Canon EOS R5 Mark II sensor resolution likely to stick at 45mp but with new AI features [CR2]

[Walrus]

Careful, there are some who might not realise you are joking.

Am I?
It's a rumors site, I may have sources on my own; of course I don't trust them entirely, so neither should anyone else.
It will be foolish to trust anything read/said here before reading on an official Canon note and/or website

 

[AlanF]

Am I?
It's a rumors site, I may have sources on my own; of course I don't trust them entirely, so neither should anyone else.
It will be foolish to trust anything read/said here before reading on an official Canon note and/or website

You trust what you read on an official Canon website?

 

[Cryve]

Looking at what we know, we saw that there was info on canon using either a high mp sensor or stick with 45 mp.

It seems they supposedly made their decision and went for the 45 mp sensor.

This seems logical, as 45mp allows for:

• Faster Readout
• Less roling shutter
• better iso performance
• Smaller file sizes
• more frames per second
• better video specs (no crop in 8k, 4k etc)
• less cost

These are features that most photographers interested in the r5 range want and need.
A high mp sensor, like 60 mp, would be problematic for all of these variables.

I think canon probably considered going for 60 mp but then weighted their options and went for the 45 mp, because it has broader appeal.

What this means tho, if the market for it is big enough, is that canon could be working on a dedicated high megapixel camera.

 

[Walrus]

You trust what you read on an official Canon website?

Tech specs related, yes, I would totally trust them, typos aside. If they say their camera has 45mpx and weights 700g, it's usually true.

Mkt/sales pitches? No way, by any company; I've been sales executive for 9 years in a global company, I wouldn't trust any establishment even if it was personally owned by me

 

[neuroanatomist]

What this means tho, if the market for it is big enough, is that canon could be working on a dedicated high megapixel camera.

I suspect there will be an R5s in the future, perhaps in the 80 MP range.

 

[Cryve]

I suspect there will be an R5s in the future, perhaps in the 80 MP range.

Perhaps they are using the sensor architecture of the 32 mp aps-c sensor but werent able to get good yields for the sensor yet. I imagine that this could be difficult with that many pixels.

Or they are banking on the next sensor architecture. The 32mp sensor (that could be scaled to 84 mp FF) is already 5 years old. Perhaps a new one is right around the corner.

 

[Del Paso]

I wonder if Canon could afford a subscription model.
The risk of loosing new customers to competition is not to be neglected. I would never have entered the Canon ecosystem if it had been based on subscription. I'd now be a more or less happy Leica L or Nikon customer.
Should such stupidity ever come, I'd certainly keep using what I have, and, after a few years, buy used non-subscription gear to replace what is worn.
But I can afford that, being a hobbyist. For professionals, things could be a bit different!

 

[AlanF]

Tech specs related, yes, I would totally trust them, typos aside. If they say their camera has 45mpx and weights 700g, it's usually true.

Mkt/sales pitches? No way, by any company; I've been sales executive for 9 years in a global company, I wouldn't trust any establishment even if it was personally owned by me

You can't rely on tech specs for lenses. They often lie about apertures and focal lengths, especially for telephoto lenses. Here are two taken at random: RF 800mm f/5.6, actual 780mm, f/5.9; EF 400mm f/2.8 II, actual 392mm, f/2.9. The correct values are given in the patents but they round the focal lengths up and the f-numbers down on the website.

 

[frankchn]

I suspect there will be an R5s in the future, perhaps in the 80 MP range.

Would make sense. R7's 32.5 MP sensor extended to FF makes 83.2 MP.

 

[AlanF]

Perhaps they are using the sensor architecture of the 32 mp aps-c sensor but werent able to get good yields for the sensor yet. I imagine that this could be difficult with that many pixels.

Or they are banking on the next sensor architecture. The 32mp sensor (that could be scaled to 84 mp FF) is already 5 years old. Perhaps a new one is right around the corner.

They won't use the current 32 mp sensor made 2.56 times larger for FF - it would be very slow at 75ms read out time. Sensors can be made much faster. The current R5 45 Mpx sensor is only slightly slower at 16.3 ms than the 24 Mpx R6ii at 14.6 ms. Go to stacked sensors and the Sony A1 50 Mpx has only 3.8 ms.

 

[padam]

I'm finding it amusing that in the past, some people were grumbling about any sort of extra features in modern cameras they never intend to use.
Yet outraging on a possibility of making them optional via software.
For the moment. it is completely vague what that means.
And the main thing is that I can't see Canon being the only one implementing it, if all cameras will have exponentially more features than they do now.

Sony already tried something like this years with their original VENICE camera.

 

[frankchn]

They won't use the current 32 mp sensor made 2.56 times larger for FF - it would be very slow at 75ms. Sensors can be made much faster. The current R5 45 Mpx sensor is only slightly slower at 16.3 ms than the 24 Mpx R6ii at 14.6 ms. Go to stacked sensors and the Sony A1 50 Mpx has only 3.8 ms.

They may change the architecture of the silicon but keep the density -- this means they won't have to re-design microlenses and other bits of the optical stack apart from the silicon.

 

[Bob66]

Ok I hear everyone about the subscription thing. The way it’s been done, I don’t think it could be worth it. But what if you could buy the R5 mark II for like $1500 as long as you subscribe for two years at $100 a month? And then with that you get meaningful updates and a direct community connection with canon to workshop new features? Mix that in with significant discounts on products and upgrades and that’s the only way I’d be interested in a subscription.

If they want to make it subscription how about $100 for the camera, firmware updates and fixes and a subscription for video. I don't like idea of subscription devices or software. I don't use Photoshop for this reason.

 

[alanphotography]

I hate subscriptions.

However I would welcome an internet-connection requirement that bricks the camera if declared stolen.

For example every time it connects to internet it restarts an internal counter of X months (user selectable without limit) until bricking and display remaining time at every startup.

Do that and something similar for lens, coordinate the same with other makers, and violent theft of camera gear would go down drastically.

I live in a very safe country but it seems easy to protect your customers safety.

 

[3kramd5]

I think Adobe is the reason a lot of companies are trying the subscription model.

I think it has more to do with the prevalence and acceptance of subscription-based entertainment and smart-device apps than it does with Adobe. Probably a good 40% of people don't know what Adobe is, and of the 60%, half just know them as the pdf company.

 

[John Wilde]

I wonder if Canon could afford a subscription model.

I'm putting this in my Don't Believe File until proven otherwise.

The only thing I can think of would be charging a connection fee if a camera has a built-in 5G transmitter.

 

[Walrus]

You can't rely on tech specs for lenses. They often lie about apertures and focal lengths, especially for telephoto lenses. Here are two taken at random: RF 800mm f/5.6, actual 780mm, f/5.9; EF 400mm f/2.8 II, actual 392mm, f/2.9. The correct values are given in the patents but they round the focal lengths up and the f-numbers down on the website.

Yeah but it's a lie that is widely known by people "who needs to know", while for the general public is pretty irrelevant if a 28-105 is a 30-102 and f4 is actually f4.2
And a 400mm being 392mm, in percentage, is even less relevant then with shorter focals.

Also, speaking about f stop, you're very well aware of difference between F stops and T stops; two nominal f2 lenses (meaning the focal length divided by the entrance pupil, let's say two different 100mm with an entrance pupil of 50mm) at same iso may require different shutter values due to light loss in transmission differences (different glass, different schemes, etc), so you may have, to bring the example to the limit, a f1.8 lens with a great transmission which is "faster", in terms of light captured (so faster shutter and/or less iso required), then a f1.4 lens with bad transmission (of course DoF is still different, shallower on the f1.4 lens and maybe with better bokeh rendering, but that's a different point).

So yes, lens data are all rounded, but still I don't find it really a relevant lie, as it's a widely available knowledge; like I won't find a real lie in "this camera reaches 40fps" and then you find out by testing that can only reach 38fps, that would be annoying, but still. Even "this thing weights 700g" and then it's 710g (or 690g), who cares, it's not payload to Mars were every gram counts.

Of course we should take everything with a grain of salt; but if I read anywhere "R5 II will be 60mpx, stacked, improved IBIS up to 10 stops, 80fps in electronic shutter, 8k240 video, battery last 5000 shots or 4h of 8k video, AI will recognize bride from groom at a wedding and will stay on him/her without AF switching and also recognize bride's dress and will control highlights on it reducing the current directly to the pixels covering the dress so it doesn't clip", well I want to read it black on white on Canon website before believing it, and I would probably just believe the first part (10 stops IBIS excluded), and totally doubt the second until I try it personally in the field and see with my own eyes the dress not clipping while the face remains of a higher luminosity.

 

[Quarkcharmed]

At 500€£$ that wouldn't be fun at all; I think if the camera would cost 4.500€$£ + sub's, then we'll have some real fun!

To me it would depend on the base kit price, the features under subscription and the subscription cost. Depending on what's in the package, maybe I don't care at all, or maybe I'll switch the brand. Maybe a GFX100II is waiting for me somewhere in the stock storage...

An R5 with RF 100-500 + GFX100II with wider angle lenses would make a pretty good combo.

 

[Quack]

Nikon have a 45 mp sensor since the release of the d850 in 2017. Thew z7 has 45 mp, so does the z7 ii and also the z8 and z9.

Perhaps 45 mp is somewhat of a sweetspot.

Stop making sense. There's no room for that on this forum!

 

[AJ]

Subscription? That'll be as popular as charging for use of the bathroom on an airplane.
If Canon is looking for a revenue stream like this then maybe they should reconsider licensing their RF mount to third-party manufacturers.