Canon eos 77D

[Nininini]

Uh what? Are you saying that cameras "get lucky" when ever they track an object properly?

Yes, because they don't understand what you're focusing on. Cameras are dumb.

From my experience it is 100 percent possible and extremely reliable. Have I missed something, or are you referring to a certain camera?

Try shooting a crow diving from a nest in a poplar without getting the AF focusing on the tree behind it.

Try capturing a praying kestrel during it's dive without having the AF system focus on the meadow behind it.

 

[Ryananthony]

Uh what? Are you saying that cameras "get lucky" when ever they track an object properly?

Yes, because they don't understand what you're focusing on. Cameras are dumb.

From my experience it is 100 percent possible and extremely reliable. Have I missed something, or are you referring to a certain camera?

Then you need more experience.

Try shooting a crow diving from a nest in a poplar without getting the AF focusing on the tree behind it.

Try capturing a praying kestrel during it's dive without having the AF system focus on the meadow behind it.

LOL. Okay. Your the professional, my bad. No idea why cameras have autofocus in the first place.

 

[Nininini]

EDIT: Sorry, I missed the part where you were referring to your use of rebels. This is a photo my wife took using my 1dx with the sigma 150-600C. She tracked this bird while it flew behind a canopy of trees. This was one shot of many that were in focus.

Large slow flying birds with high-lift wings like buteo buteo, eagles, vultures, are not hard to shoot. They don't fly erratic, I shot a buteo with my iphone and it turned out fine.

But relying on the AF for birds with elliptical wings, in forest or gardens, isn't going to work. There is no way an AF system can track a wren flying overhead for example.

 

[Nininini]

LOL. Okay. Your the professional, my bad. No idea why cameras have autofocus in the first place.

AF works for some subjects.

Like I said before, AF works for large slow moving birds at a distance, it does not work for the large majority of birds, which are passerine, ie songbirds.

Shooting an eagle is as challenging for the AF system as shooting a truck. Shooting a wren hopping between the trees is like trying to track a ping-pong ball with the AF system, it's not going to work. There is a difference, recognise it.

(I've never said I was a professional btw. I have consistently said I was not and I have consistently said I shot with rebel cameras. But that doesn't mean I don't have experience shooting)

 

[Proscribo]

Since 77D is kinda close to 80D, could it be that 80D is going to be replaced soon(ish)? Or maybe that's going to happen early 2018 anyway.

Btw 5D4's 7fps starts to look laughable. These XXXD and semi-XXD series are shooting almost as fast and I guess 80D replacement would get a boost to fps too (not to mention that competitor's old model goes "6,5"fps). Can I wish for 2D, 3D, 4D, 5DX or anything that would be FF and at least 9fps? I'd go with 1DX but I'm not sure about the size. :

 

[AvTvM]

mirrorslapper, not interested.

But why oh why dors Canon not put this type of fully articulated LCD also on EOS M5 and M6 series???

 

[Sharlin]

mirrorslapper, not interested.

But why oh why dors Canon not put this type of fully articulated LCD also on EOS M5 and M6 series???

Because it wouldn't physically fit the form factor they want. At least not without shrinking the LCD screen considerably.

 

[Deleted member 378664]

Because it wouldn't physically fit the form factor they want. At least not without shrinking the LCD screen considerably.

I just compared EOS M5 and 80D and "measured" with photoshop (115,6mm width of M5 = 412 Pixel as base).

The flippy tilty screen of the 80D is just 0,5mm wider (88,6mm vs 88,1mm) than the screen of the EOS M. The hight measured from the bottom of the cam ist the same.

 

[PeterT]

How on earth this model makes any sense is beyond me.

It makes a lot of sense to me.

6 years ago I wrote this in a DPReview thread called "Would you buy a Rebel-sized 7Di/7000D?":

-- citing my 6 years old (Feb 8, 2011) text:
I definitely would like the 7D's AF including micro-adjust in a Rebel-sized body.
I want to upgrade my already "very old" 350D. But actually my only complaint is AF and I do not want a bigger/heavier camera. So I have not found any single model in Canon's production in last 6 years, which would be worth the upgrade.
-- end of citation

During those 6 years the 70D and 80D came, both of them are smaller than the 60D, which was IMO a right move, but only a half step towards my "dream camera" because AF micro adjustments were included, but the body is still unnecessarily heavy and the grip too big (for my way of holding the camera my middle finger must firmly touch the body and it is not the case with the 70D grip).
I made only a tiny upgrade to a 450D that was given to me by a friend who upgraded to Sony FF (so it was not really an upgrade decided by me).
And my list of complaints (about my current 450D) has now two items: the first and most important one is still AF that cannot be adjusted and the second one is too low high ISO and too low quality of high ISO.

So maybe after 6 years of writing the above cited text I will be able to get the good AF of the higher end models (including AF micro adjustments) in a lightweight camera...? Well we will see if 77D will actually have not only the number of AF points listed but also the ability to micro adjust the AF. If so, then I will finally have a reason to update after 12 years...

So for me this model, if it includes AF micro adjust, has a lot of sense. And I do not think that I am alone.

I want the Rebel shaped body and I can give up some features that are direct consequences of that: smaller and lighter body means no weather sealing, pentamiror instead of pentaprism and a smaller battery. Smaller battery means slower shutter i.e. smaller max FPS and smaller max shutter speed.

 

[Axilrod]

Wow the same camera they've been releasing for the last 5 years with a new name, amazing!

 

[Loswr]

Wow the same camera they've been releasing for the last 5 years with a new name, amazing!

Yeah, Nikon and Sony are much more innovative because they release new models to correct defects in the predecessors.

 

[Orangutan]

Wow the same camera they've been releasing for the last 5 years with a new name, amazing!

Blame Sony and Nikon: since they clearly have better products, they should be taking large chunks of market share from Canon. What's the deal with them? [/cheek]

 

[Berowne]

I will not buy another Crop-Body.

 

[Khufu]

Oh Gee, Should i sell my seven-ty dee? or my Seven dee to buy this seven-ty seven dee? Or just own three?

Wheeeeee!

Canon's branding has historically been pretty well ordained and understood.

But between...

• The M --> M2 --> M3 --> M6 coupled with the coexistence of an M10 and M5, and
  
  
• There were two Rebel lines--> now there are three Rebel lines --> nope, we're back to two Rebel lines... and now the X0D line has an (X-1)7D little brother

...I am starting to get a headache. It's not as bad as Olympus's overlappy amalgam of Os and Ms and Ds and Es and 1s, but Canon's brand clarity is definitely trending in the wrong direction.

- A

There was the 500D (Rebel), just the one line, and the 50D pro-crop line, which then changed to the 7D, and spawned a new plastic guy which adopted the 60D etc titling... then the 1000D series appeared, to use up old parts or whatever, and the amazing little 100D (SL1) rocked up after a while; a little later the 700D turned into both the 750D and 760D; that's:

7D
XXD
XXXD
XYXD (Now XYD)
1XXD
XXXXD

Plus...
M5
M6
M10

...aaall running as separate lines, where there was once just a 400D and a 40D.

 

[Sporgon]

Any news on whether this camera has a decent pentaprism instead of the pentamirror ? Given that we now have the M5, as well as other makes with pretty decent EVF, I have been predicting for some time now that if the cheaper dslr s are going to keep up they will have to move to pentaprism finders. However to date my tack record of accurate predictions is dire to say the least, and have all been completely wrong, so I guess there is a pretty good chance that this one will be too.

I am just wondering if the move to a two digit moniker on this rebel heralds a general up grade.

 

[ExodistPhotography]

Uh what? Are you saying that cameras "get lucky" when ever they track an object properly?

Yes, because they don't understand what you're focusing on. Cameras are dumb.

From my experience it is 100 percent possible and extremely reliable. Have I missed something, or are you referring to a certain camera?

Try shooting a crow diving from a nest in a poplar without getting the AF focusing on the tree behind it.

Try capturing a praying kestrel during it's dive without having the AF system focus on the meadow behind it.

Nini is actually correct here. AF works great if its something big and nothing is going to get in front of your focus. But even if a bird is in the sky, fn camera may just try to focus on a cloud in the distance and not the freaking eagle you wanted.. This is why so many use the AF-ON button. I personally have mine to to turn the AF off when pressed. But still does the same job.

 

[ajfotofilmagem]

Any news on whether this camera has a decent pentaprism instead of the pentamirror ? Given that we now have the M5, as well as other makes with pretty decent EVF, I have been predicting for some time now that if the cheaper dslr s are going to keep up they will have to move to pentaprism finders. However to date my tack record of accurate predictions is dire to say the least, and have all been completely wrong, so I guess there is a pretty good chance that this one will be too.
I am just wondering if the move to a two digit moniker on this rebel heralds a general up grade.

Pentaprism viewfinder on the Rebel?
I believe that soon the Rebel line will have electronic viewfinder, as they will become mirrorless, leaving only line 80D or higher with the good old mirror.

 

[PeterT]

Pentaprism viewfinder on the Rebel?
I believe that soon the Rebel line will have electronic viewfinder, as they will become mirrorless, leaving only line 80D or higher with the good old mirror.

But 77D is not going to be a real Rebel.
I really hope for an 80D in Rebel body for those (like me) that just do not like the usual XXD body size and weight, but want all the features of 80D that are possible in the smaller body, including AF micro adjustments.
On the other hand, I think that Rebel body means a pentamirror (I have no proof for that, though). And I can live with that (as well as with smaller battery and all the consequences of that, see my previous post in this thread).

I do not believe in mirrorless Rebels. For mirrorless Canons there is the evolving EOS M world.
Do you think that new Rebels will move into the EOS M world? (i.e. that they will lose the mirror along with the mirror box resulting in shorter flange focal distance). Or do you think that the mirror box will stay, which will result in a Pentax K-01-like solution? It wasn't terribly successful, was it?

 

[slclick]

Pentaprism viewfinder on the Rebel?
I believe that soon the Rebel line will have electronic viewfinder, as they will become mirrorless, leaving only line 80D or higher with the good old mirror.

But 77D is not going to be a real Rebel.
I really hope for an 80D in Rebel body for those (like me) that just do not like the usual XXD body size and weight, but want all the features of 80D that are possible in the smaller body, including AF micro adjustments.
On the other hand, I think that Rebel body means a pentamirror (I have no proof for that, though). And I can live with that (as well as with smaller battery and all the consequences of that, see my previous post in this thread).

I do not believe in mirrorless Rebels. For mirrorless Canons there is the evolving EOS M world.
Do you think that new Rebels will move into the EOS M world? (i.e. that they will lose the mirror along with the mirror box resulting in shorter flange focal distance). Or do you think that the mirror box will stay, which will result in a Pentax K-01-like solution? It wasn't terribly successful, was it?

I don't see Rebels morphing into the M world myself but hey, I'm wrong usually once a day.

I do think this is a bridge between the Rebel and XXD body world what with size, weight and features. It will not have everything folks want ( things higher priced bodies have, duh) but it will be an SL1 successor of sorts.Newer tech, better IQ and noise levels, better AF point system. All while being relatively small and light.

I'd still buy an 80D in a heartbeat over this myself.

 

[LucidPhotographer]

Some people here question the sense of releasing a model like the 77D. For some part, I can understand that, but personally, I think this model line has great potential... it's just that canon cripples the wrong specs, for my taste.

I have been shooting with the classic rebel line for over a decade (350D0>550D>650D) and I really like it. Price-performance is great and since I don't have large hands, the rebel line fits perfectly. Actually, I think many people don't realize how much better the ergonomics are on the more recent models (side by side, the 350D feels like a brick in comparison). Still, that wasn't really an issue (at least to me it wasn't). I really prefer a smaller camera, because of the size, because of the weight but also because it looks more discreet. During all those years, the only thing that I really missed in comparison with the X0D line was the larger viewfinder. Viewfinders cannot be too large. To me, the other things were just "nice to have" (in case of a better autofocus system a "very nice to have"), but not necessary. Mainly, because there are either workarounds or the improvement of my own skill makes more difference than the difference in specs. So basically, in my point of view, the benefits were offset by the size (or the differences were to small to justify the size for my use). So something, which is pretty much as small and discreet as a normal rebel, but offers (most of) the features of the X0D is perfect for me. However, I can totally understand, that many think differently, because for many, the rebel line is too small.

In the end, I am extremely disappointed with Canon mainly for one reason: 4K. I am now in a situation, where I could really, really use 4K, or actually, where I need it, but for various reasons have to shoot with (cheap) Canon and have a very limited budget. Pretty much every cheap camera on the market can now film in 4K, but Canon does not offer this feature. Even low-quality 4K would be better than nothing... I was disappointed, that the 80D has no 4K and now it seems, that the new rebel line is no different.
[sarcasm]Well, at least Canon is working on 8K... because everyone will need 8K....[/sarcasm]