally more overhead keeping up with the tax. Many of them will be OK in SD because of the $100,000 limit there, but other states may not follow suit.

I’ve never heard the constitutional issue addressed of what amounts to a cross-border tariff.
The big issue for my small business is record keeping and filing tax returns for every state and territory.  In Washington State, for example, I must file annual taxes for 300 different tax jurisdictions.  Now, imagine that times 52, and the tax rates are constantly changing, every time a county, town or city decides to change them.
The solution, of course is to pay thousands of dollars a year for a tax service to collect them for you.  Every state will have their own different setups as well.  I sell on Amazon, they collect taxes on sales, so thats no issue, but ebay will be a nightmare.  You will have to collect sales tax selling your used camera based on which of the 15,000 sets of tax locations the buyer resides in.

AlanF

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2018, 02:52:12 AM »
That shouldn’t be too much of a burden on companies of that size, just a little more bookkeeping overhead. And the good news for them is that they won’t need to avoid expanding physical presence into other states to preserve the tax break that is no longer there.

The real losers will be small online retailers who depended upon the competitive advantage of price, who on top of losing that, will have proportionally more overhead keeping up with the tax. Many of them will be OK in SD because of the $100,000 limit there, but other states may not follow suit.

I’ve never heard the constitutional issue addressed of what amounts to a cross-border tariff.

On the other hand, it should help the small high street stores who have been at a disadvantage.
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stevelee

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2018, 09:21:26 AM »
That shouldn’t be too much of a burden on companies of that size, just a little more bookkeeping overhead. And the good news for them is that they won’t need to avoid expanding physical presence into other states to preserve the tax break that is no longer there.

The real losers will be small online retailers who depended upon the competitive advantage of price, who on top of losing that, will have proportionally more overhead keeping up with the tax. Many of them will be OK in SD because of the $100,000 limit there, but other states may not follow suit.

I’ve never heard the constitutional issue addressed of what amounts to a cross-border tariff.

On the other hand, it should help the small high street stores who have been at a disadvantage.

That seems to be the intent, but it is too late to bring most of them back. Best Buy and Walmart are my only options for buying camera equipment within 15 miles or so, and I live in a metropolitan area. Even the chain camera stores have closed. The Best Buy south of me has a pretty decent camera department staffed by knowledgeable people. I bought my 6D2 there.

privatebydesign

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2018, 09:38:07 AM »
That shouldn’t be too much of a burden on companies of that size, just a little more bookkeeping overhead. And the good news for them is that they won’t need to avoid expanding physical presence into other states to preserve the tax break that is no longer there.

The real losers will be small online retailers who depended upon the competitive advantage of price, who on top of losing that, will have proportionally more overhead keeping up with the tax. Many of them will be OK in SD because of the $100,000 limit there, but other states may not follow suit.

I’ve never heard the constitutional issue addressed of what amounts to a cross-border tariff.

On the other hand, it should help the small high street stores who have been at a disadvantage.

That seems to be the intent, but it is too late to bring most of them back. Best Buy and Walmart are my only options for buying camera equipment within 15 miles or so, and I live in a metropolitan area. Even the chain camera stores have closed. The Best Buy south of me has a pretty decent camera department staffed by knowledgeable people. I bought my 6D2 there.

That's a naive expectation. I believe the intent is for sates to start collecting money left on the table, nothing more or less.
Too often we lose sight of the fact that photography is about capturing light, if we have the ability to take control of that light then we grow exponentially as photographers. More often than not the image is not about lens speed, sensor size, DR, MP's or AF, it is about the light.

neuroanatomist

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2018, 09:53:21 AM »
I believe the intent is for sates to start collecting money left on the table, nothing more or less.

+1

States lose millions of dollars in annual tax revenues because of this 'loophole'.  That's a lot of education and community services left unfunded. 

I'm sure very few people are honest enough to declare their out-of-state purchases on their tax returns (and I'll freely admit, it was less than pleasant paying an 'extra' $800 in taxes the year I bought my 600/4 II from B&H).

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2018, 09:53:21 AM »

unfocused

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2018, 10:12:10 AM »
That shouldn’t be too much of a burden on companies of that size, just a little more bookkeeping overhead. And the good news for them is that they won’t need to avoid expanding physical presence into other states to preserve the tax break that is no longer there.

The real losers will be small online retailers who depended upon the competitive advantage of price, who on top of losing that, will have proportionally more overhead keeping up with the tax. Many of them will be OK in SD because of the $100,000 limit there, but other states may not follow suit.

I’ve never heard the constitutional issue addressed of what amounts to a cross-border tariff.

On the other hand, it should help the small high street stores who have been at a disadvantage.

That seems to be the intent, but it is too late to bring most of them back. Best Buy and Walmart are my only options for buying camera equipment within 15 miles or so, and I live in a metropolitan area. Even the chain camera stores have closed. The Best Buy south of me has a pretty decent camera department staffed by knowledgeable people. I bought my 6D2 there.

That's a naive expectation. I believe the intent is for sates to start collecting money left on the table, nothing more or less.

It’s both. States were concerned about the loss of revenue, but brick and mortar retailers support it as well because they saw it as an unfair advantage.

Hometown camera stores were essentially dead the day digital came into existence since it was the regular sale of developing and printing supplies, that were their bread and butter, rather than the occasional camera or lens sale. But the ruling should help retailers like Best Buy, etc. I see that as a good thing since they are the ones that employ actual people in cities and towns and pay the property taxes that most local schools rely on.

From what I can tell reading news stories about the case, it sounds like the court decided that a physical presence was too narrow of a definition of someone doing business in a state. That is, if you are marketing, advertising, shipping and selling to customers in a state, you can’t claim not to have a presence there.

As far as the burden on small online retailers, I imagine most states will adopt a threshold. And, as for eBay sellers, I’d bet a whole lot of money that eBay already has checkout software written that will calculate and include the sales tax.

Mt Spokane Photography

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2018, 10:21:02 AM »

That's a naive expectation. I believe the intent is for sates to start collecting money left on the table, nothing more or less.
Exactly, states relying on sales tax for income are suffering.  Its Walmart and the Big chains pushing for the new rules.

kphoto99

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2018, 10:25:35 AM »

That's a naive expectation. I believe the intent is for sates to start collecting money left on the table, nothing more or less.
Exactly, states relying on sales tax for income are suffering.  Its Walmart and the Big chains pushing for the new rules.

Instead of relying on sales tax, why not eliminate it completely and raise income tax. It is the same people who pay income tax and sales tax. This would reduce the cost of the extra bureaucracy for collecting sales tax.

timmy_650

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2018, 11:18:17 AM »

That's a naive expectation. I believe the intent is for sates to start collecting money left on the table, nothing more or less.
Exactly, states relying on sales tax for income are suffering.  Its Walmart and the Big chains pushing for the new rules.

Instead of relying on sales tax, why not eliminate it completely and raise income tax. It is the same people who pay income tax and sales tax. This would reduce the cost of the extra bureaucracy for collecting sales tax.

B/c is this the US and we want to be tricked into paying high taxes and not just have one high bill at the end of the year.

Old Sarge

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2018, 11:47:18 AM »

That's a naive expectation. I believe the intent is for sates to start collecting money left on the table, nothing more or less.
Exactly, states relying on sales tax for income are suffering.  Its Walmart and the Big chains pushing for the new rules.

Instead of relying on sales tax, why not eliminate it completely and raise income tax. It is the same people who pay income tax and sales tax. This would reduce the cost of the extra bureaucracy for collecting sales tax.
There are nine states which have no state income tax (though two of those states tax investment income) so that would be an issue.  And the sales tax is often divided between state/county/city (in Texas it is divided between state/city with limits on both and how it is distributed).  I once did some research on states with income tax vs. states without income tax but a higher sales tax.  Using my estimated figures in retirement it worked out to about the same (I also figured in property taxes).  Those states with higher property/sales taxes and no income tax ended up with about the same amount of my income and those with lower property/sales taxes and an income tax.  Can't escape
taxes, I'm afraid.
The Old Sarge

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #12 on: June 24, 2018, 12:22:53 PM »

That's a naive expectation. I believe the intent is for sates to start collecting money left on the table, nothing more or less.
Exactly, states relying on sales tax for income are suffering.  Its Walmart and the Big chains pushing for the new rules.

Instead of relying on sales tax, why not eliminate it completely and raise income tax. It is the same people who pay income tax and sales tax. This would reduce the cost of the extra bureaucracy for collecting sales tax.
There are nine states which have no state income tax (though two of those states tax investment income) so that would be an issue.  And the sales tax is often divided between state/county/city (in Texas it is divided between state/city with limits on both and how it is distributed).  I once did some research on states with income tax vs. states without income tax but a higher sales tax.  Using my estimated figures in retirement it worked out to about the same (I also figured in property taxes).  Those states with higher property/sales taxes and no income tax ended up with about the same amount of my income and those with lower property/sales taxes and an income tax.  Can't escape taxes, I'm afraid.

The main difference between VAT and income taxes are that high VAT works like a toll between different economies in a toolfree zone. That's why the VAT is maximized to around 20% in the EU, that is such a zone. You pay less tax for local product vs "imported", comparably. That would work the same way between states in the US too...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_value_added_tax#VAT_rates

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #12 on: June 24, 2018, 12:22:53 PM »

YuengLinger

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2018, 01:50:38 PM »
Shopping in your home state at an online store is no excuse not to pay sales tax.  So what if the store doesn't have a physical presence in your state?  You don't have to pay the money to drive or fly to New York--look what you just saved!  You are a state resident buying an item that you will likely use in your state--and you are paying from your state--and physically present in your state when making the purchase.  And the product is delivered to your home in your state.  Only masochists like paying sales taxes, but only lazy cheats get angry when they must.

It's better that B&H et al collect it up front than leave it to me to go fill out paperwork and write a check to a state agency. If I "remember" to do so.  No, I don't want to pay it, but my state can use the revenue for useless pet projects.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2018, 01:57:46 PM by YuengLinger »

stevelee

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2018, 02:01:04 PM »

That's a naive expectation. I believe the intent is for sates to start collecting money left on the table, nothing more or less.
Exactly, states relying on sales tax for income are suffering.  Its Walmart and the Big chains pushing for the new rules.

Instead of relying on sales tax, why not eliminate it completely and raise income tax. It is the same people who pay income tax and sales tax. This would reduce the cost of the extra bureaucracy for collecting sales tax.

No, the difference is that sales taxes are regressive, hitting hardest those least able to pay. In theory, at least, income taxes are supposed to be progressive.

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Re: Looks like B&H, Adorama, etc will start collecting sales tax
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2018, 02:01:04 PM »