7D!

[dtaylor]

I have just bought a 7D and have been very disappointed with the IQ from it. Much worse than my old 10mp 40D. Amazing camera but whats the point when the IQ is rubbish. So noisy where it counts 100-400ISO, very disappointed.

Do a like-for-like comparison and multiply the 10MP image by 1.8x and see which camera is best, you'll be surprised

Dude, there are so many people that don't get this it blows my mind. They just zoom to 100% in PS and start complaining, never stopping to think that 18 MP at 100% is higher magnification then 10 MP at 100%. Or worse, they zoom to 200% or 300% failing to realize that they are now testing their viewing software and not the cameras. This is the source of so much confusion and so many bad recommendations that it's not even funny.

There are people who honestly believe that diffraction and CA is worse with higher resolution cameras because they can't equalize their image sizes in PS. And there are people who will recommend a 40D over a 60D or 7D for the same reason.

Another comparison where this drives me nuts: 1D3 vs 7D. The 1D3 is a great camera, but the 7D has superior IQ across the board. Yet when the topic comes up: "Oh, my 1D3 shots are sooo smooth. Not like that noisy 7D." Yeah. Scale those shots up and see how soft and noisy they become.

Sorry, I don't mean to rant, but this hits one of my pet peeves.

 

[jthomson]

* Touchscreen - Couldn't be more of a gimmick

My Panasonic G3 has a touch screen and I have found it to be quite a fast way to access camera features. Much better than the quick menu on my T1i. So I would like to see a touch screen on the 7D2.

 

[DB]

There are people who honestly believe that diffraction and CA is worse with higher resolution cameras because they can't equalize their image sizes in PS. And there are people who will recommend a 40D over a 60D or 7D for the same reason.

Another comparison where this drives me nuts: 1D3 vs 7D. The 1D3 is a great camera, but the 7D has superior IQ across the board. Yet when the topic comes up: "Oh, my 1D3 shots are sooo smooth. Not like that noisy 7D." Yeah. Scale those shots up and see how soft and noisy they become.

Sorry, I don't mean to rant, but this hits one of my pet peeves.

Couldn't agree with you more, they just need to understand that 'noise' comes from 2 things:

(1) sensor (captured) noise - gapless microlens tech is improving all the time (better quantum efficiency)

(2) read noise - basically what the camera software does after the image is captured, so algorithms/AA filter/analog-digital conversion etc. and how the processor deals with these is also improving as DIGIC4 was better than DIGIC-III and now DIGIC5+ even better, hence better noise + ISO performance

However, there is one area where Canon seems to lag the competition, and that is tonal performance or Dynamic Range (DR), but I don't have the technical expertise to understand why

 

[tomscott]

I have just bought a 7D and have been very disappointed with the IQ from it. Much worse than my old 10mp 40D. Amazing camera but whats the point when the IQ is rubbish. So noisy where it counts 100-400ISO, very disappointed.

Do a like-for-like comparison and multiply the 10MP image by 1.8x and see which camera is best, you'll be surprised

Dude, there are so many people that don't get this it blows my mind. They just zoom to 100% in PS and start complaining, never stopping to think that 18 MP at 100% is higher magnification then 10 MP at 100%. Or worse, they zoom to 200% or 300% failing to realize that they are now testing their viewing software and not the cameras. This is the source of so much confusion and so many bad recommendations that it's not even funny.

There are people who honestly believe that diffraction and CA is worse with higher resolution cameras because they can't equalize their image sizes in PS. And there are people who will recommend a 40D over a 60D or 7D for the same reason.

Another comparison where this drives me nuts: 1D3 vs 7D. The 1D3 is a great camera, but the 7D has superior IQ across the board. Yet when the topic comes up: "Oh, my 1D3 shots are sooo smooth. Not like that noisy 7D." Yeah. Scale those shots up and see how soft and noisy they become.

Sorry, I don't mean to rant, but this hits one of my pet peeves.

I honestly didnt know this. Thank you for pointing it out. So basically to get a true comparison I need to photograph one subject with both cameras but with the 40D zoom to 180% to get the same magnification to accurately compare?

So really is it more accurate to view the 7D images at less than 100%?? Like 66%? Because at 100% they do look grainy at 100-400 especially. I have been more impressed by its higher ISO results than the 100-400ISO range.

I have been looking at 5DMKIII sample raws at staggering ISOs at 100% and the detail is phenomenal in comparison, 1600 (if not higher) is easily similar to 800 on the 7D. I no it is full frame and the 7D has higher pixel count but what is a true comparison? I was under the impression 100% is 100% and a viable comparison, all the quick reviews ive seen online do this like thecamerastoretv 5DMKIII and D800 although the D800 res is much higher.

 

[AprilForever]

Honestly, if you frame FF and APS-C the same, you get very similar results, except aps-c corners are better... So, no aps-h for me! The 7D is awesome as it is, and they need for the 7D mark II to not to damage it.

 

[AprilForever]

Here is the same still life test shot from the Imaging Sensor taken with the new 5D3 @ ISO 400 f8 70mm, again just extracting a 720 x 480 pixel crop, it is insanely good -> look at the improved detail & better coloring on the face of the fiddler on the bottle

Which is a cycle ahead of the old 7D, which is a lot in digital years...

 

[DB]

Here is the same still life test shot from the Imaging Sensor taken with the new 5D3 @ ISO 400 f8 70mm, again just extracting a 720 x 480 pixel crop, it is insanely good -> look at the improved detail & better coloring on the face of the fiddler on the bottle

Which is a cycle ahead of the old 7D, which is a lot in digital years...

Sure is. I've checked the 5D3 @ 12,800 ISO and it is way better than the 7D @ 3,200 ISO (especially in color saturation retention, similar in banding & noise) so at least +2 stop improvement (possibly 3 stops) vis-a-viz the King of the APS-C (not counting 1D's cos' they're Pro range). I think a half-stop per annum improvement is definite progress.

 

[bkorcel]

I agree it's a gimmick. I've never been fond of touch screens. Human hands are always very dirty/oily. Just look at anyone's iPod or iPad. When the screen is filthy it makes it very difficult to chimp your shot..and especially so with today;s antireflective screen coatings. One smudge and your wanting a cloth and some cleaning fluid.

Where the touch screens are useful is when you can write on the image or manipulate the image in some way using finger gestures...though I am very acclimated to zooming using the other camera controls...and Apple has that patent anyway.

No touch screens on our pro and semi-pro DSLRs please. Save it for the kids to play with.

* Touchscreen - Couldn't be more of a gimmick

My Panasonic G3 has a touch screen and I have found it to be quite a fast way to access camera features. Much better than the quick menu on my T1i. So I would like to see a touch screen on the 7D2.

 

[pierceography]

I agree it's a gimmick. I've never been fond of touch screens. Human hands are always very dirty/oily. Just look at anyone's iPod or iPad. When the screen is filthy it makes it very difficult to chimp your shot..and especially so with today;s antireflective screen coatings. One smudge and your wanting a cloth and some cleaning fluid.

Where the touch screens are useful is when you can write on the image or manipulate the image in some way using finger gestures...though I am very acclimated to zooming using the other camera controls...and Apple has that patent anyway.

No touch screens on our pro and semi-pro DSLRs please. Save it for the kids to play with.

* Touchscreen - Couldn't be more of a gimmick

My Panasonic G3 has a touch screen and I have found it to be quite a fast way to access camera features. Much better than the quick menu on my T1i. So I would like to see a touch screen on the 7D2.

I still think it's a gimmick. I don't know about those who use or want to use a touch screen on an SLR, but when I'm shooting, I'm holding on to that camera with BOTH hands! Maybe I'm just overly protective of my gear, but you'll rarely find me holding the camera with just one hand with no neck strap. So at that point, I'm pretty much limited to index fingers and thumbs -- which work just fine operating the existing buttons. Throw your commonly used menu items in the custom menu and call it a day. Though I wouldn't mind seeing the ability to add more than six items to the custom menu. But there's a big difference between a magnesium alloy SLR and a five ounce iPhone.

Besides, I'd rather Canon use their resources on developing better imaging technology than waste those resources on a trend that arguably has little to no impact on picture quality.

 

[AprilForever]

I agree it's a gimmick. I've never been fond of touch screens. Human hands are always very dirty/oily. Just look at anyone's iPod or iPad. When the screen is filthy it makes it very difficult to chimp your shot..and especially so with today;s antireflective screen coatings. One smudge and your wanting a cloth and some cleaning fluid.

Where the touch screens are useful is when you can write on the image or manipulate the image in some way using finger gestures...though I am very acclimated to zooming using the other camera controls...and Apple has that patent anyway.

No touch screens on our pro and semi-pro DSLRs please. Save it for the kids to play with.

* Touchscreen - Couldn't be more of a gimmick

My Panasonic G3 has a touch screen and I have found it to be quite a fast way to access camera features. Much better than the quick menu on my T1i. So I would like to see a touch screen on the 7D2.

I still think it's a gimmick. I don't know about those who use or want to use a touch screen on an SLR, but when I'm shooting, I'm holding on to that camera with BOTH hands! Maybe I'm just overly protective of my gear, but you'll rarely find me holding the camera with just one hand with no neck strap. So at that point, I'm pretty much limited to index fingers and thumbs -- which work just fine operating the existing buttons. Throw your commonly used menu items in the custom menu and call it a day. Though I wouldn't mind seeing the ability to add more than six items to the custom menu. But there's a big difference between a magnesium alloy SLR and a five ounce iPhone.

Besides, I'd rather Canon use their resources on developing better imaging technology than waste those resources on a trend that arguably has little to no impact on picture quality.

Indeed. There are many better things than that. Tis a mere gimmick for rebel cameras. And, honestly, I don't want an articulating screen wither. I want the thing to be built like a tank.

And it must needs be APS-C! And they better not steal any MP...

 

[tnargs]

....So basically to get a true comparison I need to photograph one subject with both cameras but with the 40D zoom to 180% to get the same magnification to accurately compare?...

Mate, are you a camera reviewer? What's the point? Go read a real reviewer's test of the 7D e.g. dpreview.com: they thought the IQ was fine.

 

[pdirestajr]

I shoot raw with the 7D. Never any problem with noise. Just don't underexposed your shots!

 

[jondave]

More than anything it's a tone curve I always apply on my raw files.

Saturation is purely subjective, depends on what the photo and how I want it to look.

 

[tome223]

After the disappointing 6d announcement I;ll also be holding out for the 7d mark ii. I think it will be aps-c but if they make it aps-h Thats all the more reason to buy it. I think the 70d may be announced first, maybe in January.