Help me decide on my next camera purchase - full frame high end
- Thread starter RChauhan
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I can vouch for 5d3 on being more than good enough. Plenty of autofocus points, plenty of FPS for most amateur wildlife shooting, and I can speak to it's weather sealing. Took a water balloon straight to the camera without issue. Only complaint is no dual pixel AF or it would have completely replaced my HV30 for video.
The question is, what are you losing by not having a full frame camera? Better put, what are you losing by buying now vs. 5d4? Lot of if's there.
The question is, what are you losing by not having a full frame camera? Better put, what are you losing by buying now vs. 5d4? Lot of if's there.
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Re: Help me decide on my next camera purchase
Simple. Get both the 1Dx mkI and the 5d mkIII. Both are a steal right now. Sell the 70D to help fund it all and give the T2i to a deserving child.
Keep the 1Dx stored while aboard ship to avoid corrosion.
Yeah, like me, you are a hobbyist. But you like quality too. Get both. If I could, that is exactly what I would do... and right now. I just can't yet, and I am afraid the camera's at these prices will be gone when I can.
Humidity? Get a couple of dry bags and order some desiccant pouches. They work. Everything shipped from Asia comes with desiccant pouches. I ordered by the case when I lived in Florida (for my guns).
Simple. Get both the 1Dx mkI and the 5d mkIII. Both are a steal right now. Sell the 70D to help fund it all and give the T2i to a deserving child.
Keep the 1Dx stored while aboard ship to avoid corrosion.
Yeah, like me, you are a hobbyist. But you like quality too. Get both. If I could, that is exactly what I would do... and right now. I just can't yet, and I am afraid the camera's at these prices will be gone when I can.
Humidity? Get a couple of dry bags and order some desiccant pouches. They work. Everything shipped from Asia comes with desiccant pouches. I ordered by the case when I lived in Florida (for my guns).
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Just stick with the 70D. Rather than getting a FF camera and shooting at higher ISO's, you'd get better results using a wide aperture prime and shooting at lower ISO's on your 70D. On paper, the AF performance on a 5Diii or 1DX might look better. But if you're not getting the right results with your 70D, you just need more practice, not a new body.
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Hi Hillsilly.
The op says he likes to shoot landscape and wildlife, therein lies the flaw with the wide aperture primes used wide open.
Landscape needs a smaller aperture for some depth of field, and a wide prime 400 or 500 for wildlife is going to be about the cost of the 1Dx! (Or possibly the 1Dx and a 5DIII) ;D
Cheers, Graham.
The op says he likes to shoot landscape and wildlife, therein lies the flaw with the wide aperture primes used wide open.
Landscape needs a smaller aperture for some depth of field, and a wide prime 400 or 500 for wildlife is going to be about the cost of the 1Dx! (Or possibly the 1Dx and a 5DIII) ;D
Cheers, Graham.
Hillsilly said:
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Sounds like a case of G.A.E. to me 
Sailing is one of my hobbies - one of the reasons I try not to spend too much on photo gear ! When it comes to damage, in my experience there is a relationship between the size of boat and the time you are at sea. The worse case scenario for damp is a small boat at sea for a long time, the best case a large ship at sea for a short time.
Even in the first case it's very much down to how you manage the photo gear. With modern electronic cameras the damage seems to be done after the shooting is done - when it's stowed. The gear must be put away and stowed dry.
Unless your container ship is a dire FOC derelict I don't see a problem with any camera as long as you are reasonably sympathetic with it.
Sailing is one of my hobbies - one of the reasons I try not to spend too much on photo gear ! When it comes to damage, in my experience there is a relationship between the size of boat and the time you are at sea. The worse case scenario for damp is a small boat at sea for a long time, the best case a large ship at sea for a short time.
Even in the first case it's very much down to how you manage the photo gear. With modern electronic cameras the damage seems to be done after the shooting is done - when it's stowed. The gear must be put away and stowed dry.
Unless your container ship is a dire FOC derelict I don't see a problem with any camera as long as you are reasonably sympathetic with it.
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The plan is to have a crop and a full frame camera. Depending on the place(s) I will travel to and how I will go, I will change things around in the kit I carry.
The 70D is perfectly fine and I have a lot to learn yet. This is more about making a plan so I can save accordingly. Like I said earlier, I eventually want a big white, most probably a 300/2.8 with both extenders for maximum versatility.
My list at the start was almost in order of my preferences so all the support for a 5D3 backs up my impression. A good camera will always be a good camera even when the replacement comes out.
My 'ship' kit will eventually be:
-body (crop or FF depending on where I'm going and what I reasonably expect to shoot)
-most probably the tokina 11-16/2.8 if crop, I don't have a wide angle for FF yet
-24-XX zoom, I have the 24-105 but am almost sure of getting the 24-70/2.8ii in a few months.
-24/2.8 STM walkabout lens if I am anywhere I don't want to attract attention (or the 40/2.8 STM which I will buy with the FF camera)
-maybe a zoom, the 100-400 is too heavy to carry as a just in case lens, so might try a lighter/smaller zoom or prime.
The T2i and old 50/1.8 will eventually be given away to someone who can't afford a good camera if my wife doesn't start taking more interest in coming out of auto. She loves the G10 (so do I).
The 70D is perfectly fine and I have a lot to learn yet. This is more about making a plan so I can save accordingly. Like I said earlier, I eventually want a big white, most probably a 300/2.8 with both extenders for maximum versatility.
My list at the start was almost in order of my preferences so all the support for a 5D3 backs up my impression. A good camera will always be a good camera even when the replacement comes out.
My 'ship' kit will eventually be:
-body (crop or FF depending on where I'm going and what I reasonably expect to shoot)
-most probably the tokina 11-16/2.8 if crop, I don't have a wide angle for FF yet
-24-XX zoom, I have the 24-105 but am almost sure of getting the 24-70/2.8ii in a few months.
-24/2.8 STM walkabout lens if I am anywhere I don't want to attract attention (or the 40/2.8 STM which I will buy with the FF camera)
-maybe a zoom, the 100-400 is too heavy to carry as a just in case lens, so might try a lighter/smaller zoom or prime.
The T2i and old 50/1.8 will eventually be given away to someone who can't afford a good camera if my wife doesn't start taking more interest in coming out of auto. She loves the G10 (so do I).
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The kit will also include:
-Tripod
-Ballhead
-Clamp(s)
-Filters
-Cleaning gear like air blowers and lenspens.
Another separate kit setup will be when I travel just for photography. Then I am thinking:
-Full frame with Wide Angle
-70D with telephoto
-other lenses and accessories depending on the nature of the trip.
-Tripod
-Ballhead
-Clamp(s)
-Filters
-Cleaning gear like air blowers and lenspens.
Another separate kit setup will be when I travel just for photography. Then I am thinking:
-Full frame with Wide Angle
-70D with telephoto
-other lenses and accessories depending on the nature of the trip.
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RChauhan said:
It'll be best to figure out how you'll use your 70D and your FF camera. After switching to FF, it's very hard to go back to the crop sensor. The shallower DOF is appealing and so is the better high ISO performance. I find that I'd rather bring another lens than a second body, but your circumstances may be different. The 70D will be a fine backup option, but if it's not your primary option does it make sense to retain EF-S lenses (like the Tokina 11-16 rather than switching to a Tamron 15-30 or Canon 16-35 f/4 IS). Another option is to retain the 70D and use it as video camera (with STM lenses) with a secondary role as a backup to the FF.
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Remember that a crop sensor effectively adds a 1.6x extender to the lens without loss of IQ by added glass, in fact as I understand, the center crop uses the better controlled part of the lens.
The crop on a telephoto is a benefit in my view since I will not get multiple telephotos for various reaches. Additionally, we do not lose any f-stops on fast glass.
So both have their own places. Weight is not a factor I am considering in the kits as backpacking is not a big plan.
I saw two Americans travelling together in Ladakh two years ago and they had this setup - 1 FF with 24-70/2.8 & 1 crop with 70-200/2.8. Looked pretty good to me from a versatility point of view. Even in the old monastries, one was taking full scene shots and one was zooming into details. I've been thinking about it since then actually. Its only now that I feel I am serious enough about photography that a FF will not be a waste or an impulse buy.
The crop on a telephoto is a benefit in my view since I will not get multiple telephotos for various reaches. Additionally, we do not lose any f-stops on fast glass.
So both have their own places. Weight is not a factor I am considering in the kits as backpacking is not a big plan.
I saw two Americans travelling together in Ladakh two years ago and they had this setup - 1 FF with 24-70/2.8 & 1 crop with 70-200/2.8. Looked pretty good to me from a versatility point of view. Even in the old monastries, one was taking full scene shots and one was zooming into details. I've been thinking about it since then actually. Its only now that I feel I am serious enough about photography that a FF will not be a waste or an impulse buy.
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RChauhan said:
No it does not. It is just the same as enlarging and cropping the center section of a FF shot (thereby saving the weight and cost of the crop camera), and every single comparison test I have ever seen of same generation sensors has shown that even though the smaller sensor puts more pixels on the subject the actual real world realisation of additional detail is insignificant.
I have asked many times for people to show me same generation crop camera and cropped ff camera images that actually show a meaningful difference in resolution and nobody ever has, they think they have but when you process both images to their full potential, ie not the same, then there has never been a significant difference.
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privatebydesign said:
+1 in real world use.
Ideal conditions, perfect lighting, tripod, live view and so forth to make that perfect image, yes more pixels matter.
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privatebydesign said:
So if you have a 5DIII and crop the picture from the 22 MP to the equivalent APS-C crop it will be 8.5 MP (like a 20D). So a current model 7D Mark II should have a better resolution for a pic that a 5DIII cropped to the same aspect ratio.
Am I doing something wrong?
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JWMilton said:
No you are doing nothing wrong, common wisdom says the 7D MkII should absolutely blow the cropped 5D MkIII away for detail and resolution, but real world results across same generation sensors actually show that isn't the case to any meaningful degree. If you already have a 5D MkIII and a 100-400 MkII don;t think a 7D MkII is going to get you a meaningful 'reach advantage', it isn't.
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Sporgon said:
I'd hope not but actual results from similar density crops so far have not supported much difference. I would hope to see a meaningful difference between the 5D MkIII and the 5DSR, but having done many uprezzing and crop tests (on other cameras) I think the differences are going to much more modest than most people expect.
Studio lighting is going to be the biggest differentiator, but then it already is.
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privatebydesign said:
Asking for clarification - so pixels on target does not have an effect when shooting birds etc?
The crop sensor will make a better enlargement than the cropped full frame, correct?
On this point, why was a 70D used with a tele for the new Panorama record? Serious question, not being sarcastic.
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privatebydesign said:
Agreed. Greater output size will be the first impression, beyond that in practice..... I think you'll need a pretty stringent set of conditions to get the most out of it.
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RChauhan said:
If I could answer that, being something of a panoramic specialist; they used a combination of 400mm focal length and crop sensor due to the size of the format that they were creating. Remember that on a 10 x 8 camera the "standard lens" focal length is 300mm ( that is equivalently to 50mm on FF).
In order to get the field of view that they wanted for the (ridiculous) file size that they wanted to create if they had used a FF camera they would have needed to use a 640mm lens. Also they specifically wanted the 'biggest' file size, so more smaller crop frames at 20mp does it for them. It has nothing to do with resolution. In fact it would have been better on a 5D with 600mm lens, but the overall file size would not have been as big.
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