Any news on Sony A7R II?

[emko]

I doubt they would enter into an agreement like that. Rather I assume they have determined it doesn't matter (and in the preponderance of shooting conditions, it doesn't). Shrug.

Still may be an upcoming firmware change to enable lossless raw

It does matter ...

Yes, but not in the preponderance of shooting conditions. I would like the option and I'd probably use it because space isn't in issue.

and how exactly can they call something RAW when its lossy compressed it would be like calling JPEG raw when its clearly not

Not quite; JPEG is debayered. Is there an industry standard definition of how much processing "unraws" something? A better question is: how can they claim 14-bit output?

yes i do take photos of stars and also i would not want to worry about any artifacts when i don't have to with other camera

I've seen plenty of pictures of stars produced with Sony's 11+7 compression and tone curve. I have seen the example by the RAWDIGGER guy of trails with artifacts that he accentuated, but I haven't seen much evidence that it's a pervasive problem, such as "if you shoot stars you're going to get halos." It's an edge case.

Then you have 12bit BECAUSE you choose to use BULB? really? or any of the other modes other then single shot.

I don't claim to understand it. Bulb is annoying, as is silent shutter. I wonder if it's a hardware limitation or a software thing.

to be honest i probably would be fine with the lossy but i am paying $3,999.99 for something that should have option for RAW 14bit and then having to always think about if there is going to be artifacts in my photos.

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

any news on a lossless compression?

No.

and have they fixed where bulb, and the shutter mode is set to continuous drive, speed-continuous drive, continuous bracketing result in a 12bit file instead of 14bit?

No, bulb, LNR, etc. still drop precision to 12-bit.

that really sucks, how can a company that makes great sensors not be able to get RAW images from it? is this a deal with Nikon or something? where Nikon can get RAW images for their Cameras ?

Yup. Canon is getting better IQ on their G3 X than Panasonic or Sony from the same 1 inch sensor. The processor makes a difference.

 

[emko]

any news on a lossless compression?

No.

and have they fixed where bulb, and the shutter mode is set to continuous drive, speed-continuous drive, continuous bracketing result in a 12bit file instead of 14bit?

No, bulb, LNR, etc. still drop precision to 12-bit.

that really sucks, how can a company that makes great sensors not be able to get RAW images from it? is this a deal with Nikon or something? where Nikon can get RAW images for their Cameras ?

Yup. Canon is getting better IQ on their G3 X than Panasonic or Sony from the same 1 inch sensor. The processor makes a difference.

that makes no sense unless the cause is the losssy compression how can the RAW data be different? or does the processor adjust the RAW data?

 

[3kramd5]

There's also a question of whether someone testing "sensor IQ" has truly isolated the sensor (and for the sake of argument, the associated signal chain). For fixed lens cameras, the answer is obviously: no. Perhaps the canon's optics transmit colors better than the panasonic's and sony's, leading to better measured colors in a sensor analysis.

Shrug.

 

[bwud]

I'm waiting for a trusted source to post some raw results in low incandescent light. High ISO shots always look fairly good in bright light, its the low light shots that interest me. So far, its about what I expected, ISO 6400 is usable with NR.

Minus the "trusted source," here are a few high iso shots under street lights.

f/4: ISO6400@1/30, ISO8000@1/40, ISO12800@1/60.

Attached is ISO12800. The noise looks really fine and peppery. I would probably clean up easily, but I wouldn't even bother.

 

[Dylan777]

I'm waiting for a trusted source to post some raw results in low incandescent light. High ISO shots always look fairly good in bright light, its the low light shots that interest me. So far, its about what I expected, ISO 6400 is usable with NR.

Minus the "trusted source," here are a few high iso shots under street lights.

f/4: ISO6400@1/30, ISO8000@1/40, ISO12800@1/60.

Attached is ISO12800. The noise looks really fine and peppery. I would probably clean up easily, but I wouldn't even bother.

Good enough to sell my a7s once a7r II arrived

Thanks for sharing

 

[bdunbar79]

If I can dig up the link I just read a review last night with the A7R II and Canon EF 70-200 f/2.8L II IS auto-focus test. It was, according to the review, miserably slow with the metabones adaptor, which isn't surprising. It was a video with that lens and the 40mm pancakie. Sorry for the premature post; I'm looking for the hyperlink.

 

[msm]

If I can dig up the link I just read a review last night with the A7R II and Canon EF 70-200 f/2.8L II IS auto-focus test. It was, according to the review, miserably slow with the metabones adaptor, which isn't surprising. It was a video with that lens and the 40mm pancakie. Sorry for the premature post; I'm looking for the hyperlink.

This?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cejgMDYI-TU

If so that is neither the metabones adapter, nor the 70-200 IS II. Also seems unclear if he is talking about the bare lens or with the 2x v2 teleconverter. The latter combo isn't exactly stellar on Canon cameras either.

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

I suspect that the data presented in "raw files" is more likely to be "half-baked" and that raw sensor values are never seen by the user.

You can take that to the bank.

There is noise reduction and other things going on before being converted to a raw file. Sony uses lossy compression in their raw files, so they degrade the image some small amount.

 

[emko]

I'm waiting for a trusted source to post some raw results in low incandescent light. High ISO shots always look fairly good in bright light, its the low light shots that interest me. So far, its about what I expected, ISO 6400 is usable with NR.

Minus the "trusted source," here are a few high iso shots under street lights.

f/4: ISO6400@1/30, ISO8000@1/40, ISO12800@1/60.

Attached is ISO12800. The noise looks really fine and peppery. I would probably clean up easily, but I wouldn't even bother.

what the hell is that really 12800? looks just as good as a 5D3 how on earth can 5DS look so bad in comparison at high ISO?

 

[bdunbar79]

If I can dig up the link I just read a review last night with the A7R II and Canon EF 70-200 f/2.8L II IS auto-focus test. It was, according to the review, miserably slow with the metabones adaptor, which isn't surprising. It was a video with that lens and the 40mm pancakie. Sorry for the premature post; I'm looking for the hyperlink.

This?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cejgMDYI-TU

If so that is neither the metabones adapter, nor the 70-200 IS II. Also seems unclear if he is talking about the bare lens or with the 2x v2 teleconverter. The latter combo isn't exactly stellar on Canon cameras either.

You're absolutely right. I got a information-loaded email from an individual who is testing several adapters on several MILC. Sorry I should have actually watched the video first. In the A7R II that is NOT the case. My apologies.

 

[Neutral]

Interesting notes from EOSHD review of a7rII :
-----------------
http://www.eoshd.com/2015/07/hands-on-with-the-sony-a7r-ii/

It looks significantly less noisy at first glance than the Canon 5DS.

We had the Sony 55mm F1.8 FE on the camera. With this AF was enormously impressive. There’s been a big leap here for the A7R II over previous Sony cameras. AF object tracking is massively more sophisticated and getting much closer to a flagship pro DSLR like the 1D X.


The camera is now able to take power from a the USB port whilst recording. This means you can connect a massive USB power cell (20,000mha) and have it act like a V-lock battery on your rig. It also mean you can carry fewer Sony batteries, even jettison the battery grip and charge your camera via a phone top up power bank during down time on set, or even during a shot from the cell Velcro’ed to your rig.

The zoomed focus assist can be toggled during a shot whilst recording 4K, which is something the Canon 1D C doesn’t allow. I find this endlessly useful in the real world and prefer it to peaking. The A7R II does have peaking but I’ll wait to the final production unit to try it out.
---------------

I myself also had quick look at some A7RII high ISO RAW samples posted around and it seems that a7rII is on par with high ISO performance of Canon 1DX at ISO 6400 and 12800
When I get my own a7RII first thing that I will do is comparison of AF (with Sony native lenses) and high ISO performance between my 1DX and a7RII. Will be interesting to see DXO results when available
Considering all above, I have a feeling that a7RII will be able to replace 1Dx for most of my needs and only remaining application for 1DX will be actions/sport/fashion where long (above 100mm) L tele lenses are required.

Could be very handy for travels, had several occasions when had serious difficulties passing on board due to excessive hand baggage weight because of heavy Canon 1DX and Canon lenses that I wanted to be with me during travels.

 

[3kramd5]

Considering all above, I have a feeling that a7RII will be able to replace 1Dx for most of my needs and only remaining application for 1DX will be actions/sport/fashion where long (above 100mm) L tele lenses are required.

Or shooting in weather.

 

[Neutral]

Considering all above, I have a feeling that a7RII will be able to replace 1Dx for most of my needs and only remaining application for 1DX will be actions/sport/fashion where long (above 100mm) L tele lenses are required.

Or shooting in weather.

Agree, so far Sony has nothing that could compete with 1DX in this respect.

Interested to see what Sony would offer with rumored A9 which expected to be targeted for professional users.
Technically a7rII has surpassed my expectations , I thought that this set of features and performance level is reserved for a9, and a7rII would be basically a7R with IBIS and slightly better AF , but seeing what was done with a7rII I would not be surprised to see something really exciting with A9. May be they will announce it after Canon announce 1DXm2, the same as was done with Canon 5DS and 5DsR.
Now Sony as system has best and widest set of primes (both native lenses and best primes from Canon/Nikon/ Zeiss etc.).
Sony is still behind Canon and Nikon with zoom lenses and long primes and Flash system, possibly they will do something competitive in this area in couple of years.

 

[3kramd5]

I will be surprised if Sony makes a move on the pro-level market in the near term. They don't have nearly the infrastructure (lens system, flash system, etc). Sure, the zeiss offerings may be compelling (I'll get the 2/25), but having a mixed bag of manufacturers makes service ponderous.

I think a7r II is the rumored a9. But who knows?

 

[3kramd5]

yes i do take photos of stars

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/54831980

Works for me!

 

[RGF]

Interesting notes from EOSHD review of a7rII :
-----------------
http://www.eoshd.com/2015/07/hands-on-with-the-sony-a7r-ii/

It looks significantly less noisy at first glance than the Canon 5DS.

We had the Sony 55mm F1.8 FE on the camera. With this AF was enormously impressive. There’s been a big leap here for the A7R II over previous Sony cameras. AF object tracking is massively more sophisticated and getting much closer to a flagship pro DSLR like the 1D X.


The camera is now able to take power from a the USB port whilst recording. This means you can connect a massive USB power cell (20,000mha) and have it act like a V-lock battery on your rig. It also mean you can carry fewer Sony batteries, even jettison the battery grip and charge your camera via a phone top up power bank during down time on set, or even during a shot from the cell Velcro’ed to your rig.

The zoomed focus assist can be toggled during a shot whilst recording 4K, which is something the Canon 1D C doesn’t allow. I find this endlessly useful in the real world and prefer it to peaking. The A7R II does have peaking but I’ll wait to the final production unit to try it out.
---------------

I myself also had quick look at some A7RII high ISO RAW samples posted around and it seems that a7rII is on par with high ISO performance of Canon 1DX at ISO 6400 and 12800
When I get my own a7RII first thing that I will do is comparison of AF (with Sony native lenses) and high ISO performance between my 1DX and a7RII. Will be interesting to see DXO results when available
Considering all above, I have a feeling that a7RII will be able to replace 1Dx for most of my needs and only remaining application for 1DX will be actions/sport/fashion where long (above 100mm) L tele lenses are required.

Could be very handy for travels, had several occasions when had serious difficulties passing on board due to excessive hand baggage weight because of heavy Canon 1DX and Canon lenses that I wanted to be with me during travels.

Have you used an adapter and Canon Lenses (even in MF).

I tried the A7R can could not zoom in live view. Not sure if this was my error or a limitation of the camera.
Do you know if this can be done w/ adapters and canon (or other) lenses?

 

[raptor3x]

Interesting notes from EOSHD review of a7rII :
-----------------
http://www.eoshd.com/2015/07/hands-on-with-the-sony-a7r-ii/

It looks significantly less noisy at first glance than the Canon 5DS.

We had the Sony 55mm F1.8 FE on the camera. With this AF was enormously impressive. There’s been a big leap here for the A7R II over previous Sony cameras. AF object tracking is massively more sophisticated and getting much closer to a flagship pro DSLR like the 1D X.


The camera is now able to take power from a the USB port whilst recording. This means you can connect a massive USB power cell (20,000mha) and have it act like a V-lock battery on your rig. It also mean you can carry fewer Sony batteries, even jettison the battery grip and charge your camera via a phone top up power bank during down time on set, or even during a shot from the cell Velcro’ed to your rig.

The zoomed focus assist can be toggled during a shot whilst recording 4K, which is something the Canon 1D C doesn’t allow. I find this endlessly useful in the real world and prefer it to peaking. The A7R II does have peaking but I’ll wait to the final production unit to try it out.
---------------

I myself also had quick look at some A7RII high ISO RAW samples posted around and it seems that a7rII is on par with high ISO performance of Canon 1DX at ISO 6400 and 12800
When I get my own a7RII first thing that I will do is comparison of AF (with Sony native lenses) and high ISO performance between my 1DX and a7RII. Will be interesting to see DXO results when available
Considering all above, I have a feeling that a7RII will be able to replace 1Dx for most of my needs and only remaining application for 1DX will be actions/sport/fashion where long (above 100mm) L tele lenses are required.

Could be very handy for travels, had several occasions when had serious difficulties passing on board due to excessive hand baggage weight because of heavy Canon 1DX and Canon lenses that I wanted to be with me during travels.

Have you used an adapter and Canon Lenses (even in MF).

I tried the A7R can could not zoom in live view. Not sure if this was my error or a limitation of the camera.
Do you know if this can be done w/ adapters and canon (or other) lenses?

You have to turn the lens to MF to allow focus magnification with an adapted lens. If you try it with AF switched on it will give some message about being unsupported or something like that.

 

[3kramd5]

You have to turn the lens to MF to allow focus magnification with an adapted lens. If you try it with AF switched on it will give some message about being unsupported or something like that.

I can't quite remember since I didn't use the A7R much. Thought it was C1 to toggle various zoom levels, but you may be right about disabling AF first. My A7Rii should arrive in two days, so I'll try on the new platform.

 

[Neutral]

Interesting notes from EOSHD review of a7rII :
-----------------
http://www.eoshd.com/2015/07/hands-on-with-the-sony-a7r-ii/

It looks significantly less noisy at first glance than the Canon 5DS.

We had the Sony 55mm F1.8 FE on the camera. With this AF was enormously impressive. There’s been a big leap here for the A7R II over previous Sony cameras. AF object tracking is massively more sophisticated and getting much closer to a flagship pro DSLR like the 1D X.


The camera is now able to take power from a the USB port whilst recording. This means you can connect a massive USB power cell (20,000mha) and have it act like a V-lock battery on your rig. It also mean you can carry fewer Sony batteries, even jettison the battery grip and charge your camera via a phone top up power bank during down time on set, or even during a shot from the cell Velcro’ed to your rig.

The zoomed focus assist can be toggled during a shot whilst recording 4K, which is something the Canon 1D C doesn’t allow. I find this endlessly useful in the real world and prefer it to peaking. The A7R II does have peaking but I’ll wait to the final production unit to try it out.
---------------

I myself also had quick look at some A7RII high ISO RAW samples posted around and it seems that a7rII is on par with high ISO performance of Canon 1DX at ISO 6400 and 12800
When I get my own a7RII first thing that I will do is comparison of AF (with Sony native lenses) and high ISO performance between my 1DX and a7RII. Will be interesting to see DXO results when available
Considering all above, I have a feeling that a7RII will be able to replace 1Dx for most of my needs and only remaining application for 1DX will be actions/sport/fashion where long (above 100mm) L tele lenses are required.

Could be very handy for travels, had several occasions when had serious difficulties passing on board due to excessive hand baggage weight because of heavy Canon 1DX and Canon lenses that I wanted to be with me during travels.

Have you used an adapter and Canon Lenses (even in MF).

I tried the A7R can could not zoom in live view. Not sure if this was my error or a limitation of the camera.
Do you know if this can be done w/ adapters and canon (or other) lenses?

It does this easily.
As far as I remember it was initially C1 button to turn on magnification in manual zoom with 3d party lenses. With native lenses this is automatic. Then later I did all buttons reassignment to be convinient to me and make things more easy, so rarely need to open menu to change settings.
Much more easy than with 1dx.
Initially I bought a7r to be as compact digital back for Canon TSE17 and 24-70 F/2.8L m2.
Using Metabone III adaptor for this.
Later started buying native lenses.
Last zeiss 35mm f1.4 and especially new 90mm macro are just amazing.

All worked very well with Canon lenses, ironically enough manual focus with canon lenses is much more easy and convinient on Sony body than on Canon.
Regards.