Canon's Mirrorless Entry

[FunPhotons]

Honestly?

Thanks to the Shorty McForty, I have no interest in a mirrorless camera.

Agreed, with a camera for my wife, son, and one on the belt (S100) I'm drowning in chargers and batteries. Not to mention the old Rebel I keep with me because it's a crop body.

 

[cliffwang]

I have a 5D Mark III and a lot of L glass and such...
...but I use two MicroFourThirds cameras all of the time. I have ten lenses, all AF and 8 of them fast primes. I have from fisheye to 350mm (equiv.). Is the IQ and Versatility as good as my 5D ....Hell No!..BUT the images are damn good! I WOW DSLR owners with them all of the time. ..usually on a gallery wall. No kidding. I own OM-D and GX-1 (LVF-2) bodies. They complement each other perfectly..and give the system a lot of versatility. I do not see Canon besting this. Sensor basically the same size on the new mirrorless with I am sure 3 pedestrian lenses.
I can really run out the door with a pocket full of kryptonite with some of the lens & body choices in MFT. It is a cool, FUN "system". Really FUN! It offers waaaaaaay more than soccer-Mom results. No doubt.

How do you like the OM-D? I am thinking to get one for my wife. She doesn't like my 5D2. It's too heavy for her.

 

[gmrza]

We’ve heard only little bits of info about the mirrorless camera. The most notable is mentions that it will use the same sized sensor as the G1 X, and maybe even the exact same sensor.

And there we have it! This is exactly what I predicted a couple of weeks ago! Yet another let down down from Canon is on the horizon.

I guess the only way to get a mirrorless camera with FF is to dish out out $7000 - $8000 for the Leica M9, or the upcoming M10.

Dear Canon, why have you ceased to innovate and amaze?

Given that the consumer end of the range will be targeted at P&S upgraders, I can't see anything larger in terms of sensor size than the G1X sensor (or APS-C).

I will be a bit disappointed if Canon does not use the sensor tech from the 650D - the AF in the G1X has come in for a bit of criticism, so having phase detect AF would be a good improvement.

I will probably hold out for the prosumer/pro models to be announced.

 

[infared]

How do you like the OM-D? I am thinking to get one for my wife. She doesn't like my 5D2. It's too heavy for her.
[/quote]

I really like that camera..I consider that my "big" MFT camera. (I have big hands and it really needs the top half of the battery grip for me. Making it a bigger package) It really offers a lot of versatility in a small package. It's small and the lenses are small! Pany will soon be offering a f/2.8 12-35mm zoom (24-70mm equiv.). Put that baby on the OM-D and that would be a lot of camera in a small package with IS.
I am not a fan of the menu system..but I have found that with some time it has become a non-issue.
For many uses it is all of he camera you need!

 

[psolberg]

well I guess that all but nails down what we already knew:

sony is the only game in town for quality mirrorless. Unlike canon/nikon, sony doesn't have a market to protec so they are not messing around and hold back on their mirrorless to protect their entry level dslr market.

I was hoping I could keep some canon gear after my switch out of their dslr system. It seems I'm going to be shooting nikon dslrs with sony NEX mirrorless.

things change huh.....

 

[psolberg]

G1X sensor is a very good center piece for their first mirrorless camera.

If there are going to be mirrorless cameras above this one then there is every chance that one of the future cameras will have an APS-C sized sensor and be an EF-S native mount, that is unless the new lens mount has lenses capable of projecting an image circle big enough for an APS-C sensor.

Remember that part of the difference between an EF/EF-S lens and those for the mirrorless is the distance from the focal point to where the image plane is expected to be for accurate distance readings.

the problem is that as soon as you say EF mount you're talking a legacy mount designed to be X distance from the sensor to clear the mirror. I expect everybody will have to dump their mirror based mounts to be able to make smaller cameras. You can always slap an adapter to mount old EF mount lenses.

I'd love to see an end to the mirror based mounts. they are unecessarily huge and too far away from the sensor.

 

[JurijTurnsek]

Why do people whine about the size of DSLRs? quality has to come at a price - even if todays best quality will be available in a GoPro-sized body, a regular size DSLR would still bring quality, that is that much better.

Also, this is just an early rumor - no one said it's going to have G1X's sensor. Proof is in the pudding - pancake 40mm points towards a bigger sensor (and no new mount?)...

 

[gmrza]

Why do people whine about the size of DSLRs? quality has to come at a price - even if todays best quality will be available in a GoPro-sized body, a regular size DSLR would still bring quality, that is that much better.

Also, this is just an early rumor - no one said it's going to have G1X's sensor. Proof is in the pudding - pancake 40mm points towards a bigger sensor (and no new mount?)...

It's about use cases. I think for most professional and a lot of enthusiast use cases, the size of a DSLR is more appropriate. For protracted use on a large job, with a big lens attached, the format of a "large" DSLR, with a portrait grip is the most ergonomic. IF you need higher quality than a DSLR can offer, you need to goo medium format.

For people wanting a compact camera, where size, weight, or obtrusiveness are an issue, a smaller system has a lot of benefits. This includes some specialist professional uses (probably mainly reportage). A smaller camera also has a lot going for it for street photography.

I think most people who want a small (mirrorless) system are not expecting the same IQ, focusing capability etc. as a 5DIII or a 1DX. Those who are wanting a mirrorless system for a reason other than upgrading from P&S are mostly aware that there is a compromise on quality relative to a DSLR.

For myself, I want a camera that I can easily take with while cycling, as I tend to be out and about a lot on my bike at sunrise and sunset, for air travel, and for situations where a DSLR is too obtrusive. I would probably settle for a general purpose zoom with IS and a few of primes (wide, normal and portrait). The system needs to be compatible with my current Speedlites (i.e. hotshoe is a must-have), and should have an adapter to use EF lenses for the odd occasion when I want to use a more specialised lens.

 

[Wild]

Why couldn't it be an FD-mount and offer focus peaking like the Sony's NEX line. It would make using our old glass fun again, plus there would be a ton of cheap, but good quality glass to use already. And make an EF-mount adapter for some L-glass goodness ;D

Oh and I really hope it's at least an APS-C sensor. I mean they already have a sensor made that would work perfectly in the T4i, since it has the center phase detect pixels (I think) to help AF.

 

[preppyak]

Proof is in the pudding - pancake 40mm points towards a bigger sensor (and no new mount?)...

Except why would they release a lens for a system before the system is even announced? You think they have 3 other pancake lenses lined up for a mirror less EF system?

The pancake 40mm points to Canon wanting an f/2.8 prime with the silent autofocus motor at a price that Rebel users would purchase.

 

[briansquibb]

I fully expect the lowest possible consumer-crappy mirrorless camera from Canon.
It will be a G1X with a lens mount and possibly a sorry little EVF instead of the G1X's sorry little OVF.
The lenses will be three sorry crappy kit lenses, a 28-90 equivalent f/3.5-5.6 kit zoom, a slow 40mm pancake of some sort and a slow tele zoom.

Autofocus will be dead slow like on the G1X. It will not have the hybrid FPPD-AF + CD-AF of the 650D.
fps and operational speed will be dead slow. The thing will suck in every possible way and still cost as much as a 60D.

I really hate them for it already in advance.

Instead of pouring your hate into every thread why not have a more objective approach backed up with some real experience/evidence instead of just malicious rumour and gueswork?

 

[Wild]

I fully expect the lowest possible consumer-crappy mirrorless camera from Canon.
It will be a G1X with a lens mount and possibly a sorry little EVF instead of the G1X's sorry little OVF.
The lenses will be three sorry crappy kit lenses, a 28-90 equivalent f/3.5-5.6 kit zoom, a slow 40mm pancake of some sort and a slow tele zoom.

Autofocus will be dead slow like on the G1X. It will not have the hybrid FPPD-AF + CD-AF of the 650D.
fps and operational speed will be dead slow. The thing will suck in every possible way and still cost as much as a 60D.

I really hate them for it already in advance.

Instead of pouring your hate into every thread why not have a more objective approach backed up with some real experience/evidence instead of just malicious rumour and gueswork?

+1

Sure some people have been a bit disappointed by their latest releases, but that doesn't mean you can't have some hope for something awesome on the horizon

 

[Ricku]

I fully expect the lowest possible consumer-crappy mirrorless camera from Canon.
It will be a G1X with a lens mount and possibly a sorry little EVF instead of the G1X's sorry little OVF.
The lenses will be three sorry crappy kit lenses, a 28-90 equivalent f/3.5-5.6 kit zoom, a slow 40mm pancake of some sort and a slow tele zoom.

Autofocus will be dead slow like on the G1X. It will not have the hybrid FPPD-AF + CD-AF of the 650D.
fps and operational speed will be dead slow. The thing will suck in every possible way and still cost as much as a 60D.

I really hate them for it already in advance.

Instead of pouring your hate into every thread why not have a more objective approach backed up with some real experience/evidence instead of just malicious rumour and gueswork?

+1

Sure some people have been a bit disappointed by their latest releases, but that doesn't mean you can't have some hope for something awesome on the horizon

Kinda hard to have hope after the 5D3 sensor, and now this.

But yeah, otherwise I agree with you.

 

[maxxevv]

Instead of pouring your hate into every thread why not have a more objective approach backed up with some real experience/evidence instead of just malicious rumour and gueswork?

That's so true indeed.

BT topic.

I think this would make sense that they are looking at an 'entry' MIL camera with the G1X sensor. It has the right attributes that an P&S upgrader would want.

i) It has proven to take really good quality pictures on the G1x.
ii) Its aspect ratio would allow for really compact lenses. Probably something not much larger than what we see on the G1x for the same aperture and focal length range.
iii) It would keep the costs of such a system down, thus more attractive to P&S upgraders.
iv) Its 'upward compatible' with EF mount as well as EF-S lenses. In short make a good back-up camera/secondary travel camera for people who already own EF / EF-S glass with an adaptor.
v) It leaves room for the APS-C sensors of the DSLR cameras.
vi) It leaves room for a separate line of MIL cameras that clearly differentiates itself in the market. Which Canon has tried and proven quite a few times in history. Such as the original Rebel, the 5D, the G1x, the G-series powershots. Possibly an APS-H or even FF MIL camera if they determine there is strong enough a demand for them down the line.

Of course, many of us on this forum would want something that's of higher specifications but economically, its not really so viable for Canon if the market for something 'higher end' is not deemed to be strong enough at the moment.

 

[wickidwombat]

um whats wrong with the 5Dmk3 sensor? other than not being eleventy billion pixels

 

[Ricku]

um whats wrong with the 5Dmk3 sensor? other than not being eleventy billion pixels

A bit off topic, but let's see now.

* Yes, no bump in resolution.
* Almost no improvement in dynamic range (no improvement at all @ lower ISO settings).
* Canon failed to completely fix the issue with banding.
* The only strength 5D3 sensor has over the 5D2 is in the extreme ISO settings. (which I never use anyway).

Nikon on the other hand, they did all of it and then some!

I am not saying that the 5D3 is a bad camera, but people upgrading from 5D2 to 5D3 are basically paying $3500 for upgraded (fixed) AF, built in HDR and a rate button.

The sensor is just meeh..

 

[wickidwombat]

um whats wrong with the 5Dmk3 sensor? other than not being eleventy billion pixels

Well let's see now.

* There were no bump in resolution.
* Almost no improvement in dynamic range (no improvement at all @ lower ISO settings).
* Canon failed to completely fix the issue with banding.
* The only strength 5D3 sensor has over the 5D2 is on the extreme ISO settings. (which I never use anyway).

Nikon on the other hand, they did all of it and then some!

I am not saying that the 5D3 is a bad camera, but people upgrading from 5D2 to 5D3 are basically paying $3500 for upgraded (fixed) AF, built in HDR and a rate button.

so you own one do you? or are you just regurgitating the tired old internet waffle that is continuously being regurgitated as absolute fact?

 

[briansquibb]

um whats wrong with the 5Dmk3 sensor? other than not being eleventy billion pixels

A bit off topic, but let's see now.

* Yes, no bump in resolution.
* Almost no improvement in dynamic range (no improvement at all @ lower ISO settings).
* Canon failed to completely fix the issue with banding.
* The only strength 5D3 sensor has over the 5D2 is in the extreme ISO settings. (which I never use anyway).

Nikon on the other hand, they did all of it and then some!

I am not saying that the 5D3 is a bad camera, but people upgrading from 5D2 to 5D3 are basically paying $3500 for upgraded (fixed) AF, built in HDR and a rate button.

The sensor is just meeh..

I think your analysis of the 5DIII is rather like saying a D800 is an upgrade of a D700 - totally off mark.

 

[Ricku]

um whats wrong with the 5Dmk3 sensor? other than not being eleventy billion pixels

Well let's see now.

* There were no bump in resolution.
* Almost no improvement in dynamic range (no improvement at all @ lower ISO settings).
* Canon failed to completely fix the issue with banding.
* The only strength 5D3 sensor has over the 5D2 is on the extreme ISO settings. (which I never use anyway).

Nikon on the other hand, they did all of it and then some!

I am not saying that the 5D3 is a bad camera, but people upgrading from 5D2 to 5D3 are basically paying $3500 for upgraded (fixed) AF, built in HDR and a rate button.

so you own one do you? or are you just regurgitating the tired old internet waffle that is continuously being regurgitated as absolute fact?

:

Lack of arguments huh? Don't know what to say in defense? I can see why, because there is nothing to say.

No, of course I do not own a 5D3. Why would I?

However, I have tried it, and my conclusion is the same as most other's (except the hardcore fanboys). The 5D3 is a good camera, just like the 5D2, but with no sensor improvement. It pales in comparison to the main competitions latest offering (the D800).

 

[Ricku]

um whats wrong with the 5Dmk3 sensor? other than not being eleventy billion pixels

Well let's see now.

* There were no bump in resolution.
* Almost no improvement in dynamic range (no improvement at all @ lower ISO settings).
* Canon failed to completely fix the issue with banding.
* The only strength 5D3 sensor has over the 5D2 is on the extreme ISO settings. (which I never use anyway).

Nikon on the other hand, they did all of it and then some!

I am not saying that the 5D3 is a bad camera, but people upgrading from 5D2 to 5D3 are basically paying $3500 for upgraded (fixed) AF, built in HDR and a rate button.

so you own one do you? or are you just regurgitating the tired old internet waffle that is continuously being regurgitated as absolute fact?

:

Lack of arguments huh? Don't know what to say in defense? I can see why, because there is nothing to say.

No, I do not own a 5D3. Why would I?

However, I have tried it, and my conclusion is the same as most other's (except the hardcore fanboys). The 5D3 is a good camera, just like the 5D2, but with no sensor improvement. It's sensor pales in comparison to the main competitions latest offering (the D800).

I think your analysis of the 5DIII is rather like saying a D800 is an upgrade of a D700 - totally off mark.

Nope. The D800 is the true successor of the 5D2. Too bad it has a Nikon-badge on it.