70D vs D7100 ISO Comparison at 100%

[Loswr]

Ok, I conclude that the D7100 has problems with color fidelity and exposure metering that occur specifically at ISO 800. Maybe it wasn't a useless test after all... :

how did you come to that conclusion?

Isn't it obvious? The ISO 800 shot from the D7100 is underexposed and the color balance is off, compared to the other D7100 shots. Therefore, based on this test, the D7100 has a problem at ISO 800. : : :

 

[ishdakuteb]

i have lent people my raw files, Im relatively new here but at preview they are used to get my raw files since 2001 where Im a senior member

I have not be printing a business card since 10 years, back i took down my Picture Bank years ago, you se I have enough of customers and need not to show off my self, but you can always google at my name
questions?

1. "i have lent people my raw files": please raise your hands if there is a person in this forum has received ankorwatt raw file
2. "Im relatively new here": yes, you are new with a new nick name but pretty old with nick Mikael Risedal which was banned
3. "need not to show off my self": i am not sure what you can show off in this forum? at least not to me. but i do respect mr. MichaelTheMaven since i did learn something from his youtube videos back to the day when i fisrt start with dslr
4. "i took down my Picture Bank": i have seen some of your SNAPSHOTS taking in indochina, but nothing interested... want to see some interested images taking in the same places? here is one of the link: http://www.peterphamphotography.com/ or search for Don Hong-Oai for photo painting
5. "but you can always google at my name" for what? since there is nothing that i can learn from you. if you offer some great tutorials helping me taking great images, i will certainly look for your name. but i do not think you have this chance any more with available light since i am way pass your skills in this area. well, i am starting to learn strobist... know strobist or some skills like Erik Johansson? put up some tutorials, i put your name into my search list LOL

questions?

 

[horshack]

The High ISO performance between two competing bodies of the same generation are very close, which means two things:

1) The differences aren't that important in actual, practical use.

2) To measure those small differences you have to use an exacting methodology. This means the same absolute exposure (aperture/shutter speed) with the same lighting. Matching the aperture requires using the same lens on both bodies, which for Canikon means using a Nikon-mount lens with a manual aperture ring, and adapting the lens to the Canon body using a F-mount -> EF mount adapter. Failing to use the same lens on both bodies means the actual aperture/t-stop can vary by up to or more than a 1/2 stop, which is larger than the actual High ISO difference between most bodies of the same sensor size. Naturally you also have to use a tripod, timer release, MLUP, and identical framing.

 

[scottkinfw]

Regardless of results, I am not about to "jump ship", like a recent poster, just for a test. Now if a new Canon body or lens came out that had some great feature or spec that I had to have, that would be another story. However, the point has been mad many times, it is the whole system that counts. Not withstanding the validity of this test.

 

[Marsu42]

1) The differences aren't that important in actual, practical use.

I wouldn't say that, since iso noise is the main limiting factor on crop even a 1/2 stop gain might very well make a difference to some - it's not much, but it will show on each and every image you produce. And when you downsample the 24mp d7100 to 18mp and compare with the current Canon crop sensor, there will be more than nothing to see.

2) To measure those small differences you have to use an exacting methodology.

+1

 

[Loswr]

Ok, I conclude that the D7100 has problems with color fidelity and exposure metering that occur specifically at ISO 800. Maybe it wasn't a useless test after all... :

how did you come to that conclusion?

Isn't it obvious? The ISO 800 shot from the D7100 is underexposed and the color balance is off, compared to the other D7100 shots. Therefore, based on this test, the D7100 has a problem at ISO 800. : : :

or the photographer to handle the camera

Wait, wait...are you suggesting that someone can conduct a 'test' in such a way that it appears there's a 'problem' or 'defecit' with the camera's performance, but it's really just the fault or bias of the person conducting the 'test'? What an amazing idea... Gee, I wonder if that's happened anywhere else on this forum?

 

[Jim O]

as I said, google
is there anything you particularly want to know? I was among the first in Sweden to go to the digital process and that I have scanned film about 10years before digital camera came along, I've been co authors of numerous articles, I have 30 long years of working experience as a photographer?

I do not plan to argue with you but I am curious. I am new here and you seem, well you seem to be fairly opinionated. I have googled you and find little more than argumentative posts here and elsewhere, a few photos from Lund University, and one on Wiki of Martin Saarikangas. By the way, are his teeth really that yellow? I didn't find any serious articles but perhaps they are hard to find hidden among your rants, raves, insults, and boasts here and elsewhere. Can you point us to say, a half dozen or even better a dozen of these "numerous articles". It's ok if they're in Swedish. I can use Google Translate.

 

[Marsu42]

BOB N has now presented the figures for 70D regarding read out noise, DR etc

Interesting - I can understand the large dr difference, but would anybody please care to explain to poor /me what read noise and saturation mean for real world shooting?

I tried to look at the explanations (from http://www.clarkvision.com/articles/digital.sensor.performance.summary/index.html) - but they are very technical and according to these numbers, both the 5d3 and 70d have to be complete junk @iso100 which doesn't seem to hinder even pros using them. So what's the real world difference?

 

[celestyx]

BOB N has now presented the figures for 70D regarding read out noise, DR etc
here we can se 70d in comparison with one Toshiba and one Sony made sensor
The read out noise is 4,35 times higher , compare this to 5dmk3 vs d800 there 5dmk3 has 12,2 times higher read out noise.

Why is it the measured ISO are so different from the reported ISO?
Shouldn't this be taken into account when we compare the noise of cameras at high iso?

 

[Loswr]

if you take a look at dpreview and 800iso from d7100 and 70D there is not any strange with 800iso from any camera

Thanks to you and your 30 years experience for clearing that up, I'm sure glad to know the D7100 doesn't have a problem at ISO 800. Now I feel a little embarrassed for all those posts I almost made on Nikonrumors about the "D7100 ISO 800 problem," silly me. But you've cleared it all up for me, Mikael - I really thought the test reported here was valid and well executed. Or did I? Let's take a look and se what I wrote above, and try to read and understand about tests and validity.

 

[Marsu42]

Why is it the measured ISO are so different from the reported ISO? Shouldn't this be taken into account when we compare the noise of cameras at high iso?

Imho no, because the measured iso is just an intermediate layer nobody cares about - the more the companies cheat on the iso value, the more underexposed the shots will get and *that* is the thing to compare because it will raise the noise level.

 

[Pi]

BOB N has now presented the figures for 70D regarding read out noise, DR etc
here we can se 70d in comparison with one Toshiba and one Sony made sensor
The read out noise is 4,35 times higher , compare this to 5dmk3 vs d800 there 5dmk3 has 12,2 times higher read out noise.

Where did you get this, it is not on sensorgen yet?

The d7000 has an amazing saturation level, a stop above the typical for a crop camera.

 

[Loswr]

Mikael, sorry I confused you again and again and again. I was joking. Sarcasm. You don't get it, that's ok, just let it drop.

 

[Pi]

BOB N has now presented the figures for 70D regarding read out noise, DR etc

Interesting - I can understand the large dr difference, but would anybody please care to explain to poor /me what read noise and saturation mean for real world shooting?

I tried to look at the explanations (from http://www.clarkvision.com/articles/digital.sensor.performance.summary/index.html) - but they are very technical and according to these numbers, both the 5d3 and 70d have to be complete junk @iso100 which doesn't seem to hinder even pros using them. So what's the real world difference?

the real difference do you se in a contrasty motif with large DR or that you can expose a large DR motif different (described 100 of times of me) and you can reproduce more from the blackest to the whitest where in a Canon the read out noise and banding puts an end in the darkest parts in Canon .= to get large DR

In addition - the high saturation level of the d7000 - twice as much as usual, makes this sensor an ISO 50 one, if you consider the rest of the crop bunch to be ISO 100. This allows you to allow for more light, when possible (SS, etc.), and get a lower noise, which is perceived as better tonality. You get the tonality of FF sensors basically. For that, you need to ETTR properly. This, combined with the read noise kept under control increases the DR even further.

EDIT: not quite right: I forgot that the d700 has 16mp "only".

 

[AlanF]

I tend to shoot at 320-640-1250 for wild life. Am I right in interpreting from those data kindly provided from BobN that the sensors tend to be much similar there?

 

[Marsu42]

You get the tonality of FF sensors basically.

Thanks for the explanations - and oh my, does that mean if you shoot at base iso (landscape & architecture w/ tripod) with Nikon crop and the 24mp are enough for you vs. d800 you don't need a ff sensor anymore, esp. not a Canon ff? That's ignoring the lenses and software, of course.

 

[Pi]

You get the tonality of FF sensors basically.

Thanks for the explanations - and oh my, does that mean if you shoot at base iso (landscape & architecture w/ tripod) with Nikon crop and the 24mp are enough for you vs. d800 you don't need a ff sensor anymore, esp. not a Canon ff? That's ignoring the lenses and software, of course.

I was not quite right there. I forgot that the d7000 has 16mp, I thought it is like the d7100. So the d7000 is 1 stop behind the D800 in terms of light collection, instead of 1 stop and 1/3 or so. Not enough to get close to FF, and the D800 is not just any FF.

Even if it had the D800 tonality, the resolution difference due to the pixel count and the enlargement factor still would stay.

 

[Jim O]

My first test is from 1978 Leica summicron-vs a zoom Nikkor 80-200
then search at for example in old Photodo magazines.
is this the best you and others can do , when the arguments runs short, trow garbage at others, it would be better if you and others could met me and argue with facts

If this was a "response" to my questions, it is several things but it didn't answer any of the questions I posed.

I am still waiting for answers. I have searched. Please provide the links since evidently I am too stupid to find them.

Bye the way, that was sarcasm, but I still want the links to your oh so many articles. Saying they're there, and their actually being there are two different things. It's time to walk the walk, not just talk the talk.

 

[aj1575]

Ill be posting a bunch of tests between these 2 cameras. Im learning a lot of really interesting things, and so far it has been an absolute slugfest. The Nikon has been surprising me in positive ways, and then the 70D comes back and crushes the D7100 in others. Ill have a full write up available soon.

Check this out. No commentary on my part, decide for yourselves. Quick and dirty test with description of what I did here:

http://www.michaelthemaven.com/?postID=2894&canon-70d-vs-nikon-d7100-iso-noise-chart

Thanks for the work you put in, but this is not really helpfull. These kinds of tests can be seen at dpReview easely. If you really like to make a test, then show us some real world examples, with decent quality (not like the ones of candles you posted, where some pictures are out of focus.

 

[Pi]

Ill be posting a bunch of tests between these 2 cameras. Im learning a lot of really interesting things, and so far it has been an absolute slugfest. The Nikon has been surprising me in positive ways, and then the 70D comes back and crushes the D7100 in others. Ill have a full write up available soon.

Check this out. No commentary on my part, decide for yourselves. Quick and dirty test with description of what I did here:

http://www.michaelthemaven.com/?postID=2894&canon-70d-vs-nikon-d7100-iso-noise-chart

Thanks for the work you put in, but this is not really helpfull. These kinds of tests can be seen at dpReview easely. If you really like to make a test, then show us some real world examples, with decent quality (not like the ones of candles you posted, where some pictures are out of focus.

The test means nothing if they were not exposed the same way, and there is no mentioning of that. Also, NR is on, one of the shots is misfocused, etc.