7d or Mark II for filming?

[Dave]

If you don't depend on full frame, I think the 600D is the best video SLR at the moment. The 7D is a superior camera but it lacks a flip screen and the new digital video crop zoom thingie from the 600D. If you are primary filming all the cool features of the 7D carry not much weight.

 

[FunkyJam]

Thanks for all the replies. After alot of thinking I'll pick a 5d mark ii and a 50mm 1.8 or even 1.4 if I find a cheap one. Later on, when I have more cash I'll buy more lenses and some other stuff needed.

So, 5D mark ii + 50 1.8(or 1.4) is a good combo to start, what do you think?


Bye.

 

[thejoyofsobe]

i'd go the 50mm f/1.4 route instead of the 50mm f/1.8 if you can afford it and are only looking for one prime lens. it's two-thirds of a stop faster, the bokeh's better with 8 blades vs. 5 blades and the manual focus ring is much more usable.

though i guess for what you're going to pay for the 50mm f/1.4 you could always go for a little more variety and pick up both the 50mm f/1.8 and the 35mm f/2.0.

 

[Jedifarce]

Thanks for all the replies. After alot of thinking I'll pick a 5d mark ii and a 50mm 1.8 or even 1.4 if I find a cheap one. Later on, when I have more cash I'll buy more lenses and some other stuff needed.

So, 5D mark ii + 50 1.8(or 1.4) is a good combo to start, what do you think?


Bye.

I can tell you, although a 5D produces superior image quality and vibrant colors (assuming you're not going for the 'Flat' look) for video, it has a very steep learning curve when compared to a prosumer video camcorder. You might be shocked how terrible your early footage will come out.

These links might help you out ->

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/find/hdslr.jsp

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/indepth/category/tags/hdslr-online-guide?cm_sp=HDSLR-_-HDSLR`Guide-_-HDSLR`Go2Guide

http://philipbloom.net/education/

 

[leGreve]

If you can afford it, go prosumer cam corder instead... the MKII and 7D are old tech by now, and their shortcomings are getting noticed. Thus is the game of the late arriver a hard one.

Rolling shutter, jello'ing and the lack of proper sound, makes for nothing more than a hobby camera, and as soon as clients learn that it was fun for a while with all that shallow depth of field crap, what they loose in return when buying projects from dslr videographers outweighs the fun side of it.

If you wanna stick with Canon... wait around for the october announcement and see if it at all competes with what Sony and Pana has put out. Canon still rules the still world imo, but in the video world they are falling behind again.

Did I mention the crappy sound??? Sound is atleast 50% of any video / film project.

 

[CJRodgers]

Hi Jedifarce,

I checked out them links on B&H educational series things. Found it helpful. On epsisode 1 or two he showed a gear that is attatched to the still lens. Do you know how he has done that and where to get them from, or do you need to send you lens somewhere to have it customised?

Thanks,

Craig

 

[Chicorob]

If you can learn the 7D/5DII in and outs and use them in the right way, you will get much better results that a prosumer camcorder. Color and constrast are simply better in the DLSR's. In bright situations you will get acceptable/good results from a prosumer cam but they will not have the "pro" feel. In low light situations, you just cannot compare the 5DII/7D results to a camcorder. We had 2 cameras recently at a wedding and during the first dance under VERY low light we shot a 5DII at ISO 1600/F2.8 with a LED video light which resulted in a clean/bright image. Under the same situation with a Canon HF G10 and the image was noisy, the colors were flat, and it was really unusable footage. There was a small amount of rolling shutter and jello from the 5D but it was minimal.

Use the right tool for the right shot but if I were given a choice between a G10/7D/5D I would go for the 5DII in an instant. That will a 50 f1.4 will get you about anything you need. A cheap shoulder rig and LCD Loupe will help with stabilization and focus.

 

[Chaos411vm]

The unfortunate thing now and days is that people all want auto focus which doesn't work with creating movies anyway. If you are filming as you appear to be doing. Auto-focus on any camera would be completely useless. Shoot with the 5D as you would shoot with an actual film camera. Pull focus and purchase manual lenses and build up your experience eying focus. Due to the extreme shallow depth of field it can be quite a challenge at first but the results of a proper pull definitely are worth it.

A kit of old Nikon Primes with adapters work amazingly well on the 5D mark II and is quite cheaper. Plus you can control your F-stops manually and not electronically which is worth the purchase right there.

 

[beardofzeus]

I just want to add I've heard about some issues regarding filming with the 7d for extended periods of time. One friend of mine says his sensor overheats after a while and my old roommate had his shutter get stuck open from filming for so long.

Also, that same roommate is a very successful wedding videographer here in hawaii, and he uses a 60d and a 7d ...so there is no point arguing about whether or not a DSLR is suitable for filming. I will add that it takes alot more investment in other rigs to make filming with a DSLR successful, i.e. steady cam, fluid head tripod, cinevate slider, proper sound recording, etc. which can easily add up to the cost of a prosumer video system.
He also loves the swivel screen of the 60d and prefers it over his 7d.

 

[Jedifarce]

If you can learn the 7D/5DII in and outs and use them in the right way, you will get much better results that a prosumer camcorder. Color and constrast are simply better in the DLSR's. In bright situations you will get acceptable/good results from a prosumer cam but they will not have the "pro" feel. In low light situations, you just cannot compare the 5DII/7D results to a camcorder. We had 2 cameras recently at a wedding and during the first dance under VERY low light we shot a 5DII at ISO 1600/F2.8 with a LED video light which resulted in a clean/bright image. Under the same situation with a Canon HF G10 and the image was noisy, the colors were flat, and it was really unusable footage. There was a small amount of rolling shutter and jello from the 5D but it was minimal.

Use the right tool for the right shot but if I were given a choice between a G10/7D/5D I would go for the 5DII in an instant. That will a 50 f1.4 will get you about anything you need. A cheap shoulder rig and LCD Loupe will help with stabilization and focus.

I have to agree. I used to have a JVC GY-HM100 which is considered a "prosumer" camcorder. In terms of image quality, theres no comparison between the JVC and a 5D, the 5D kicks its ass. When you stop to consider that the JVC depreciated by more than a $1000 before I sold it while the 5D hasn't says a lot.

Of course we're talking about image quality, not action. Any fast panning or quick movement, the 5D is your worst enemy.

 

[Jedifarce]

If you can afford it, go prosumer cam corder instead... the MKII and 7D are old tech by now, and their shortcomings are getting noticed. Thus is the game of the late arriver a hard one.

Rolling shutter, jello'ing and the lack of proper sound, makes for nothing more than a hobby camera, and as soon as clients learn that it was fun for a while with all that shallow depth of field crap, what they loose in return when buying projects from dslr videographers outweighs the fun side of it.

If you wanna stick with Canon... wait around for the october announcement and see if it at all competes with what Sony and Pana has put out. Canon still rules the still world imo, but in the video world they are falling behind again.

Did I mention the crappy sound??? Sound is atleast 50% of any video / film project.

Old doesn't necessarily mean bad, I use Nikkor AIS primes that are 20 years old, and they are comparable to Canon L lenses in terms of sharpness and image quality.

 

[Jedifarce]

Hi Jedifarce,

I checked out them links on B&H educational series things. Found it helpful. On epsisode 1 or two he showed a gear that is attatched to the still lens. Do you know how he has done that and where to get them from, or do you need to send you lens somewhere to have it customised?

Thanks,

Craig

Oh, you mean that gear around the lens. That lens gear attaches to a a follow focus (See link) - basically it allows the camera operator to turn a side knob attached to a gear mechanism that turns the lens gear on the focus part of what ever lens you are using. The follow focus allows for very smooth focusing and to minimize camera movement.

http://www.redrockmicro.com/static/images/cat/lg/microFF_indie_bundle_lg.jpg

The reason for using the lens gear without the follow focus, is to make it easier to focus by hand if you're a run-an-gun filmer or if you can't afford a follow focus set up. The Redrock micro follow focus costs about $800.

However, much like the filter size on lenses and how they differ from model to model, you have to make sure you buy the correct lens gear size. (Take a good look at the 3-different gears on that link above, you'll notice they're actually 3-different sized gears)

Too big and it won't attach and lock onto the focus ring of the lens, too small and you won't be able to get it on at all. The lens gear is hard plastic that you can loosen and tighten with a threaded screw and nut at the top of the gear.

 

[Jedifarce]

The unfortunate thing now and days is that people all want auto focus which doesn't work with creating movies anyway. If you are filming as you appear to be doing. Auto-focus on any camera would be completely useless. Shoot with the 5D as you would shoot with an actual film camera. Pull focus and purchase manual lenses and build up your experience eying focus. Due to the extreme shallow depth of field it can be quite a challenge at first but the results of a proper pull definitely are worth it.

A kit of old Nikon Primes with adapters work amazingly well on the 5D mark II and is quite cheaper. Plus you can control your F-stops manually and not electronically which is worth the purchase right there.

Nikkor AIS primes with an nikon to eos adapter and you're good to go.

 

[Jedifarce]

I just want to add I've heard about some issues regarding filming with the 7d for extended periods of time. One friend of mine says his sensor overheats after a while and my old roommate had his shutter get stuck open from filming for so long.

Also, that same roommate is a very successful wedding videographer here in hawaii, and he uses a 60d and a 7d ...so there is no point arguing about whether or not a DSLR is suitable for filming. I will add that it takes alot more investment in other rigs to make filming with a DSLR successful, i.e. steady cam, fluid head tripod, cinevate slider, proper sound recording, etc. which can easily add up to the cost of a prosumer video system.
He also loves the swivel screen of the 60d and prefers it over his 7d.

I like filming at night or at Hawaii's Ice Palace, no overheating problems in there. Lol. However I did watch a friend shooting portraits at the beach on a sunny day and after being in the sun for an hour or so, her T1i kept overexposing the images and she had to shut down her camera for half an hour before she could use it again.

I don't know how your roomate films with the camera screen and not an external monitor. He must have eagle eyes.

 

[CJRodgers]

Thanks! I am very interestesed in this, after looking at this and phillip blooms website he reviewed a much cheaper one ($139) and says it does the job. Heres the link, let me know what you think.

http://www.dfocussystem.com/dfocus.php

Craig

Hi Jedifarce,

I checked out them links on B&H educational series things. Found it helpful. On epsisode 1 or two he showed a gear that is attatched to the still lens. Do you know how he has done that and where to get them from, or do you need to send you lens somewhere to have it customised?

Thanks,

Craig

Oh, you mean that gear around the lens. That lens gear attaches to a a follow focus (See link) - basically it allows the camera operator to turn a side knob attached to a gear mechanism that turns the lens gear on the focus part of what ever lens you are using. The follow focus allows for very smooth focusing and to minimize camera movement.

http://www.redrockmicro.com/static/images/cat/lg/microFF_indie_bundle_lg.jpg

The reason for using the lens gear without the follow focus, is to make it easier to focus by hand if you're a run-an-gun filmer or if you can't afford a follow focus set up. The Redrock micro follow focus costs about $800.

However, much like the filter size on lenses and how they differ from model to model, you have to make sure you buy the correct lens gear size. (Take a good look at the 3-different gears on that link above, you'll notice they're actually 3-different sized gears)

Too big and it won't attach and lock onto the focus ring of the lens, too small and you won't be able to get it on at all. The lens gear is hard plastic that you can loosen and tighten with a threaded screw and nut at the top of the gear.

 

[Jedifarce]

Thanks! I am very interestesed in this, after looking at this and phillip blooms website he reviewed a much cheaper one ($139) and says it does the job. Heres the link, let me know what you think.

http://www.dfocussystem.com/dfocus.php

Craig

It probably works, just remember you always get what you pay for. If you buy a cheaper lens compared to an L lens, while they both have glass and a focus ring, you're going to see the difference in your images when using an L lens over the cheaper model. Same for the cheaper follow focus,

I purchased the Redrock micro follow focus, when you think about it is just as expensive as my external SmallHD monitor. But you know what it's silky smooth and well built. Would you get the same build quality for something $700 cheaper, I sort of doubt it.

It pretty much comes down to if you're a hardcore filmer or something you do as a hobby occasionally shooting video, if it's the latter the cheaper follow focus would make sense. However, if you plan on taking video to its max, don't waste your money buying the cheaper model then regretting not purchasing the higher end follow focus first.

 

[allhallowseve]

Hey,

Im about to upgrade my camera but I'm not quiet sure which one is the right one for me. Here is the deal, as I study tv and cinema I need a camera for filming but I also enjoy taking pictures(that's why I won't buy a handy cam or something). So my problem comes when I don't know which one to choose. I heard the Mark II better but is the 600€ worth the difference? Anyone has both or used both? Please help me out Thank you in advance

Shooting on the 7D is cool... if you love amazing looking footage! I have shot my 2 most recent short films on the 7D and was amazed with the cinematic quality of the footage. That, coupled with the Habbycam HD shoulder brace made my films amazing! http://www.habbycam.com