Canon's Full Frame Future [CR2]

[Canon Rumors]

There’s a lot of random information out there about what Canon is going to do with it’s three long-in-the-tooth full frame cameras, the EOS 6D, EOS 5D Mark III and EOS-1D X. One of our sources wants to shed a little bit of light on things, but even admits things are very “muddy” at the moment.</p>
<p><strong>EOS 5D Mark IV</strong>

This camera’s focus will be high ISO performance over resolution. The camera will use a new DIGIC processor and will share a version of a new flagship AF system. We had <a href="http://www.canonrumors.com/2015/02/possible-canon-eos-5d-mark-iv-spec-talk-cr2/" target="_blank">heard back in February</a> that an 18mp sensor was in testing in a camera body and that’s what could appear here. Are consumers willing to sacrifice 4mp for a few stops of ISO performance boost? I’m pretty sure they would be. I don’t believe the resolution of the APS-C offerings has any bearing on how the full frame sensor development will play out in the prosumer & professional markets.</p>
<p>4K? It depends on the day and who’s talking. I think it’s safe to say that 4K video recording appearing in the EOS 5D Mark IV is 50/50 at the moment. :)</p>
<p><strong>EOS 6D Mark II</strong>

This camera is said to be moving slightly “upmarket”, as it will get a better AF system and a few other consumer features like NFC. We’re also told this camera could have a higher resolution sensor than the EOS 5D Mark IV. The source couldn’t confirm this, but said all signs seemed to point that way. It was suggested that the “consumer” market still cares about resolution and that the EOS 6D Mark II could become the “do everything pretty well” DSLR in the lineup. No resolution number was given, but I can see a 24mp-28mp sensor.</p>
<p><strong>EOS-1D X Mark II</strong>

This camera is on its own and the goal is to improve ISO performance as well as “industry leading” dynamic range, we’re apparently going to see some C300 Mark II technology in this camera. It will have a brand new flagship AF system and an increased framerate. 4K video is still a possibility, as no one expects to see a follow-up to the EOS-1D C.</p>
<p>We’re not very close to an announcement for any of these cameras, so it’s very possible there’s a lot of misdirection and false information being floated around internally at Canon. I expect things to start getting a bit clearer towards the end of the summer and into early fall.</p>

 

[dolina]

The features these three bodies will have will largely depend on what Sony/Nikon will have on offer before August 2016.

Learned my lesson with the 5DsR. I will wait about a week before pursing an order. Could have saved myself $300 if I did. >_<

 

[Chaitanya]

eager to see what Af unit 6D mark II gets. I really liked overall performance of orignal 6D but its AF unit was stupid and only that unit being upgraded would make it a very good camera. Also a tilt-swivel screen would be a good upgrade.

 

[meywd]

What I read from this is that:

1) 5D IV will be the 1D X in a 5D body and maybe get the new AF as a boost.
2) 6D II will be the 5D III in a smaller, feature rich body.
3) 1D X II will be the new King to rule them all (beat the D5(s) and Sony offerings).

 

[tayassu]

I'm actually surprised about that. I always figured that the 5D line was the allround type of bodies, I assumed the next one would have just around 24-28MP and stellar AF, while the 6D line was something like the low-light, travel cameras with ~20 MP that also could compete with something like the A7S. It seems to be reverse here...

 

[meywd]

I'm actually surprised about that. I always figured that the 5D line was the allround type of bodies, I assumed the next one would have just around 24-28MP and stellar AF, while the 6D line was something like the low-light, travel cameras with ~20 MP that also could compete with something like the A7S. It seems to be reverse here...

Maybe since the 5D is the king of video under the cinema line - 1D C is from the cinema line - they want it to be the one to beat the a7S, though this is only a rumor...

 

[Maximilian]

We’re not very close to an announcement for any of these cameras, so it’s very possible there’s a lot of misdirection and false information being floated around internally at Canon. I expect things to start getting a bit clearer towards the end of the summer and into early fall.

Early fall is not so far away. Inderesting to see that we're still poking around in the dark.
But Canon has been quite good throughout the last few years in only leaking what they want to.

Would be quite interesting to know, what alternative designs of those FF cameras are considered and maybe even tested. Esp. with the 5D4 and 6D2.


Craig, do you have any info about the order of announcements and releases?

 

[Canon Rumors]

I'm actually surprised about that. I always figured that the 5D line was the allround type of bodies, I assumed the next one would have just around 24-28MP and stellar AF, while the 6D line was something like the low-light, travel cameras with ~20 MP that also could compete with something like the A7S. It seems to be reverse here...

I think Canon has started the change of course, with more focused products, especially for the prosumer. If you can't get new DSLR customers, get the ones you have to buy more of them.

 

[Maximilian]

... while the 6D line was something like the low-light...

Thinking about the 5D3 beeing the wedding and event workhorse where availabe light capabilities and no flash is quite often required some of these event photogs would have asked themselves, why the 6D got a "better" sensor and more sensible AF. So maybe this was a requirement coming back from the market to turn this around with the 5D4.

 

[Canon Rumors]

We’re not very close to an announcement for any of these cameras, so it’s very possible there’s a lot of misdirection and false information being floated around internally at Canon. I expect things to start getting a bit clearer towards the end of the summer and into early fall.

Early fall is not so far away. Inderesting to see that we're still poking around in the dark.
But Canon has been quite good throughout the last few years in only leaking what they want to.

Would be quite interesting to know, what alternative designs of those FF cameras are considered and maybe even tested. Esp. with the 5D4 and 6D2.


Craig, do you have any info about the order of announcements and releases?

I expect the 6D2 to be the last of the 3. No idea on the order of the 1DX2 and 5D4.

 

[Maximilian]

Craig, do you have any info about the order of announcements and releases?

I expect the 6D2 to be the last of the 3. No idea on the order of the 1DX2 and 5D4.

Thanks.
If I were Canon I would go the price order, highest features and price first, esp. if I reuse top line features in the minor lines.

 

[Canon Rumors]

The phrase 'new flagship AF system' is mentioned twice.

Does it mean that the 5DIV will get new AF when it is announced and then the 1DXII will get its own new AF when it is announced? Or will they both share the same?

I suspect it will be like the current 1dx and 5d3.

 

[TheJock]

Is it probable that the 5DIV will have an 18mp sensor?
Even considering better DR and low light IQ, isn't that a step backwards compared to the competitors??.....or do I sound like one of the Sonikon fanboys ;D

 

[Maximilian]

Is it probable that the 5DIV will have an 18mp sensor?
Even considering better DR and low light IQ, isn't that a step backwards compared to the competitors??.....or do I sound like one of the Sonikon fanboys ;D

compared to an a7s with 12.1 MP it would be an improvement.
But as it will be no EXMOR it is impossible to compare those two

 

[GuyF]

"1DX mk2....the goal is to improve ISO performance as well as “industry leading” dynamic range."

Pfff, I'll still only go by what DxO Mark measures.

 

[privatebydesign]

The 5D MkIV having less than 24MP would be a massive mistake, a backwards step like that in a major spec is a marketing nightmare and will confuse the good name the 5D has.

The 1DX MkII having less than 21MP would be a massive mistake, people demand ever more, even news and sports shooters want to crop hard sometimes (often).

The 1DX MkIV not having 4K (though I don't care) would be a massive mistake, by the time it is a mature product in 2020 it will be a joke if it doesn't have 4k.

Yes there is good reasoning for specialisation, but most people still shoot generally and the 5D has always sold because you could do a bit if everything with it. I see a three 5 lineup making much more sense than an 18MP backwards (in eveybodies mind) step, a 5DC that is video orientated and low light specialist, a 5D MkIV that kills the general purpose and wedding scene but never goes backwards on a spec, and a 5DS'10' a single high MP camera that doesn't have an AA filter.

 

[LSXPhotog]

Based on speculation and rumors, Canon should really reconsider its approach to the camera market. There needs to be a camera to compete with Nikon and Sony at every price point and compete at a similar level. The d610, d750, d810, d4S. It doesn't need to reinvent the wheel here and go nuts - these are ultra specific and stands to cannibalize its following.

If Canon starts to...continues to go crazy with its strategy here, it will further confuse consumers and continue to piss off professionals who want their next camera to become more competitive not more limited in use.

They're in a very delicate dance when the competition allows us to switch and keep our glass. Camera bodies are more important than ever at establishing a following. Canon has the biggest, but that can only last so long.

 

[davidmurray]

I'm actually surprised about that. I always figured that the 5D line was the allround type of bodies, I assumed the next one would have just around 24-28MP and stellar AF, while the 6D line was something like the low-light, travel cameras with ~20 MP that also could compete with something like the A7S. It seems to be reverse here...

I think Canon has started the change of course, with more focused products, especially for the prosumer. If you can't get new DSLR customers, get the ones you have to buy more of them.

Personally I would consider it a step backwards if Canon reduced the resolution of the 5D4.

I'm hoping for incremental improvements in all aspects of the 5D4 over the 5D3.

The areas that I'd like to see the biggest improvement is in low light image quality and improvements in low light auto focus.

Of course all the other areas - resolution, speed, DR, low ISO quality would be nice, but they already largely do what I need. It's low light performance and low light/small aperture auto focus that would get me replacing my 5D with another 5D.

I certainly wouldn't want to see any feature taking a step backwards.

 

[LDS]

IMHO not all 5D users will be happy with a 18Mp sensor, especially if the 6D reaches 24-28 Mp. Not everybody needs high ISO, but somebody needs some cropping space or a little more pixels - and the 5D III is today a good all-round camera for many different needs.
Even if Canon makes the 6D pricier, it risks to move a lot of customers to the cheaper camera. Unless Canon wants a clear big difference from the 5D and 5Ds, even larger than today.
Could specializing too much eventually backfire? Selling more cameras to the same customer is not that easy, especially at those prices. Unless you're a commercial photographer specialized in one field only, you may want a more versatile camera, especially when travelling. It can also create a lot of confusion in customers, especially new ones.

 

[verysimplejason]

eager to see what Af unit 6D mark II gets. I really liked overall performance of orignal 6D but its AF unit was stupid and only that unit being upgraded would make it a very good camera. Also a tilt-swivel screen would be a good upgrade.

Yup. +1. The tilt-swivel screen is very much handy for especially for events and macro.