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i just got a set of those cheap rectangular polycarb ebay ones where you get six and a little pouch havent tried them much but I couldnt find anyone that sells glass or coated ones. I thought i'd get the cheap ones first to see if the technique appealed to me before dumping lots of cash on something hard to get that may be very expensive when i do find it.
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Loswr
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wickidwombat said:
Great idea. Then, after a while, you can pick the strength (ND2/3/4) and edge (hard or soft) style(s) you use the most, and invest in better quality filters.
As you say, most are resin - even expensive brands like Lee and Singh-Ray. FWIW, Schneider Optics (parent company of B+W filters) does make Schott glass grad NDs, sold under their MPTV (motion picture television) line.
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jaduffy007 said:
if its just to experiment and see what suits dropping $20 or so on the ebay ones works and the little filter case you get with them is not too bad even if the filters turn out to be bad
work out what strength suits most then hunt down the good quality onesalso they are so cheap i cut up one of the plastic mounting frames so i can use it on my 16-35 FF and not get vignette issues from the edge of the frame protruding, 2 mins and a hacksaw and job done works well
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rocketdesigner
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wickidwombat said:
I bought one 4x4 2 stop gradient / chinese made / plastic for $30 ... But found that it was a bit weak on the landscape with sky.
Singh Ray told me they normally don't make 4x4 gradients glass filters, but I got a price quote for $160 for a custom, 3 stop 4x4 gradient ... but wondering if I should get a 4 stop instead?
Probably should spring for $320 and get both...
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if you do get them post back i would be interested to see how they go maybe do a head to head comparison with the cheap ones 
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branden
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Maybe you can try renting the nice stuff?
That's always the challenge -- the cheap stuff is cheap. This reminds me, I've got some eBay special 67mm ND filters holding down my desk for the past 10 months, if anyone wants them. Set of 3, ND2, ND4, and ND8. Cast a nice purplish tone to your image for you. :rolls my eyes:
Point is, I could have rented nice ND stuff for the same price as buying it cheap.
That's always the challenge -- the cheap stuff is cheap. This reminds me, I've got some eBay special 67mm ND filters holding down my desk for the past 10 months, if anyone wants them. Set of 3, ND2, ND4, and ND8. Cast a nice purplish tone to your image for you. :rolls my eyes:
Point is, I could have rented nice ND stuff for the same price as buying it cheap.
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Though the Singh Ray vari-ND is one of the best ND filters to have in your bag, it is not a gradient ND.
Rectangular resin filters by Singh Ray and Lee are fairly reasonable for the quality. Rectangular glass Schneider filters are appreciably more $$$. My experience with Cokin filters is the higher ND levels leave a purplish color-cast. As Neuro pointed out, you'll want to evaluate the hard vs soft edge available at the gradient transition line. As for the level of ND, there is no one overall solution here - the level you will need will vary with the lighting conditions/ratio between the bright areas and darker areas. Having a kit of three levels is usually sufficient.
Also, some photographers have success simply holding a solid (non-gradient) ND filter out in front of the lens and only covering half of the lens opening/front. By holding it out a centimeter or so and varying that distance, they can simulate hard or soft edged transitions. This is something you can try with your eBay kit you bought.
Rectangular resin filters by Singh Ray and Lee are fairly reasonable for the quality. Rectangular glass Schneider filters are appreciably more $$$. My experience with Cokin filters is the higher ND levels leave a purplish color-cast. As Neuro pointed out, you'll want to evaluate the hard vs soft edge available at the gradient transition line. As for the level of ND, there is no one overall solution here - the level you will need will vary with the lighting conditions/ratio between the bright areas and darker areas. Having a kit of three levels is usually sufficient.
Also, some photographers have success simply holding a solid (non-gradient) ND filter out in front of the lens and only covering half of the lens opening/front. By holding it out a centimeter or so and varying that distance, they can simulate hard or soft edged transitions. This is something you can try with your eBay kit you bought.
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The cheap set of eBay filters is a good idea. I did the same and then eventually bought a few Sing-Ray. I have a 2, 3 , and 4 stop, and have to say the 3 is my favorite, and the rest may go back to ebay. The cheap ones I paid < $20 for and gave to a friend.
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seacritter
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Okay... I shoot mainly landscape. I've been experimenting for a while with these. My views so far:
My most used ND Grad filter is the soft ND Grad 0.6 (2 stops of light). I use it so much, that I keep a backup. This is the only grad that I have a backup of. After that, this is the order that I would buy them in...
1. Soft ND Grad 0.6 (2 stops)
2. Hard ND Grad 0.6 (2 stops)
3. Reverse ND Grad 0.9 (3 stops)
4. Soft ND Grad 0.9 (3 stops)
5. Hard ND Grad 0.9 (3 stops)
As to brand... I have both the Hitech and Singh-Ray. The Singh-Ray is a better filter hands down. The Hitech does the job for 1/3 the price, with no color change. I like the Singh-Ray better because it is a longer filter, making it easier to handle and hand-hold when necessary. Also, Singh-Ray is local in Florida and it is impossible to beat their service!!!
Unfortunately, you will pay a much higher price for the Singh-Ray. If I were wealthier, I wouldn't even look at the Hitech, but I am slowly replacing them filter by filter with the Singh-Ray. You can find the Hitech on Amazon, and just go direct for the Singh-Ray...
My most used ND Grad filter is the soft ND Grad 0.6 (2 stops of light). I use it so much, that I keep a backup. This is the only grad that I have a backup of. After that, this is the order that I would buy them in...
1. Soft ND Grad 0.6 (2 stops)
2. Hard ND Grad 0.6 (2 stops)
3. Reverse ND Grad 0.9 (3 stops)
4. Soft ND Grad 0.9 (3 stops)
5. Hard ND Grad 0.9 (3 stops)
As to brand... I have both the Hitech and Singh-Ray. The Singh-Ray is a better filter hands down. The Hitech does the job for 1/3 the price, with no color change. I like the Singh-Ray better because it is a longer filter, making it easier to handle and hand-hold when necessary. Also, Singh-Ray is local in Florida and it is impossible to beat their service!!!
Unfortunately, you will pay a much higher price for the Singh-Ray. If I were wealthier, I wouldn't even look at the Hitech, but I am slowly replacing them filter by filter with the Singh-Ray. You can find the Hitech on Amazon, and just go direct for the Singh-Ray...
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Righteye
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In the UK Lee filters are very popular with amateurs and Pros.
Don't buy cheap you will end buying a quality filter in the end ( i made this mistake)
I use the 0.60 and 0.45 most of the time i have others but rarely use them.
Price example http://www.robertwhite.co.uk/shop-by-brand/lee-filters/lee-0-45-neutral-density-grad-hard-filter.html
Lee filters http://www.leefilters.com/camera/products/finder/ref:C475674155E58E/
NOTE, that due to the fact that there is a high demand for these filters you may have to wait a while.
http://www.robertwhite.co.uk/lee-product-order-updates/
Don't buy cheap you will end buying a quality filter in the end ( i made this mistake)
I use the 0.60 and 0.45 most of the time i have others but rarely use them.
Price example http://www.robertwhite.co.uk/shop-by-brand/lee-filters/lee-0-45-neutral-density-grad-hard-filter.html
Lee filters http://www.leefilters.com/camera/products/finder/ref:C475674155E58E/
NOTE, that due to the fact that there is a high demand for these filters you may have to wait a while.
http://www.robertwhite.co.uk/lee-product-order-updates/
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Hi,
for a first try I can recommend the Hitech resin filters by Formatt. The price is OK for what they offer. I have from Hitech the soft and hard Grad ND filters with 0.3, 0.6 and 0.9 as well as the reverse Grad ND in 0.6 and 0.9. Like seacritter the most used one is the soft ND Grad 0.6 followed by the hard 0.6 Grad ND filter. The effect of the 0.9 is often too strong, so for a start I would recommend the soft ND Grad 0.6.
Color cast is no issue for me with the Hitech filters. But you might loose a little bit of sharpness.
for a first try I can recommend the Hitech resin filters by Formatt. The price is OK for what they offer. I have from Hitech the soft and hard Grad ND filters with 0.3, 0.6 and 0.9 as well as the reverse Grad ND in 0.6 and 0.9. Like seacritter the most used one is the soft ND Grad 0.6 followed by the hard 0.6 Grad ND filter. The effect of the 0.9 is often too strong, so for a start I would recommend the soft ND Grad 0.6.
Color cast is no issue for me with the Hitech filters. But you might loose a little bit of sharpness.
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If you're not too concerned with IQ, then the $20 ebay set will do perfectly to see what strength ND you need.
But then once you decide and buy a 'good' brand version, you've definitely spent $20 more than otherwise. (still, it's better than spending $100 on one that is the wrong strength).
I'd say somewhere in the 6 to 10-stop range is a good start for slowing an f/8 landscape down to 1-2 seconds to get waterfall blur. 20 stops might be needed to get any sort of motion blur in an f/2 or wider low-DOF shot.
I actually bought a Canon-brand 72mm ND8 off ebay second-hand for $30 shipped, it's not too bad quality, but for an f/6 or so landscape on a bright sunny beach i'm still getting 1/100s, I need maybe 20-stops to get to 2 seconds to blur waves.
What i'd recommend, if you don't know what strength to get, and do want quality, just get a good-brand Variable-ND (have to ask others which are the better brands, some make weird cross-hatch patterns at certain settings).
But then once you decide and buy a 'good' brand version, you've definitely spent $20 more than otherwise. (still, it's better than spending $100 on one that is the wrong strength).
I'd say somewhere in the 6 to 10-stop range is a good start for slowing an f/8 landscape down to 1-2 seconds to get waterfall blur. 20 stops might be needed to get any sort of motion blur in an f/2 or wider low-DOF shot.
I actually bought a Canon-brand 72mm ND8 off ebay second-hand for $30 shipped, it's not too bad quality, but for an f/6 or so landscape on a bright sunny beach i'm still getting 1/100s, I need maybe 20-stops to get to 2 seconds to blur waves.
What i'd recommend, if you don't know what strength to get, and do want quality, just get a good-brand Variable-ND (have to ask others which are the better brands, some make weird cross-hatch patterns at certain settings).
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Heya
There's 3 levels of Grad NDs
Level 1: Cokin (They have a colour shift)
Level 2: Heliopan (Very good, slight shift)
Level 3: Singh-Ray & Lee. I prefer Singh-ray for no good reason.
a 2 stop soft and 3 stop hard are what I'd recommend.
I hand hold grad filters, so I have no recommendation for holders. The Lee is regarded as the best, but the Cokin is just fine too.
Cheers
CR
There's 3 levels of Grad NDs
Level 1: Cokin (They have a colour shift)
Level 2: Heliopan (Very good, slight shift)
Level 3: Singh-Ray & Lee. I prefer Singh-ray for no good reason.
a 2 stop soft and 3 stop hard are what I'd recommend.
I hand hold grad filters, so I have no recommendation for holders. The Lee is regarded as the best, but the Cokin is just fine too.
Cheers
CR
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The Cokin filters, in my experience, have a very minor color cast. Maybe not. It's not bad at all. Even the cheapest grad filters are usable.
The hi-tech filters don't have a color cast, but they are transparent to IR. That means for some films (fast color negative, velvia 100, others) they'll produce a magenta cast. For properly manufactured digital they shouldn't. Possibly at high ISOs with newer sensors, though. With the red camera they might be a disaster...
The Singh-Ray filters, at least above two stops (three stops and above), have an IR dye and are color neutral across it and the visible spectrum. Pretty cool, but possibly unnecessary. You can custom order two stops with the IR dye, too.
I'd get two stops soft. Three stops hard is useful, since sky and reflection are often around three or four stops apart, so you'll get a nice symmetry to shots of the ocean at sunset. But the look is too pronounced and kind of cheesy, imo. I have a lot of respect for anyone who can get by without any hdr or grad filters, but if you choose to use them I'd go two stops hard/two stops soft. If you like a dramatic look three stops is good, too. The "reverse" ND filters that fade in two directions look really cool, if very special-purpose. A three stop reverse filter might be really cool.
The hi-tech filters don't have a color cast, but they are transparent to IR. That means for some films (fast color negative, velvia 100, others) they'll produce a magenta cast. For properly manufactured digital they shouldn't. Possibly at high ISOs with newer sensors, though. With the red camera they might be a disaster...
The Singh-Ray filters, at least above two stops (three stops and above), have an IR dye and are color neutral across it and the visible spectrum. Pretty cool, but possibly unnecessary. You can custom order two stops with the IR dye, too.
I'd get two stops soft. Three stops hard is useful, since sky and reflection are often around three or four stops apart, so you'll get a nice symmetry to shots of the ocean at sunset. But the look is too pronounced and kind of cheesy, imo. I have a lot of respect for anyone who can get by without any hdr or grad filters, but if you choose to use them I'd go two stops hard/two stops soft. If you like a dramatic look three stops is good, too. The "reverse" ND filters that fade in two directions look really cool, if very special-purpose. A three stop reverse filter might be really cool.
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bones
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I have a wide range of filters and other that I'm trying to sell as I have had difficulty trying to find a replacement camera for all the goodies I got from my old man.
He gave me a box and bag full of lenses, filters, bellows and a Pentax M camera (which is what I have been trying to replace due to the shutter mechanism being faulty)
The filters I have are 4x4 Gradients, 4x4 Std Colours, Circle and Wide Angle.
Anyone interested let me know...
He gave me a box and bag full of lenses, filters, bellows and a Pentax M camera (which is what I have been trying to replace due to the shutter mechanism being faulty)
The filters I have are 4x4 Gradients, 4x4 Std Colours, Circle and Wide Angle.
Anyone interested let me know...
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When deciding on filters you need to look at more than just the filter itself. The filter holder system you choose will also impact your overall level of satisfaction with your filters.
Personally, I love my Lee system. The way their filter holder works is that you have one screw on piece that you buy for each of the filter sizes you need (for each lens) then there is a simple clip that connects the actual filter holder to the screw on piece. The holder itself is awesome because you can customize it to hold multiple filters (and even hoods) simultaneously. Also, the two piece systems allows you to rotate the filter holder very easily to cock your filters at various angles.
Finally don't forget that the holder system will have an impact on the amount of vignetting you have when using the filters. Again, I love my Lee wide angle attachment for their holder system. It provides vignetting free filtration on my 17-55 f/2.8 .
My point is that once you go beyond a $20 throw away set of filters you are buying into a "system"... And just as with lenses you are going to want to do some projecting to see what your needs are going to be down the road.
As for actual filters, I definitely can recommend Lee. They are a bit hard to get ahold of in the US, bu it is worth it. Their 0.6 soft grad is my go to filter... But second would be a 0.9 soft grad.
Personally, I love my Lee system. The way their filter holder works is that you have one screw on piece that you buy for each of the filter sizes you need (for each lens) then there is a simple clip that connects the actual filter holder to the screw on piece. The holder itself is awesome because you can customize it to hold multiple filters (and even hoods) simultaneously. Also, the two piece systems allows you to rotate the filter holder very easily to cock your filters at various angles.
Finally don't forget that the holder system will have an impact on the amount of vignetting you have when using the filters. Again, I love my Lee wide angle attachment for their holder system. It provides vignetting free filtration on my 17-55 f/2.8 .
My point is that once you go beyond a $20 throw away set of filters you are buying into a "system"... And just as with lenses you are going to want to do some projecting to see what your needs are going to be down the road.
As for actual filters, I definitely can recommend Lee. They are a bit hard to get ahold of in the US, bu it is worth it. Their 0.6 soft grad is my go to filter... But second would be a 0.9 soft grad.
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