Interview with Canon Executives at CP+

[Mikehit]

is that the Canon rep or the questions they were asked?
Look at the questions like-for-like and there is not a lot of difference - unless you care to elaborate?

 

[goldenhusky]

"We obviously have to look at the technical feasibility of it, cost-wise, as well as [the challenge of power consumption]. Those factors will tell us how we will introduce 4K technologies going forward.

That is the most ignorant answer anyone can expect from an executive of top photography equipment designer and manufaccturer in the world and the first company to implement 4k video shooting in a DSLR form (1DC) and especailly after 4 of their competitors (I know, I know, per canon and some people here there is no competition for the "Industry leader") offering 4K video capability in low cost consumer model cameras for a few years now.

"the challenge of power consumption"

increase the battery size dumb asses and give us a kick ass camera. Some people will complain about the size and weight once they start using it all those complaints will vanish without a trace

"We will continue to challenge and overcome these technical hurdles"

I wonder what the hell is that technical hurdle they are talking about in 2017

"4K should compliment, rather than hinder"

Now it is up to this lunatics to figure out the 4K implementation in 1dxii and 5D4 is the hindrance or compliment

"Our intention is to become number one in the overall ILC market"

Aren't they number one in ILC market in the entire world already? I wonder if these guys were even sober when they answered this question

Sorry people not to offend lot of you here on this forum but I just can't take it. I am an enthusiast primarily shoots canon and loving canon products so far. I had to buy an a6300 mainly for 4k and HFS because stupid canon would not offer anything in their consumer camera line up unless someone shells out $8k (may be $4k now). While I still love their products they are annoying me to the core as a company.

Some of the other non sense are not including UHS-II and cfast cards in the 5D4. Had they done that at least magic lantern will offer some help (I am still hoping for it).

When asked about why no 4K HDMI out on the 5D4 canon's response was their design engineers did not had access to the HDMI 2.0 hardware when they designed the camera. It is as ignorant as the answers we have got now.

No one can find out the shutter count of their latest camera models anymore. They were already making it hard to get the count but now they have completely blocked it. Why would they block anyone from getting the shutter count on purpose? what sought of non sense is that? It is very easy for them to just show the shutter count in the menu itself.

I guess there are people from all parts of the world here in this forum. Aren't 4k TVs predominant in most places on the earth with the exception of some markets in Asia and Africa? I saw a stat that said in 2016 alone there were more than 48 million 4K TVs sold across the globe. I could not get the break up by market though. So I guess there are not enough 4K displays is a lame argument at this point. Anyone who have numbers broken by markets please let me know.

I acknowledge Canon is the undisputed leader in the photography equipment business at this point but if they do not innovate they cannot continue as leader for long. Anyone saying no Canon will not sink, just look at Nokia not long ago they were worlds #1 handset makers but no where now. I know they have stamped the NOKIA name on some foxxconn junk as of now. My point is that there is no such thing called indisputable in this tech world any more. Canon still has the potential. They can introduce a decent mirroless cameras in 2018 and still steal sales from other manufacturer's camp. But time is running out fast for them. One more thing I wonder is that all along they have filled a lot of patents but nothing extra ordinary is coming to the market. What the hell are they doing with those patents? Hope Canon will understand this and take the lead position to bring back innovative products to market.

 

[AvTvM]

Why did DPreview not ask questions about FF and in particular the 6D MKII

they are tame pussies, no real interviewers or journalists.
I would not conduct "interviews" with such people who don't say shit. Or I would at least not print it.
Actually, one should buy 1 Canon share, attend their stock holder meeting and really publicly grill these execs there. I'd have a question or 2 for them.

 

[Jopa]

DPAF is useless with manual lenses. Does not make up for resolution.

It's useless with manual lenses indeed, it also can't autofocus diesel engines, teapots and ballerinas. But guess what - it works great with AF lenses!

 

[Woody]

I acknowledge Canon is the undisputed leader in the photography equipment business at this point but if they do not innovate they cannot continue as leader for long.

I've heard the above statement repeated ad nauseam in various internet forums for the past few years... ;D

Anyone saying no Canon will not sink, just look at Nokia not long ago they were worlds #1 handset makers but no where now.

Nokia fell apart because when big clunky smartphones arrived, they did not believe big clunky things could take the world by storm. I was surprised too.

When mirrorless cameras arrived, everyone thought they would take the world by storm. But reality paints a different picture. Even Canon execs are surprised: "... But having said that, compared to two years ago we’re now seeing a slowing down of mirrorless taking over. We were expecting to see more mirrorless taking off, keeping that momentum, but that has not happened."

Oooops!

If something new arrives on the horizon and decimates the camera market, everyone falls apart: Canon, Nikon, Olympus, Pentax etc etc. Canon won't be alone. Sony may still be OK as they are pretty diversified and may continue to survive in the sensor market... We shall see.

 

[Ryan P]

"But it is important to keep in mind that we don’t want to harm the original inherent concept of these products. 4K should compliment, rather than hinder." -Canon

?

My iPhone 6 plus (last generation) just shot awesome 4k for over an hour without a hiccup? LOL sooo....my iPhone that cossets under $1k shoot 4k video (no time limit) has a lens, a computer, apps, wifi, email, browser, huge touch screen etc etc is better than the latest generation Canon $2k DSLR in terms of photo/video performance....sad and transparent excuse (BTW they have no problem sticking more MP and marketing it in their cameras) Thanks Sony, Panasonic and Sigma for "doing your job" and appeasing the demand of the market!

You know your little iphone sensor is about the size of your baby finger thumbnail?
While phones in general produce pretty great quality images considering, they cant hold a candle to a dslr or mirrorless when it comes to high level quality

Are you sure about that? See the link below for a comparison of the iPhone 7+ and the $50K RED Weapon. If you have good light, the small sensor can be a blessing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztpX3AO1UtU

 

[Woody]

Are you sure about that? See the link below for a comparison of the iPhone 7+ and the $50K RED Weapon. If you have good light, the small sensor can be a blessing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztpX3AO1UtU

This is not new at all. People have discussed similar topics for years. For example, this article from 2010 which compares the Canon Powershot G11 to DSLRs:

https://www.photigy.com/do-you-really-need-an-expensive-dslr-camera-point-and-shoot-vs-professional-dslr/

"There is no arguing that a good camera is a must-have for a professional photographer. All DSLR’s are much faster and most of them are more convenient to work with than point-and-shoot cameras. However, do you really need a new, expensive DSLR to learn how to shoot, and to build your portfolio? I think not."

 

[dak723]

I guess there are people from all parts of the world here in this forum. Aren't 4k TVs predominant in most places on the earth with the exception of some markets in Asia and Africa? I saw a stat that said in 2016 alone there were more than 48 million 4K TVs sold across the globe. I could not get the break up by market though. So I guess there are not enough 4K displays is a lame argument at this point. Anyone who have numbers broken by markets please let me know.

Figures I was able to find (from mid-2016) projected that by the end of 2016 4K TVs would be in approx. 15% of US households. They project that by the end of 2019, 4K TVs will be in 50% of US households. So, while 4K TV sales are actually higher than projected a couple years ago, it will still be another couple years until 4K TVs are predominant.

 

[Ozarker]

Why did DPreview not ask questions about FF and in particular the 6D MKII

they are tame pussies, no real interviewers or journalists.
I would not conduct "interviews" with such people who don't say S___. Or I would at least not print it.
Actually, one should buy 1 Canon share, attend their stock holder meeting and really publicly grill these execs there. I'd have a question or 2 for them.

The view of the world is a strange one up there,
When floating around on so much hot air.

Do you really think that Canon could care,
what AvTvM has on mind to share?

Still he continues to muss his hair,
to shimmy and shake for mirrorless wares.

He twists and writhes and becomes contorted,
but pay him no mind... his own is unsorted.

 

[goldenhusky]

Thank you.

I guess there are people from all parts of the world here in this forum. Aren't 4k TVs predominant in most places on the earth with the exception of some markets in Asia and Africa? I saw a stat that said in 2016 alone there were more than 48 million 4K TVs sold across the globe. I could not get the break up by market though. So I guess there are not enough 4K displays is a lame argument at this point. Anyone who have numbers broken by markets please let me know.

Figures I was able to find (from mid-2016) projected that by the end of 2016 4K TVs would be in approx. 15% of US households. They project that by the end of 2019, 4K TVs will be in 50% of US households. So, while 4K TV sales are actually higher than projected a couple years ago, it will still be another couple years until 4K TVs are predominant.

 

[Ozarker]

"We obviously have to look at the technical feasibility of it, cost-wise, as well as [the challenge of power consumption]. Those factors will tell us how we will introduce 4K technologies going forward.

That is the most ignorant answer anyone can expect from an executive of top photography equipment designer and manufaccturer in the world and the first company to implement 4k video shooting in a DSLR form (1DC) and especailly after 4 of their competitors (I know, I know, per canon and some people here there is no competition for the "Industry leader") offering 4K video capability in low cost consumer model cameras for a few years now.

"the challenge of power consumption"

increase the battery size dumb asses and give us a kick ass camera. Some people will complain about the size and weight once they start using it all those complaints will vanish without a trace

"We will continue to challenge and overcome these technical hurdles"

I wonder what the hell is that technical hurdle they are talking about in 2017

"4K should compliment, rather than hinder"

Now it is up to this lunatics to figure out the 4K implementation in 1dxii and 5D4 is the hindrance or compliment

"Our intention is to become number one in the overall ILC market"

Aren't they number one in ILC market in the entire world already? I wonder if these guys were even sober when they answered this question

Sorry people not to offend lot of you here on this forum but I just can't take it. I am an enthusiast primarily shoots canon and loving canon products so far. I had to buy an a6300 mainly for 4k and HFS because stupid canon would not offer anything in their consumer camera line up unless someone shells out $8k (may be $4k now). While I still love their products they are annoying me to the core as a company.

Some of the other non sense are not including UHS-II and cfast cards in the 5D4. Had they done that at least magic lantern will offer some help (I am still hoping for it).

When asked about why no 4K HDMI out on the 5D4 canon's response was their design engineers did not had access to the HDMI 2.0 hardware when they designed the camera. It is as ignorant as the answers we have got now.

No one can find out the shutter count of their latest camera models anymore. They were already making it hard to get the count but now they have completely blocked it. Why would they block anyone from getting the shutter count on purpose? what sought of non sense is that? It is very easy for them to just show the shutter count in the menu itself.

I guess there are people from all parts of the world here in this forum. Aren't 4k TVs predominant in most places on the earth with the exception of some markets in Asia and Africa? I saw a stat that said in 2016 alone there were more than 48 million 4K TVs sold across the globe. I could not get the break up by market though. So I guess there are not enough 4K displays is a lame argument at this point. Anyone who have numbers broken by markets please let me know.

I acknowledge Canon is the undisputed leader in the photography equipment business at this point but if they do not innovate they cannot continue as leader for long. Anyone saying no Canon will not sink, just look at Nokia not long ago they were worlds #1 handset makers but no where now. I know they have stamped the NOKIA name on some foxxconn junk as of now. My point is that there is no such thing called indisputable in this tech world any more. Canon still has the potential. They can introduce a decent mirroless cameras in 2018 and still steal sales from other manufacturer's camp. But time is running out fast for them. One more thing I wonder is that all along they have filled a lot of patents but nothing extra ordinary is coming to the market. What the hell are they doing with those patents? Hope Canon will understand this and take the lead position to bring back innovative products to market.

There are about 7,000,000,000 (That's 7 b, b, b, BILLION) people on the Earth. 48 million 4k televisions sold globally last year isn't significant.

If the cable company isn't broadcasting 4K, it doesn't matter anyway.

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

There are about 7,000,000,000 (That's 7 b, b, b, BILLION) people on the Earth. 48 million 4k televisions sold globally last year isn't significant.

If the cable company isn't broadcasting 4K, it doesn't matter anyway.

True, but when I go into Costco, more and more of the low priced TV sets are 4k, down into the under $500 level now. They may not be wonderful, but they claim 4K.

I've been looking at the LG OLED sets, they start at about $2,000 in our local stores. The reviews rate them highly, but I likely could not tell you which was which if you put $2,000 sets from Samsung and LG in front of me.

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

There are about 7,000,000,000 (That's 7 b, b, b, BILLION) people on the Earth. 48 million 4k televisions sold globally last year isn't significant.

If the cable company isn't broadcasting 4K, it doesn't matter anyway.

True, but when I go into Costco, more and more of the low priced TV sets are 4k, down into the under $500 level now. They may not be wonderful, but they claim 4K.

I've been looking at the LG OLED sets, they start at about $2,000 in our local stores. The reviews rate them highly, but I likely could not tell you which was which if you put $2,000 sets from Samsung and LG in front of me.

The other issue is editing a high quality 4K file and playing it on a computer. I'm not sure how I would manage to play a 4K video on a 4K TV set, I would need some really large and fast media I'd think. My NAS struggles to play MP4 HD to my TV set via the network, I have to connect it directly via hdmi.

I have a tough time believing that many of those 48 million owners are creating 4K home videos to watch. Maybe 0.001%

 

[AvTvM]

one of many questiln i would ask those canon execs would be:
"why is EPS M5 sensor performance behind 80D sensor? as measured by DXO ... and M5 being 2 years newer.. ???"

a simple, fact-based straightforward question. i would not care whether or not this would be considered "disrespectful" or not in japanese culture. and even if there was no (real) answer and explanation provided, those guys should be treated to real interviews and real questions - from a critical journalistic perspective - as often as possible. they deserve it!

 

[AvTvM]

Why did DPreview not ask questions about FF and in particular the 6D MKII

they are tame pussies, no real interviewers or journalists.
I would not conduct "interviews" with such people who don't say S___. Or I would at least not print it.
Actually, one should buy 1 Canon share, attend their stock holder meeting and really publicly grill these execs there. I'd have a question or 2 for them.

The view of the world is a strange one up there,
When floating around on so much hot air.

Do you really think that Canon could care,
what AvTvM has on mind to share?

Still he continues to muss his hair,
to shimmy and shake for mirrorless wares.

He twists and writhes and becomes contorted,
but pay him no mind... his own is unsorted.

reported to moderator. one of many totally off topic personal attacks. incessant cyber-bullying and mobbing. hope you get banned for some time, @canonfanboy.'

 

[ExodistPhotography]

.....

I've been looking at the LG OLED sets, they start at about $2,000 in our local stores. The reviews rate them highly, but I likely could not tell you which was which if you put $2,000 sets from Samsung and LG in front of me.

I was looking at one of those LG OLED sets with the super thin bezel at 55 inches this week also.. Super nice.


I may not agree with Canon's stance on 4k in their DSLRs. But I can not understand why they do not at least make the 1080p video sharper. I am not a Sony fan boy at all, matter of fact I dislike their cameras as whole. But Sony down samples 6k to 4k video to improve sharpness and over all look of their video. Why can canon not do something like 3k to 2k (1080p) to improve the video quality. Even on my 80D 1080p just does not look as good as it should. IMHO.. I may be to picky.. IDK..


EDIT: Matter of fact if you use the video time-lapse option. The image quality that comes from it even though its 1080p is amazing..

 

[Valvebounce]

Hi AvTvM.
So you now have your single share in Canon and booked a place and a question at their next board meeting?
No point waiting for someone else! DIY.

Cheers, Graham.

Why did DPreview not ask questions about FF and in particular the 6D MKII

they are tame pussies, no real interviewers or journalists.
I would not conduct "interviews" with such people who don't say S___. Or I would at least not print it.
Actually, one should buy 1 Canon share, attend their stock holder meeting and really publicly grill these execs there. I'd have a question or 2 for them.

 

[Mikehit]

"We obviously have to look at the technical feasibility of it, cost-wise, as well as [the challenge of power consumption]. Those factors will tell us how we will introduce 4K technologies going forward.

That is the most ignorant answer anyone can expect from an executive of top photography equipment designer and manufaccturer in the world and the first company to implement 4k video shooting in a DSLR form (1DC) and especailly after 4 of their competitors (I know, I know, per canon and some people here there is no competition for the "Industry leader") offering 4K video capability in low cost consumer model cameras for a few years now.
He was talking about introducing 4K into every model. Not sure why his comment was 'ignorant' - or wsa it that it did not given the information you would like to have heard?

"the challenge of power consumption"

increase the battery size dumb asses and give us a kick ass camera. Some people will complain about the size and weight once they start using it all those complaints will vanish without a trace
So we hane you saying 'put in a bigger battery and AvTvM saying cameras have to be smaller or the company will go bust. I'llleave you two to swing your handbags... Meanwhile in the real world do you not think Canon have already thought of that problem

"We will continue to challenge and overcome these technical hurdles"

I wonder what the hell is that technical hurdle they are talking about in 2017
Try and find an interview that asks those questions instead of merely berating the extec.

"4K should compliment, rather than hinder"

Now it is up to this lunatics to figure out the 4K implementation in 1dxii and 5D4 is the hindrance or compliment
He made a statement of fact but your comment is coming across as a criticism - so what exactly are you criticising?


When asked about why no 4K HDMI out on the 5D4 canon's response was their design engineers did not had access to the HDMI 2.0 hardware when they designed the camera. It is as ignorant as the answers we have got now.
Why is that an 'ignorant answer'? He gave an honest qanswer so please tell me why it is ignorant

So I guess there are not enough 4K displays is a lame argument at this point.
You guess it is bad business to pile manufacturing costs into a functionality that only a small minority of people have the capability of using, not evn cosidering that the number who even care is even less.

Wow....just, wow...!

 

[Sharlin]

But I can not understand why they do not at least make the 1080p video sharper. I am not a Sony fan boy at all, matter of fact I dislike their cameras as whole. But Sony down samples 6k to 4k video to improve sharpness and over all look of their video. Why can canon not do something like 3k to 2k (1080p) to improve the video quality. Even on my 80D 1080p just does not look as good as it should. IMHO.. I may be to picky.. IDK..

EDIT: Matter of fact if you use the video time-lapse option. The image quality that comes from it even though its 1080p is amazing..

In timelapse mode they have all the time in the world to do full sensor readout and proper downsampling from 6000x4000. But when you're trying to flush the sensor 60 times per second, push that data to the processor and encode in real time the constraints are a bit tighter. Not sure whether it's thermal budget or bandwidth that's the bottleneck, but it's evidently not just about turning a sharpness knob somewhere.

 

[ExodistPhotography]

.......
In timelapse mode they have all the time in the world to do full sensor readout and proper downsampling from 6000x4000. But when you're trying to flush the sensor 60 times per second, push that data to the processor and encode in real time the constraints are a bit tighter. Not sure whether it's thermal budget or bandwidth that's the bottleneck, but it's evidently not just about turning a sharpness knob somewhere.

Correct, but yea "if" there is no bottle neck or thermal issues. Then I can not see why they can't or will not. The improved video could make many canon owners care a little less about 4k at least for the next few years.
It could be band width. Even on the 80D you can only do 1080 60p in IPB mode. ALL-I does not have the 60p option.