EOS 7D Replacement Mentioned Again [CR1]
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For this extremly long time waiting, my expectations are very high now.
The 7D replacement should be a real improvement, even better than the D7100, that was released more than a year ago.
If it will just be a 7D with flipscreen, touchscreen, wifi and dualpixels and the overall image quality and high ISO performace will be about same as the old one or only marginally improved. That would be my last disappointment with canon.
The 7D replacement should be a real improvement, even better than the D7100, that was released more than a year ago.
If it will just be a 7D with flipscreen, touchscreen, wifi and dualpixels and the overall image quality and high ISO performace will be about same as the old one or only marginally improved. That would be my last disappointment with canon.
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geonix said:
You can get that now with the 70D...of which I was disappointed in. The best feature they added was AFMA adjustment and that was something to be excited about for those coming in from a 60D or T series.
The 7DII will likely have a LOT of video features that will drive the price up. I'm sure one thing we can ALL agree on is that we will be disappointed with the price they set as is with all of their new products.
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What's really sad is that I gave up waiting and bought at 1D X. Not a decision I regret, but it was a lot more than I wanted to pay for an faster frame rate than the 5DIII. The recent firmware upgrades have made it an amazing camera for wildlife photography and I'm curious to see if Canon adds some of those to the 7D II. I also fear it will be a videographer's dream camera, which means zilch to me.
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mackguyver said:
Zilch until your interest morphs and you take up wildlife videography.
I chose not to get a 1DX for a number of reasons but the number one was the shutter noise. CPS loaned me one and in drive mode it pretty much scared away everything I was photographing unless I was in a noisy environment. 12 fps is useless if you scare away your subject on shot 1.I chose the 5DIII and while the fps is lacking in some cases it does not give me away in my blind. If I dont need the FPS, then silent mode keeps me undercover. I hope the 7D2 offers a MUCH quieter drive mode shutter than the 1DX. That might be the only show stopping thing for me. Otherwise I am pretty much waiting for the pre-orders to start.
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East Wind Photography said:
In what way could I have significantly better IQ and high ISO performance with the 70D???? All tests and reviews I looked at say that IQ and noise has only marginally improved in the 70D. At side-by-side comparison of images at 100% you can see that.
I want the 7D successor to at least match the sensor of the D7100, although Nikon is surely already improving that one.
A 24MP APSC sensor with no or hardly visible noise up to ISO 1600 or even 3200 would be a milestone for Canon. But I'm afraid they are actually not even trying to achieve that. If this news about another delay due to problems with the dual-pixel senor are true, the 7D II will only be a 70Ds
With the time and rumors after rumors without any clear statement from canon themselfs, I feel more and more fooled by them. Canon doesn't seem to realise that there are a lot of customers who want a APSC Camera for wildlife photography which is up-to-date in IQ and low ISO performance. Or maybe there are not as many as I think.
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It is the focusing system. The focusing system (AFMA, focus points, live view) is far more capable on the 70D than the 60D and will give a better keeper ratio.geonix said:East Wind Photography said:
In what way could I have significantly better IQ and high ISO performance with the 70D???? All tests and reviews I looked at say that IQ and noise has only marginally improved in the 70D. At side-by-side comparison of images at 100% you can see that.
I want the 7D successor to at least match the sensor of the D7100, although Nikon is surely already improving that one.
A 24MP APSC sensor with no or hardly visible noise up to ISO 1600 or even 3200 would be a milestone for Canon. But I'm afraid they are actually not even trying to achieve that. If this news about another delay due to problems with the dual-pixel senor are true, the 7D II will only be a 70Ds
With the time and rumors after rumors without any clear statement from canon themselfs, I feel more and more fooled by them. Canon doesn't seem to realise that there are a lot of customers who want a APSC Camera for wildlife photography which is up-to-date in IQ and low ISO performance. Or maybe there are not as many as I think.
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I understand and just can't let myself do video. I've done it in the past (pre-DSLR) and it interests me, but the cost to do it right is obscene, not to mention the storage requirements and the amount of footage you need to shoot to get a few minutes of finished video. I really don't want to test the limits of my AMEX, marriage, or sanity by getting back into videoEast Wind Photography said:mackguyver said:
Zilch until your interest morphs and you take up wildlife videography.
I chose the 5DIII and while the fps is lacking in some cases it does not give me away in my blind. If I dont need the FPS, then silent mode keeps me undercover. I hope the 7D2 offers a MUCH quieter drive mode shutter than the 1DX. That might be the only show stopping thing for me. Otherwise I am pretty much waiting for the pre-orders to start.
Besides, and not to open the debate, but to me, there's always been something more meaningful and lasting about a still vs. video. I saw an interview a year or so ago (Nikon/some war photog, I think) who talked about how many videos you can remember vs. still shots and that further cemented the idea of focusing on stills for me.
Back to the camera, I do wish the 1D X had a silent burst mode like the 5DIII, but where I shoot (swamps, subtropical forests, and coastal areas) all have so much ambient noise from insects and other creatures that the loud shutter isn't an issue for me. In the cold silent forests of New England where I grew up, or places like it, I can imagine it would scare the crap out of everything in sight. I guess that's why they let you adjust the speed down from 12fps so it's at least a bit quieter. Over the years, I've missed so many shots by missing focus or the key moment that 12fps is something that I will really get a lot out of for my work. I say it that way because I've hardly had time to use it since I've bought it, but in about a month my time will be my own again
I prefer full frame as well and the 5DII was a revelation to me and my shooting. I came to prefer it over the 7D even with it's AF and burst speed limitations, so I'm not sure crop would interest me again unless the IQ is much better above ISO 1600 on the 7DII. With my 1D X and 300 f/2.8 II IS, I can literally start shooting (moving) wildlife before sunrise now, which gives me another 30+ minutes of shooting over the 7D and f/4 & f/5.6 lenses I used in the past. For me, that is truly a game changer.
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I wonder if the Image Quality, Dynamic Range and High ISO Performance of the 7D replacement will match the D7100, which is on the market now for over a year. Or if it will be at the same level as the 70D.
Of course we won't know for sure until it will finally be anounced, but for some reason I am changing more and more from having high expectations to the 7D II, to beeing rather pessimistic about its features.
Of course we won't know for sure until it will finally be anounced, but for some reason I am changing more and more from having high expectations to the 7D II, to beeing rather pessimistic about its features.
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if it has the Same AF as the 5Dmk3 I will probably get one to use with the tamron 150-600, hopefully the body and ergonomics will be essentially the same as the 5Dmk3 and also please please use the same battery as the 5Dmk3
sigma 50mm 1.4 on the 5Dmk3 tamron 150-600 on the 7Dmk2 and the 11-22EF-M on the EOS-M and i might never have to change lenses again
.... (that was sort of a joke for anyone thinking of giving me a lecture)
sigma 50mm 1.4 on the 5Dmk3 tamron 150-600 on the 7Dmk2 and the 11-22EF-M on the EOS-M and i might never have to change lenses again
.... (that was sort of a joke for anyone thinking of giving me a lecture)
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I wonder whether it will have evolutionary technology like Sony are exploring:-
"Curved CMOS Image System: When light transmitted by a lens strikes a perpendicular target such as a CMOS image sensor, it forms a circle of light called an image circle. It’s difficult for a flat (planar) CMOS image sensor to deliver high image sensitivity at high resolution (highly scaled pixel pitch) because of the fundamental physical limit known as quantum efficiency. To break through that physical limit and to achieve higher sensitivity anywhere within the image circle at higher resolution, Sony built and will describe an imaging system that comprises a hemispherically curved, back-illuminated CMOS image sensor (BIS) and integrated lens. It doubles the sensitivity at the edge of the image circle while increasing sensitivity at its center by a factor of 1.4, with a 5x reduction of dark current (Jd) compared to a planar BIS. Moreover, a common problem known as lens field curvature aberration (Afc) is mitigated by the curved sensor itself, and so the curved BIS enables higher system sensitivity with a brighter lens with a smaller F number (Fn) than is possible with a planar BIS. In addition, by controlling the tensile stress of the BIS chip to produce a curved shape in the first place, the energy band-gap (Eg) is widened and a lower Jd is achieved. (Paper T2.1, “A Novel Curved CMOS Image Sensor Integrated with Imaging System,” K. Itonaga et al., Sony)"
"Curved CMOS Image System: When light transmitted by a lens strikes a perpendicular target such as a CMOS image sensor, it forms a circle of light called an image circle. It’s difficult for a flat (planar) CMOS image sensor to deliver high image sensitivity at high resolution (highly scaled pixel pitch) because of the fundamental physical limit known as quantum efficiency. To break through that physical limit and to achieve higher sensitivity anywhere within the image circle at higher resolution, Sony built and will describe an imaging system that comprises a hemispherically curved, back-illuminated CMOS image sensor (BIS) and integrated lens. It doubles the sensitivity at the edge of the image circle while increasing sensitivity at its center by a factor of 1.4, with a 5x reduction of dark current (Jd) compared to a planar BIS. Moreover, a common problem known as lens field curvature aberration (Afc) is mitigated by the curved sensor itself, and so the curved BIS enables higher system sensitivity with a brighter lens with a smaller F number (Fn) than is possible with a planar BIS. In addition, by controlling the tensile stress of the BIS chip to produce a curved shape in the first place, the energy band-gap (Eg) is widened and a lower Jd is achieved. (Paper T2.1, “A Novel Curved CMOS Image Sensor Integrated with Imaging System,” K. Itonaga et al., Sony)"
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If the 7D2 was the 70D with a faster burst rate and 5D3 AF, it would sell well..... and if that is what it was, it would have been on the market a year ago. Those are tried and true technologies... very little work required to throw them together and make a camera out of them.
The wait for the 7D2 most likely is due to some new technology or feature(s). I expect a surprise here....
Possibilities are:
High speed storage - and that means faster burst rates and more FPS video...
Quad Pixel technology - and what does this mean for focusing speed, image tracking, resolution?
Smaller fabrication size - and does this impact noise, speed, and light sensitivity?
Next Gen WiFi interface - and what does this mean for remote/tethered/studio shooters?
Mirrorless - problems to be overcome but opens up new possibilities for focus and tracking
Hybrid Viewfinder - best of optical and digital combined....
Who knows? Certainly not me.. will it be worth the wait?
The wait for the 7D2 most likely is due to some new technology or feature(s). I expect a surprise here....
Possibilities are:
High speed storage - and that means faster burst rates and more FPS video...
Quad Pixel technology - and what does this mean for focusing speed, image tracking, resolution?
Smaller fabrication size - and does this impact noise, speed, and light sensitivity?
Next Gen WiFi interface - and what does this mean for remote/tethered/studio shooters?
Mirrorless - problems to be overcome but opens up new possibilities for focus and tracking
Hybrid Viewfinder - best of optical and digital combined....
Who knows? Certainly not me.. will it be worth the wait?
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Don Haines said:
You could be right and/or wrong...
But if we are comparing Canon's competitors here and trying to beat them... then we have a problem. Because Canon being at number 1 is making them a huge bullseye, who were their main competitors? Nikon? Olympus? Now Sony + Panasonic...
The competitors will constantly reinvent themselves to gain market share...
If Canon releases something tomorrow, its beat by all the other competitors the following year, now everyone is complaining that Canon isn't fast enough to respond.
Lets be real... what are the chances that it will be the most epic camera you have ever heard of till now?
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Don Haines said:
The surprise might be that there is no surprise, Canon keeps being Canon, juggling features and trickling down tech and they simply cannot find a position for a 7d2 in their lineup between 70d and 5d3 and in comparison to the crop competition.
Btw rumor has it they'll give the 7d1 another boost and lifetime extension with the firmware 3.0 in q4/2014 as they are eager to find out how long they people keep buying a camera with a by now 6 year old sensor. With this marketing data, they can push back the 5d4 release to early 2018.
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geonix said:
AF is not on par with modern cameras. Between poor IQ and slow inaccurate AF (relative to new sensors) It really makes it a poor choice for a new buyer. Those two alone should imprive with the 7D2 making it a better choice. How it stacks up with 5diii and 1div, 1dx we'll see.
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geonix said:
Alas, they also won't enlarge the pixels - after adding a ff 6d to my crop 60d I found that the "elasticity", i.e. what amount of editing you can get away with w/o introducing artifacts in post is much better in ff files.
Btw you can currently add +2 stops of dynamic range on the 7d with Magic Lantern's dual_iso module and ~0.5 stop with the upcoming mini_iso module - I really depend on these for noon and sunset shots of moving objects.
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