Article: The 5 Reasons Why I Switched Back to Canon From Sony

[martti]

Re: Article: The story of a broken Zony Zoom.

Canon service –especially the ones I have used in Sweden and Finland– have been prompt, professional and reasonable.


But what if you have a broken Zeiss Sony Zoom that would not focus in those countries.
There is nobody in Helsinki with an access to the machine to calibrate the lens.
In Malmö there is the service center with the facilities. My son does business with them so he knows the guys.
So, the camera was sent to Malmö and got back with a 28o euro bill.
Does it focus?
No, if the subject is too far.
It will go back to the shop and maybe before midsummer it will focus.
Kan hända, jodå, det är helt möjligt, as they said in Swedish.


I really wanted to continue my relation with Sony cameras but it was not meant to be.
I have a very short temper with equipment that starts acting up on me...
Canon takes pictures. That's why I bought yet another one.
The buttons also are where they should be...

 

[Talys]

Re: Article: The story of a broken Zony Zoom.

The buttons also are where they should be...

It sounds so stupid, since you have a zillion freaking programmable buttons on Sony, but this is so true.

Others will feel differently, I'm sure, but it's impossible to program the Sony buttons to a configuration which I actually prefer to Canon. One reason is that the number of buttons accessible by the right index finger is too small (only C1 and C2).

Another related issue: the Canon Shutter release is much better than Sony. One thing that birders learn to do is to gently roll the finger over the shutter button instead of jabbing it down, in order to avoid torqueing the whole camera when you have a big lens on the end. Sounds dumb, but it makes a difference. But you can't do that with a Sony, because there's too deep of a ridge in the ring around the shutter.

Also, why must the Sony shutter finger dial feel so cheap? It is particularly strange, because the same dial on the grip feels much more premium. But neither roll and click with as nice a feel as even the cheapest of Canon DSLRs.

 

[9VIII]

It’s ridiculous that Canon is the only one with touch enabled menus.

What are you talking about? My wife's 2011 Panasonic G3 has full touch-screen menu control, and it wasn't the first Panasonic to do so.

How good were Canon's touch-screen menus in 2011?

Good for Panasonic, now where do I get a Full Frame body from them?

The fact that Panasonic (and I’ve heard good things about Olympus) can do such a good job while not being anywhere close to a market leader just makes the condition of Sony’s menus that much more embarrassing.

 

[Talys]

Good for Panasonic, now where do I get a Full Frame body from them?

It's only for Canon that innovation requires full frame mirrorless. For every other company, any mirrorless will do.

It's a moving goalpost, after all. Before, it was always canon's lack of cheap 4k; now it's the lack of FF MILC. Next, it will be a cheap FF MILC. Then it will be no dual slots. And on and on.

To those people, I say... buy what you like, be happy with it, and if it makes you happy, go buy a new camera every year for the next thing that you have to have in order to take good photos.

 

[martti]

It’s ridiculous that Canon is the only one with touch enabled menus.

What are you talking about? My wife's 2011 Panasonic G3 has full touch-screen menu control, and it wasn't the first Panasonic to do so.

How good were Canon's touch-screen menus in 2011?

Good for Panasonic, now where do I get a Full Frame body from them?

The fact that Panasonic (and I’ve heard good things about Olympus) can do such a good job while not being anywhere close to a market leader just makes the condition of Sony’s menus that much more embarrassing.

Well, I really like taking pictures.
I am sure there are cameras that could give me the Ultimate Picture Taking Experience.
I am pretty sure that there is a reason why cats and some people are crazy for Red dots, like the ones on the Leicas.
My experience with Lumix-3 was very positive. The pictures were so beautiful.
I see my friend doing absolutely delicious videos on his Olympus gear.
My son is using my A6000, doing fine, my ex is using the pocket Sony whatever the name or number and she is happy without me, with her camera.
So good!
Right before the EOS series was introduced, I had a Nikon F3 with a 35mm f/1.4. the best film camera ever.
So I was committed to Canon. If not...who knows.
My experience with Nikon was very positive and if I did not have a hermetic Pelican case full of Canon EF/EOS gear, I'd probably be shooting with a D850.
We can only live one life at a time.
And we can only take pictures with the camera that we have available, buttons or not.
By the end of this year I will probably get a 5D4.
I so like having the choice of using the 24-70 f/2.8 v.II or the old 35mm f/1.4 for evening events.
Or the worn-out 70-210 or the old 85mm f/1.2 to take portraits of people I like'n love.
It is not rational. Humans are not rational!

 

[ecqns]

don't think you'd have a problem with that with a 5D4, either, though. I mean, it's clearly overexposed, but not so horribly so that everything is just blown out white.

As an aside, using the A7R3 at the moment, one of my complaints is that I don't trust its metering, though often it's a problem of under rather than over exposure (which is a lot more correctible). I think Canon's evaluative metering or Nikon's matrix metering is just better. On the other hand, I have learned to trust that WYSIWYG viewfinder and use the thumb dial to manually adjust a lot of photos.

I don't know about that - having the extra stop of DR (especially at the high end) plus the 12 extra MPX makes a huge difference for me. In this shot I didn't have to transform and crop but it happens quite often on tight building portraits. If I had the 5Ds, I would have had the pixels but not the necessary DR, the 5Dmk4 I'd be almost there (people here say) in DR but not close in pixels. So I am comfortable saying that the Sony is by far the best tool for my job.

Then in this case, I had my 5 section Gitzo at almost full extension and I was on a step ladder. I was using the flip out screen so I could view the image from below and it was essential in this situation. The problem was I didn't have the lcd set to daylight viewing so it was overexposed, I was working quickly and by myself in this case. But the viewfinder is always spot on for me.

 

[neuroanatomist]

The problem was I didn't have the lcd set to daylight viewing so it was overexposed

Is there a histogram display?

 

[ecqns]

The problem was I didn't have the lcd set to daylight viewing so it was overexposed

Is there a histogram display?

Yes of course, but not sure if I had it on. Plus the camera was quite a bit over my head and I was using the remote to fire.
To tell you the truth, I never had that happen before so I didn't really know there was a daylight setting! I'm usually much closer to the camera or ideally tethered into Capture One.

 

[LDS]

Yes of course, but not sure if I had it on. Plus the camera was quite a bit over my head and I was using the remote to fire.

That's why for architecture I still prefer an handheld spot meter, especially with TS lenses... I never trust the viewfinder nor the histogram (which may not be computed on the RAW data). But probably I'm old school as I still like to expose correctly instead of correcting in post...

 

[ecqns]

That's why for architecture I still prefer an handheld spot meter, especially with TS lenses... I never trust the viewfinder nor the histogram (which may not be computed on the RAW data). But probably I'm old school as I still like to expose correctly instead of correcting in post...

I started shooting architecture on 4x5 film so I know my way around a meter but haven't needed one in quite some time. The mirrorless viewfinder is very accurate for me. I trust you are accommodating for your lens shift on the spot meter?

 

[LDS]

I trust you are accommodating for your lens shift on the spot meter?

It depends. It's a vignetting effect, not an overall dimming (at least with my Canon TS-E lenses). So I need to judge where it falls, and what it means for a given subject. The external meter is not deceived as the internal one could, so it's a matter of deciding which correction may be needed. My tests showed that with moderate shifting it is usually close to 0.5 stops (something more at affected edges), so most of the times can be ignored. With more tilt or shift, I'll need to take into account a correction for readings in the affected areas - dialing in a correction in the meter is not IMHO useful - I use it for filters like a PL or ND ones.

 

[Quirkz]

You're right- I meant to say "in the top 20" when I wrote my statement- which is true- and will modify accordingly. Still VERY concerning. "Canon #27 in MILC." Should I really have to click through to 21-40 to see their imaging dominance?

Given that MILCs are generally less popular than dSLRs in the US, I doubt that Canon is or should be terribly concerned. Now, the fact that Canon has topped Sony in the domestic MILC market should have Sony VERY concerned to the point of crapping their collective pants.

Also of interest is the fact that just looking at mirrorless charts or dslr charts is very misleading. They don’t include bundles. Check out the combined interchangeable lens charts and you can see that the canon t6 in kit or bundle form makes up HALF of the top 10 list. ( position 1, 3, 4, 7, 10 ). One single camera model from canon (maybe) outstrips everything else combined.

Canon still dominates. Though I am pleased to see the healthy competition in mirrorless and full frame.

 

[KevinP]

Lots of leanings on display. I'm in the bargain shopper camp, under $1k for a body. That and a couple lenses are keeping me with Canon. Speed of AF is still in DSLR favor in the low-cost range. IBIS seems 2-4 years out for my price range. Eye AF is arriving in M50 and probably 90D, but a refurb 77D or 80D on sale for $600 seem like a better deal than waiting for a $1200+ new model, given my goals.

Canon's DPAF speed seems like a clear priority so they can go head to head with Sony as they make more mirrorless models. The dual card slot was really a sharp move by Sony, penalizing Canon for withholding a $25 feature to push event photographers $1300 higher on the product line.

I wonder what portion of brand preferences are driven by ergonomics. A full frame smaller and lighter than 80D is a large part of my Sony crush. There seems to be a big loyalty to the large camera body though. That size may be an important part of why Canon has been a leader. A friend pointed out that Beats by Dre has pot-metal ballast to make them feel more substantial. Fun to window shop, but back to the budget section this year.

 

[9VIII]

...A full frame smaller and lighter than 80D is a large part of my Sony crush...

How long have we been hearing this now?
Put a Full Frame sensor in the SL2 Body, with or without the Mirror, it would sell very well.

My perfect camera would be an SL2, with all the extra controls and autofocus off the 7D2, and the 5DSR sensor.
I guess making a 35mm SLR that compact would still be a big challenge.

Really I still want it to be an SLR. I took a hike with my Fuji X-E2 today, people say that putting it to “EVF Only” is great for battery savings and almost as good as an SLR... Well it would be if the eyepiece sensor weren’t resting on my body the entire time that I’m walking and not taking pictures. I guess I could try moving the camera strap to only attach on one side (theoretically allowing it to stay rotated away), but right now it doesn’t look like there’s any way to consistenly get around the need to turn the camera off when you’re not actively shooting.

 

[Random Orbits]

Lots of leanings on display. I'm in the bargain shopper camp, under $1k for a body. That and a couple lenses are keeping me with Canon. Speed of AF is still in DSLR favor in the low-cost range. IBIS seems 2-4 years out for my price range. Eye AF is arriving in M50 and probably 90D, but a refurb 77D or 80D on sale for $600 seem like a better deal than waiting for a $1200+ new model, given my goals.

Canon's DPAF speed seems like a clear priority so they can go head to head with Sony as they make more mirrorless models. The dual card slot was really a sharp move by Sony, penalizing Canon for withholding a $25 feature to push event photographers $1300 higher on the product line.

I wonder what portion of brand preferences are driven by ergonomics. A full frame smaller and lighter than 80D is a large part of my Sony crush. There seems to be a big loyalty to the large camera body though. That size may be an important part of why Canon has been a leader. A friend pointed out that Beats by Dre has pot-metal ballast to make them feel more substantial. Fun to window shop, but back to the budget section this year.

Having a consistent UI is nice if you hand off the camera to someone else often. Then you don't have to explain to people which button is for back-button focus, etc. and they don't have to go mucking around in the menus as much because the controls are as labeled.

Sony should just assign the programmable buttons to the most used programmed setting (poll) and leave it as a default.

 

[Talys]

Having a consistent UI is nice if you hand off the camera to someone else often. Then you don't have to explain to people which button is for back-button focus, etc. and they don't have to go mucking around in the menus as much because the controls are as labeled.

Sony should just assign the programmable buttons to the most used programmed setting (poll) and leave it as a default.

The Sony default button scheme is crazy, obscuring some of the best features and assigning unimportant features to a small number of custom buttons that are in the most accessible areas. So yeah, I agree on reassigning the defaults for sure.

On the other hand, it's also a camera that is attractive to a pretty diverse group of people. So, whether you want it to be a landscapes camera or a video rig or something for portraiture is gong to really change how it's configured. An intelligent way for them to do it would be to have presets for landscapes, wildlife, video, portraiture, etc.

The other thing is, there are like, 50 menu options that you have to set if you want your camera to work well. Some of the default menu option choices are baffling to me.

Every time I've seen an A7/A9 demoed, a customer seems confused about something that works in an awkward way, and the salesperson tells them, well, they can reprogram that when they first configure the camera.

 

[Calaverasgrande]

I'm not a huge brand loyalist. However I do really enjoy the Canon system. Having worked my way up from a T2i and kit lens to a 6D and a couple L lenses.
My sister who is a jewelry artist wants to get into doing her own product photography. Part of me really want's to recommend a Canon DSLR. For no other reason than I'd have an easier time showing her how to use it. And be better able to answer the inevitable frantic text messages if we both had similar cameras.
But there are all these nice Sony cameras, and the newer M4/3rd cameras from Fuji, Olympus etc are pretty damn capable. (though I'm still not buying the 50mp from a 16mp sensor using IBIS).

The Canon glass is for the most part still just as great. But the development of their cameras is lagging. Not just in the sensor and DR area. The way that the camera body is laid out harkens back to the 80's.
In fact, show a current DSLR to a millennial and they are likely to assume it's some grandpa's film camera.
The LCD display on the top, with it's weak illumination lamp hammers this home.
For Canon to expand it's base of users it needs to make a camera that isn't just more resolution. But more modern. The Sony A7 series just looks more like a thing that is made now (as does the new Hassleblad).

 

[slclick]

I had my first opportunity to use a friends a6300 and found so many reasons why I love my Canons. First off was the lcd screen as I had to be in optimal light to see the image. The button/dial layout was awkward to me and the menu system was while not a Nikon like makes no sense, it easily could have been much simpler. Definitely not intuitive. The VF was brighter than my M5 and the focus points were great but thats all I could see as a benefit.Not so big on the colors either, both indoors and out. I only used one low end lens and would like more time with adapted and better glass.

 

[Orangutan]

My sister who is a jewelry artist wants to get into doing her own product photography. Part of me really want's to recommend a Canon DSLR. For no other reason than I'd have an easier time showing her how to use it. And be better able to answer the inevitable frantic text messages if we both had similar cameras.
But there are all these nice Sony cameras, and the newer M4/3rd cameras from Fuji, Olympus etc are pretty damn capable. (though I'm still not buying the 50mp from a 16mp sensor using IBIS).

While I'm no expert, I do want to offer an observation as you consider what to recommend to your sister. In the last few years, the main sensor differences are MP, high-ISO, and high-DR. For jewelry shots, your sister will have 100% control of the environment: she'll shoot on-tripod under controlled lighting, so ISO and DR sensor improvements are worthless. As others on the forum have written before, jewelry photography is more about skill than gear until you get to the point of using a TS lens. My advice to you for your sister: buy a used/refurb body and lens, a basic/inexpensive set of continuous lighting, and a color card. Then be prepared to spend many hours on the Internet reading-up on technique, and then more hours practicing. As her skill develops she'll figure out what upgraded gear she needs.

 

[Valvebounce]

Hi Orangutan.
I seem to recall product photography was discussed in great detail, with a very good argument being made on why to get a pro to do it for you (or at least someone who understands photography and lighting, like a brother!) if you want to actually sell the product, nothing hinders sales more than a poor photo!

Cheers, Graham.

My sister who is a jewelry artist wants to get into doing her own product photography. Part of me really want's to recommend a Canon DSLR. For no other reason than I'd have an easier time showing her how to use it. And be better able to answer the inevitable frantic text messages if we both had similar cameras.
But there are all these nice Sony cameras, and the newer M4/3rd cameras from Fuji, Olympus etc are pretty damn capable. (though I'm still not buying the 50mp from a 16mp sensor using IBIS).

While I'm no expert, I do want to offer an observation as you consider what to recommend to your sister. In the last few years, the main sensor differences are MP, high-ISO, and high-DR. For jewelry shots, your sister will have 100% control of the environment: she'll shoot on-tripod under controlled lighting, so ISO and DR sensor improvements are worthless. As others on the forum have written before, jewelry photography is more about skill than gear until you get to the point of using a TS lens. My advice to you for your sister: buy a used/refurb body and lens, a basic/inexpensive set of continuous lighting, and a color card. Then be prepared to spend many hours on the Internet reading-up on technique, and then more hours practicing. As her skill develops she'll figure out what upgraded gear she needs.