Canon 7D MK2 RAW Files

[Lee Jay]

Trying to figure out what has changed here. The 7DII looks just as unusable at ISO 1600 and 3200 as the 7D and 70D.

Unusable? I'd call the 7D usable as 6400 and the 7D2 and 70D usable at 12,800 at least.

It all depends on the purpose. For a small print or a internet photo, you can get away with high ISO's just fine. However, some want to print large, and the noise becomes visible, or the detail is blurred by NR.

It all depends on the person and his use.

From what I've seen, the 7D MK II is just a tad better than the 70D at high ISO, and about 2 stops behind a FF like the 5D MK III.

I'd print those 6400 files at 18x12 or 13x19 no problem. I could manage acceptable 12x8s at 12,800.

 

[Quasimodo]

I might be naive, but would it not be better to wait for the codecs to appear in EOS Utility and Adobe programs before making judgments based on work-arounds?

 

[stefsan]

I might be naive, but would it not be better to wait for the codecs to appear in EOS Utility and Adobe programs before making judgments based on work-arounds?

Of course it would be better – but who is that patient nowadays?

 

[tomscott]

I think half the problem here is the conversion. When the codec comes out I think the 7DMKII will give slightly bette results than the 70D. Saying that useful up to 1600 3200 at a push, pretty much the same story with all APC. 3200 and 6400 are perfectly useable on the FF cameras like the 6D and 5DMKIII.

I don't know how you get away with only shooting 800ISO with wildlife, keeping the shutter speed at 1/1000 on an overcast day requires 1250+ in my experience. If you are in a darker environment like a forrest or under cover 3200+ is where you need to be.

Therefore for a lot of wildlife photographers the 1/2 stop advantage of the 20mp sensor might be pointless.

 

[MichaelHodges]

I don't know how you get away with only shooting 800ISO with wildlife, keeping the shutter speed at 1/1000 on an overcast day requires 1250+ in my experience. If you are in a darker environment like a forrest or under cover 3200+ is where you need to be.

I would never use ISO 3200 for wildlife on a crop camera. You might be able to get away with it for indoor sports, but it's not going to cut it for antler and fur detail in RAW. The shots I've taken at 3200 are strictly for memories (wild bobcats, grizzly bears).

ISO 800 is about the limit of my friends usage on crop as well. I do dip into ISO 1600 from time to time, but these need major work to restore fur and antler detail.

If you are routinely using ISO 3200 on a crop camera for wildlife, you need to consider moving to FF ASAP, because that's shooting a weakness.

 

[Lee Jay]

This is a processed-from-JPEG Canon sample. It's shot at ISO 3200 on the 7DII, but I pushed it a stop in post (so, it's actually ISO 6400) and stretched it's contrast a ton (also enhances noise a lot). I'm posting this at 1920x1200 for viewing at that size on a 1920x1200 (or 1920x1080) screen at 1:1. On my screen, that makes it 20.5"x12.5", so it's roughly how a print that size would look. The processing I did was just a few clicks in the basic and detail panels of Lightroom. Just took 20 seconds or so.

I think this is quite good for an image that's effectively above ISO 6400.

 

[MichaelHodges]

I don't shoot in jpeg.

The squirrel's fur also looks like a water color painting, and the delicate whiskers are eaten by noise/noise removal.

 

[Lee Jay]

I don't shoot in jpeg.

Well, then you should be able to do even better then, right?

The Canon sample was provided in JPEG, so that's all we have for this shot.

 

[MichaelHodges]

I don't shoot in jpeg.

Well, then you should be able to do even better then, right?

No. To get the kind of detail I want, you cannot shoot crop RAW at these ISO's.

The 5D III, 1Dx, and 6D will.

 

[Lee Jay]

I don't shoot in jpeg.

Well, then you should be able to do even better then, right?

No. To get the kind of detail I want, you cannot shoot crop RAW at these ISO's.

The 5D III, 1Dx, and 6D will.

I meant better than the sample I posted.

 

[AprilForever]

I don't shoot in jpeg.

Well, then you should be able to do even better then, right?

No. To get the kind of detail I want, you cannot shoot crop RAW at these ISO's.

The 5D III, 1Dx, and 6D will.

They said the same about 4'x6' vs. 35mm film for the longest time...

 

[MichaelHodges]

If you find yourself shooting ISO 3200 and 6400 consistently, it's FF time.

 

[Lee Jay]

If you find yourself shooting ISO 3200 and 6400 consistently, it's FF time.

So, that sample is unusable to you, correct?

I have both formats and I know what each is good for.

 

[MichaelHodges]

Yes. The whiskers are eaten away by noise and the fur is lacking detail. Also, the face looks washed out/blown which is hard to fix in jpeg.

 

[Lee Jay]

Yes. The whiskers are eaten away by noise and the fur is lacking detail.

Well, full-frame will get you 1 1/3 stops over APS-c given the same sensor performance. Maybe 2 stops if the sensor is quite a lot better. This is a stretched ISO 6400 shot, and I think it's quite good given that fact. Is it as good as an ISO 100 shot? No, of course not. But whatever you can shoot at ISO 12,800 with a 1Dx or 6D you can shoot at ISO 3200 or a little higher with this camera.

 

[MichaelHodges]

As an owner of a 70D, I would disagree. I never shoot it above ISO 1600.

My FF cameras are significantly better. I would say the 6D is 2 1/2 stops better, 5DIII 2 stops.

 

[Lee Jay]

As an owner of a 70D, I would disagree. I never shoot it above ISO 1600.

My FF cameras are significantly better. I would say the 6D is 2 1/2 stops better, 5DIII 2 stops.

Okay, whatever. I'd call the 6D 2 stops and the 5DIII 1 1/2, but that's only a half stop discrepancy.

 

[DominoDude]

I thought that the squirrel-shot was quite good. Since it was taken in mid-January I suspect that there has been some alterations and tweaks done to the final product, and that RAWs will come out nicely from this 7D Mark II even at fairly high ISO settings.

 

[tomscott]

I don't know how you get away with only shooting 800ISO with wildlife, keeping the shutter speed at 1/1000 on an overcast day requires 1250+ in my experience. If you are in a darker environment like a forrest or under cover 3200+ is where you need to be.

I would never use ISO 3200 for wildlife on a crop camera. You might be able to get away with it for indoor sports, but it's not going to cut it for antler and fur detail in RAW. The shots I've taken at 3200 are strictly for memories (wild bobcats, grizzly bears).

ISO 800 is about the limit of my friends usage on crop as well. I do dip into ISO 1600 from time to time, but these need major work to restore fur and antler detail.

If you are routinely using ISO 3200 on a crop camera for wildlife, you need to consider moving to FF ASAP, because that's shooting a weakness.

Thats why I shoot FF… Which is why I said i don't know how people get away with only shooting ISO800.

I think the squirrel image is pretty good, it is a little muddy but with a little too much sharpening.

 

[MichaelHodges]

I thought that the squirrel-shot was quite good. Since it was taken in mid-January, I suspect that there has been some alterations and tweaks done to the final product, and that RAWs will come out nicely from this 7D Mark II even at fairly high ISO settings.

you're okay with noise/noise removal removing parts of the animal?