Earthshatteringly Disappointed With 7D

[Loswr]

Here is another focussed with the 5dII, servo mode coming towards me .....
70-300L@300, 1/400, f5.6, iso200

Wow! You certainly know how to focus with the 5D mkII! Nice!

To be honest, it looks to me like the critical focus is from the backs of the wings to the tail, not on the head where it should be. That's consistent with the 5DII's AI Servo AF not being able to track all that well, nor predict motion very well.

can you give us people struggling with AF some detailed tips for shooting with the 5D2 AF?
it would really be much appreciated

You red my mind sir!

He did just that in another thread...twice:

Try focusing at f/8 or more which is what I do for weddings ....

I dont use the 5DII for shallow DOF - typically nowadays for weddings and landscapes for anything much less than f/8 is rare.

If you're shooting with a deep DoF, such as at f/8, focus errors are masked quite well. But as I stated in that other thread (apologies for repeating myself), most people expect a $2K+ camera to focus accurately even with a shallow DoF. Speaking for myself, I certainly didn't buy a 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II, 135mm f/2L, or 85mm f/1.2L II to 'f/8 and be there.'

 

[briansquibb]

He did just that in another thread...twice:

Try focusing at f/8 or more which is what I do for weddings ....

I dont use the 5DII for shallow DOF - typically nowadays for weddings and landscapes for anything much less than f/8 is rare.

If you're shooting with a deep DoF, such as at f/8, focus errors are masked quite well. But as I stated in that other thread (apologies for repeating myself), most people expect a $2K+ camera to focus accurately even with a shallow DoF. Speaking for myself, I certainly didn't buy a 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II, 135mm f/2L, or 85mm f/1.2L II to 'f/8 and be there.'

... again you have totally misread my comments

 

[briansquibb]

Here is another focussed with the 5dII, servo mode coming towards me .....
70-300L@300, 1/400, f5.6, iso200

Wow! You certainly know how to focus with the 5D mkII! Nice!

To be honest, it looks to me like the critical focus is from the backs of the wings to the tail, not on the head where it should be. That's consistent with the 5DII's AI Servo AF not being able to track all that well, nor predict motion very well.

I suppose you never get the AF point in the wrong place when tracking a fast moving bird across the sky?

It certainly doesn't prove that the AF system is weak as you suggest - just means I got the big bit of the bird - but that wont serve your argument though like when you rubbished the kart pictures when in reality they did prove the servo tracking was working.

 

[JR]

If you're shooting with a deep DoF, such as at f/8, focus errors are masked quite well. But as I stated in that other thread (apologies for repeating myself), most people expect a $2K+ camera to focus accurately even with a shallow DoF. Speaking for myself, I certainly didn't buy a 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II, 135mm f/2L, or 85mm f/1.2L II to 'f/8 and be there.'

Good point there. This is why I am looking forward so much to the 1DX for its AF capability in those situation. In the mean time though, I will try your suggestion to focus at F8 and see if I can catch my little girl!

 

[Loswr]

I suppose you never get the AF point in the wrong place when tracking a fast moving bird across the sky?

Of course I do. I've done so dozens, if not hundreds of times. But I deleted those shots as not having the critical focus where I wanted it, i.e. OOF shots. I didn't save them and post them to exemplify good AI Servo tracking of moving subjects.

 

[briansquibb]

I suppose you never get the AF point in the wrong place when tracking a fast moving bird across the sky?

Of course I do. I've done so dozens, if not hundreds of times. But I deleted those shots as not having the critical focus where I wanted it, i.e. OOF shots. I didn't save them and post them to exemplify good AI Servo tracking of moving subjects.

My client liked them enough. I never said they exemplified good AI Servo - just that the servo kept up and essentially if I can do it anyone can. Many not be perfection but it is a real life photo that does show that the servo kept up - even if it was embarassing to me..... but I am not showcasing my photos, just suggesting that the AI servo is adequate.

I could post some OOF 7D pictures and argue that this showed how poor the 7D is ......

 

[Orangutan]

I suppose you never...

But I...

If you two don't stop squabbling, the teacher's gonna send you both to the principal's office.

 

[unfocused]

I suppose you never...

But I...

If you two don't stop squabbling, the teacher's gonna send you both to the principal's office.

+1. Maybe now people will understand why I like this feature. http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php/topic,2473.0.html

 

[Orangutan]

+1. Maybe now people will understand why I like this feature. http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php/topic,2473.0.html

Thanks, but it took about 1 minute after my post for someone to smite me. Possibly a new record.

 

[unfocused]

+1. Maybe now people will understand why I like this feature. http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php/topic,2473.0.html

Thanks, but it took about 1 minute after my post for someone to smite me. Possibly a new record.

Hey, a two to one applaud-to-smite ratio is still golden. Lots better than the misbehaving students.

 

[pj1974]

If I can just add my 5 cents worth. There is a place for both the 7D and the 5D (classic and 5DmkII). [How diplomatically started, right] ;D

I've used full frame and APS-C. For me, at this stage and my style of photography, the 7D suits me best. I really appreciate the AF improvements (over my 350D). I'll acknowledge that the 5D's focus is above that of my 350D.

However I even still use my 350D - eg when I really need something light, and I will pack my 18-55mm kit lens, and still achieve great photos.

But for anything sports, moving, macro, etc- my 7D comes out first. Also, I'm very happy with my 7D for landscapes at ISO100, or ISO200, and for low light photos, I do like the 7D's ability and handling. With some careful post processing, I can get images I am thankful for.

Definitely for landscape a 5D or 5DmkII with the FF sensor is most suited for most of those general 'scenic' applications. Though - as I wrote in another post - unless someone's pixel peeping, often it's hard (or impossible) to tell from normal viewing distance if a certain photo was taken with FF or APS-C.

All the best to everyone!

Paul

 

[friedmud]

If I can just add my 5 cents worth. There is a place for both the 7D and the 5D (classic and 5DmkII). [How diplomatically started, right] ;D

I've used full frame and APS-C. For me, at this stage and my style of photography, the 7D suits me best. I really appreciate the AF improvements (over my 350D). I'll acknowledge that the 5D's focus is above that of my 350D.

However I even still use my 350D - eg when I really need something light, and I will pack my 18-55mm kit lens, and still achieve great photos.

But for anything sports, moving, macro, etc- my 7D comes out first. Also, I'm very happy with my 7D for landscapes at ISO100, or ISO200, and for low light photos, I do like the 7D's ability and handling. With some careful post processing, I can get images I am thankful for.

Definitely for landscape a 5D or 5DmkII with the FF sensor is most suited for most of those general 'scenic' applications. Though - as I wrote in another post - unless someone's pixel peeping, often it's hard (or impossible) to tell from normal viewing distance if a certain photo was taken with FF or APS-C.

All the best to everyone!

Paul

Good post Paul... and most definitely appreciated! Good to hear from someone who has used a 7D for quite a few different purposes.

I am quickly realizing that the 7D was still my best bet at this moment (although I am thinking I could have held out a bit longer to see what comes down the pipe from Canon... but that's water under the bridge now). After initially receiving underwhelming performance I went straight to the 'net and found scores of others claiming the 7D has all sorts of problems (as you can do for any piece of photographic equipment!) and quickly convinced myself I had made a mistake.

All of the quality posts pouring into this thread about the versatility of the 7D are making me realize that I fell into that old internet trap of listening to those who yell loudest (which are typically the ones with "problems").

Are there real issues? Certainly. If you have the cash to spend, are there better options for purely landscape photography? Yes (I think that has been well established at this point). Is it still a highly versatile camera with MANY excellent points: DEFINITELY.

This thread proves once again that the best pictures are the ones we actually take... and that any modern equipment can be used to produce exceptional and moving images when put in the right hands. It is plainly obvious at this point that the 7D won't hold anyone with capability back.

I would like to thank all of the 7D owners who have chimed in with their helpful experiences in using this camera. It has been thoroughly insightful!

 

[wickidwombat]

17 page thread in such a short space of time not relating to a new announcement or release...

Well Done

 

[AprilForever]

If you're shooting with a deep DoF, such as at f/8, focus errors are masked quite well. But as I stated in that other thread (apologies for repeating myself), most people expect a $2K+ camera to focus accurately even with a shallow DoF. Speaking for myself, I certainly didn't buy a 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II, 135mm f/2L, or 85mm f/1.2L II to 'f/8 and be there.'

Good point there. This is why I am looking forward so much to the 1DX for its AF capability in those situation. In the mean time though, I will try your suggestion to focus at F8 and see if I can catch my little girl!

Use f8 on people pictures only if your reason is to ensure adequate depth of field or to balance flash ratios (this happens a lot in studios and other controlled pictures...)

For a running child, take a lot of pictures with shallow deoth of field and LEARN how to use shallow dof to your advantage... By the way, at f8, you'll need a flash too for any indoor picture... or mad high ISO... or both... If you want natural pictures. learn how to use your lenses, don't rely on crutches.

When I use f8 when taking pictures of birds, it is because I am taking pictures of large birds in flight (herons and egrets), and am doing so in broad daylight. I usually want both wing and beak in focus, so this is necessary. But for a child? all you need is an eye in focus! And sometimes, not even that! The purpose for your pictures is the emotional connection to the memory, not technical image quality. "Sharpness is a bourgeois concept." (Henri Cartier-Bresson)

 

[briansquibb]

The suggestion for f/8 came about solely for groups of people.

I would suggest that is you want to catch a running child then f/5.6 will get most of the child in focus, depending on the lens and the distance from the child

Not sure I like portraits with one eye in focus and the other OOF

 

[AprilForever]

17 page thread in such a short space of time not relating to a new announcement or release...

Well Done

My 7D is an emotional matter!

 

[Timothy_Bruce]

If I can just add my 5 cents worth. There is a place for both the 7D and the 5D (classic and 5DmkII). [How diplomatically started, right] ;D

I've used full frame and APS-C. For me, at this stage and my style of photography, the 7D suits me best. I really appreciate the AF improvements (over my 350D). I'll acknowledge that the 5D's focus is above that of my 350D.

However I even still use my 350D - eg when I really need something light, and I will pack my 18-55mm kit lens, and still achieve great photos.

But for anything sports, moving, macro, etc- my 7D comes out first. Also, I'm very happy with my 7D for landscapes at ISO100, or ISO200, and for low light photos, I do like the 7D's ability and handling. With some careful post processing, I can get images I am thankful for.

Definitely for landscape a 5D or 5DmkII with the FF sensor is most suited for most of those general 'scenic' applications. Though - as I wrote in another post - unless someone's pixel peeping, often it's hard (or impossible) to tell from normal viewing distance if a certain photo was taken with FF or APS-C.

All the best to everyone!

Paul

I can totally agree!
I use my old scratchy 350D for the really hard times! When there is the not so small chance that the used camera is smashed on a rock while I am climbing or I could easily fall into salt water with it.
beside I love my 7D but hate that noisy low ISO-Images it produces (no word on hi-ISO )

 

[Axilrod]

If I can just add my 5 cents worth. There is a place for both the 7D and the 5D (classic and 5DmkII). [How diplomatically started, right] ;D

I've used full frame and APS-C. For me, at this stage and my style of photography, the 7D suits me best. I really appreciate the AF improvements (over my 350D). I'll acknowledge that the 5D's focus is above that of my 350D.

However I even still use my 350D - eg when I really need something light, and I will pack my 18-55mm kit lens, and still achieve great photos.

But for anything sports, moving, macro, etc- my 7D comes out first. Also, I'm very happy with my 7D for landscapes at ISO100, or ISO200, and for low light photos, I do like the 7D's ability and handling. With some careful post processing, I can get images I am thankful for.

Definitely for landscape a 5D or 5DmkII with the FF sensor is most suited for most of those general 'scenic' applications. Though - as I wrote in another post - unless someone's pixel peeping, often it's hard (or impossible) to tell from normal viewing distance if a certain photo was taken with FF or APS-C.

All the best to everyone!

Paul

I can totally agree!
I use my old scratchy 350D for the really hard times! When there is the not so small chance that the used camera is smashed on a rock while I am climbing or I could easily fall into salt water with it.
beside I love my 7D but hate that noisy low ISO-Images it produces (no word on hi-ISO )

You realize you're responding to an 8-month old thread right?