Canon USA: Canon Professional Services

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
3,057
1,801
If you pay the same amount of money for the service and bought the same expensive cameras, you should get the same service. There should not be any privileges for "professionals". It is the same with journalists. It always makes me very angry if "professional" journalists get any kind of special access, because today basically everyone is a journalist. We all publish things on blogs or platforms like Instagram or Facebook. In the past a small group of editors in chief acted as a kind of filter between the truth and the readers. I am glad that those times are over.
What you get when 'everyone' is allowed 'media' access at close range is one of two things:

1) A front row that stands fully erect surrounding the subject from two feet away while holding up their phones and iPads blocking the view of anyone shooting with a wider than 20mm (35mm equivalent) lens.

2) No event at all because whoever is putting it on isn't willing to let unvetted people get that close to the person(s) of interest. They don't want to be the one that allows the next Sirhan Sirhan, John Hinkley, Jr., Mark David Chapman, John Wilkes Booth, etc.
 

michi

EOS RP
Jul 26, 2011
274
12
There's no charge for the SIlver Membership, which is the only level that does not get a discount on repairs, shipping, or loaners.

For Gold level the annual cost is $100. It includes a 20% discount on parts/labor for up to 10 repairs per year and free return shipping (overnight). It also includes a loaner if they don't ship your equipment back to you within the guaranteed turnaround time. In other words, if they don't fix it in two days, they'll ship you a loaner on the second day. I've never sent them anything that wasn't finished on time. (Although the day they receive it is 'Day 0', the beginning of the next day is 'Day 1').

For Platinum level the annual cost is $300 and includes a 30% discount on parts/labor for up to 15 repairs per year and free overnight shipping both ways. It also includes a loaner shipped (overnight) the day they receive your equipment at their facility.
I don't know why you quoted my comment with an explanation of how CPS works? I understand how it works. People were saying it is like a extended warranty to which I replied it is not, because it doesn't extend any warranties. It just speeds up service and possible reduces cost of repair if you pay for a higher level...
 

RunAndGun

EOS RP
CR Pro
Dec 16, 2011
406
81
Everyone wants to be "special"... And no one wants to be excluded or told they can't do something. I've had the thought for years that that's why so many amateurs pitch a fit about wanting to be in CPS.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
3,057
1,801
I don't know why you quoted my comment with an explanation of how CPS works? I understand how it works. People were saying it is like a extended warranty to which I replied it is not, because it doesn't extend any warranties. It just speeds up service and possible reduces cost of repair if you pay for a higher level...
Probably because I don't consider a 20% or 30% discount on a several hundred dollars repair to be "slight."
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
3,057
1,801
Everyone wants to be "special"... And no one wants to be excluded or told they can't do something. I've had the thought for years that that's why so many amateurs pitch a fit about wanting to be in CPS.
There's a lot of wiggle room between "amateur" and "full time professional, the majority of whose income is derived from producing images."

Consider the (increasingly rare) full-time photojournalist who is lucky to be making $40K a year in some markets.

Compare that to a dentist who makes $250,000 as a dental surgeon, but also makes $50,000 from selling large prints to her dentist friends to hang in their lobbies, doing senior portraits for many of her teen patients, shooting weddings of her twenty-something patients, baby photos for her thirty-something patients, etc.

Even though she actually earned more from imaging related activities than the "full-time professional", is the dentist who generated $50K from photography an amateur because she made more from her "day job" than from shooting every weekend and editing several nights a week?

(Okay, so that is maybe an extreme example, but you should get the point)
 
Mar 31, 2014
1,001
96
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Center of my universe
I'll pass on CPS and the Canon Factory Service Center; I had them do two repairs and both had to be sent back for glaring damage down there. KEH has down it right the first time on two repairs.
 

RunAndGun

EOS RP
CR Pro
Dec 16, 2011
406
81
There's a lot of wiggle room between "amateur" and "full time professional, the majority of whose income is derived from producing images."
Not really. That's pretty black & white, especially using your example of percentage of income earned from photography.

The spirit and intent of the original requirements for CPS was that it was there to service full-time working photographers. Think full-time photo-journalists working for a paper or magazine(one example and maybe a poor one today). And I think most people realize and know what the true intention was(is). Some play devil's advocate. And some just want to try to find a loophole that justifies them being able to join.

And before someone takes it there, I'm in no way trying to infer that "amateurs" aren't as talented or skilled as "professionals". There are tons of amateurs that are incredibly talented and skilled, and even more-so than many "professionals".
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
3,057
1,801
Not really. That's pretty black & white, especially using your example of percentage of income earned from photography.

The spirit and intent of the original requirements for CPS was that it was there to service full-time working photographers. Think full-time photo-journalists working for a paper or magazine(one example and maybe a poor one today). And I think most people realize and know what the true intention was(is). Some play devil's advocate. And some just want to try to find a loophole that justifies them being able to join.

And before someone takes it there, I'm in no way trying to infer that "amateurs" aren't as talented or skilled as "professionals". There are tons of amateurs that are incredibly talented and skilled, and even more-so than many "professionals".
But the dentist is probably spending more hours per week shooting and editing for their side business than the PJ who is limited to 40 hours/week so the paper doesn't have to pay overtime. Are you saying if the PJ is a trust fund baby and makes more from the stock market than the news business they should not get the preferential turnaround time either?

And anyone who thinks turnaround time is not critical for someone charging $3000+ to shoot a wedding three out of every four weekends from May to October needs to have their head examined.
 

neuroanatomist

I post too Much on Here!!
CR Pro
Jul 21, 2010
24,647
2,165
But the dentist is probably spending more hours per week shooting and editing for their side business than the PJ who is limited to 40 hours/week so the paper doesn't have to pay overtime. Are you saying if the PJ is a trust fund baby and makes more from the stock market than the news business they should not get the preferential turnaround time either?
The requirement doesn't specify fraction of time, it specifies fraction of income. Are you saying the dentist derives a majority of his income from photography? Obviously not, since the numbers in your example show the contrary. Your trust-fund PJ has a better claim, as a card-carrying pro.

It's all academic anyway. Canon USA never gave a damn about the 'pro' requirement, they were happy to take money from anyone who owned some gear and (more importantly) paid the fee. Now, they're merely making it official.
 

takesome1

EOS R
Aug 23, 2013
1,490
122
99
Licking, Missouri
There's a lot of wiggle room between "amateur" and "full time professional, the majority of whose income is derived from producing images."
You miss quote the requirement.
(a) that are full time self-employed, or an employee of a professional imaging business, who plays a direct role in the creation of moving or still images for third parties on a professional basis,

There is no dollar value assigned. It does not say "the majority of".

A Dentist (self employed) and makes still images to evaluate his patients would qualify.
The patient is the third party and there is no dollar value assigned in the requirement.
 

takesome1

EOS R
Aug 23, 2013
1,490
122
99
Licking, Missouri
The requirement doesn't specify fraction of time, it specifies fraction of income. Are you saying the dentist derives a majority of his income from photography? Obviously not, since the numbers in your example show the contrary. Your trust-fund PJ has a better claim, as a card-carrying pro.

It's all academic anyway. Canon USA never gave a damn about the 'pro' requirement, they were happy to take money from anyone who owned some gear and (more importantly) paid the fee. Now, they're merely making it official.
I went back and read the thread. What are they making official?
 

neuroanatomist

I post too Much on Here!!
CR Pro
Jul 21, 2010
24,647
2,165
I went back and read the thread. What are they making official?
Canon USA eliminated the requirement for members to be professional photographers (as defined in your bolded section above). Now, you just need enough qualifying gear and to pay the fee.
 

lux

EOS M6 Mark II
Jan 4, 2013
89
2
Canon USA eliminated the requirement for members to be professional photographers (as defined in your bolded section above). Now, you just need enough qualifying gear and to pay the fee.
I just looked at the website. I don't see a change.
I've always wanted to join. For me the opportunity for cleaning seemed pretty great
 

takesome1

EOS R
Aug 23, 2013
1,490
122
99
Licking, Missouri
Canon USA eliminated the requirement for members to be professional photographers (as defined in your bolded section above). Now, you just need enough qualifying gear and to pay the fee.
Maybe I am confused by your response. The bold I posted is the exact cut from CPS website this week. In fact while I was there getting the clip I went ahead and renewed my silver membership. In older it had the same requirement 4 years ago. Maybe the professional photographer requirement was before that.

It seems like this topic never goes away. Always the same outcome and I think you will agree, regardless of what the terms and conditions say Canon just doesn't care.

For anyone wanting the correct terms and conditions go to this link. Click on on the link "More About CPS Silver Membership:
http://cps.usa.canon.com/about_cps/silverMembership.shtml
 

neuroanatomist

I post too Much on Here!!
CR Pro
Jul 21, 2010
24,647
2,165
Maybe I am confused by your response. The bold I posted is the exact cut from CPS website this week. In fact while I was there getting the clip I went ahead and renewed my silver membership. In older it had the same requirement 4 years ago. Maybe the professional photographer requirement was before that.

It seems like this topic never goes away. Always the same outcome and I think you will agree, regardless of what the terms and conditions say Canon just doesn't care.

For anyone wanting the correct terms and conditions go to this link. Click on on the link "More About CPS Silver Membership:
http://cps.usa.canon.com/about_cps/silverMembership.shtml
It seems I’ve been propagating false information, my apologies. I was basing my statements on the commentary from Richard (CanonNewsGuy), where he stated:
Canon USA has released a new video discussing the features and benefits of CPS (Canon Professional Services). Unlike other programs, the only qualification needed is how much eligible Canon gear you have. You don’t have to have professional credentials unlike both Sony and Nikon services, anyone can take advantage of CPS.
In the first part of the video, they do state that anyone with a certain level of professional equipment can join and I think that may have led to some confusion. Later in the video, they state that CPS is for people making a living using Canon equipment.

Or, maybe Richard is not suggesting that anything has changed, but merely stating declaratively what is practically true (and I agree with your post above) – Canon doesn’t care if you’re a pro, they only care if you have the gear and pay the fee, despite the requirement listed on their website.
 

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Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
3,057
1,801
You miss quote the requirement.
(a) that are full time self-employed, or an employee of a professional imaging business, who plays a direct role in the creation of moving or still images for third parties on a professional basis,

There is no dollar value assigned. It does not say "the majority of".

A Dentist (self employed) and makes still images to evaluate his patients would qualify.
The patient is the third party and there is no dollar value assigned in the requirement.
The last time I renewed my CPS membership there was still language relating to "majority" of income in the registration process.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
3,057
1,801
Perhaps the biggest misunderstanding is what the initial post actually says as compared to what many seem to think it is implying:

"You don’t have to have professional credentials unlike both Sony and Nikon services... "

Saying that is not the same thing as saying, "You don't have to be a professional."

There are many freelancers and sole proprietors who are professional photographers that do not have credentials issued from a major press organization such as the AP (Associated Press) or Reuters, a local media company such as a newspaper, or a major professional organization such as ASMP (American Society of Media Photographers).

Admittedly, Canon does not really enforce it at all, but they do still require one to declare:

Discipline: The choices are 'Photography', 'Video/Cinema', or 'All'

Professional Status: The choices are 'Freelance', 'Owner', or 'Staff'

Primary Industry/Media Outlet: There are 27 choices including five different 'Film & TV' categories (Documentary, Episodic, Narrative, News/Weather, and Studio Production), four 'Government' categories (Federal, Military. Law Enforcement, and Local Government), two 'Corporate' categories (Large or Small/Medium), two 'Education' categories (K-12 or Higher), two for Portrait (High Volume or Studio/Location), and others such as 'Security/Surveillance', 'Wedding/Event', 'Sports', 'House of Worship', 'Magazine/Editorial/Fashion', etc.

Primary Specialty: There are 33 choices ranging from 'Annual Reports' to 'Wildlife' including things such as 'Sports', 'Wedding', 'Student/Equipment Manager', 'Paparazzi' (yes, that is an actual category in the menu!), 'Medical', 'Editorial', 'Catalogue', etc.

Secondary Specialty: The choices are the same as for Primary Specialty
 
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takesome1

EOS R
Aug 23, 2013
1,490
122
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Licking, Missouri
The last time I renewed my CPS membership there was still language relating to "majority" of income in the registration process.
It would have had to been before 2014. The requirement read that way that far back.

But I have been reading the 51% statements and the majority statements for years when this topic pops up. It hasn't been that way in years.
 

michi

EOS RP
Jul 26, 2011
274
12
Probably because I don't consider a 20% or 30% discount on a several hundred dollars repair to be "slight."
Fair enough, it's still not a "extended warranty" because if it was, it would be free. A $1000 repair is still $800/$700 with the discount. It's not THAT big of a deal. Those $200 you saved, you probably paid in CPS fees. If you're a pro who constantly ends up with damaged equipment, then yes, it would be worth it.
 

RGF

How you relate to the issue, is the issue.
Jul 13, 2012
2,816
35
If that is not the norm at Sony or Nikon, that really is something that would stop me from buying there products.

The only complain I had about CPS in the past, is that you needed TWO professional bodies to qualify. I hope they changed that. If Canon is really confident with the quality of their lenses, a single camera should be enough for most photographers unless they need wide and long lenses at the same time. Instead of wasting the money on two cameras, I would rather buy more lenses.

I also hated that after a while a camera did not longer qualify.
A large format (24" and wide) does not count but the 13" and 17" printer do. Go figure