Canon Responds to Rebel T6i/T6s Sensor Issue With Service Advisory
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YuengLinger said:
It doesn't mean that marked cameras are already out in the wild. The service advisory is meant to be read now and in several months, and next year and the year after that, etc., until the camera ceases to exist. Service advisories stay online for many years. As time goes by, there will indeed be marked cameras in the wild, on the used market, etc. The service advisory isn't specifically telling you there are marked cameras available now, although that's possible too. Canon services cameras pretty quickly. So a camera sent in 10 days ago could already be back to its owner, repaired and marked.
The idea that Canon would be "shipping product they knew was bad or sitting on in hoping nobody would notice" is beyond absurd. They are in the imaging business and know these spots are VERY visible and VERY problematic in a number of ways. And they know that word gets around on the Internet very quickly.
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The CMOS sensor T6i and also T6s is manufactured by Canon.bertzie said:
Up to this moment Canon used Sony sensor only in some of its compact cameras Powershot.
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A good question.bertzie said:
According to Masaya Maeda, Managing Director of Canon, the Dual Pixel AF sensor has a downside: High cost of manufacturing.
I'm sure the knowledgeable photographers would prefer that new T6i, T6s, M3 had the same 70D sensor. But the average buyer does not research on specialized sites like we do, and he is impressed by more megapixel.
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bertzie said:
Can't you tell by the (lack of) low iso dynamic range :-> ?
bertzie said:
In this segment, specs matter a lot with people comparing online in two colums or side-by-side in a shop. And the metapixie count still is one of the deciding factors, 24 (Rebel) has to be better than 18 (1dx), right :->?
It's unfortunate as few beginners really calculate how much resolution they need for which purpose, and if their glass is up to the task yadayadayada, but there you are. That being said, I'd take a 24mp aps-c sensor for macro shooting anytime over my 20mp ff 6d in good light.
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there is clearly a QC issue. Honestly, they don't electronically inspect the finished product? For crying out loud this is an imaging company and the can't take a picture w/ or of the sensor prior to assembly and make sure all the parts are right.
Further which part was bulk manufactured w/ a defect, should have caught it there- outbound to the next step.
Lastly inbound inspection of the parts.
There are at least 3 spots in the manufacturing process that should have caught this LONG before the units made it out the door.
Is that the faint aroma of garlic, lemon and a little fanny frying I smell?
Further which part was bulk manufactured w/ a defect, should have caught it there- outbound to the next step.
Lastly inbound inspection of the parts.
There are at least 3 spots in the manufacturing process that should have caught this LONG before the units made it out the door.
Is that the faint aroma of garlic, lemon and a little fanny frying I smell?
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Busted Knuckles said:
I doubt the problem was there initially, it most likely manifested itself over time so it was not there when the cameras were produced.
You can get all sorts of things happening in materials used for precision coatings, such as phase separation and crystallization, that happen slowly. I suspect that was the problem with this particular batch of sensors, where one of the coatings applied to the sensor surface was either improperly applied, cured or was contaminated, and over time the flecks appeared as the sensor aged. This sort of thing happens all the time in high tech gadgets but obviously is not intended, and it is very difficult to pick up in QC because it is not immediately apparent.
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neuroanatomist said:
Bolded the part you chose to ignore. Reading comprehension is a dying art it seems.
You generally don't hear from manufacturers about these sorts of things until they have characterized the problem (in other words, know that it actually is a problem on their end) and have a solution for it.
They don't want to issue a general product recall because someone left a shipping box in the baking sun for two weeks, for example.
The "speed" of their response implies that they were well aware of the problem long before the Lens Rentals posting and already knew the likely cause because they were immediately replacing the units. They had probably been getting back reports from users as soon as they started shipping the camera. All the Lens Rentals article did was accelerate the process and make damage control neccessary, otherwise they most likely would have quietly replaced the bad batch as people made service returns.
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Re: Canon Japan Responds to Rebel T6i/T6s Sensor Issue
They had no choice after the Lens Rentals posting, if they did not publically respond to an issue with that sort of sample size, and individual users continued to post "defective images" it would have basically killed the camera. Without the Lens Rentals posting I'm not so sure it would have happened with quite the speed, since the IQ effects of the defect only become apparent in shooting conditions that most users of the camera would not use. So, there would have been sporadic public complaints, but as past experience has shown, those don't carry quite the same clout. Over time the defective units would have been quietly phased out of the market, and that certainly would be the preferred route for any manufacturer. Do things with the least fuss and bother, and above all avoid admitting fault until absolutely necessary.
zlatko said:
They had no choice after the Lens Rentals posting, if they did not publically respond to an issue with that sort of sample size, and individual users continued to post "defective images" it would have basically killed the camera. Without the Lens Rentals posting I'm not so sure it would have happened with quite the speed, since the IQ effects of the defect only become apparent in shooting conditions that most users of the camera would not use. So, there would have been sporadic public complaints, but as past experience has shown, those don't carry quite the same clout. Over time the defective units would have been quietly phased out of the market, and that certainly would be the preferred route for any manufacturer. Do things with the least fuss and bother, and above all avoid admitting fault until absolutely necessary.
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zlatko said:
I don't put much weight in the "do the right thing" of major companies, and the "right thing" is relative to shareholder value.
One might think that a company would issue a recall due to a safety issue as a matter of course, but as GM has shown us, they're willing to sit back and pay settlements rather than undergo a relatively expensive (up front) fix.
Even within the imaging industry, errors which are VERY visible and VERY problematic have been pushed aside until the largest nation on the planet outright banned sale of the problem product.
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Tugela said:
Fair enough,
There has been some recent "lack of aging" across the photo seen. T4i, the recent Nikon oil problems.
The key to this is the rapid cycle improvement and error correction - give Canon good marks on that. I still have an issue w/ lenses coming out the factory anything other than perfect, particularly Ls
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Re: Canon Japan Responds to Rebel T6i/T6s Sensor Issue
You must be confusing Canon with another manufacturer when you talk about what "past experience" has shown. They have a list of service advisories on their web site, addressing a variety of problems. There isn't a public service advisory every time someone reports a problem with a new product, but they obviously do warranty service all of the time. If I send them a new lens with decentered optics, it comes back fixed within 10 days, and there's no public service advisory about it.
Even without the Lens Rentals posting, it's likely that every affected camera would have been serviced or replaced under warranty. That dramatic pattern of spots all over the sensor is not the sort of thing that most users would miss. Anyone using P mode or Auto mode on a sunny day outdoors would have gotten some shots at f/11 or f/16 and seen them in the sky.
You're saying Canon had to act because of the Lens Rentals posting. And you're saying that sporadic public complaints would not have had much clout; so defective units could be "quietly phased out". But then you're saying that individual users posting defective images would have "basically killed the camera". Do you see the contradiction there?
Tugela said:
You must be confusing Canon with another manufacturer when you talk about what "past experience" has shown. They have a list of service advisories on their web site, addressing a variety of problems. There isn't a public service advisory every time someone reports a problem with a new product, but they obviously do warranty service all of the time. If I send them a new lens with decentered optics, it comes back fixed within 10 days, and there's no public service advisory about it.
Even without the Lens Rentals posting, it's likely that every affected camera would have been serviced or replaced under warranty. That dramatic pattern of spots all over the sensor is not the sort of thing that most users would miss. Anyone using P mode or Auto mode on a sunny day outdoors would have gotten some shots at f/11 or f/16 and seen them in the sky.
You're saying Canon had to act because of the Lens Rentals posting. And you're saying that sporadic public complaints would not have had much clout; so defective units could be "quietly phased out". But then you're saying that individual users posting defective images would have "basically killed the camera". Do you see the contradiction there?
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