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simonhowes said:
I don't know if they will answer of if the reps will even have the info but how about:
Did they improve the ISO 100 dynamic range over the 5D2?
Did they take care to lessen pattern banding in low ISO shadows?
Did they lessen high ISO banding? (tentatively, looking at samples, it seems the answer might be yes)
How many stops better SNR at high ISO in RAW compared to the 5D2?
Does the AF system run AI Servo using the same CPU and thus same speed as the 1DX does (or at least the same speed regardless of what they use to drive it)?
Does it allow EC in all AutoISO modes?
Is the histogram outlined (currently you can't easily see where it tops out when you are outside under bright sun)?
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Oh and is there a crop mode for movies? (it can be hard to get close to wildlife)
And if you can bring back RAW files then bring these two back:
set the camera to ISO 100 then
1. set camera to 1/8000th, if you are allowed remove lens and put on lens cap, try to keep camera as dark as you can and snap a total black frame (maybe bring a spare body cap if you can, a lens cap of various sizes if you can), it really needs to be a pitch black frame taken, no light leakage at all (maybe a lens cap on the lens combined with ISO100 and 1/8000th would be good enough if you also shield it with your body/shirt, if a lens is on the body it can't be faster than f/2.8 or it will, for sure, mess up the results due to secret boosts they apply to RAW files for fast lenses to make up for certain issues with how microlenses and all behave)
2. set the camera to a long enough shutter speed so that a nice solid chunk of an image you take is 100% utterly blown out in all channels, blow out for sure by a mile
With those two files and assuming IRIS will be able to at least partially open the files then we can find out the ISO 100 dynamic range, SNR, and pattern banding characteristics and we will then know if they are still stuck at 11ish stops DR or if they have approached or attained the 13.8 stops of the Sony/Nikon Exmor sensors. And if the ugly banding at low ISO is less or not.
And if you can bring back RAW files then bring these two back:
set the camera to ISO 100 then
1. set camera to 1/8000th, if you are allowed remove lens and put on lens cap, try to keep camera as dark as you can and snap a total black frame (maybe bring a spare body cap if you can, a lens cap of various sizes if you can), it really needs to be a pitch black frame taken, no light leakage at all (maybe a lens cap on the lens combined with ISO100 and 1/8000th would be good enough if you also shield it with your body/shirt, if a lens is on the body it can't be faster than f/2.8 or it will, for sure, mess up the results due to secret boosts they apply to RAW files for fast lenses to make up for certain issues with how microlenses and all behave)
2. set the camera to a long enough shutter speed so that a nice solid chunk of an image you take is 100% utterly blown out in all channels, blow out for sure by a mile
With those two files and assuming IRIS will be able to at least partially open the files then we can find out the ISO 100 dynamic range, SNR, and pattern banding characteristics and we will then know if they are still stuck at 11ish stops DR or if they have approached or attained the 13.8 stops of the Sony/Nikon Exmor sensors. And if the ugly banding at low ISO is less or not.
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T
tt
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From trying them today -
EDIT - I haven't seen this mentioned and it'd be really useful for a lot of folks - If you have one, put a fast glass like 85mm 1.2 or a 50mm 1.2 and see what the focus is like.
There's a thread about focusing screens - excluding the manual focus folk, it'd be useful to see how the 5D responds to fast glass - can it consistently shoot? They should let you change lens, choose the right/quieter queue camera or sound like you're interesting in buying and they'll push a sale and maybe let you try it. Should know in 3-4 weeks, but this is a great opportunity!
The 1DX and 5D MkIII are on different stands, on metal security cables.
You're not going to get a card sneaked into the 5D i'd imagine seeing as there will be a few Canon employees a foot or so away from you. Not sure about testing the weather sealing either!
After hearing all the complaints about price - yes, it's high, but then i've heard similar at a Jessops about the 70-200 f/2.8 - and photographers still buy it.
There was a lot of folks eyeing up buying it too - the dealers are making brisk sales of the model it seems with preorders.
Fun thing definitely worth trying to see some of the Canon talks if anything appeals -
http://www.focus-on-imaging.net/news/?cat=5 (Canon talks halfway down).
Histogram - is it outlined?
I'd take Neuro's advice - take a high ISO photo and look at it zoomed in.
Maybe take shots of the lights and do the same and see if you get black halos?
Q about if movie crop feature is available.
Q about f8 focusing (it's unlikely they'll comment on it i'd imagine though)
(it's pretty evenly lit and fairly well lit in the NEC - I didn't take a meter reading, but it wasn't dark feeling).
You might get away with a HDMI cable (to see if you plug it in during live view if the LCD goes out or stays on - presumably that's not needing to attach anything to the other end jlev23?) - as it's much more unexpected than trying to sneak or ask to put a memory card in. You could either bring it up suddenly or maybe talk about video a bit first.
High ISO video might be doable.
best bet about making a dark scene - you're going to need to create your own.
For anyone going - maybe the trick is to sneak a ND filter on then test the high ISO shots and high ISO video!
PS - Have a play with the silent mode. If you're used to sound, and the sound of the 5DM2 its fun to (not) hear!
It's an upgraded 5D. Pricey, but think of that as a 1 time cost that you get benefits from every time you use it it seems
EDIT - I haven't seen this mentioned and it'd be really useful for a lot of folks - If you have one, put a fast glass like 85mm 1.2 or a 50mm 1.2 and see what the focus is like.
There's a thread about focusing screens - excluding the manual focus folk, it'd be useful to see how the 5D responds to fast glass - can it consistently shoot? They should let you change lens, choose the right/quieter queue camera or sound like you're interesting in buying and they'll push a sale and maybe let you try it. Should know in 3-4 weeks, but this is a great opportunity!
The 1DX and 5D MkIII are on different stands, on metal security cables.
You're not going to get a card sneaked into the 5D i'd imagine seeing as there will be a few Canon employees a foot or so away from you. Not sure about testing the weather sealing either!
After hearing all the complaints about price - yes, it's high, but then i've heard similar at a Jessops about the 70-200 f/2.8 - and photographers still buy it.
There was a lot of folks eyeing up buying it too - the dealers are making brisk sales of the model it seems with preorders.
Fun thing definitely worth trying to see some of the Canon talks if anything appeals -
http://www.focus-on-imaging.net/news/?cat=5 (Canon talks halfway down).
Histogram - is it outlined?
I'd take Neuro's advice - take a high ISO photo and look at it zoomed in.
Maybe take shots of the lights and do the same and see if you get black halos?
Q about if movie crop feature is available.
Q about f8 focusing (it's unlikely they'll comment on it i'd imagine though)
(it's pretty evenly lit and fairly well lit in the NEC - I didn't take a meter reading, but it wasn't dark feeling).
You might get away with a HDMI cable (to see if you plug it in during live view if the LCD goes out or stays on - presumably that's not needing to attach anything to the other end jlev23?) - as it's much more unexpected than trying to sneak or ask to put a memory card in. You could either bring it up suddenly or maybe talk about video a bit first.
High ISO video might be doable.
best bet about making a dark scene - you're going to need to create your own.
For anyone going - maybe the trick is to sneak a ND filter on then test the high ISO shots and high ISO video!
PS - Have a play with the silent mode. If you're used to sound, and the sound of the 5DM2 its fun to (not) hear!
It's an upgraded 5D. Pricey, but think of that as a 1 time cost that you get benefits from every time you use it it seems
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rlarsen said:
1. According to Canon's website, no. On the day the 5D Mark III was announced, the BG-E6 did list the Mark III as compatible, but was removed the following day.
http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/products/cameras/slr_cameras/modelSNACompatibles.action?accessoryCid=0901e024800c4fcf&accessoryModelName=Battery+Grip+BG-E6
2. "It uses a transparent LCD to superimpose a customizable combination of focus points and gridlines directly over the image."
http://www.amazon.com/Canon-Frame-Digital-Camera-24-105mm/dp/B007FGZ1V0
"This high-grade viewfinder is further enhanced with the integration of a superimposed transparent LCD that displays autofocus and exposure information. This newly developed Intelligent Viewfinder gives a range of information, and is easily turned off to return you to the clear, unadulterated view from the optical finder itself."
http://www.photouae.org/canon-eos-5d-mark-iii-has-finally-arrived
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simonhowes
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Cheers all. I'll see what I can do. Doubt I'll be able to slip in a CF card.
I had a private showing at Arri of the 1Dx and C300 days after they were announced, they wouldn't let us use cards then, so I doubt they would let me at a trade show.
I doubt I'll get any numbers from the reps, they tend to repeat what is in the marketing materials.
Video cropping, HDMI out, taking photos at high ISOs is my main area of interest. If there are no cards in the camera, it may be hard to view on screen as it will disappear after a few seconds.
I had a private showing at Arri of the 1Dx and C300 days after they were announced, they wouldn't let us use cards then, so I doubt they would let me at a trade show.
I doubt I'll get any numbers from the reps, they tend to repeat what is in the marketing materials.
Video cropping, HDMI out, taking photos at high ISOs is my main area of interest. If there are no cards in the camera, it may be hard to view on screen as it will disappear after a few seconds.
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simonhowes said:
Ask about video resolution vs the 5DII! If the 5DIII is using a method similar to the c300 (full read out bayer sensor but no bayer interpolation or downscaling) and using a full raster read out it should be incredibly sharp. If it's pixel binning then debayering or line skipping or something it could be softer than the 5DII. Ask about resolution and sensor readout relative to the c300!
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nighstar
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Z said:
maybe this will help re: weather sealing of the Mark III?
http://cpn.canon-europe.com/content/education/technical/inside_canon_eos_5d_mark_iii.do
see: Related Links - EOS 5D Mark III - weather sealing
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tt
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Re: I have my hands on a 5D III and 1Dx tomorrow. Questions?
I stand corrected Might be possible to get a a car in as part of a private showing?
canonrumors guy links to someone who did get one.
Less likely if you just ask to a normal rep on the stand though I imagine.
If you have CPS maybe you'll get favored?
Paul Ward http://t.co/XN6oXHpN
http://bertstephani.com/2012/03/02/canon-eos-5d-mark-3-first-review/
I stand corrected Might be possible to get a a car in as part of a private showing?
canonrumors guy links to someone who did get one.
Less likely if you just ask to a normal rep on the stand though I imagine.
If you have CPS maybe you'll get favored?
Paul Ward http://t.co/XN6oXHpN
http://bertstephani.com/2012/03/02/canon-eos-5d-mark-3-first-review/
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simonhowes
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I'm back. Had a good 10 minutes with 5D III. Q&A didn't go too well with two of the reps, kept on telling me the 5D had Firewire.
So, the sensor. They had memory cards in which was good. Set the camera to RAW, turned off all noise reduction. ISO 800 clean, ISO 1600 getting very noisy, ISO 3200 is very very noisy. No banding that I could see. No weird halos. Any better than the 5D II, not really. I have been trying to think of a camera to compare it with, thinking the 7D, or the 800D, but no. I have to compare the difference as the old 40D and 50D. Take the 40D being similar to the 5D II, and the 50D to 5D III. Technology wise, they are similar, edge to edge micro lenses etc were introduced int he 50D. The Canon 50D was advertised as being better at low light than the 40D, the 50D had a higher pixel count, and in real world shots the 50D was no better. I feel the same with the 5D III. Bad news, pixel peeping, the D800 was cleaner at ISO 1600 and faster. I wouldn't say it was no more than 1 stop better, half a stop at most, D800 1/3 a stop again.
Build quality, didn't feel as rugged as the D800. Would have had a better answer to this if I did a few drop tests, but I didn't do this.
Video out. Same as the 5D II. No RAW out via HDMI, mirrors what's on the rear screen. No crop mode, and no drop frame!
The AF and AE are not unified to work together like the 1Dx, or the D800 and D4. It cannot do some of the more advanced features. AF is good, tried a 85 f/1.2 and 50 f/1.2, it never missed even when choosing an out of centre focus point. At f8, told the AF does not work at all (reps seemed out of their depth to really answer), and certainly no tracking. AE was like the 7D, hit and miss.
In conclusion, the 5D III is a full framed 7D. There was no answer to the price, especially when compared to the D800. I think the reps knew this, but couldn't answer it publicly, I think the look in their eyes said enough. D800 has the edge in all areas, but IQ on the D800 may be just as good, if not slightly better. It is not a low light camera, the same is said for the D800. I was there with my photographer, met some other pros who shoot Canon. They felt bitter about the 1Dx and its price over the D4, and they won't be rushing out to replace their 1D III's.
I can't say much about the 1Dx as I have already had a day with it, not under an NDA but I have to play nice.
So, the sensor. They had memory cards in which was good. Set the camera to RAW, turned off all noise reduction. ISO 800 clean, ISO 1600 getting very noisy, ISO 3200 is very very noisy. No banding that I could see. No weird halos. Any better than the 5D II, not really. I have been trying to think of a camera to compare it with, thinking the 7D, or the 800D, but no. I have to compare the difference as the old 40D and 50D. Take the 40D being similar to the 5D II, and the 50D to 5D III. Technology wise, they are similar, edge to edge micro lenses etc were introduced int he 50D. The Canon 50D was advertised as being better at low light than the 40D, the 50D had a higher pixel count, and in real world shots the 50D was no better. I feel the same with the 5D III. Bad news, pixel peeping, the D800 was cleaner at ISO 1600 and faster. I wouldn't say it was no more than 1 stop better, half a stop at most, D800 1/3 a stop again.
Build quality, didn't feel as rugged as the D800. Would have had a better answer to this if I did a few drop tests, but I didn't do this.
Video out. Same as the 5D II. No RAW out via HDMI, mirrors what's on the rear screen. No crop mode, and no drop frame!
The AF and AE are not unified to work together like the 1Dx, or the D800 and D4. It cannot do some of the more advanced features. AF is good, tried a 85 f/1.2 and 50 f/1.2, it never missed even when choosing an out of centre focus point. At f8, told the AF does not work at all (reps seemed out of their depth to really answer), and certainly no tracking. AE was like the 7D, hit and miss.
In conclusion, the 5D III is a full framed 7D. There was no answer to the price, especially when compared to the D800. I think the reps knew this, but couldn't answer it publicly, I think the look in their eyes said enough. D800 has the edge in all areas, but IQ on the D800 may be just as good, if not slightly better. It is not a low light camera, the same is said for the D800. I was there with my photographer, met some other pros who shoot Canon. They felt bitter about the 1Dx and its price over the D4, and they won't be rushing out to replace their 1D III's.
I can't say much about the 1Dx as I have already had a day with it, not under an NDA but I have to play nice.
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so, when you say the hdmi out mirrors whats on the screen, does that mean the lcd screen on the camera stayed on when you had an external monitor attached??? like you could see both at once? that would be a big revaluation if so and what a lot of people are waiting to hear, tell me its true!!!simonhowes said:
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simonhowes said:
Isn't that like taking a supermodel in the morning before they put on the makeup and do her hair and yell, See, I told ya she's not that pretty, look at all those blemishes! =) I guess we'll see in a matter of weeks when these cameras are released and scientific tests are done.
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WarStreet
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Thanks for the info.
Interesting that staff like video crop, which is available on 2 rebels, 60D, Nikon's D4 and D800, is not available on the 5D III ? As far as I know, Canon was first to release this, Nikon added this feature on it's new top end cameras, and Canon ??
With all respect, I really hope you are wrong on the image quality. This was a big surprise.
Interesting that staff like video crop, which is available on 2 rebels, 60D, Nikon's D4 and D800, is not available on the 5D III ? As far as I know, Canon was first to release this, Nikon added this feature on it's new top end cameras, and Canon ??
With all respect, I really hope you are wrong on the image quality. This was a big surprise.
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