Canon CPS Requirements

gbchriste

EOS RP
Jan 19, 2012
245
1
I'm at the point of gear acquisition that I think I would really like to have access to Canon CPS services. I have two 5D3s, a 70-200 2.8L II, 24-70 2.8L II, and 50 1.4.

I've looked at the Canon CPS site and it appears that it is restricted to people who are actually earn their living from photography. Per Canon CPS membership qualifications - "Professional Image Makers -Self-employed or an employee of a professional imaging business"

I'm a hobbyist with a full time job in another career field. I occasionally and rarely take a paid assignment but am in now way a "self employed" professional imaging business.

How closely is this scrutinized in the CPS membership process?
 

jdramirez

EOS 5D MK IV
May 31, 2011
2,944
0
42
I think you are fine. If you were just starting and had zero income, you still qualify.

Sign up for a silver... then upgrade to gold or platinum.
 

takesome1

EOS 6D MK II
Aug 23, 2013
1,490
122
98
Licking, Missouri
They will never know nor will they check.
The question is how comfortable you are in telling the small lie.
Perhaps you can bend their words a bit to make it more comfortable.
 

FEBS

Action Photography
Hi,

I don't know if CPS requirements differ from country to country, but according my information, you don't fulfill the requirements. For bodies the 2 x 5D3 does even fulfill for gold level. For lenses however the 50 1.4 is unclassified, so you stay with only 2 lenses 24-70 and 70-200 and that's not enough for silver or gold.
 

Mt Spokane Photography

I post too Much on Here!!
Mar 25, 2011
15,636
824
FEBS said:
Hi,

I don't know if CPS requirements differ from country to country, but according my information, you don't fulfill the requirements. For bodies the 2 x 5D3 does even fulfill for gold level. For lenses however the 50 1.4 is unclassified, so you stay with only 2 lenses 24-70 and 70-200 and that's not enough for silver or gold.
He appears to be in the USA and easily qualifies. The requirements vary around the world and are set by the different Canon business units in each location.

This is for CPS USA.

Silver = 10 pts
Gold=20 pts
Platinum=50 pts

As for his points

2 X 5D MK III = 14 pts

1 X 24-70 f/2.8L MK II = 12 pts

1 X 70-200mm f/2.8L MK II = 12 pts

1 X 50mm f/1.4 = 4 pts

So his total of 42 points qualifies him for gold. If he has TC's and Flashes they will add more points.



join and get the silver membership, its free, you will get a small gift, and a discount on repairs.
 

dswtan

EOS T7i
Sep 15, 2012
77
1
500px.com
Personally, I have not been prepared to lie about this, since the US criteria are clear. I hope it changes (again) one day, since they've made good business from this amateur! :p
 

gbchriste

EOS RP
Jan 19, 2012
245
1
I knew I had the points. My question was about the employment qualifications. If I earn $1 is that enough? Do you have to submit documentation or is your self declaration that you are an "imaging professional" enough?
 

gbchriste

EOS RP
Jan 19, 2012
245
1
dswtan said:
Personally, I have not been prepared to lie about this, since the US criteria are clear. I hope it changes (again) one day, since they've made good business from this amateur! :p
That's me to date as well. Not sure I understand that requirement. If you've invested the same amount of money in gear as a working professional, would seem that you should qualify.
 

dak723

EOS 6D MK II
Oct 26, 2013
1,141
435
Here's the qualification requirement:

Membership is available only to those individuals (self-employed or employed by a professional imaging business), who play a direct role in the creation of moving or still images for third parties on a full-time basis and are legal residents of the 50 United States or the District of Columbia.

For Full-time professional photographers. Pretty clear.
 

takesome1

EOS 6D MK II
Aug 23, 2013
1,490
122
98
Licking, Missouri
dak723 said:
Here's the qualification requirement:

Membership is available only to those individuals (self-employed or employed by a professional imaging business), who play a direct role in the creation of moving or still images for third parties on a full-time basis and are legal residents of the 50 United States or the District of Columbia.

For Full-time professional photographers. Pretty clear.
It doesn't say full time pro photogs only. You are adding to it.
 

privatebydesign

Would you take advice from a cartoons stuffed toy?
Jan 29, 2011
8,159
1,505
119
takesome1 said:
dak723 said:
Here's the qualification requirement:

Membership is available only to those individuals (self-employed or employed by a professional imaging business), who play a direct role in the creation of moving or still images for third parties on a full-time basis and are legal residents of the 50 United States or the District of Columbia.

For Full-time professional photographers. Pretty clear.
It doesn't say full time pro photogs only. You are adding to it.
It says full time imaging professionals, you are splitting hairs.

I think the spirit of the membership is clear, I also believe most people who are members are not full time imaging professionals.

On the other hand I am a full time imaging professional and a legal resident of the 50 US States, and am not a member, I have been before but they have changed the format, criteria, and price for membership several times along the way and now I just don't get the value from it.
 

takesome1

EOS 6D MK II
Aug 23, 2013
1,490
122
98
Licking, Missouri
privatebydesign said:
takesome1 said:
dak723 said:
Here's the qualification requirement:

Membership is available only to those individuals (self-employed or employed by a professional imaging business), who play a direct role in the creation of moving or still images for third parties on a full-time basis and are legal residents of the 50 United States or the District of Columbia.

For Full-time professional photographers. Pretty clear.
It doesn't say full time pro photogs only. You are adding to it.
It says full time imaging professionals, you are splitting hairs.

I think the spirit of the membership is clear, I also believe most people who are members are not full time imaging professionals.

On the other hand I am a full time imaging professional and a legal resident of the 50 US States, and am not a member, I have been before but they have changed the format, criteria, and price for membership several times along the way and now I just don't get the value from it.
No doubt you qualify, but the description reads broader than that.
When they drop the words self employed and full time.

Are we using the tax mans definition of Hobby or full time?

For that matter the local pharmacy print shop operator could qualify.
 

privatebydesign

Would you take advice from a cartoons stuffed toy?
Jan 29, 2011
8,159
1,505
119
takesome1 said:
privatebydesign said:
takesome1 said:
dak723 said:
Here's the qualification requirement:

Membership is available only to those individuals (self-employed or employed by a professional imaging business), who play a direct role in the creation of moving or still images for third parties on a full-time basis and are legal residents of the 50 United States or the District of Columbia.

For Full-time professional photographers. Pretty clear.
It doesn't say full time pro photogs only. You are adding to it.
It says full time imaging professionals, you are splitting hairs.

I think the spirit of the membership is clear, I also believe most people who are members are not full time imaging professionals.

On the other hand I am a full time imaging professional and a legal resident of the 50 US States, and am not a member, I have been before but they have changed the format, criteria, and price for membership several times along the way and now I just don't get the value from it.
No doubt you qualify, but the description reads broader than that.
When they drop the words self employed and full time.

Are we using the tax mans definition of Hobby or full time?

For that matter the local pharmacy print shop operator could qualify.
Of course he could, but I think the local pharmacy print shop operator couldn't, with his hand on his heart, claim they are playing a "direct role in the creation of moving or still images" their reproduction yes, but not their creation. Neuro made a similar comment one time about his photography hobby and the fact that he does medical imaging as part of his 'day job' so also would, under the letter of the rules, qualify. But I think the spirit of the rules is quite clear.

I don't understand your comment "When they drop the words self employed and full time.", am I missing something there, did they drop those words?
 

takesome1

EOS 6D MK II
Aug 23, 2013
1,490
122
98
Licking, Missouri
privatebydesign said:
takesome1 said:
privatebydesign said:
takesome1 said:
dak723 said:
Here's the qualification requirement:

Membership is available only to those individuals (self-employed or employed by a professional imaging business), who play a direct role in the creation of moving or still images for third parties on a full-time basis and are legal residents of the 50 United States or the District of Columbia.

For Full-time professional photographers. Pretty clear.
It doesn't say full time pro photogs only. You are adding to it.
It says full time imaging professionals, you are splitting hairs.

I think the spirit of the membership is clear, I also believe most people who are members are not full time imaging professionals.

On the other hand I am a full time imaging professional and a legal resident of the 50 US States, and am not a member, I have been before but they have changed the format, criteria, and price for membership several times along the way and now I just don't get the value from it.
No doubt you qualify, but the description reads broader than that.
When they drop the words self employed and full time.

Are we using the tax mans definition of Hobby or full time?

For that matter the local pharmacy print shop operator could qualify.
Of course he could, but I think the local pharmacy print shop operator couldn't, with his hand on his heart, claim they are playing a "direct role in the creation of moving or still images" their reproduction yes, but not their creation. Neuro made a similar comment one time about his photography hobby and the fact that he does medical imaging as part of his 'day job' so also would, under the letter of the rules, qualify. But I think the spirit of the rules is quite clear.

I don't understand your comment "When they drop the words self employed and full time.", am I missing something there, did they drop those words?
Clarify I meant included the wording.

I am mobile now and can't look it up, but not long ago CPS had a more rigid description in the terms and definitions.

You mention the spirit of this, the spirit of this for Canon is you pay them for additional customer service. Canon is aware that amateurs join. If they cared they would find a way to exclude them.
 

privatebydesign

Would you take advice from a cartoons stuffed toy?
Jan 29, 2011
8,159
1,505
119
Oh I agree, at it's root as it is now structured CPS in the USA is just a revenue stream and anybody who wants to pay the money gets to play. Meanwhile the places where CPS make a huge footprint, the Olympics and the like, anybody with a press pass can get any Canon gear they like for the duration.

Previously you had to send in tear sheets with your application to CPS as proof of your image creation background, but as soon as that was dropped then it was obviously considered a cash cow, as opposed to the European CPS which is still free. They both just rely on the points system now though so you can say you are anything and if you have the gear to qualify the points, or if you make up or copy the serial numbers to make up the points, you are in.
 

unfocused

EOS 1D MK II
Jul 20, 2010
5,261
1,879
66
Springfield, IL
www.mgordoncommunications.com
takesome1 said:
...the spirit of this for Canon is you pay them for additional customer service. Canon is aware that amateurs join. If they cared they would find a way to exclude them.
Yeah, this has been debated many times before on this site.

There are those who feel strongly that it should be limited to their definition of professionals only.

There are others who don't feel it matters.

But, what really matters is how Canon treats the program and it's pretty clear that their actions speak louder than their words.

If you own the requisite amount of equipment they are happy to take your money and take your word for it that you are a professional.

I imagine there are several things at work here:

1) It's not as easy to define as one might think. Between full-time photographer and ordinary Joe in the street, there is a wide range of territory and I doubt Canon really wants to spend time and resources parsing the definition. Better to simply take people's word for it;

2) There are fewer and fewer people earning a living exclusively from photography and if Canon restricted membership to that small group, the service wouldn't be cost-effective to maintain;

3) Maintaining the facade that this is for professionals only makes membership more desirable. People are willing to write Canon that $100 check each year and think they are getting away with something. If they just opened it up officially to anyone, membership would be perceived as less desirable;

4) All those people joining who may not actually meet the requirements helps to support the program for the true professionals. No doubt, Canon knows exactly what demographics are joining and whether they are generating income or increasing costs. Financially, it's better for the program to cast a wider net.
 

takesome1

EOS 6D MK II
Aug 23, 2013
1,490
122
98
Licking, Missouri
This is the current wording, look under terms and conditions;


Updated as of August 4, 2014
Applicant must be a full-time self-employed individual, or an employee of a professional imaging business, who plays a direct role in the creation of moving or still images for third parties on a professional basis.

Notice the change in wording on full-time self-employed and the structure of the sentence.

Break it down from my perspective, I am full- time self-employed individual who plays a role in the creation of moving or still images for third parties on a professional basis. I am in the contraction industry, images are something we create as support or provide as part of a contract. Without the words "Imaging Business" I qualify.

Maybe the semantics experts can chime in and correct me, but with this wording and the placement of commas I wouldn't have to have a full-time self-employed imaging business. I only have to play a direct role in the creation of moving or still images for third parties on a professional basis. For instance I went on a recent pheasant hunt where as part of the package the owner of the business took and captured pictures for the clients to take home. He would qualify under this description.

But still I think a definition of full-time self-employed is up for interpretation.
 

neuroanatomist

I post too Much on Here!!
Jul 21, 2010
24,635
2,142
It's like the senator said about p0rn - you know a professional photographer when you see one. You can parse the grammar all you want, but I'd say if you're earning an income from photography on which you're paying taxes, you qualify. As PBD stated, I could make a case for myself under the letter of their policy...but that's sophistry. FWIW, I'm not a CPS member.
 

jdramirez

EOS 5D MK IV
May 31, 2011
2,944
0
42
So is it wrong I didn't bother reading the requirements... I have something like $10,000 in gear... and I had a crap ton of points... so I signed up...