Why does 7D II seem COMPARATIVELY soft with certain lenses?

[Jack Douglas]

Thanks takesome1,

That is precisely what I'll now have to start learning because it's critical to success with action shots.

Do you happen to recall a discussion relating to optimal settings for a 1D Mark IV relative to BIF?

Jack

 

[Jack Douglas]

A few weeks back I downloaded the 7D II AF-Settings Guidebook and I have to say Canon knew there would be challenges with such a sophisticated AF system, and have done a pretty good job addressing the issue. It's almost overwhelming. This AF should be simply amazing if issues are sorted out. It is being sorted out with the 7D II so it doesn't cause embarrassment when it appears in a 1DX II or 5D IV - no??

Jack

 

[dolina]

Jack, another thread cited a video as to the decline of cameras.

Too complicated and not fun as compared to those found on smartcameras.

If I wasn't shooting wildlife and sports I would not bother with this body.

 

[Jack Douglas]

Jack, another thread cited a video as to the decline of cameras.

Too complicated and not fun as compared to those found on smartcameras.

If I wasn't shooting wildlife and sports I would not bother with this body.

Self inflicted punishment isn't it? We collectively keep demanding higher technical standards, suggesting that previous cameras are not good enough, so with sophistication comes complexity. When one is 20, you thrive on it, but everyone ages and by 65 or 70 this complexity starts to become a burden.

This is why I've struggle with my conundrum - I love my 6D in all respects except it's restrictive AF relative to action and I didn't really want to be finding myself packing around double the camera weight in a 1D IV, but here I go. Guess I'll adapt.

Jack

 

[dolina]

Self inflicted punishment isn't it? We collectively keep demanding higher technical standards, suggesting that previous cameras are not good enough, so with sophistication comes complexity. When one is 20, you thrive on it, but everyone ages and by 65 or 70 this complexity starts to become a burden.

This is why I've struggle with my conundrum - I love my 6D in all respects except it's restrictive AF relative to action and I didn't really want to be finding myself packing around double the camera weight in a 1D IV, but here I go. Guess I'll adapt.

Jack

In my case I am moving towards a fixed lens compact camera with a large sensor.


Leica X (Typ 113) by alabang, on Flickr

I have the 5D Mark II and skipped the Mark III (incompatibility with 1 important lens) but after watching the video and thinking of what I want to do I am "soft" in wanting a Mark IV if one were to come out August.

To put things in perspective here are the sales figures of 2014

1.5 billion smartphones
40 million dedicated cameras covering point and shoot, MILC and DSLRs.

 

[NancyP]

Well, yes. The phone has taken over the snapshot business for those who would be satisfied with a single focal length - most of the camera market - the equivalent of the Brownie and Instamatic users of the past. People who buy cameras are now hobbyists. Prestige technologic goods now are the absolute latest version of phones and tablets.

 

[Jack Douglas]

For sure and they most likely didn't even consider the camera in purchasing the phone and may never use it so in some ways this comparison does not really prove much.

Now if there are statistics on actual numbers of photographs taken, that would be more useful in identifying who is actually using the phone as a camera specifically for that purpose and in a meaningful way. Then again, does it really matter.

A relative (he's a lawyer) not too long ago suggested I should get an iphone because of its photographic image quality and that's after receiving many emails from me that included various bird/animal/nature shots such as I've posted on CR. He's passed me some photos that I have no problem acknowledging as "nice".

I didn't reply other than to say his phone was wonderful. I still get the biggest grin whenever I think of him and his wonderful camera and it doesn't phase me in the least.

FWIW.

Jack

 

[dolina]

Per same video I watched claims that flickr receives more than 180,000 images every 60 mins.

As for stats on smartphones here you go.

http://petapixel.com/2015/02/12/importance-cameras-smartphone-war/

Worldwide 2 billion people who uses smartphones in 2014.

92% use them to take photos.

80% of these people send their photos

Deciding factor on buying a smartphone.

36% tend to buy based on quality of camera.

 

[Jack Douglas]

Can't argue with those numbers, that's significant. I guess the next question would be, how do the photos stack up in competition? No doubt very well with respect to the spontaneity and quick access and convenience. Seems so "in contrast" to a 1DX with a big fat lens, for sure.

Jack

 

[WillThompson]

Simply put soft lenses.

 

[dolina]

A friend of mine noticed an iPhone was used in a winning photo for the World Press Photo Contents

http://petapixel.com/2015/02/17/breakdown-cameras-captured-winning-images-world-press-photo-2015/

He showed fear that his EF system will become obsolete.

It is a given that any technology will become obsolete. Some takes longer than others.

Samsung, Sony, Nikon and Panasonic are making smartphones with beefier cameras. I expect Canon to do the same sooner rather than later.

 

[Jack Douglas]

Won't say more since this really should be another thread but who can argue with a cell phone being the handiest pocket camera and the one that will be available to anyone during a riot.

The question is more, is this going to suffice for more specialty shots such as our birds. In my mind the 6D is big enough and I chose it over the 5D III at the time for that reason and still am pleased with that choice. However I now own the 1D IV for when I head to Haida Gwaii. I will not be using a cell phone for photos.

Jack

 

[privatebydesign]

Won't say more since this really should be another thread but who can argue with a cell phone being the handiest pocket camera and the one that will be available to anyone during a riot.

The question is more, is this going to suffice for more specialty shots such as our birds. In my mind the 6D is big enough and I chose it over the 5D III at the time for that reason and still am pleased with that choice. However I now own the 1D IV for when I head to Haida Gwaii. I will not be using a cell phone for photos.

Jack

Welcome to the 1 series club Jack. Used 1 series cameras are insanely good value when compared to the price of the 'newest', 'bestest' bodies.

 

[Jack Douglas]

privatebydesign, thanks, that's a most welcome "reassurance" since I remain tentative about it being the correct choice. It sure has a few features that I'll love and does "feel", well, just unique. Also, it seems they are good value right now, at least mine was financially the best choice. I guess based on the update cycle the 1DX came in shortening the 1D IV cycle, so many 1D IV's are not as "used" as say 7D's for example and the technology is a little more up to date. I'll have more thoughts on this as I get used to it for those that are interested. I won't have the 7D II for comparison though.

Jack

 

[BobAaron]

I have both the 7D and the 7dii. I had the 7D for nearly a year and the 7Dii was supposed to be an upgrade for me.
Both cameras were set to the same exact settings (or as close as possible given that the shutter speeds have slight variations, etc.). I was shooting horse races using both the 70-200mm f/2.8 L IS II and the 3oomm f/2.8 L IS prime lens. On day one I used the 7D and 7Dii with the 70-200 lens alternating cameras one race after the other. On day two I alternated cameras race by race using the 300mm. RESULTS: Both the 7D and 7Dii shot identical quality shots using the 70-200mm. Using the 300mm prime lens, only the 7D shot in-focus shots one after the other. Nearly every shot taken by the 7dii was blurry. I spent a solid week testing and retesting. Same results.

There is something inherently wrong with here. Compatibility issues? Maybe? I sent the 7Dii back to B+H which honored their 30-day return policy.

Now my search for an upgrade to the 7D continues. I thought the 7Dii would be that upgrade but it turned out to be a huge disappointment!

 

[DominoDude]

I have both the 7D and the 7dii. I had the 7D for nearly a year and the 7Dii was supposed to be an upgrade for me.
Both cameras were set to the same exact settings (or as close as possible given that the shutter speeds have slight variations, etc.). I was shooting horse races using both the 70-200mm f/2.8 L IS II and the 3oomm f/2.8 L IS prime lens. On day one I used the 7D and 7Dii with the 70-200 lens alternating cameras one race after the other. On day two I alternated cameras race by race using the 300mm. RESULTS: Both the 7D and 7Dii shot identical quality shots using the 70-200mm. Using the 300mm prime lens, only the 7D shot in-focus shots one after the other. Nearly every shot taken by the 7dii was blurry. I spent a solid week testing and retesting. Same results.

There is something inherently wrong with here. Compatibility issues? Maybe? I sent the 7Dii back to B+H which honored their 30-day return policy.

Now my search for an upgrade to the 7D continues. I thought the 7Dii would be that upgrade but it turned out to be a huge disappointment!

Ok, so since you've done such thorough testing I'm sure you have a few test shots to show us the effects you are seeing.
All lenses had been properly AFMA'ed to the bodies, right?

 

[Jack Douglas]

Although it would take some effort, I agree it would be most helpful to see some of the comparative examples. Sometimes things that are hard to believe are true but the average person doesn't have quite that much faith as to not want proof. The photo shop I visited recently and asked about their experiences were indicating no negative customer feedback even when I pressed the issue, not that that proves too much.

Jack

 

[tron]

Marsu42, I think I've probably read most of the threads and it was still hard to make the decision, that is until the price was right. That really helped but still this keeps going around in my head. What is so challenging is user versus camera and personal biases. You'd like to trust a given person's judgment/ability but you never know for sure, although certain folk are very experienced, unbiased and trustworthy so .......

Jack

Jack,

I have both the 1D IV and the 7D II.
Go back to your cropping thread for birds. That is what it comes down to.

With the 7D II when it hits you will have a super sharp image that you can crop tighter with greater detail. It adds a bit to that ability. It will give you a bit more sharpness to work with than the 1D IV.

With the 1D IV you will have a body with an AF system that hardly misses. Your little flying bird, it will be easier to get this pic with the 1D IV. If you miss the shot with the 7D II, how much resolution does the 7D II have? It has none.

I took the 7D II out this weekend, I had one situation presented itself with a running bird that I wish I had the 1D IV.
The 7D II missed and it would have been the shot of the day. But for the rest of the day the 7D II did just fine.

This is really useful information. Do you have an opinion of 5D3 in comparison with 7DII and 1DIV for birds in flight? That would be very interesting for me to know.

Because of the frame rate I never considered the 5D III for BIF. That is why I never bought it over the 1D IV.
I have an opinion, which is the 1D IV would be better because of frame rate. From what I have read I believe the 5D III would track very well. Probably not on par with the 1Dx but close.

Thanks for answering. Not being a pro I was thinking the 7DII for cases where I am FL limited. But for now I will stick to my 5DIIIs and save money for the next iteration.

 

[BobAaron]

I tested the two cameras last month. I saved no images.

What does AFMA mean???

 

[DominoDude]

"AFMA" can mean roughly: You get what you deserve, if you don't read the manual properly.

Don't blame the camera. Or the lens.