1DX and 5D3 RAW files

[bdunbar79]

Joking aside and to wocka's credit, I know he's right. At least I have found some individuals who see the same things I do and agree with me.

 

[GMCPhotographics]

My neighbor / cousin-in-law...just last week, bought a 1DX with his newly earned "toy money"...and claims he has now relegated his 5D3 to his wife, with a 50 1.4 attached, to make it easier for her to carry around.

So I hope to attempt to put the 1DX to the test in low light at some point, hopefully with my 135L mounted.

I must say, holding his 1DX with 70-200 f/2.8 series 1, mounted...and then my 6D with 70-200 f/4 (non-IS), it was quite a lot more weight. Holding his was kind of like holding three bricks, mine fealt light as a feather. I would not want to walk around with that weight all day. I own one lens that is a bit more weight than a 70-200 2.8, but I use it on a monopod. I've rented superteles, and used them on the monopod also (or a tripod).

I might be seen as stupid for asking this, but it seems like much of the recent discussion in this thread, has degenerated into speaking about the 1DX's dynamic range and s/n ratio, at lower ISO. And yet, the OP shoots basketball games, etc...in less than ideal light at higher ISO. So why even discuss the low ISO capability, especially if all the independent tests indicate that higher ISO is where the 1DX really shines, and was obviously meant to be used?

It seems to me, that rather than compare the 1DX to Nikon crop bodies at low ISO, or to the 5D3 at most any ISO...that it should be compared to the Nikon D3s. I suspect the D3s would give it a serious run for its money, perhaps in the ISO range from 1000 to 25,600. Of course the file dimensions are only 12 MP from the D3s, but it would still be interesting to compare...because if the D3s really does have lower noise of both types, then the actual or practical resolution from the RAW files might be equal or even superior to the 1DX (at least as ISO goes up, perhaps above ISO 4000 or 5000).

It's interesting that the noise pattern of the 1DX might be larger and more difficult to overcome in post editing, since I've found the same true going from the 5D3's files, to my 6D. The 6D's noise, especially the luminance noise (or "grain")...is about 1/3 the size of the 5D3's...at least on these particular bodies that I've used.

The 1dx is superior to the D3s in every regard. Is it even reasonable to compare a 2012 18mp flagship with a 2008 12mp (no longer state of the art flagship)?
The newer D4 should be compared to the 1Dx, but unfortunatly there's a number of pros leaving Nikon due to the lock ups and problems with their D4 cameras. Nikon have seriously dropped a clanger with this cam. Late last year I was at Birds in flight workshop and there were several guys on Nikkon bitching about their new D4 cams. Both of them swapped over to their backup D3s cams within an hour of shooting. I was the only 5DIII user (no issues and lots of great photos) and two guys with 1Dx's...again no issues and lots of great shots...the AF was amazing by the way. The 1Dx was slightly better at tracking than the 5DIII

 

[East Wind Photography]

Interesting. I have a buddy that switched to Canon due to three Nikon body failures during the same shoot. He lost a lot of money that day from lost shots and in the end he had no working cameras. That was the main reason why I made the commitment to stay with Canon. Regardless of which body is better, if you cant take the shot, what good is it?

Are they ? , here in Europe lot of sports photographer/agenties moved to Nikon because of the D3S , D4 and the 200-400/4 is working so well.

 

[Loswr]

At the Olympic Games in Beijing there where many Canon shooters moving directly to Nikon because of the low keepers they got with 1Dmk3.
The lens line 14-24 , 24-70, 70-200 and 200-400 Nikon lens was also a big argument to move over to Nikon at this time.

Yeah, but the "this time" to which you're referring is now 5 years ago, and two camera generations back.

 

[East Wind Photography]

If memory serves me correctly the 1DX was "rushed" to market with priority given to Olympic photographers. I'm sure there were not many who actually had their hands on it or would "trust" a brand new camera for something so critical. The only option for most was older technology.

At the Olympic Games in Beijing there where many Canon shooters moving directly to Nikon because of the low keepers they got with 1Dmk3.
The lens line 14-24 , 24-70, 70-200 and 200-400 Nikon lens was also a big argument to move over to Nikon at this time.

Yeah, but the "this time" to which you're referring is now 5 years ago, and two camera generations back.

 

[bdunbar79]

lot of Canon sport shooters went to Nikon when Canons keepers went down with the AF problems in the 1dmk3, the D3 was much better as a sport camera and Nikon followed up with D3s , compared to 1Dmk4. At the Olympic Games in Beijing there where many Canon shooters moving directly to Nikon because of the low keepers they got with 1Dmk3.
The lens line 14-24 , 24-70, 70-200 and 200-400 Nikon lens was also a big argument to move over to Nikon at this time. Nikon have increased the number of users from a few up to 50/50 in some events, Canon is still Nr1.

Funny, I CAN speak from experience. I shot the Big Ten track meet this year, and out of all of the sports photogs there, there was ONE Nikon shooter. Everyone else had a 1D Mark IV or 1Dx and ALL of them had a 400 f/2.8 for their primary lens.

 

[J.R.]

lot of Canon sport shooters went to Nikon when Canons keepers went down with the AF problems in the 1dmk3, the D3 was much better as a sport camera and Nikon followed up with D3s , compared to 1Dmk4. At the Olympic Games in Beijing there where many Canon shooters moving directly to Nikon because of the low keepers they got with 1Dmk3.
The lens line 14-24 , 24-70, 70-200 and 200-400 Nikon lens was also a big argument to move over to Nikon at this time. Nikon have increased the number of users from a few up to 50/50 in some events, Canon is still Nr1.

Funny, I CAN speak from experience. I shot the Big Ten track meet this year, and out of all of the sports photogs there, there was ONE Nikon shooter. Everyone else had a 1D Mark IV or 1Dx and ALL of them had a 400 f/2.8 for their primary lens.

And I CAN speak from experience of watching from the sidelines . Here in India there was the Indian Premier Cricket League (quite a big national level event here) and out of the 23 photogs, 19 were using the great whites (yes, I counted them from the stands and the count is correct unless anyone was using lenscoat skins for the great whites).

Now the way I understand, the great whites cannot be mounted on the D3 or the D3s ... so I leave you to guess which cameras the pros were using.

 

[J.R.]

lot of Canon sport shooters went to Nikon when Canons keepers went down with the AF problems in the 1dmk3, the D3 was much better as a sport camera and Nikon followed up with D3s , compared to 1Dmk4. At the Olympic Games in Beijing there where many Canon shooters moving directly to Nikon because of the low keepers they got with 1Dmk3.
The lens line 14-24 , 24-70, 70-200 and 200-400 Nikon lens was also a big argument to move over to Nikon at this time. Nikon have increased the number of users from a few up to 50/50 in some events, Canon is still Nr1.

Funny, I CAN speak from experience. I shot the Big Ten track meet this year, and out of all of the sports photogs there, there was ONE Nikon shooter. Everyone else had a 1D Mark IV or 1Dx and ALL of them had a 400 f/2.8 for their primary lens.

there are a world larger outside than USA

Clutching straws ... Are we? The largest customer base for both cameras is in the US so the sample would be more than a fair representation. Anyway, I gave you the example from India as well.

As always though, we can agree to disagree and move on.

Cheers ... J.R.

 

[Loswr]

yes and, are there any problems with the lens line from Nikon , or D4 ?

Depends. Perhaps you don't think asymmetric focusing issues, lockup issues, not to mention the XQD slot (seems like a dead-end format since SanDisk abandoned support for it, time will tell) are problems. Maybe they aren't problems...after all, the D4's sensor is perfect, and that's all that matters. :

there are a world l outside the USA

Is India part of the USA?

Here in India there was the Indian Premier Cricket League (quite a big national level event here) and out of the 23 photogs, 19 were using the great whites (yes, I counted them from the stands and the count is correct unless anyone was using lenscoat skins for the great whites).

Now the way I understand, the great whites cannot be mounted on the D3 or the D3s ... so I leave you to guess which cameras the pros were using.

 

[Loswr]

Not at all, then you do not know about the ASIAN market including China.

Now who's talking sales? :

 

[Loswr]

well , as one example, in Asia, Japan the 3DX has been sold as a status camera, nothing Canon can brag about, do you still think sales from a 18Mp are important factor for the audience here? Then I suggest a compact camera, easier, better tuned for average people to get a straight good JPG out from the camera

What's a 3DX? If Canon had released one, they'd be bragging about it, you can count on that.

Am I to understand that you're suggesting that I should look for 'a compact camera, easier, better tuned for average people to get a straight good JPG out from the camera'? I hope I'm simply misunderstanding you...

 

[J.R.]

Not at all, then you do not know about the ASIAN market including China.
who do you think you are

That Mikael is the wrong question ... The right question is, who do you think YOU are?

Im a photographer with a large contact net, been co writer / test person of a large number of articles about darkroom equipment, scanners, digital cameras, color handling etc and been invited as press member at Photokina since early 1980.
Who are you?

I'm a hobbyist who likes to shoot and learn. I'm a qualified CPA by profession and am very, very good at what I do for a living.

What I am NOT is someone who goes around insulting people on forums whom I've never personally met. That is surely something you cannot say for yourself.

I'd suggest you go back and read my earlier post. What I mentioned is simple fact that can be VERIFIED from the annual reports of Nikon and Canon. Too bad if you are unable to read and are only talk. The Asian market is less than 1/3 of the US and Europe market combined. If in doubt, you can check up this link that I googled for you -

http://digital-photography-school.com/canon-vs-nikon-a-financial-and-consumer-comparison-infographic

That said, I guess learning is something that is completely beyond you because you like to live in your own la-la land where you are right and everyone else is wrong. If you are what you claim to be, I would say you need professional help. Someone with your experience is usually held in high esteem by everyone around you but your behaviour borders between childish to downright nasty and makes it impossible to have a civilised conversation.

Again, you can go back and read my earlier post ... We can agree to disagree and move on. Simply because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't mean you can get into "who do you think you are" sort of childish behaviour.

 

[RLPhoto]

lot of Canon sport shooters went to Nikon when Canons keepers went down with the AF problems in the 1dmk3, the D3 was much better as a sport camera and Nikon followed up with D3s , compared to 1Dmk4. At the Olympic Games in Beijing there where many Canon shooters moving directly to Nikon because of the low keepers they got with 1Dmk3.
The lens line 14-24 , 24-70, 70-200 and 200-400 Nikon lens was also a big argument to move over to Nikon at this time. Nikon have increased the number of users from a few up to 50/50 in some events, Canon is still Nr1.

Funny, I CAN speak from experience. I shot the Big Ten track meet this year, and out of all of the sports photogs there, there was ONE Nikon shooter. Everyone else had a 1D Mark IV or 1Dx and ALL of them had a 400 f/2.8 for their primary lens.

there are a world l outside the USA , depending of event there are now 50/50 % , look at the latest London Olympic Games. IF sales was the only factor to count for quality then Zeiss, Leica etc would be inferior in all respects
Im using both Canon and Nikon and I think I have more Canon gear then most of you have and I have access to everything from Canon and Nikon. Now Im testing a light zoom , the new 80-400VR together with D800, a couple of weeks ago I was testing all new super tele from Nikon and waiting for the new 200-400 lens from Canon.
In the mean time Im longing after a high resolution camera from Canon
Have a good day all Nikon and Canon users

Dude, Nikon lost like all the sport's shooter since the 90's. They've gained a few back with the d3, but It still canon haven on the sidelines. I was watching the spurs game and it was like 80% canon on the court sidelines.

Canon make's better super-teles than nikon, especially with a tele-converted combo.

 

[East Wind Photography]

The 3DX is the pirated Canon copy they made from stolen architecture plans and reverse engineering the 1DX firmware. :

well , as one example, in Asia, Japan the 3DX has been sold as a status camera, nothing Canon can brag about, do you still think sales from a 18Mp are important factor for the audience here? Then I suggest a compact camera, easier, better tuned for average people to get a straight good JPG out from the camera

What's a 3DX? If Canon had released one, they'd be bragging about it, you can count on that.

Am I to understand that you're suggesting that I should look for 'a compact camera, easier, better tuned for average people to get a straight good JPG out from the camera'? I hope I'm simply misunderstanding you...

 

[J.R.]

Not at all, then you do not know about the ASIAN market including China.

Now who's talking sales? :

Ha ha ... It is this thoroughbred professional having umpteen years of experience who has no clue what he is talking about, check out the annual report of Nikon for the year 2012 here -

http://www.nikon.com/about/ir/ir_library/ar/pdf/ar2012/12annual_e.pdf

The demographics of the sales are thus-

China - 13.7%
Europe - 24.6%
US - 24.1%
Japan - 14.2%
Others - 23.3%

I hear someone likes to talk 'facts'. Tak about the Chinese market in the face of Europe and US market ... What a joke!

 

[J.R.]

What's a 3DX? If Canon had released one, they'd be bragging about it, you can count on that.

No they can't brag about it ... It doesn't have sufficient DR

 

[J.R.]

have I insult people

Yes

 

[RMC33]

Man, Mik derails threads like my 1dx/5d3 produce great images, every time! Hell even my Leica M6 does good work still~

In regards to sports, the last two base ball (minor league) and kayaking events I have shot are all Canon shooters, and a boatload of converts for a better over all system, NOT JUST THE GD SENSOR OR LENS.

Also, Bdunbar lemme know what your test ideas are to compare the two sensors, I have both bodies, a safe full of glass and a 220 ft long studio/shop I can shoot in~

 

[RLPhoto]

lot of Canon sport shooters went to Nikon when Canons keepers went down with the AF problems in the 1dmk3, the D3 was much better as a sport camera and Nikon followed up with D3s , compared to 1Dmk4. At the Olympic Games in Beijing there where many Canon shooters moving directly to Nikon because of the low keepers they got with 1Dmk3.
The lens line 14-24 , 24-70, 70-200 and 200-400 Nikon lens was also a big argument to move over to Nikon at this time. Nikon have increased the number of users from a few up to 50/50 in some events, Canon is still Nr1.

Funny, I CAN speak from experience. I shot the Big Ten track meet this year, and out of all of the sports photogs there, there was ONE Nikon shooter. Everyone else had a 1D Mark IV or 1Dx and ALL of them had a 400 f/2.8 for their primary lens.

there are a world l outside the USA , depending of event there are now 50/50 % , look at the latest London Olympic Games. IF sales was the only factor to count for quality then Zeiss, Leica etc would be inferior in all respects
Im using both Canon and Nikon and I think I have more Canon gear then most of you have and I have access to everything from Canon and Nikon. Now Im testing a light zoom , the new 80-400VR together with D800, a couple of weeks ago I was testing all new super tele from Nikon and waiting for the new 200-400 lens from Canon.
In the mean time Im longing after a high resolution camera from Canon
Have a good day all Nikon and Canon users

Dude, Nikon lost like all the sport's shooter since the 90's. They've gained a few back with the d3, but It still canon haven on the sidelines. I was watching the spurs game and it was like 80% canon on the court sidelines.

Canon make's better super-teles than nikon, especially with a tele-converted combo.

dude, they are not few. from few to 40% and depending of the event more than 40% is not few
dude

I'd say its a 1 nikon to 3 canons in sports. Not that it really matters now since nikon users are migrating back to canon for the 1Dx.

 

[J.R.]

have I insult people

Yes

many more have insult me due the lack of knowledge and make funny remarks, all from exposures, DR to motives when I have laying proof on the table and strait comparisons, Im lucky I have more than one system, others have one and and stick with it as it was the most important things in the world.

I'll quote you your own words Mikael, you said it best (though in a different context it but applies to your above post as well)-

sorry, its not like that, you can wish or believe what you want if that is important for you