Wishlist or Real?
A new spec list for the upcoming 1D appeared in my in mailbox. This is from a 50/50 source.
Specifications
16mp FF
DIGIC V (Dual)
10fps
61AF Points (Somewhere around 20 selectable)
100% ViewFinder
3″ VGA LCD (It’s mentioned OLED is a possibility, it exists in test cameras)
SD/CF Slot
1080p Movie (24p, 25p, 30p)
New Lighter Battery
Ergonomic Changes (2nd Joy Stick Type Controller)
CR’s take
That’s a lot of AF points, that’s what makes me thing it’s a wishlist. We have yet to receive a solid (with proof) spec list.
cr
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Would be great but there does seem to be a few too many great things on that list.
Still we can all wish can’t we?
Nooooooooooooooo…… :-)
is there still any chance to see 25P on the 5D mark II??
i m still very frustrated!!!!
The Neutral Observer will believe this when he sees it.
Only 10fps? FF? No direct print buttons?
Sounds like absolutely perfect camera for me!
Hone to be true!
If this is real.. man o man, that would be great. What are the chances Canon next week will also announce the new and long rumored 35 mm/1.4LII?
This camera with 24LII and 35LII.. s w e e t !
Now.. that would make a very appealing ‘do everything’ camera!
FF wide, sports camera speed! And a promise of bleeding edge ISO and AF!!
Wow… if I can afford it,it would make for a fantastic ‘do all’ replacement for my 5dii! …*yikes…!*
Oh please let it be true. This spec list actually sounds reasonable and has all the major requirements.
But Canon, seriously I am disappointed. Where is the espresso machine?
If this is true then why in the world would the 7D specs be 2mp more and only 2fps less for less then half the price.
All these sources are mixing up which camera is which IMO.
Thats the reason that Canon will move APS-H sensor type to 7D body, and making 1D a FF Sport Camera, while 7D will be entry level sports camera.
5D2 – > 1Ds
7D – > 1D
Sounds perfect to me.
what would one of these set me back in australian dollars?
stfu already
I’ll buy that camera the day it hits the shelves.
> 16mp FF
> 10fps
> 100% ViewFinder
That’s enough for me. The rest is icing.
> 1080p Movie (24p, 25p, 30p)
I can live without video, but if Canon is finally recognising that not everyone lives in NTSC-land, that is certainly interesting (but doubtful, and it’s that that makes me doubt this is more than just a wish-list).
I agree with Nino. Things seem pretty confused and hyper hectic. 16 MP FF just doesn’t make sense for 2 Digic V processors and a “state of the art” camera. A lot of talk was previously about a 16 MP 1.3 crop. Some who have apparently been correct in the past have indicated 1.3 is what the 1D4 will be.
Maybe this is correct? I don’t think so. I think it will either be 1.3 and 16 MP or 18 MP and FF.
2 Joystick Controllers? That will take a while to learn to do fast!
portrait orientation joystick wouth be a JOY!
61 AF points? Doesn’t that sound a little.. Prime?
Not that I know much about the Canon 1D series AF system, but wouldn’t this make a strange AF point arrangement…
I could be looking at this from a completely wrong perspective, of course.
Hi
No. We need a APS H Crop Sports MKxx. FF is good for the Ds MKxx and for 5D.
This MKx is not real, it’s a fake:)
br
#934 @Ben
Awesome camera if true. I’ll pre-order as soon as it’s announce by Canon.
But, what makes me think it’s fake is the new battery. The current battery system would have just lastest 1 generation? If so, I’m glad I didnt buy any MKIII camera because I would need to buy new batteries again :(
that because everyone was saying how good is the 51 focus point of nikon, and how bad is the 9 point ONLY xxD & xD focus system, they forget Canon has that too in the 1D series, now if Canon have 61 point to be obvious to notice, I think nikon will come out with 91 points to please nikofan and they say we have more red boxes in the view finder.
And AF with 61 points seems possible. If you take the actual 45 points and add a complete row of new point outside the elipse, it would probably put the AF around 61 points.
1080p Movie (24p, 25p, 30p)…
dual DIGIC V…
and no 50p ????
To Good to be true
that actually makes alot of sense.
canon could have trialled many different sensors .. the rumours can / may always be quite varied .. but for the most part.. I believe (IMO) if i recall .. that the 1Ds and 1D shared for the most part the same guts including mirror box, etc between the two ..
Dual DIGIC IV would handle around 140Mp/sec (14bit), however, by convention .. a single DIGIC V going by speed jumps with DIGIC *should* be able to handle 150Mp/sec .. still not enough for 10 fps at 14 bit ..
also I doubt that canon would settle for 10 fps ..
they would by all stretches of the imagination want the title of “worlds fastest SLR” back.
Best comment yet!
+1 what nino said!
yea it does!
Hopefully that would be it! Then there is no use for the rumored 3D anymore :p
The spec of FF is significant as this would mean the redesign of the shutter and mirror mechanisms, flapping and whining with 30% larger mechanical pieces. The big advantage is that spreading 16MP over the FF sensor would lead to better Hi ISO performance… As to frame rate, if you need over 10 fps then you need Video at 24-30 fps…
Canon really needs to move from mirrors and mechanical shutters, and go full electronic shutter and viewfinder… JimW
“Bizarre”, the other sources on the net I have seen are talking about APS-H sensor…instead of FF…but the same spec list except for the speed…I have heard more 11-12 fps with 1,3 croped sensor than 10 FF…A prototype was being given to the agencies at the beginning of the year, they signed a NDA for that. I sincerly doubt the FF option…what for? Sport and bird proshooter are all praising the 1.3 focal length factor…
Plus, due to the, not-so-dumb calculation from other people (see 7D rumors comments) on the processing capability of Digic 3, 4 it is odd… Digic 3 has a rough calculation throughput of 50-55 Mp / sec (that’s why 1ds Mk3 has two to ensure 5 fps of 21Mp), while the Digic 4 has globally 95 Mp/sec (computed from 50D, 5D II…). It’s logic to double the throughput of a chip while upgrading it to next gen.
My guess : Digic 5 might not double the throughput but only multiply it by 1.5 or 1.6 as it would be insanely quick and powerfull so, a real battery eater…and having two digic 4 once the volume made it drop per price/unit is plausible…but then… I don’t see the utility of two digic IV. So : We can take for granted that no matter what the sensor is, it will be more than 10 Mp…and given the pixel density of 50D it could be at least 15 or 16 MP on an APS-H. 1D has to be quick and trump nikon and their surprise D3 with nearly 10fps…So maybe the “true” sport camera should be more…topping the opponent is not enough so I bet for 11 or 12 fps to really keep away Nikon.
So…Even at 10 fps which is a minimum, 15 or 16 MP will represent 150 or 160 Mp to put through each second…clearly outside of Digic 4…but could be within the range og digic 5. Remember that Digic 4 was issued right after the 1ds mark 3…And remember that having an Intel core 2 duo at 2.2Ghz and have the same cpu at let’s say 4 Ghz…is not the same thing, nor eats the same current. Keep in mind that you can have intel core 2 quad core instead of core 2 dual core…So it’s not because compact may share the same generation of embedded computing unit as the DSLR, that your compacts digic 4 has the same power…Embedded computing unit in video or image device are THE secret potion of any picture circuit, and by secret I mean secret. Now it must be kind a proprietary fashion of ARM model I don’t know(with a lot of parrallel processing units, like a GPU in computers). But for sure, any other version of the digic could handle at least 150 Mp/sec. So why two (if the information is true), I bet for more than that, the info could be partially wrong, the digic 5 ready, and canon embed two Digic 4 because of the low price (Digic 5 in early developpments needs volume to decrease the unit price, and rentabilize the conception…) High end is no volume, that’s why we will see digic 5 on a potential Mass selling camera (not pro for now). It is my take, but I’d rather say 11 or 12 fps at 15 or 16 Mp and potentially more fps (difficult) or more pixel (possible). Two digic 4 must be around 180-190 Mp /sec of throughput. Using only 150 could be quite a waste (engineering joke).
No comments on the sensors size except my precedent position… We have seen Canon reply to the huge popular demand of manual control for 5D2…I hope they will reply to the same 24P demand…and given to this, I don’t see Canon turning back to the huge support of APS-H (speed, tele ratio…) from Pro Shooters…
Okay, another long post from me ! (Makes easy to spot my post recently).
Good evening to everybody
There was also another set of rumored specs for the 7D that put it at 12Mp – this would make more sense if it was a cropped sensor built for speed… we’ll see.
Give me one AF point that works over 61 that don’t.
Where are the ISO specs??
I agree. The new battery sounds suspicious.
I hate you
Looks like it could be true this time, but I have to agree that 10 fps actually seems kind of slow. D3 is capable of 11 fps in dx mode and that’s a two year old product.
Rest of the specs looks nice.
No Swivel Screen ??!?!?!!! that’s a no go for me
;-)
These specs sound fishy too me. It sounds like a wish list. It doesn’t mention the possible ISO settings at all. As a wildlife photographer, that is the my important criteria. I want 14bit depth as dark as I can get, at 10 fps. As far as the 1.3 crop, I am fine with it.
Does anyone know if Canon could make a really wide lens that could fit on an APS-H body? Something like an 8-16mm? Is there some physical limitation? Wouldn’t that fix all the folks that to shot wide?
Dodgy on this one. Why is this CR2? What previous rumor has this source gotten partially right before? I doubt Canon would stick with the 19selectable + 26non-selectable AF points logic design with their new AF layout. Nikon has all 51pts. selectable, and the previous Mk.I & IIs have all 45pts. selectable, none of this silly 19+26 fancy distinction that only highlights the fact that the AF CPU used can’t handle all 45pts. to be user-selectable.
Canon, just give us all-cross-type 45AF pts., with ECF to boot!!! Nikon can have their mere 15 cross-type pts. bunched in the center of their 51-pt. ellipse. =P
Thank you ~ You are about the only person who writes posts worth reading. A thoughtful analysis and a break-down of points and supporting reasoning.
So nice to not have another “NO WAY it cantz be truez!” or “OMG!!! I LOVE IT! I HOPE IT is for realz!”
So thank you, sir.
I thought the rumors said dual DIGIC V?
In any case, the rumored specs sounds more like someone’s wish list. Zero credibility for me.
canon does not make any such lens. the widest you can get from canon is the 14mm prime, otherwise the 16-35mm wide angle zoom. an 8-16mm for an EF mount would be ludicrously sized and also have major optical compromises.
sigma currently produces a 12-24mm for the EF mount that is the widest the 1.3x crop can get. however, as with all sigmas, you’re getting wildly erratic quality control and major softness shot anywhere near wide open — still, its a pretty awesome field of view on a FF, and still an ultrawide on a 1.3x crop
> 2 Joystick Controllers? That will take a while to learn to do fast!
Portrait and landscape orientation, possibly? That would be very nice.
What if the dual Digic V provides the necessary additional horsepower for real-time in camera processing that current Canons are unable to perform?
Like advanced noise reduction, in-camera HDR, sharpening, auto-contrast, auto lighting optimiser so that we can get quality jpegs straight out of the camera that many PJs and wedding photographers need? Currently, we see that out-of-camera jpegs are better from Nikon compared to Canon.
Imagine a camera that can produce jpegs that are as good as RAW conversions and perform the necessary conversions and calculations at high speed. Many pros would welcome that. I know several Nikon pros who switched from Canon, citing one of their reasons as Nikon providing better out-of-camera quality pics.
We’d also have faster previews, faster live view, faster AF during live view, etc…
Me thinks you can’t have too much processing power. :)
Bring on the Digic Vs!
ISO settings can be easily extrapolated:
Base ISO: still 100 (none of that Nikon-style cheating by using ISO200 as base ISO so they can claim native ISO3200 & 6400), up to ISO 6400 native. Boosted ISOs: Hi1=12800, Hi2=25600, (and, if they feel they need to 1-up Nikon who introduced ISO12800 & 25600 first), Hi3=51200 (no matter if all pics taken at Hi3 look like watercolor paintings of tiny XMas lights :P). Pulled ISOs: Lo1=50, (and maybe) Lo2=25.
I’ve been watching the tennis tournaments on the road to the US Open. I have personally witnessed three complaints to the chair ump about the excessive noise coming from the press photo stockade. Djokovich, Serena Williams, and Sharapova all explained that during play they are hearing camera noises with louder than usual shutters. The TV commentators thought these were odd protests since the distance from the press pool to the players has not changed.
Faster, louder, or both?
“canon could have trialled many different sensors”
LOL! Do you have the slightest idea what the preparations for the production of a IC – which of course have to be made more or less regardless of the amount of actual pieces produced – cost?
Yes, it does make a lot of sense.
Then I guess the specs of the 7D will be a bit lower. (2 fps slower is alright if the MP is lower… like 15mp in APS-H for awesome low light performance)
or 14mp maybe?
if the rest of the stuff is true, it might actually make more sense that there’s a new battery, this thing could be a major processing power hog
sounds great, I would buy this over the 5D MII.
That is interesting. Any idea why there would be these complaints all of a sudden? Or is this a common complaint?
with all that great feature, still some people complaining something. :)
Well said.
Soon the entire viewfinder will be swamped with AF points. LOL
The commentators thought the complaint was very unusual. What’s very interesting is that the women play in Toronto, while the men’s tournament was in Cincinnati. So you have two different venues with the exact same complaint, 2-3 days apart, and a seemingly rare complaint at that.
Please, no more silly Direct Print comments…
Maybe the second joy stick is the reason why the on off switch is on that one photo from the 7d on the left top corner
No matter how wide you make the lens, those with crop cameras will always be unable to take advantage of the lens’s capabilities compared to a FF. No matter which way you look at it, FF with in-camera crop options is the best of both worlds. Why doesn’t Canon follow Nikon’s lead? Or is that one of the reasons for the dual Digic V?
Just a silly wishlist. 1D series are APS-H, 1 DS are FF. Canon changes the model when they change a sensor size.
I do expect some sort of provision for GPS though, its a feature that PJ’s want
Will be double the price of a 5DMK2!
“Hi3 look like watercolor paintings of tiny XMas lights :P”
Thats very funny!
Yeah the price!
agreed.
instead of seeing the photo through the lens, all you see is red boxes completely covering the entire viewfinder, making it impossible to see through it.
lol. would love to see that happen. i think it’ll be kind of hilarious.
As much as I’d love this to be real it sounds like a wishlist. the dual Digic V blows it for me, Canon never introduces new processors on a flagship camera, and for good reason, they haven’t been fully tested until they’ve been put in the field in lower end models. besides, dual digic IV should be able to give you 16 MP 10 fps, so… what’s the point?
At least something that mounts on the hot shoe.
Wrong!
1st – There will be NO MORE APS-H
2nd – 1D > 3D
1Ds > 5D
The “7D” as it is rumored at the moment will be the 3D and the real 7D will replace the 60D next year.
That is an information I got from two 3D-Testers.
hmmmmm no gps-tracker??
Definately. These specs make more sense than previous spec-ulations. Not sure about the focus points but given the AF bashing the 1D3 got maybe…
I don’t think the women should be allowed to complain about “noise” with the amount of blood-curdling screaming they do…
If the 1D4 has 25p, which I kinda doubt and it makes me think this is a wish list, than I’d think a firmware update for the 5D2 would be coming with 25p…interesting none of the DSLR-like video manufacturers have 25p.
?
The 1Dv (film) is FF and can do 10fps. It is also very old and technology is probably much improved when it comes to mirrors and mechanical shutters
are you a photographer… or a truck driver?
i would love to get this camera.
in fact i probably would if this were true… hopefully with the same (or simular) price point as the when the other 1D’s came out.
Man, i just want a new camera. I have lenses waiting for it!
Considering the sports photography needs, a 1.3 crop wouldn’t be bad at all…
the extra reach with the 70-200L and 300L will make nice pics..
and if using the APC-H sensor means faster frame rate, it would make the dream camera for sport photographers.
More like a 10-20 for a 13-26 equivalent.
ideally, a 10-27 for a 13-35 equivalent.
That would be awesome.
TEH threadwinner p0st is j00.
The 1D4 would have much better AF, weather sealing & superb durability, faster fps by 2 may not seem like much but it would also have much longer sustained max fps in RAW shooting. PJ’s are very hard on cameras and expect them to make it through war-zones and keep working in situations a 5D or 7D would die so there’s no real competition between a 1D4 and a fast FF 7D. Pros will get the 1D4 at twice the price, maybe a 7D for light backup.
the 25p makes me think wish-list too
you are correct, they dont test different sensors, they come up the specs they want, the engineering dept tells them what they can give them, it goes into pre-production and they build some cameras at various levels of firmware programming where the camera gets dialed in until it hits production quality – so the only thing really getting “tested” in the field is the firmware.
You stud!
10 fps is incredibly fast, considering a physical shutter that must open and close at that rate, and a mirror that must change directions twice as many times. If you need much faster, use a movie mode.
it’s been a well known rumour that canon field tests many different cameras and tells the pros trailing them, that this may not be what is in the production body.
that’s been mentioned many many many different times.
how do you think they figure out if certain sensors work “in the field” versus on paper? by luck? chance?
so could canon create limited runs of sensors? yes.
heck, it’s their own fab plant.
next statement?
If Canon could get the to rule of thirds with AF points, that would be a step in the right direction
I love looking directly through the lens. EVF sucks in comparison. I use the liveview for video because I have to and it would be a major downgrade to have only that like a GH1. As for the redesign of the mirror, the 1Ds already has it, so what’s the big deal? Even if they redesigned it from the ground up, so what? Canon could do that no problem, and they already have given they made a film 35mm camera…
WAY BACK IN 1972!!!
The F1 High Speed did 9 frames per second.
In 1984 Canon made an even faster 14 fps F-1 High Speed with pellicle mirror!
So all this nonsense about it being “too difficult” for Canon to make a high speed full frame camera because of the mirror box is just silly given they could make them as far back as 1972!
Nikon D700?
keep in mind that 16.9Mp .. is the same equiv pixel density as the Mark III .. simply FF versus APS-H.
Full Frame makes no sense for a sports shooter camera, APS-H (1.3) does.
should caveat the D3 .. that is without any AF, and no metering.
I also wouldn’t be surprised if this purported IV has a faster FPS mode in liveview.
Check the bottom of the press release on the Canon Australia site.
Canon needs to make a 12-24 f/4 as a grown-up of the 10-22 EF-s lens, for the 1.3 crop cameras.
and may i ask, why is that?
+1
plus one my friend
wow… i think i just j***ed myself
Back in the day, it used to cost about US$1m to get to “tape-out”: R&D, design, prototyping, layout, etc. Once you spent your million, and spent more tooling up, you were ready to *start* manufacture of samples.
If I had to test lots of alternative sensor photosite designs, I’d simulate them in software first, pick the best candidates and bung them all on one chip–a really small chip with just a cluster of each type of photosite on it. A photosite doesn’t care about the aesthetics of a scene you point it at, it just captures a few photons. My test sensor would never see the inside of a camera, or even the light of day. I strap it to a lab bench, shine a torch at it, check my oscilloscope and pick the best photosite design. After that, I’d make my real sensor and start tweaking the firmware.
Of course, there’s more to it than just the photosites….
I wonder how much this Mark IV (with this spec) cost….
+100
good point, the 25p makes it seem like a wish list too
Dont assume extra reach due to crop. It is a mistake.
if 1d is FF, what are the chances of 7d be a apsh wich accept EF and EFS lens?
“Canon changes the model when they change a sensor size”????
20D -> 30D same sensor size
APS-H is dead. It was the bomb when it came out, but Canon has to start competing and that sensor can’t compete with FF competition so Canon will not release a 1D4 camera that’s already not as good as the D3.
MOAR!
I may even buy more than one of these if true- perfect camera spects.
give me 61 points that work over 1
hmmm i would like to see the update to the 24-70 come out soon as well… i want that baby.
It wouldn’t replace my 5D2 except for sports/wildlife/bad weather, but it would be a nice 2nd body for everything else.
Hell, the 5D II is loud enough to wake the dead. Way louder than the 1Ds and 1D bodies. Maybe they just heard the 5Ds.
what crack are you on?
The 7D will not be a tough pro camera, nor will it have anywhere near as good an AF, while the 7D would sell like hot cakes, it will not impact 1D4 sales to the pros it is intended for.
It makes no sense for Canon to move an outdated sensor format to compete with FF competition.
you’re an ——> idiot <——
Nikon has invisible auto focus points that only light up once you are focused. i wouldn’t see that as a problem.
Why? There were entirely new batteries from the Ds 1, to the DsII to the DsIII…
Auuuggh! Just bring on the darn new cameras. All these specs seem all messed up. C’mon Canon — just show us what you got! And please do it tomorrow, not Sept 1st. The suspense is killing me!
Interesting. Not sure I buy the 3D or why they would reverse the pecking order from 1Ds high rez above fast 1D to fast 3D above high rez 5D. Making it a fast 7D below the high rez 5D makes more sense to me, but I’d not complain about a 3D instead.
Photoshop hit C
I get jpegs for sports shooters who need to upload within minutes of the shoot. For wedding shooters jpeg shooting is simple laziness. Get lightroom and you’re good to go. There is no reasonable reason to want jpeg vs RAW for a wedding shooter. None, I tell you! :)
And oh so true…
With CPS it will proabably sell for 5K. Not quite double, but if the specs be true then well worth it!
Go try to manually focus a Panasonic Lumix in low light
Canon 1Dv film camera…
mentioned on rumor site comments makes it valid?
Computer modeling defines the parameters/specs/design. There’s no need to test different sensors in the field and manufacturing just doesn’t work that way. The camera specs are worked out between executives and engineering long before any pre-production bodies are made. The field testing is firmware development to work out glitches and ensure the expected performance.
+1
Exactly. There’s also layers of R&D in materials before it gets made into a sensor. They already have expectations for photosite behavior, not to mention years of R&D from previous development.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/inkyjournal/
yeah, that’s why the Nikon D3 FF is blowing the doors off the 1D3 in sales because FF makes no sense for sports…lol
takes big balls to call someone names anonymously…not
+10
Actually it´s not official.
I talked to both testers and one of them let me take a look at this camera. It was a 5D MarkII Body. But it was much faster (fps and AF). I don´t know how much fps that was but something like 6-8. It was FF and had the same 9-points of AF. Even the Body had the 5D MarkII logos.
He didn´t tell me the specs. But said it will we called 3D and will get the same body like 5D MarkII.
For me it makes in this point sense to me:
Megapixel-freaks (the real pros) take middle format cameras like Hasselblad or Mamiya.
So the sport cameras are the bigger deal for canon and are more important for the companys image.
That´s the only idea that make sense to me.
+1 a mispreception for sure, just look at how many people on this site have bought the “crop = reach” myth hook line and sinker…
Ni who?
If APS-H was to stay at least some EF-H glass would make sense – don’t think more APS-H or EF-H will happen though.
some people will always want a top line pro body for a xxxD price…
E-flippin-xactly. If the thing does what ever we think it will end up doing it will need a lot of juice. Besides, battery tech is changin at such a rapid pace it only makes sense the newest tech would make it into the camera. A new $200 battery isn’t an impediment to purchasing a 5K camera, anyway. Remember, that’s less than you’d spend on film and processing for one event only five or six years ago…
You have to post a comment to the same thread “maxxevv” started on the previous story. Thems is the rules. I’ll reply on both threads with contact details for my crack dealer when you’re done.
if you have to ask…hehe
zero
aps-h can never accept ef-s glass and that format will die with the 1D3 – 7D will either be FF or APS-C
Maybe it was the new Leica S2…that MF SLR camera has got to be very loud, lol
that’s what I call a reflex answer :)
maybe because it be APS-C?
Yeah, I worked as a co-op student in the design department of a wafer fab shop way back. Lots of the R&D is into the “process”–the particular characteristics of the silicon doping, various layers, dimensions, devices, etc.–that the designers get to play with. Developing and implementing a process is horrendously expensive. The big boys (Intel and the like) probably chuck at least US$1bn at one just to get the the first chip out the door. If a “process” can’t give you what you want–e.g., a particular kind of doping for a photodiode, or smaller faster transistors–expect to pay giga-bucks and wait years for the next generation process to arrive.
Engineers have to work with what they have, so not all of their bright ideas will make it into sensors any time soon.
If these are real specs and they announce a new 24-70 also, I’ll be selling my 5DII and buying both. If not, D700 here I come.
1080P movie, impossible
Such a camera will come without movie
hmmmm, well could be the tester was not given the actual model name, but I would take it as 3D or 7D to go with my 5D2 ;)
Sounds a little too slow for dual-digic V.
Dual-digic IV could do 6-7fps at 21MP. So you would think that dual-digic V could do 10-12fps, ertainly at 21MP, or 13-16fps at 16MP.
Granted making the mirror go that fast might be a pain, but you would think they would at least make it 12fps, not 10.
Maybe some of the PJ people didn’t want to deal with larger than 16MP files, but you’d think they might like at least 18MP for more reach.
Since some of them do use jpgs (although with the large buffers of today and fast batching I’m not sure how big a concern it should be) maybe Digic V focuses more on DPP-like rendering?
you mean 50i, which is the same as 25p
Please post a link to the sales data that you are using as a reference. I don’t doubt that the D3 is out selling the 1D3, but that might more to do the fact the 1D3 is well along it’s product life cycle, as opposed to the fact that it is FF.
I’ll be waiting for your Canon gears at FM.
LOL. good one.
Probably someone with a 20d. Can you say CA-KLACK!
i don’t understand why you think it’s outdated? it saves silicon and improves pixel density. to me, it seems perfectly viable.
Totally agree on that point, though I don’t know exactly what kind of foundry capability canon has…The Foundry can specialise in making sensors…Dalsa and DNP do some.
same AF? no matter how good or bad the 9 point AF is, if not just for PR sake, Canon has to increase the number of AF points. …even if they are fake AF points.
+1
4600
and don’t forget 400ds
One AF point (center) and sixty “helper” AF points.
I think APS-H is outdated from a marketing standpoint. You can’t use EF-S lenses (which only really matters if you already have some, as I imagine many upgraders would), but you don’t get maximum wide-angle coverage with EF lenses. If you’re shooting primarily telephoto, it may be nice for the extra reach, but I do not think it would be easily marketable as any sort of “feature.”
Nikon is to apple as Canon is to orange. Really, you can’t compare, I know a few but are that many shooters really switching to get the D3? Also, the shooters are doing a lot more than just sports, the high quality at high ISO is more of a draw.
as posted several times before, i have the 100% valid info from a german canon service point that there will be a 1D4 with video next month, but NO 7d. the 1D4 specs seem to be true. if you need infos about upcoming canon products, try to find people who work at canon service points, then you don’t have to waste time speculating.
“it saves silicon and improves pixel density.”
Is silicon supposed to be an endangered species??
Pixel density and format are to different topics. I wont consider an APS-H camera as a potential buy.
Speculating is fun recreation, then we get to see who was right, hehe
DIGIC V (Dual) sensor?
mmmm i think thats wrong, the DIGIC IV its a new sensor.
Thom Hogan has mentioned that Nikon puts out different trial cameras with different sensors out in the field for testing. And Thom Hogan most certainly KNOWS about these things.
I will not surprised that Canon does the same thing too.
I just look at what used to be all white lenses at sporting events on TV and it’s obvious Canon has lost a lot of market share because of the D3. If 1.3 crop was nearly as big a deal for sports as people on this site suggest we’d still be seeing walls of white glass at sporting events despite the D3, yet that’s not the case so clearly a LOT of sports pro shooters want FF.
Also, when the 1D came out it was impressive because it was the closest thing to FF in digital – the crop sensor has always been considered a less than pro feature, and Canon kept APS-H going because they couldn’t get the high speed from FF, until technology caught up…now it has.
The problem is that prototype camera may be a mix of parts for different next-gen camera.
For example, Canon has certainly tested OLED screens on the field for quiet some time, but OLED will not be integrated in a final product until cost is very low or competition introduce it.
The same went with video : a company introduces the feature, and every others follow like a sheep.
Yes shooters are doing a lot more than sports which is another reason why FF is more desirable than crop. High IQ and ISO performace is important, and is generally better in FF cameras. All the high IQ bodies people rave about from Nikon are FF; D3x, D3 and D700. The D300s is good IQ, for a crop sensor, but it doesn’t compare to it’s FF cousins. Canon’s best IQ camera is the 5D2, besting even the 1Ds3, and guess what? It’s FF. The 1D4 will be FF to compete with the high IQ FF competition.
It’s outdated because the competition offers high IQ high ISO fast FF bodies. The crop=reach concept is a marketing myth Nikon has busted big time and all the black glass at sports events where there used to be all white glass proves sports shooters are happy with FF better IQ better high ISO cameras.
Where? I’d like to read where he says it’s the same camera model being tested with different sensors in it.
sustained RAW fps is a factor too, maybe 12 fps was possible but for only 12 frames RAW, only a second of shooting, where there number of frames sustained could be much higher at 10? I dont know, just a thought.
Wrong, David.
Semiconductor companies, especially those which own foundries, will frequently send test circuits (‘early samples’) into production.
R&D place different circuits on a single wafer, and produces a small series of wafers. The only constraint is that all circuits must use the same technology (CMOS or CCD, etc).
Having early samples is useful to test in advance new designs, new technologies, new fabrication processes, and the compatibility between each of thoses.
making test wafers in R&D is not the same as putting them in functional camera bodies…I’m not wrong, the testing of camera prototypes months before product announcement is firmware testing and tweaking and nothing more.
Not totally correct. Nikon D300 (and upper) users can pick between different modes : 9-, 21- or 51 selectable points. AFAIK, every points will be used in the automatic AF mode.
The dual digic is for HD video support. The largest complaint from pro video users of the 5D MKII (and there are alot, most 5D sales are driven by indie filmakers and student filmakers. Think hollywood style double system sound, not camcorder)is that the HDMI output goes from 1080 to 480 when you start recording. Most everyone using these for filmaking has a HD 1080 monitor hooked up to them. The problem on the 5D is that the single Digic doesn’t have the horsepower to convert the video to codec and output a 1080 stream at the same time. The dual digic setup allows 1080 output to a monitor or esxternal recorder. Someone above questioned 25p, that is important for filmaking in Europe so as to avoid light flicker problems due to their power system. Folks, don’t think just still photography anymore, for pro users the new DSLRs as as much about video as stills.
It was something he said in DPReview forums. Too lazy to trawl through his posts.
But I’m sure of it. :D
BTW, that was before the D300/D3 were released. He talked about different sensors being tested for the D3.
why dont they just make the 5D2 switch to either HDMI 1080p out or on the CF card?
it’s not just video making the 5D2 sell like crazy, it bests the 1Ds3 in pic IQ for $4300 less…
I haven’t read that but I don’t believe they are testing different sensors in a specific model months or weeks before a product announcement. That’s firmware testing & tweaking at that point.
Let me guess….A$6999?????
My guess is that Canon will introduce the world with the 1D IV and the 7D and they will both be spectacular cameras. Shocking the world with brand new technology.
God says it. I believe it. Now lets see it…
Yes, I’m very hard of hearing, but my 5D MK II brings the camera click noise to a whole new level. The 1D series cameras are very quiet by comparison, and I expect them to stay quiet.
Lots of PJ’s use the 5D MK II’s because they can capture both stills and video so its likely a bunch of 5D MK II’s making the racket.
Why would you want to put EFS glass on a 1D?
Oh, and the 1D IV will be full frame.
I’ve been waiting a year for an update on this lens since its so old.. I know many have been waiting way more than that…
It sounds liek a wish list cuz of the 24p. Also the full frame would be nice. I don’t see why people would complain. You would have a slightly better crop than current 1D mark 3 if you cropped the image in photoshop. The larger sensor means better low light images with less noise. Given how crappy lighting can be for sporting events at night this is very important.
Does current 1D have a 100 percent viewfinder? I’m curious how much bigger this would make the camera.
Real Pro movie makers in Europe or elsewhere do not have a problem with 30 fps. They use professional grade lighting which does not flicker. Its the home users who think they have a camcorder and want to make video under the old style fluorescent lights who have a problem. Updating the lights to a electronic ballast eliminates the issue. Its mostly a myth.
Months before product announcement, yes… But the poster said nothing about time frame. Or even in functional bodies, for that matter. All they said is that Canon may have tested many different sensors before arriving at this one.
Canon’s a 50 billion dollar company. Of course they do a lot other than just cameras, but if it costs a couple extra million to pursue several sensor designs rather than putting all their eggs in one basket during the development of their flagship product, that’s hardly a prohibitive cost. I have no idea whether they do it or not, but I doubt 1 or 2 megabucks in the deciding factor.
the only time people are going to see a test camera in the wild is months or weeks before release, and it will be disguised so I doubt anyone would know what it even was, and not testing different sensors but firmware tweaks. It’s not a trial and error process on the sensor choice by the time it gets into a pre-production body, but as we’ve seen with the 5D2, 1D3 etc firmware testing is a big factor prior to and after release. The engineers tell the executives what they can make, the executives decide on the specs they are told can be made, it gets built as a pre-production body for testing firmware and early reviews before it gets announced.
well…
single DIGIC III approx 63Mp/sec (40D)
Dual DIGIC III approx 100Mp/sec
benefit: 158%
single DIGIC IV .. 95Mp / sec.
dual DIGIC IV .. around 150Mp/sec.
at 16Mp .. 9fps .. not fast enough.
not sure where someone got 13-16fps from :s
never say never . there’s nothing stopping canon from creating mirror movement that slides back on the way up to clear the protruding element.
if anything, APS-H would be the one size that this would be far simpler to do, than it would on FF.
from dual-digic FIVE ;)
I said dual-digic FOUR at 21MP at 6-7fps, which fits what you have and dual-FIVE at 16MP 13-16fps.
I was recently trading emails about the rumors with a Canon Shooter of Light and was told that “no one – absolutely no one outside the corporate structure knows the final specs and those that do have their job on the line if they leak. The various shooters who have drones are absolutely sworn to secrecy RE the bodies they are testing. Their future as “The Canon Privileged” will be forfeited. With this in mind I firmly believe that the new 1 series will be stunning in its performance and will blow the competition out of the water.
Yes there is good reason to say never: the diameter of the EF-S glass is not wide enough and you’d get vinetting even if you could make the mirror mechanics work.
Digic is a processor not a sensor… come on.
Yeah it’s called economic efficiency which they are by law required to maintain out of obligation to the shareholders who make money on company profits not on wasted millions testing a variety of sensors in pre-production cameras before deciding what to make. Canon may have 20 sensors in R&D any of which could be made into a new camera if they fit marketing parameters but that choice is made long before a pre-production model is built.
I have one question…
Where will the 1Ds Mark III (and eventually Mark IV) fit in if the 1D Mark IV is full frame??? It might just be me, but I would not be willing to pay double for a camera that just offers more megapixels (which really are necessary)? They better make some super huge changes on that 1Ds Mark IV to make it worth spending the extra $
But if these specs are right, this will be my next camera, no doubt about it. I’m keeping my fingers crossed.
I’m starting to get worried about the lack of more credible rumors when the 25th is almost here.
Unless Canon has done an amazing job locking down info, it seems we may be in for a lackluster 25th.
I don’t know Canon Shooter of Light but I know Explorer of Light…anyway they didn’t do a good job with the early 1D3..all of them should have been fired!
I get that impression too, that Canon has kept information leakage to a minimum this time round to increase the wow factor… I just hope it’s better than the G11 wow factor, which to me was none.
Specifications
16mp FF
DIGIC V (Dual)
10fps
100% ViewFinder
3″ VGA LCD (It’s mentioned OLED is a possibility, it exists in test cameras)
SD/CF Slot
1080p Movie (24p, 25p, 30p)
New Lighter Battery
Ergonomic Changes (2nd Joy Stick Type Controller)
All within what I’d like to see.
61AF Points (Somewhere around 20 selectable)
this is an interesting spec.
A complete redesign of the AF system from the ground up,
creates a problem due to the AF assist points in the flashes
not matching the cameras AF points.
with the 1D3 AF problems they could have augmented
the 1D3 AF system using the old AF points and adding new ones.
or
It’s a new design from scratch.
so it’s possible they could have designed a new flash for the 1D4.
time will tell.
Sorry, I did mean Explorer of Light. My Bad!!!
Amen brother, I normally turn the volume right down when watching tennis on TV without commentating. Can’t stand their roaring lioness screams. :P
tonight
Cool
in 2 hours
No, not in 2 hours
Tite
They are different markets. You are clearly not in the 1Ds market segment and most people are not. High end studio, commercial, fashion, wedding – those who demand highest end image quality are 1Ds people. My spec-ulation on 1Ds4 is 32 MP and 2K or better video.
Yes, in 2 hours.
i don’t think so, 1D IV “is” not “will be” APH-S. just wait and see.. (sept. 1)
we will see. got my moola on FF
We’ll see who’s right……
1D FF will only happen when Canon decides 1Ds to be MF
It’s not tonight…Sept 2nd.
It won’t be a lackluster 25-Aug ‘cos I doubt there’ll be any announcement.
A lumberjack who goes deep into the forest and needs a GPS to find the way out.
ALL new Canon DSLRs come with Video. The trend started a year ago.
I’d consider a 10 MP jump and 2K+ video a “super huge change,” but that’s just me and the rest of the camera world that are apparently not good enough for Mr. Fancy pants over here…
1Ds4 will be 28-32 MP well within MF range
I thought the announcement date was the 1st…what does this all mean for those of us who don’t want to spend several thousand dollars on a camera? Will there be a 7D? A 60?
If I were Canon, I’d get the prosumer 7d/60d out there now…and reserve the 1dmkiv for its own special place in Sept…
I would think Canon would want to replace the 50D…it seems to have been somewhat of a flop.
I disagree with mo, we need MOAR DIRECT PRINT!
Here’s what Canon should do to maximize impact: get their 7d/60d out there tomorrow and step all over the Sony announcement in a few days. The new Canon will be so mind blowing great that Sony won’t have an answer.
Then get the new 1dmk4 out in Sept to continue the Canon buzz…my guess is it will blow people away. Plus, in Sept it’s expected that Nikon will debut its D700x.
Yeah its all about the processing speed of the digic processors, with dual digic V it should be quite capable
if not today then 1 sept
I have a question for the more experienced Canon Rumor folowers here:
IF this camera (and possibly others) is being announced on the 25th, are we likely to see it in half an hour (midnight EST) or midday tomorrow sometime like we did with the Powershots? I’d sure like to have an SLR announcement tonight!
Yep, sounds liek a good strategy to me. Taking the wind out of Sony’s sails with the 60D sounds like a good plan. Is anyone talking abotu the Sony cams having Video? That would be a game-changer.
I’m not sure that Canon Rumor folks really realize what a splash the 5DmkII made in the video world: I just came back from a cinematography conference out West and 2/3 of the DPs there had a 5DmkII as their go-to profssional camera for corporate and stock work. It’s also the ONLY camera that film students are talking about these days, although it’s more expensive than a year’s tuition. A 60D with good video capabiltiies will be well receieved.
You see, you were wrong. In the mean time i have printed my invitation out and am getting ready for tonight.
I WANT THIS CAMERA SO FUC#ING BAD I WILL GET A JOB TO BUY THIS AND I WILL USE IT EVERY WAKEING MINUTE AND I WILL PRIINT ONLY WITH THE DIRECT PRINT BUTTON I WANT THIS NOW NOW NOW
a big flop
And it’s 12:09…. and nothing.
Eric, you are so right about the impact of the 5dmk2. I don’t think Canon will ever release another dslr w/out video because of it.
MOOOAAARRRRRR!
can’t hear you.
low your volume please.
stop arguing with your self :P
DSLR stuff was always up with a splash at 12-1AM EST before
So…. September 1st…. or 2nd…. or 9th…. or 17th…. it is! :)
that’s some pretty low tuition!
Naive question, but what’s the difference between DIGIC V and DIGIC IV? And how does anyone know since it hasn’t been announced yet?
???????????????????????????+++ 1.45am
these professional athletes can cry me a river…I don’t know why silence is needed when the Williams sisters scream like they have been stabbed…why can Ben Rothlisberger complete a Super Bowl winning ouchdown with 60,000 people screaming, but tennis players are bothered by clicking shutters…get a grip.
hey, gotta save something for the 1Ds Mark IV
if you cant hear him wouldnt you want him to turn up his volume?
lmao
fake
dear Canon:
Please put 16 direct print buttons on your new cameras. There is a serious risk of mass suicide if there are not this many direct print buttons.
Sincerely,
Epson
A 7D would be a 1.3 Crop with 5D AF Sensors.
A 3D would be a FF sensor, 1D-like AF, but without the large second grip. (Just a second grip like all the other EOS’s have.
maybe 6 hours to go ?
Direct Print Joystick?
Leaving in 30mins. Event is for 2 hours, so will be able to tell more in about 4hrs.
Can someone please post a link of the “live feed” for this event?
then what are you doing on a rumor site if you’re that sure about your sources?
i have a 5dmk2 as backup so i’d be satisfied with one. besides i don’t think i could afford more than one ;)
ha ha ha i loled .
congrats
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1032&message=28860612&changemode=1
http://www.kamerabild.se/nyheter/26-augusti-kommer-ny-Canon-Eos-1.40559.html
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=hp&hl=en&js=y&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.kamerabild.se%2Fnyheter%2F26-augusti-kommer-ny-Canon-Eos-1.40559.html&sl=sv&tl=en&history_state0=
“August 26 starts at 9.00 am in Stockholm”
nop. Looks like an ink/notebook reviewer which is shooting ink bottles with his 1Dmk3.
Get a job to pay for a camera?! Why stop there, maybe get a life while you’re at it.
LOL
MOAR DIRECT PRINT BUTTONS!!!!!!!111oneeleventwelve
oops
I should read the date the post was made.
sorry
There is none I think. What do you think this is, an apple event?! :P
are we there already? no? what about now?……….’n now?
we there are yet? how’s about the now being?
oh yes, and an extra direct print button on ALL the lenses
are we even sure there is an event?
djokovic complain because he lost against rf…
You are wrong too…I guess
Good point. IF there is, it’s something very, very minor.
I’d be extremely shocked if anything substantial is announced today.
A big belly flop
A big FAT belly flop
A big FAT belly flop into custard
if not 1 sept then 3rd Sept
Subscribe to:
http://www.usa.canon.com/rss/press_releases.xml
and wait…
If there is a new camera or cameras introduced today or within a few days, it seems like these could be critical releases for Canon. Speaking for myself, I want to upgrade from my good old reliable Rebel/300D. The 50D drew my interest for awhile but the more I read about the image quality, the longer I waited. I am also interested in the video, it would be convenient not to have to lug around a camcorder too. The DSLR video option makes taking short clips around the house or on vacations seems like less of a hassle. If the 60D or 7D (if the exist) are very, very good cameras with better DR, AF and high ISO performance, I will seriously consider moving to Nikon. I really am hoping that Canon reasserts itself!
TYPO in post, should have read…if the 60D/7D are NOT very, very good cameras, I will consider moving to Nikon.
“a physical shutter must open and close at that rate”
I think this limitation of film camera’s no longer holds true… why can’t the image sensor record two images for every cycle of the mirror? The only thing sacrificed is viewing the scene between each capture. I’m pretty sure I can track a subject just as well (poorly) with viewing it 8 times a second as I can at 16 times a second… this could even be a software setting that could be disengaged.
any news? any new cameras? any.. thing?
gees this waiting is really doing my head in
the last press conference for the g11 and it’s smaller brothers was on 3pm cet so let’s wait and see.
mmmmm custard….
look at the mp jumps of the previous 1ds models, 10mp would be quite a lot! besides the resolution is only one part of the progress made (should i mention dxomark?)
I have to say D300/D300S is really good camera.
So is the D3x :)
Moar news, rumors please!!!!!
Hurry up and wait
exactly, i was also planning to upgrade from my old trusty 400D/Rebel Xti to a 50D, but as i read the reviews, it made me think twice bfore getting it. To add to that, there were also people saying that the 500D has better IQ in higher ISO
x.x
Eos rebel 1000 discontinued
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/buy/SLR-Digital-Cameras/pn/2/ci/6222/N/4294538181+4291570227
Tonight
50 minutes to 3pm CET, if they announce anything today…
ah crap I hope its not announcement for a rebel that would be oh so gay.
Really, hahahaha.
well its not looking good for today
No announcement today, we are waiting for September 1st…
exactly
silver kit only (for the time being).
“…jpegs that are as good as RAW conversions …”
what is that supposed to mean? the reason we shoot RAW isn’t about an image-feel thing, its about flexibility. a JPG file by definition cannot retain all the information a RAW file does. there is no “perfect” RAW conversion either; the reason you work with RAW in the efirst place is so you can take your photos in different directions based on the concept of the shoot.
out-of-camera JPGs will never be the final answer no matter how much processing power you dedicate to it. so I’d rather see that data pipeline used for higher continuous shooting rates and better AF performance
*cough* T1i *cough*
False alarm
AF is about accurate recognition of targets. You guys tend to obsess over the little red boxes too much. That is dead obsolete technology (although I bet you bottom dollar its still being flogged off to us for another 5 years at least).
What we do now is store ‘intelligence’ into the AF system. Prior to a sports match you take a facial shot of your preferred target player (you can store several targets). You also take a full body shot of the player. In fact you can store up to 5 images of your target to help with AF recognition during the game.
You can then prioritise each target (lets say your editorial brief is get shots of players A,B and C). Your AF system will set itself every single time if any of your targets enter your frame. If more than one target enters your frame it will allocate focus according to your set targeting priorities before the game. It will even try to spread your f stop to accommodate multiple targets in the frame before reverting to the single priority target if its not achievable from an exposure standpoint.
For me all this is mostly garbage mickey mouse b%^%s%^t not photography. The art of photography is still there to be pursued (and is being done so by true photographers) but most of what Canon and Nikon are about is making very average hacks pass off as professionals because that grows revenues. I mean if photography was hard and challenging less people would be interested = less sales (significantly oversimplified things for the benefit of brevity).
Nikon and Canon business model “How can we make it possible for really lazy, largely intellectually challenged people to pretend/pass off/imagine/fluke their way to taking half decent images without actually having any real knowledge about the complexities of the business/art form/profession.”
And yet we champion them? I guess what other options do we have.
If you cant shoot sports with a manual film camera with a fair degree of success then you arent much to write home about professionally as a photographer and you sure as hell arent the real deal no matter how good your imagination is. And you sure as hell better not come across me in your professional travels.
And no I am not a 70yo dinosaur. I’m 28. I havent mastered film utterly. But by geez I make a good fist of it. The technical benefits are fundamental.
I mean you cant even walk up to half of these hacks at professional games anymore and have a technical discussion on the finer points of the industry. They just look at you like deer in the headlights. So you switch tack and go for a creative angle and see if they can flesh out a creative brief. Nope. Nothing.
They come from nothingness with FPS and oodles of AF in hand.
Just their big Canon, some fast glass, and an utterly delusional state of mind. Its pretty sad.
In the viewfinder of photographic life as we toggle between endless AF points we seem to be leaving behind so much essential knowledge of what the art stands for.
Tonight!
I’m Canon user but agree with you.
no announcement = all CR2 is JOKE !
hahaha
nice.
26 August, the new Canon Eos
2008-08-05 20:06 2008-08-05 20:06
We have already received an invitation from Canon to a display on 22 september. Now we have a new call.
The news will appear on 26 August is quite clear. If Canon will also demonstrate new products, 22 september, we do not know.
While serving on 26 August will start at 9.00 in Stockholm, but probably is the news released an hour earlier. We are obviously in place to report and make web-TV.
I would love too c this happen
the last 1d had serious focus issues
forget the perks. FOCUS FOCUS
FOCUS. Love canons lens selection
but at least my D3 focuses ! IF!
Canon can fix the FOCUS issues
I’m going Back too CANON, if they have
Ass it AGAIN!!!! I’m staying nikon
cause I have too get the shot right
so I can pay my bills! Peace out!
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