Optimizing AF with the Canon 85mm 1.4L IS?

[YuengLinger]

I've been using Canon's newest 85mm for about six weeks now. I started out with it on my 5D III and was getting consistently great results, but, for the most part, I was using one-shot, single-point for subjects not moving much. My AFMA value on the 5D III is -3.

Then I started trying the lens with faster moving subjects, working my way up to kids running straight towards the lens, and this is where I started noting more missed focusing. Having watched Dustin Abbott's excellent AF review of the lens again, and just yesterday rereading the AF discussion by Bryan at TDP, I understand my experience is very close to theirs.

What surprises me though is the lower keeper rate on my 5D IV. Other lenses, such as the very quick focusing 24-70mm f/2.8L II and the 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS II work BETTER on the Mark IV, as expected. In fact, though I rarely attempted "action" with my (now sold) 85mm f/1.2L II, its AF was MUCH better on the Mark IV.

Another difference between the lens on the two bodies is the AFMA value. Not only are the absolute values different, but it seems on the 5D IV my values tend to "float" a bit. What I mean is sometimes -10 is right, other times -8 or even -7. I haven't seen this on other fast lenses, such as the 135mm f/2L or the 35mm f/1.4L II. Anybody familiar with shooting at f/1.4 knows that even a little bit front or back misses exquisitely sharp eyes, something I value highly in my portraits.

So that's my experience, and I'm hoping others who own this or other fast primes in the focal length range can share any insights or suggestions regarding best AF practices with such lenses. Brainstorming the different performance on 5D III vs IV is also hoped for here!

Thanks!

 

[Larsskv]

My experience with the 85 f1.4L for “action” is limited to street shooting of people in walking speed, and I have only used it paired with the 1DXII. My limited experience is that the AF performs better than any other L series prime lens I own (I do not own any super teles), for both still and moving subjects.

 

[Random Orbits]

I'm looking forward to seeing how the lens works for basketball this weekend. I've used the 35L II and that works well, but the focal length is too short, and yes, the zooms (including the 24-70 f/2.8 II) focus faster and more consistently than the primes. I know the hit rate will be significantly less than the 24-70, but the gym is lit primarily by skylights during the day, and last week it was cloudy, so my ISO reached 12800 at f/2.8 and around 1/250 s.

 

[YuengLinger]

I'm looking forward to seeing how the lens works for basketball this weekend. I've used the 35L II and that works well, but the focal length is too short, and yes, the zooms (including the 24-70 f/2.8 II) focus faster and more consistently than the primes. I know the hit rate will be significantly less than the 24-70, but the gym is lit primarily by skylights during the day, and last week it was cloudy, so my ISO reached 12800 at f/2.8 and around 1/250 s.

Good luck! Hope to see samples...!

 

[hne]

I've seen no reason to doubt the AF speed and accuracy of the 85/1.4L IS on a 5DmkIV. That said, the fastest thing I've tried has been a child on a bum slide, which probably doesn't reach more than 15 km/h at best. At MFD the lens can barely keep up, but I can't frame properly. Not with a 25kg mass travelling towards my knees at a speed of 15km/h.

 

[YuengLinger]

My problems with the 5D Mark IV and the 85mm 1.4L are not restricted to moving subjects. My combination of lens and body just don't seem to get along as well as I wish they would--even for a subject that is moving only a little. One or two shots will be fine, then a complete miss or two, then ok, then spot on. And not just at max aperture, but up to f/5.6! Compared to using with the 5D Mark III, kind of disappointing lately.

But I will continue to experiment with various settings, scenarios, etc.

 

[Deleted member 91053]

Have you tried turning the IS off?

IS slows down the initial AF lock and impairs tracking on all my current and past IS lenses which is why I don't use it anymore.

If you are not using IS then ignore this post.

 

[jd7]

Another difference between the lens on the two bodies is the AFMA value. Not only are the absolute values different, but it seems on the 5D IV my values tend to "float" a bit. What I mean is sometimes -10 is right, other times -8 or even -7. I haven't seen this on other fast lenses, such as the 135mm f/2L or the 35mm f/1.4L II.

It would be surprising if the absolute AFMA values were the same on two bodies, of course, but if your AFMA values are consistent on your 5D3 but inconsistent on your 5DIV, maybe it would be worth getting your 5DIV checked out by Canon? Is it still under warrranty by any chance? I guess if your 135L and 35L II are not showing the same problem, that suggests the 5DIV is OK, but at the same time if your 85 1.4L is fine on your 5D3, it does seem to point to an issue with the 5DIV at least when used with the 85 1.4L.

Hope you manage to get it sorted out.

 

[Viggo]

I use the 85 IS with the 1dx2 and have struggled with kids bum sliding like described above. It’s not as epic AF as the 35 L II by any means, but I find it kind of different for different scenarios. I find it to track very well and infinitely better than the 85 f1.2 and the 1.8, but with sudden changes in speed or in overcast weather it’s not top notch.

I recently posted a thread about snowy weather and tracking and I struggle compared to the 35 and 200 f2 I used to have, different types of lenses and most importantly price, but some times I feel the 85 should be better.

If someone can share their AF settings for different scenarios that works I’ll be very thankful ;D

 

[YuengLinger]

I use the 85 IS with the 1dx2 and have struggled with kids bum sliding like described above. It’s not as epic AF as the 35 L II by any means, but I find it kind of different for different scenarios. I find it to track very well and infinitely better than the 85 f1.2 and the 1.8, but with sudden changes in speed or in overcast weather it’s not top notch.

I recently posted a thread about snowy weather and tracking and I struggle compared to the 35 and 200 f2 I used to have, different types of lenses and most importantly price, but some times I feel the 85 should be better.

If someone can share their AF settings for different scenarios that works I’ll be very thankful ;D

Thanks, V, I was hoping you'd share!

 

[Larsskv]

I use the 85 IS with the 1dx2 and have struggled with kids bum sliding like described above. It’s not as epic AF as the 35 L II by any means, but I find it kind of different for different scenarios. I find it to track very well and infinitely better than the 85 f1.2 and the 1.8, but with sudden changes in speed or in overcast weather it’s not top notch.

I recently posted a thread about snowy weather and tracking and I struggle compared to the 35 and 200 f2 I used to have, different types of lenses and most importantly price, but some times I feel the 85 should be better.

If someone can share their AF settings for different scenarios that works I’ll be very thankful ;D

Hmm... I haven’t experienced any issues with the 85L f1.4, but struggle a bit with the consistency when using off center focusing points, when using my 35LII, even on still subjects.

 

[Nelu]

I'm looking forward to seeing how the lens works for basketball this weekend. I've used the 35L II and that works well, but the focal length is too short, and yes, the zooms (including the 24-70 f/2.8 II) focus faster and more consistently than the primes. I know the hit rate will be significantly less than the 24-70, but the gym is lit primarily by skylights during the day, and last week it was cloudy, so my ISO reached 12800 at f/2.8 and around 1/250 s.

I just shot a couple of High School basketball games and my hit rate is around 40-50% on a Canon 5D Mark IV.
I think the lens works really well (my AFMA is -6) but it can struggle with players running directly to you at close distance.
Other than that, I love how bright, clean and sharp the images are!
My settings are: T= 1/1000s, A=1.4, ISO between 2000 and 3200.

I also used the lens for volleyball, which is way harder to shoot that basketball, with a very good success rate.

 

[YuengLinger]

Hi suspect that some of my problems, especially the completely out of focus shots in between good ones, might be coming from my fingers slightly turning the focus ring. I'm trying now to find a grip that holds the lens steady but doesn't result in my fingers moving the ring.

Also, I think my expectations might have been a bit high.

As for having more problems on the 5D Mark 4, is it possible the AF system is too fast for the optical elements to keep up with? Could the older, slower AF system on the 5D III be a better match?

 

[Nelu]

Hi suspect that some of my problems, especially the completely out of focus shots in between good ones, might be coming from my fingers slightly turning the focus ring. I'm trying now to find a grip that holds the lens steady but doesn't result in my fingers moving the ring.

Also, I think my expectations might have been a bit high.

As for having more problems on the 5D Mark 4, is it possible the AF system is too fast for the optical elements to keep up with? Could the older, slower AF system on the 5D III be a better match?

I recommend using the back-button focus and following the subject at all times. Also, for focusing I would suggest either 4 AF point expansion or 8 AF point expansion, as suggested here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0i2_CHhp9Q4
Nelu