Any chance of an 80D surprise?

[tcmatthews]

I hope it is true. Now for the question is it a token update or do they feel the need to put 4k in there video focused entry level DSLR.

 

[Don Haines]

I hope it is true. Now for the question is it a token update or do they feel the need to put 4k in there video focused entry level DSLR.

I have had 4K in a GoPro for the last 3 years..... if they wanted to, they could do it. It is highly likely that the camera will support the UHS-II interface for the SD cards, so that gives you an incredibly fast storage option so 4K video could be done without compressing the image to death......

 

[nickolas]

what about the shity mud blur filter like video of canon even in the old 5d mkiii....many of as bought a 70d,7d mkii or even a 5d mkiii for video purposses...i personally don't care about 4k or 120fps,can canon give me a clear video with good quality at 60fps hd..??it's much more easy to shoot with canon bodys and the lenses are awesome but the quality sucks compare to sony,nikon or panasonic(search the net or do some test's..)...what i want is a 70d at TRUE hd 60fps and BETTER iso and i cant wait forever like september or 2017....i love canon i love the skin tones,battery's,grip's,lenses...but in the end everything is about image quality and sony,nikon can give to you even bad lenses..

 

[hhkd]

I'd love to see an 80D this year. I won't buy it until next year (wedding, new truck, new shower) but high iso improvement is most important for me. The ergonomics of the XXD line are perfect and I can't justify the move to full frame since I might destroy the camera and lens while taking pictures from a kayak. Here's an ISO 3200 shot from my 60D, I'd like to get up to 12,800 with similar results. This was from a boat, I would never be near gators and pigs in a kayak.
Swamp Pig by Hashim D, on Flickr

 

[ajfotofilmagem]

I'd love to see an 80D this year. I won't buy it until next year (wedding, new truck, new shower) but high iso improvement is most important for me. The ergonomics of the XXD line are perfect and I can't justify the move to full frame since I might destroy the camera and lens while taking pictures from a kayak. Here's an ISO 3200 shot from my 60D, I'd like to get up to 12,800 with similar results. This was from a boat, I would never be near gators and pigs in a kayak.
Swamp Pig by Hashim D, on Flickr

You get great results with your 60D at ISO 3200.

I think it would be too optimistic to expect 80D will do as well in ISO12800, such as 60D in 3200. But it is possible that 80D is comparable in ISO6400.

 

[PhotographyFirst]

Photo Rumors is saying the 80D should be announced soon. It will be interesting to see if it has the new sensor tech of the 1DX 2 That would just about guarantee the 6D2 and 5D4 will as well.

 

[mkabi]

If Canon makes the 80D too good, it can hurt 7D2 sales. Too weak, and it isn't much better than a Rebel.

I speculated about 6 months back that there may never be an 80D if Canon moves the Rebels up a touch, and the flagship 7D2 comes down in price, which it has. Sale prices from authorized dealers on the 7D2 are so low, what could an 80D possibly release at to make it worthwhile for the money?

Also what features would make someone want to skip a Rebel, but not necessarily need a 7D2? Other than AFMA over the Rebel and articulating touch screen over the 7D2, I can't think of anything.

Canon would have to release the 80D at a price right between the 7D2 and Rebel. And set it up to be an in between camera.

Maybe the 80D is a dead concept?

Might be better to just release like a Rebel extreme or a higher end Rebel. Something that would replace the 70D, but keep in line with the Rebels and compete with the D7200.

Canon has this gap to deal with. Especially in AF. Canon AF goes form the 19pt system up to the 61/65 point system. Nothing in between.


Nikon isn't stingy like Canon, and has no problem offering up the 51pt system on their D7100/7200. Canon is a bit stingy, and has kept their higher end AF on the 5D series cameras and the 7D2. Not even the 6D was given anything more than a 2008 era 11pt.

It's another one of these wedge issues I like to call it. Canon likes to treat features as make-or-break for certain types of photography to segment their product lines and force up selling. That is unfortunate. So either Canon needs to engineer a middle of the road AF system that is better than the 19pt system, but weaker than the 60 point systems to quite appearing stingy and or lacking innovation OR just give these $1,000+ MSRP cameras the 60 point systems and be done with it.

Then there is the FPS. The 70D puts out a respectable 7fps. For anyone except the most serious wildlife and sports people, 7FPS is quite usable. No problem doing sports and wildlife with that casually. Heck, millions have been doing ok with 5fps for years and years. So moving up in FPS would also chip away at the 7D2. 8fps? Unlikely. Give it a 60 point AF system? That could tip the scales for someone to buy an 80D and not a 7D2.



One idea could be, leave the FPS the same. Even leave the AF the same points, maybe make it better at low light a little. Basically, make it the IQ king of APS-C in the lineup. Use the new sensor tech and have 24-28mp, and just deliver the best IQ with a nice touch screen and video features. 7D2 is the rough and tough sports camera, the 80D is the peak of APS-C IQ and video. Rebels are Rebels.

All valid points, but you have to see it another way as well.
In terms of DSLR competition, Nikon is it. They just announced the D5 & D500.
Canon responded with the 1DXII for the D5. What will be their answer for the D500???
Its direct competition should be the 7DII, but it lacks 4K.
And, that's basically it.

Canon has a few choices:
-they can release the 5D4 with 4K, that way neither Canon nor Nikon have an answer for each other's lower end releases. But I'm sure that Nikon will have an answer for that a year later, whereas Canon will always have a minimum 3-4 year release cycle.
-release 6DII with 4K, which is literally the same as the 5D4.
-release a firmware update to the 7DII, that unleashes 4K or UHD (this would be really sweet for a lot of current owners, including myself), yet to be owners may see a price hike.
-release 7DIII, highly unlikely.
-release 80D, more likely. Because, which is more older? The 7DII or the 70D? Which one is used more for video 7DII or 70D?

Ultimately, the 7DII is a mini-1DX, and used most for sports, wildlife... it does have slightly better video features than the 70D, but lacking the swivel screen and touch screen. The D500 is a mini-D5... which is newer... to have a mini-1DXII, we either have to wait or they can have a substitute for a while till the 7DIII is released.

 

[K]

All valid points, but you have to see it another way as well.
In terms of DSLR competition, Nikon is it. They just announced the D5 & D500.
Canon responded with the 1DXII for the D5. What will be their answer for the D500???
Its direct competition should be the 7DII, but it lacks 4K.
And, that's basically it.

It's the other way around. The D500 is the answer to the 7D Mark II.

Nikon users have been screaming for high end sports/wildlife flagship APS-C since the D300.

The only area where the D500 may be better than the 7D2 could be IQ in terms of ISO and DR, and that remains to be seen. But it stands to reason given it will have newer technology. I don't expect big leaps here, being that they're both crop and in a couple of years there is nothing revolutionary.

I doubt the Nikon AF system will be superior. Equal? Perhaps. I wouldn't be surprised if the 7D2 AF comes out on top, despite being older tech.

4K? Who cares. 4K is one of those things....it just isn't worth it unless it is done right. And to do it right is rare these days and expensive. Otherwise, 4K is just a token spec for marketing and publicity.

Beyond those things, they are basically the same camera.

The 7D2 has DPAF...



If the 80D has dual SD slots, I will buy 2 of them.

If not, the 70D which will be blown out for $500 or less will be a super deal and great value.

 

[afonsoclj]

The only area where the D500 may be better than the 7D2 could be IQ in terms of ISO and DR, and that remains to be seen. But it stands to reason given it will have newer technology. I don't expect big leaps here, being that they're both crop and in a couple of years there is nothing revolutionary.

IMO the buffer size difference is what gives the victory to Nikon, being both sports-oriented cameras. And the same must be applied to the 1Dx2 x D5 competition. 12 stops of DR on 7D2 isn't that bad....

 

[mkabi]

4K? Who cares. 4K is one of those things....it just isn't worth it unless it is done right. And to do it right is rare these days and expensive. Otherwise, 4K is just a token spec for marketing and publicity.

Spoken like a person that doesn't care for video features in his/her DSLR, right?
I mean... nobody will buy 4K DSLRs, what the hell were they thinking with the 1DX2?
:

The 7D2 has DPAF...

This I agree with.

 

[nhz]

Ultimately, the 7DII is a mini-1DX, and used most for sports, wildlife... it does have slightly better video features than the 70D, but lacking the swivel screen and touch screen. The D500 is a mini-D5... which is newer... to have a mini-1DXII, we either have to wait or they can have a substitute for a while till the 7DIII is released.

A mini-1DXII sounds nice, however ...

It's about time Canon gets sensor performance (especially at low ISO) that is about as good as Nikon/Sony; but I'm not holding my breath for that one. IMHO the D500 is better than 7D2 on almost every spec; of course it should be, because it is a more expensive camera. But the probably much better sensor, tilt screen and lots of other extras like Snapbridge make D500 a far more 'universal' camera to me than 7D2. 7D3 seems at least 2-3 years in the future, if Canon sticks to their usual schedule and I don't see how a 80D could bridge the gap without 'killing' the 7D2.

 

[rrcphoto]

Ultimately, the 7DII is a mini-1DX, and used most for sports, wildlife... it does have slightly better video features than the 70D, but lacking the swivel screen and touch screen. The D500 is a mini-D5... which is newer... to have a mini-1DXII, we either have to wait or they can have a substitute for a while till the 7DIII is released.

A mini-1DXII sounds nice, however ...

It's about time Canon gets sensor performance (especially at low ISO) that is about as good as Nikon/Sony; but I'm not holding my breath for that one. IMHO the D500 is better than 7D2 on almost every spec

except for things like the buffer depth is with QXD cards, 10fps is only with manual focus.. it's much heralded 4k is a heavy crop of a crop camera...

and this sept, the 7D2 will be two years old.

and btw, there's been enough leaks of the 1DX Mark II sensor to show that the low ISO latitude is close enough to the sony sensors to make it just an argument for the fanboys.

 

[nhz]

and btw, there's been enough leaks of the 1DX Mark II sensor to show that the low ISO latitude is close enough to the sony sensors to make it just an argument for the fanboys.

yeah, right ... typical Canon fanboy argument.

 

[rrcphoto]

and btw, there's been enough leaks of the 1DX Mark II sensor to show that the low ISO latitude is close enough to the sony sensors to make it just an argument for the fanboys.

yeah, right ... typical Canon fanboy argument.

they posted a +5 EV shadow push from both the 1DX II and the 1DX. the A7RII looks slightly cleaner, but this was comparing ACR output to RAW therapee non optimal RAW conversion of 1DXII.

it's not a typical "fanboy argument" when it's already been discussed here, fm and dpr.

the 1DXII has ADC's on chip using some sort of SS or DS-ADC architecture.

an ISO 100 +5 EV shadow boost apparently looks similar to ISO 6400 OOC (not sure if that was JPG OOC) .. which means it's pretty close to ISO invariant. (if that was OOC JPG then probably is close, if that was RAW, then within an EV)

doing napkin math - within 1EV of ISO invariance should remove most of the problem domain outside of a few forum dwellers that have nothing better to do.

 

[K]

4K? Who cares. 4K is one of those things....it just isn't worth it unless it is done right. And to do it right is rare these days and expensive. Otherwise, 4K is just a token spec for marketing and publicity.

Spoken like a person that doesn't care for video features in his/her DSLR, right?
I mean... nobody will buy 4K DSLRs, what the hell were they thinking with the 1DX2?
:

Nikon's implementation of 4K downright sucks. 4K is about ultimate quality. If it isn't done right, then there's no point to it. Proper 4K video capability right now is the territory of Canon flagships. Not Nikon cameras, or Canon enthusiast/consumer cameras.


Could Canon put 4K in the 80D? Yes. Would it be worthy? No.


I'd have to agree with others, the 80D just has to make sure it can compete (or surpass) with the Nikon D5500 and D7200. That means connectivity and other consumer interested features. Doubt 4K is high up on the list of consumer demand for DSLR video making....

 

[nhz]

4K? Who cares. 4K is one of those things....it just isn't worth it unless it is done right. And to do it right is rare these days and expensive. Otherwise, 4K is just a token spec for marketing and publicity.

Spoken like a person that doesn't care for video features in his/her DSLR, right?
I mean... nobody will buy 4K DSLRs, what the hell were they thinking with the 1DX2?
:

Nikon's implementation of 4K downright sucks. 4K is about ultimate quality. If it isn't done right, then there's no point to it. Proper 4K video capability right now is the territory of Canon flagships. Not Nikon cameras, or Canon enthusiast/consumer cameras.


Could Canon put 4K in the 80D? Yes. Would it be worthy? No.


I'd have to agree with others, the 80D just has to make sure it can compete (or surpass) with the Nikon D5500 and D7200. That means connectivity and other consumer interested features. Doubt 4K is high up on the list of consumer demand for DSLR video making....

Agree that the 4K on D500 doesn't look attractive, except maybe for wildlife video where the crop factor might be an advantage. But the 80D apparently skips 4K completely..., for that you have to buy the 90D in 2 years or the more expensive 5D4 end of this year ;-)