Yeah, the US and EU are pretty equalized... It's the UK that doesn't line up.
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More thoughts on the Canon EOS R1 and EOS R5 Mark II from Paris
- Thread starter Canon Rumors
- Start date
Does it matter? What matters is what we have to pay.
In the end, fact is, we pay lots more for the same product than a US customer who buys from B&H or Adorama.
And not a single chance to get Canon's reconditioned gear...
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Some have mentioned that one is with sales tax (VAT) and the other isn't. For example, here with state and local taxes, we end up paying 10.35% above the price, but there is more than that.
First, in the case of the EU, regulations require a longer minimum warrantee period than in the US. That extra warrantee time costs the company or regional distributor a not trivial sum and that has to be added to the price.
Additionally, since pretty much every market has to have some variety of localization including things like changing what is in the package based on both legally required and legally prohibited and customary accessories and on localized manuals and firmware there is an extra cost for each market. That total cost is pretty much the same in a market of 1.4 billion potential customers such as China and in very small markets such Hungary with less than ten million potential customers, Canon Hungary has cameras sold there with Hungarian documentation and Hungarian menu items in the firmware. Since no other countries use Hungarian that's a cost that has to be split by Hungarian sales.
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In addition to all the reasons listed that apply to the EU and the reasons for small localized markets, and the UK is a small, localized market being the only one using that particular version of English combined with UK specific regulations, there is also the "Brexit tax". Since the effects of Brexit on foreign manufacturers are still in flux and since the Pound is unusually fluid as a result of that, foreign vendors are all running higher prices in the UK to prevent a situation where the fluctuation means they either have to change prices monthly or risk selling below profitability.
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I do love that Canon lists operating temperature as 0-40°C for the R5 and 0-45°C for the R1.
Keeping batteries going at that temperature would be more troublesome. The advanced guide has the #shots drop a third from operating at 23C vs 0C let alone -35C!
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I will point out, for the benefit of those of us who spend time in Palm Springs, California in the Summer that both cameras (OK, to be fair pretty much every camera from every vendor) do not support using the camera outdoors, even in the shade, on hot days. We hit 50C a few days each year and this year hit 51C. (that's 124 in Fahrenheit)
To be fair, though, 40C (104F) is a potential real problem since that's a common summer temperature in a very large part of the world.
For those thinking this is not a real problem, I had two Kindles fail while reading with them in the shade. By fail, I mean die. Permanently. Amazon later updated their firmware to "correct" the limitation by putting in a warning and an automatic shut-down on overheat so at least the device didn't commit suicide.
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Loswr
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Yeah. Next, should we discuss the cost of medical care in our respective countries? (No, let’s not…the point is there are pluses and minuses in everything.)
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The 5 series as always been an all rounder. DR takes a minor hit offsetting AF/speed/video/heat management for the mark ii.
Given the increasing video/hybrid usage, then the mark ii is an excellent successor... until you see the price difference with the original R5. That becomes a different discussion.
For 5Div migrators, it will be a tough choice! R5+lens or R5ii. Nice to have choice though
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Since you brought it up.. For some reason (and taking into account social/welfare etc), the US spends dramatically more on health care than other OECD countries ie healthcare spend as % of GDP/per capita.
The only take away I can see is that someone is making a lot of money and doesn't always end up with better outcomes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_health_expenditure_per_capita
The cost of global travel insurance is separated into 2 geographies: global, and global minus USA/Nepal.
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It doesn't always appear to be the case that longer warranties = higher price though. If the product is good and Canon would know the return rate/cost very well per product then the extra cost for longer warranty is clear. There may not (and I don't know for sure) longer warranties in the US due to cost of favourable return policies and refurbished market
Canon Australia's 5 year warranty doesn't seem to add any additional cost ie our pricing follows in general the US ex-tax price with mid market currency conversion + Australian 10% GST and includes the extended warranty. Canon UK appears to be a prime target for grey market / parallel importing due to their higher prices. Grey market has basically disappeared from the Australian market.
EDIT: actually, the R5ii is cheaper in Australia cf the US at the moment!
USD4300 B&H
exchange rate of 0.66AUD = 1USD
AUD6515
AUD7150 including 10% GST
=> Canon Australia is AUD6700!
https://www.canon.com.au/cameras/eos-r5-mark-ii
Other retailers have pricing at AUD6440, AUD6470, AUD6500, etc
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Loswr
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Despite saying let’s not talk about it
what’s really going on is summed up by the old saying, ‘an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure’. You can substitute gram and kilogram if you like, though the canonical form is appropriate for our archaic system of weights and measures.With the single-payer systems used in the rest of the ‘developed’ world, people at all income levels have access to primary and preventative care. In the US, many people don’t, so problems that could be diagnosed and treated early instead progress to more severe disease and/or an emergency room visit.
But you’re also correct that people are profiting greatly from the US system, and it’s also true that a lot of money gets spent on lobbying to keep that profit flowing.
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I originally ordered the R5M2 but cancelled after the reports of the noise levels and DR not being any better than the R5 (which I have). I’ve used my wife’s R3 a few times and can easily hit 20k iso and not worry about how the photos look. Huge game changer for shooting indoor sports. So I decided to go with and purchased the R3. The focus tracking, auto focus, noise control and battery life are all better than the R5. It was cheaper than the R5M2 and honestly does everything I need it to do. I would recommend the R3. Canon is wasting their time putting upscaling and Denoise features in the camera. I just hope they don’t start baking that stuff into the files and turning everything into computational photography. I just want better auto focus and noise control in my camera sensor. I don’t need 120 photos per second. Talk about wasting a ton of time and energy to have to go thru all of those. 12 photos per second with mechanical shutter has done me just fine with sports photos. Even that can be a lot of work.
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I posted a reply on that thread. This was my R5 when shooting in Alaska in -40F weather. Not sure what happened to his camera.
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Well if you have business then it’s a little bit different the VAT gets reduced from the price.
I understand it is frustrating but then again we in Europe pay our health insurance/public education through that and a lot of other things that in the USA cost a lot.
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He lost all credibility with me the moment I saw he referred to having an Apple watch.
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Oh the LP-E19 ran at about 1/3 capacity... That was the first time I actually had to carry an extra battery... went through two in 3 hours one day. I did some video too though.
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Haha, well apparently it's very good as a smartwatch. However, It just might be the ugliest watch ever conceived. I can't believe anyone buys those Hermes straps for it. I gave up smartwatches (Samsung and Garmin) and just roll with a few G-Shocks...
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It was an odd product placement. How far he walked mattered to the story. That it wasn't a guess was to some degree. Inserting the brand name felt like it was about to be a 1950s TV ad:
"I walked 210 miles and slept five hours and forty-five minutes. Both measured by my new 2024 Apple Watch. Apple Watch, the brand you can trust when you need to know precisely. Available wherever Apple products are found. Now back to our story."
I suspect it was really just bragging but the only people who would care that he has a specific product are people who have that product and think that by buying that product they are suddenly special.
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I've got my fireproof suit on. But having gone from an R6 to an R5, just shooting maybe 10k frames in a weekend while covering a tournament, the data size and transfer/processing time is NOTICABLY longer on the R5. CRAW helps. Time taken for noise reduction which has to be applied at lower ISO levels than the R6 makes it longer too. And for most images, they end up on a phone screen or maybe as a webforum post or instagram. No value at all in the extra megapixels in most cases. I have found some value in grabbing a play across the field, and cropping it. But it has to be in an open field with no players in the foreground, and a guy like Cable isn't going to have the time to sort through, find and crop that stuff. Plus he can afford or borrow whatever glass he wants. For me, I do see there being an inflection point in MP - 45 too much, 20-24 just enough. Something in the the middle would be perfect.
I got the R3 from the rental house yesterday. Tournament this weekend. I'm excited to try it. I still have my R6 body, and used to used the upgrade cost of selling the R6 to buy an R3 is similar to selling my R5 to buy a new R5mk2. So we'll see if its worth doing either. I do like the feel of the R3 body, and have always wanted that pro style body. But will try and make the decision on performance.
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Loswr
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I had a Casio G-Shock in high school. In junior high, I had a Casio calculator watch that my math teacher made me take off during class because, as he put it, "When you're a grown up, you won't be walking around with a calculator on your wrist all the time." I guess I showed him. I'd say more on the subjects of watches and product placement, but my Apple Watch Series 5 in Space Black Stainless Steel with the matching Milanese Loop is telling me that I've been sitting on my ass for the past 50 minutes and need to get up and move around, so.........
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