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Author Topic: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]  (Read 24381 times)

iwin

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #15 on: March 14, 2011, 01:28:23 AM »
Is it safe to say that the 5dmkiii kit will come with the 24-105 f/4 lens?

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #15 on: March 14, 2011, 01:28:23 AM »

AJ

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #16 on: March 14, 2011, 10:52:16 AM »
... FF cameras produce better images/video and have more/better glass options.

Actually you have more lens options with crop because crop cameras fit both EF and EF-S. 

As for better images, it depends how large you print.  My largest prints are 13"x19" and crop works well for that.

kubelik

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #17 on: March 14, 2011, 02:54:44 PM »
Is it safe to say that the 5dmkiii kit will come with the 24-105 f/4 lens?

most likely, that will be the case.  however, there's always the possibility that canon will surprise us with a new 24-120 f/4 L IS or some such lens; anything is possible, especially as the 5DIII is probably still a year away from release (different people will give you different dates, that's just my personal opinion)

gene_can_sing

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #18 on: March 14, 2011, 03:23:35 PM »
I seriously hope that the 5D3 is not a year away. For us video guys, we need Digic 5 now. Canon is super behind on their schedule. They missed their mark on the 1D update. Would have been 3 years last Sept. We're on a 4 year old processor, which is really long in Tech years, and frankly.... kind of embarrassing for Canon.

Everyone I know is just waiting for the 5D3. Much less interest in the 1Ds and nobody I know is buying a 5D2 right now.

So if you're reading this Canon, please release the 5D3 first and soon, before all us video guys go to Panansonic which is seriously starting to take the lead in that the DSLR video world.

Etienne

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #19 on: March 15, 2011, 12:10:51 AM »
... FF cameras produce better images/video and have more/better glass options.

Actually you have more lens options with crop because crop cameras fit both EF and EF-S. 

As for better images, it depends how large you print.  My largest prints are 13"x19" and crop works well for that.

You can mount more lenses on a crop, but that doesn't mean you have more options. Crop below 28mm FF equivalent has one v good option: Tokina 11-16 2.8. However full frame has 24-105 f4, 24-70 2.8, 24 1.4, 15mm FE 2.8 (which is boring on a crop), 14mm 2.8 (which is nothing special on a crop camera), 16-35 2.8, not to mention that the 35 1.4 is an excellent lens on FF but becomes a rather boring 56mm on a crop camera. There isn't a good 35mm equivalent prime for a crop camera. And all of the wide angle options are very well made and reliable lenses with USM (except the 15mm FE).

I wish it was different, and maybe one day it will be, but FF has a great many advantages over crop. That's why so many people want full frame. Crop cameras have the advantage of lower cost, and a little better reach at the penalty of lower IQ and fewer focal length options.

zalmagor

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #20 on: March 15, 2011, 07:34:55 AM »
... FF cameras produce better images/video and have more/better glass options.

Actually you have more lens options with crop because crop cameras fit both EF and EF-S. 

As for better images, it depends how large you print.  My largest prints are 13"x19" and crop works well for that.

You can mount more lenses on a crop, but that doesn't mean you have more options. Crop below 28mm FF equivalent has one v good option: Tokina 11-16 2.8. However full frame has 24-105 f4, 24-70 2.8, 24 1.4, 15mm FE 2.8 (which is boring on a crop), 14mm 2.8 (which is nothing special on a crop camera), 16-35 2.8, not to mention that the 35 1.4 is an excellent lens on FF but becomes a rather boring 56mm on a crop camera. There isn't a good 35mm equivalent prime for a crop camera. And all of the wide angle options are very well made and reliable lenses with USM (except the 15mm FE).

I wish it was different, and maybe one day it will be, but FF has a great many advantages over crop. That's why so many people want full frame. Crop cameras have the advantage of lower cost, and a little better reach at the penalty of lower IQ and fewer focal length options.

What about the EF-S 10-22mm & Sigma 8-16mm for crop ?

Bob Howland

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #21 on: March 15, 2011, 09:04:52 AM »
There isn't a good 35mm equivalent prime for a crop camera.

My 24 f/1.4 works well on my 40D.

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #21 on: March 15, 2011, 09:04:52 AM »

Etienne

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #22 on: March 15, 2011, 10:36:44 AM »
... FF cameras produce better images/video and have more/better glass options.

Actually you have more lens options with crop because crop cameras fit both EF and EF-S. 

As for better images, it depends how large you print.  My largest prints are 13"x19" and crop works well for that.

You can mount more lenses on a crop, but that doesn't mean you have more options. Crop below 28mm FF equivalent has one v good option: Tokina 11-16 2.8. However full frame has 24-105 f4, 24-70 2.8, 24 1.4, 15mm FE 2.8 (which is boring on a crop), 14mm 2.8 (which is nothing special on a crop camera), 16-35 2.8, not to mention that the 35 1.4 is an excellent lens on FF but becomes a rather boring 56mm on a crop camera. There isn't a good 35mm equivalent prime for a crop camera. And all of the wide angle options are very well made and reliable lenses with USM (except the 15mm FE).

I wish it was different, and maybe one day it will be, but FF has a great many advantages over crop. That's why so many people want full frame. Crop cameras have the advantage of lower cost, and a little better reach at the penalty of lower IQ and fewer focal length options.

What about the EF-S 10-22mm & Sigma 8-16mm for crop ?

These two are a little dark and not constant aperture, and not weather-sealed

Etienne

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #23 on: March 15, 2011, 10:37:59 AM »
There isn't a good 35mm equivalent prime for a crop camera.

My 24 f/1.4 works well on my 40D.

Good point, this lens is good on any camera. Although you lose the ultra-wide perspective.

GMCPhotographics

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2011, 10:24:55 AM »
Actually you have more lens options with crop because crop cameras fit both EF and EF-S. 

As for better images, it depends how large you print.  My largest prints are 13"x19" and crop works well for that.

You can mount more lenses on a crop, but that doesn't mean you have more options. Crop below 28mm FF equivalent has one v good option: Tokina 11-16 2.8. However full frame has 24-105 f4, 24-70 2.8, 24 1.4, 15mm FE 2.8 (which is boring on a crop), 14mm 2.8 (which is nothing special on a crop camera), 16-35 2.8, not to mention that the 35 1.4 is an excellent lens on FF but becomes a rather boring 56mm on a crop camera. There isn't a good 35mm equivalent prime for a crop camera. And all of the wide angle options are very well made and reliable lenses with USM (except the 15mm FE).

I wish it was different, and maybe one day it will be, but FF has a great many advantages over crop. That's why so many people want full frame. Crop cameras have the advantage of lower cost, and a little better reach at the penalty of lower IQ and fewer focal length options.
[/quote]

What about the EF-S 10-22mm & Sigma 8-16mm for crop ?
[/quote]

These two are a little dark and not constant aperture, and not weather-sealed
[/quote]

The efs 10-222 is a really sweet lens optically, but compared to the build of a 16-35IIL it's a toy in comparision.
The ef-s lens is really light, which is another indicator of a toy-town build. The ef 16-35IIL has a lot more metal in it's outer construction and really is a pro lens for industrial use.

motorhead

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2011, 11:56:33 AM »
I don't believe a smaller sensor will ever have an advantage over a larger one. It has always been the case that a good big-un is better than a good little-un. Convenient and cheaper maybe, but for image quality at the end of the day, the bigger the captured image the better. It was always true with film and I'm convinced that it will remain true in this modern digital world.

It's interesting that Canon are said to be interested in acquiring a medium format foothold. While the Japanese have made the 35mm "full frame" size their own, the same is not true of larger formats. Pentax have at least made a start but Canon and Nikon seem to be a bit slow getting into the game.

Once digital technology matures, I can foresee 1.3x and 1.6x crop frame becoming a thing of the past.     

djjohnr

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #26 on: March 16, 2011, 12:00:22 PM »
... FF cameras produce better images/video and have more/better glass options.

As for better images, it depends how large you print.  My largest prints are 13"x19" and crop works well for that.

You will get sharper images from a FF sensor than a crop sensor with the same pixel count using the same lens. This is because smaller pixels require more resolving power from the lens.   It is noticeable in a 13*19 print.  It's even noticeable in a 6*9 print if you look close.  Whether or not this matters depends on what your goal with an image is. 
« Last Edit: March 16, 2011, 12:03:54 PM by djjohnr »

WarStreet

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #27 on: March 16, 2011, 01:02:12 PM »
This is because smaller pixels require more resolving power from the lens.

I look at it in a more positive way, larger FF pixels get more resolving power from the lens.



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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #27 on: March 16, 2011, 01:02:12 PM »

djjohnr

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #28 on: March 16, 2011, 05:51:14 PM »
This is because smaller pixels require more resolving power from the lens.

I look at it in a more positive way, larger FF pixels get more resolving power from the lens.

I'm on the constant quest for more resolving power.  It looks like I'll be moving to 4x5 soon.  To get similar a 12x18 print at the same lp/mm I'd need a FF lens/sensor combo that could manage 100 lp/mm  :o

gmrza

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #29 on: March 16, 2011, 07:33:36 PM »
I don't believe a smaller sensor will ever have an advantage over a larger one. It has always been the case that a good big-un is better than a good little-un. Convenient and cheaper maybe, but for image quality at the end of the day, the bigger the captured image the better. It was always true with film and I'm convinced that it will remain true in this modern digital world.

It's interesting that Canon are said to be interested in acquiring a medium format foothold. While the Japanese have made the 35mm "full frame" size their own, the same is not true of larger formats. Pentax have at least made a start but Canon and Nikon seem to be a bit slow getting into the game.

Once digital technology matures, I can foresee 1.3x and 1.6x crop frame becoming a thing of the past.   

Given the economics of semiconductor production, smaller sensors will always have a cost advantage over larger sensors.  Since an APS-C sensor is good enough for many uses, we may well see crop frame sensors continue to be used.
Where a crop sensor has a distinct advantage is in areas such as wildlife photography on foot.  A photographer can carry lighter and cheaper lenses, and still get a chance at getting a shot.  (Imagine lugging a 600mm lens on foot across mountainous terrain with a few days' supplies and a tent in your backpack!)
I think the main driver of crop frame sensors will remain cost.  For most of the consumer market, a crop frame sensor is good enough.  This is because the resolving quality is good enough to produce the print sizes most consumers want, and many users are not concerned about the benefits of a full-frame sensor, such as shallower depth of field or better low light performance.
Zeiss Ikon Contax II, Sonnar 50mm f/2, Sonnar 135mm f/4

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #29 on: March 16, 2011, 07:33:36 PM »