Movie Mode
The 60D will certainly see movie mode added to the model when its announced in the fall (or so we’re told).
There will be no manual aperture control, but there will be 24p & 30p modes at 1080p.
We may finally see the paradigm shift to SD cards for the line (For better or worse).
I’ve actually started to use an SD card in my 1D3 on a daily basis, I just wanted to know if it would annoy me. So far it hasn’t.
Larger VF
Expect to see a larger and brighter VF in the 60D. I have no info as to whether or not it will be 100%.
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Video is cool, but please let Canon focus on still photos!!! Better noise performance, at least 7 shots in AEB mode and swivel screen!!!
If not I’m off to the Nikon D400!!!
AF points…more AF points.
Darn, now I don’t even know what to have for dinner tonight
24p at 1080p. sweet…. probably. so long as rolling shutter isn’t too obvious. 720p on my 500D is fine, but 1080p is wobble city (along with the usless 20p framerate).
don’t know if it’s the sensor or processor that causes the issue, but fingers crossed the 60D will have that sorted. actually, i’m hoping for a future firmware upgrade/hack that will give the 500D 720@24p, i’d be more than happy with that
Do you think the price for the 40D body will drop under 800$ with the announcement of the 60D ?
Keep dreaming
Would someone please explain the technical hurdles preventing manual aperture control in video? IMO, this decision seems to be entirely limited by marketing goals rather than engineering or cost barriers.
Canon seems to be intentionally segmenting their product line by handicapping features rather than listening to their customer base. I understand they have a camcorder product line to defend, but Nikon and other DSLR makers do not. Canon appears to be content with maintaining the status quo rather than releasing a product with features users demand. This short-sighted attitude is certain to bite them in the end.
lol, I don’t think the D400 will have your dreamed swivel screen cause its bulky and not to mention harder to make it weather proof.
Even though Nikon does not have a camcorder line to protect, they are also struggling with manual aperture control in video. I think there’s more than meets the eye.
If there are any available, they might not be discounted any more than they are now. The 50D will probably be discounted, but still cost a good bit more than the current 40D price, as the 60D will be selling for a big premium. Unless some retailer really wants to clear some stock, the 40D will sit where it is.
Just watch how it works for the other models and you’ll see that they are rarely discounted by more than about 10% on the release of the next model, as the price has already been dropping for a long time and more-or-less hit bottom.
Adorama have the 40D for US$850 now. If you want it, why wait? Even if you’re flipping burgers for a living, an extra $50 on an $800 purchase is not much. Of course, if you meant 800 Zimbabwean dollars, I apologise for being so insensitive. (They just knocked another TWELVE ZEROS off the printed notes in February on top of the TEN ZEROS they knocked off last August and THREE ZEROS in 2006 and there are now only 370 Zim dollars to the US dollar. Woot!)
+1 for the 500D 720@24p
Nikon is new to video. There’s no doubt they’re going to have some hiccups in their R&D department while they explore relatively new technology. I expect the same from Pentax.
However, Panasonic does offer aperture control in the GH1, so the technology is entirely feasible. I’m assuming that some knowledge from their camcorder division has been applied to the Lumix line. Thus, Panasonic has determined that the potential for the GH1 cannibalizing their own camcorder line is outweighed by the increase of market share in digital imaging.
Canon, as a market leader, is choosing to play defender and dragging its feet until the competitions’ offerings are a threat. My frustration is that Canon is obviously artificially segmenting video capabilities across their product line. The new 1D will offer the greatest control of video because it’s price places it in line with Canon’s prosumer video cameras. Next down will be the 5D (post-firmware update) which might handicap shutter speed or ISO. The 60D will lose all of the above in addition to aperture control. Worst of all, these increasingly diminishing features are firmware based, not sensor or mechanical. The need for a video CHDK from day one is immediately apparent.
I’ve started using SD cards in my 400D (XTi) with the help of a CF to SD adapter. Price of SD cards is now lower per GB. And when I buy a new DSLR, I’ll have the SD cards ready. ;-)
I wont buy any new Canon body until they include the competitors’ most basic features, such as :
– larger range of braketing,
– built-in flash controler,
– LCD cover,
– head-up display in the viewfinder,
– a 21st-century AF module,
– an ergonomic “aperture preview” button.
Why would anyone need LCD covers? It is entirely possible to make practically unscratchable LCD. In fact, they are almost impossible to scratch on latest Canon cameras. Also covers kill outdoors contrast.
I’m with you on the rest.
Not to mention weather sealing (just look at Pentax and Nikon).
Canon is pretty pathetic and prefers to be a follower than a leader in terms of features.
Whatever lead they used to have in their sensor design has now been obliterated by Nikon’s latest releases: D3X, D3/D700, D300/D90/D5000. Canon does ok for high ISO but their low ISO dynamic range is pretty pathetic, compared to their Nikon counterparts.
The rolling shutter on the 500D is awful. The 5D Mark II has much less of it which means the CMOS in it refreshes the readout much faster.
The 60D should have a CMOS at least on par with the 5D II for video refresh. Otherwise it will be a big disappointment.
Aperture control is in the new Pentax K7 but not shutter control. That will be a must feature for the 60D to be competitive. If the K7 video is low on the rolling shutter and the codec quality is as good or better than the Mark II, many indy film makers will jump to that system.
The good news is that once the 5D II is cracked in the Aperture and Shutter controls, its only a bit more work to get the same on a 60D or 500D. If canon wont deliver, the user base will! Their loss to Nikkor lenses and user mindsets.
Since I am about to buy a few DSLR for my future projects, I just hope that there isnt too much different in the overall look of the various DSLR IQ that are coming out soon from Canon. Else, I am going to spend most of my time doing color correction…
At the end of the day IQ values for me with 50D features.(cough cough… better ISO ;) )
I am getting really annoyed about Canon (but also Nikon, Sony, etc.) investing so much time/money/effort on adding video features to their cameras. I couldn’t care less. If I could get a 1$ discount for a non-video version, I’d get the discount instead of the video.
Why not invest on what really counts for photographers? With today’s APS-C SLRs, #1 priority should clearly be improving high ISO performance in terms of S/N ratio (i.e. low noise) and exposure latitude. A really usable Live View would probably be #2, and a better VF a very close #3.
Hey genius, I have news for you.
the technology is already developed, they’re just copying and pasting lines of code.
Having video makes the cmaera more marketable, which means more people to share the other R&D costs and therefore lower cost.
How is the current liveview not useable?
I do agree that noise and DR should be they’re top priorities, but the video thing doesn’t hurt that.
Zac,
video on SLRs is unfortunately not fully developed yet — it’s hard to use, AF and even aperture control are mostly not there, and I could go on with other limitations & issues. So there’s quite a bit R&D more to do for Canon & C. to improve it, assuming they intend to do so (and unfortunately #2) that seems to be the case. And that’s ignoring the money invested in marketing it. I really wish they’d spend it in more useful features.
SD Cards On xxD Series?! Are You Joking? Now I Have About 10 CF Card Equals About 200 Dollar and about 40GB… Then If I Buy, What Should I Do with Them?! It Would Be Better If They Put CF+SD Card Slots Together (I Think So)
I’m not a big fan of SD cards either since I have 6 CF cards. I don’t want to buy SD cards, I like the size and shape of the CFs. I’m sure performance wise it’d be the same though.
Maybe they could just have dual slots so you can do SD or CF.
You (nor I) have any idea how much they spend on what in R&D. But I think it’s quite likely that not adding video will significantly hurt sales. Which means that they wouldn’t be able to afford as much R&D on other aspects of the camera as well. Spending R&D on video capabilities quite likely allows for more spending on the features you want.
Also, the video features you claim require more R&D is more likely not implemented due to market segmentation by Canon, and not the lack of technical knowledge – they don’t want to cannibalize their professional video camera lines, which do have those features.
Actually CF cards have significantly faster write speeds than SD cards. That’s why they’re preferred for higher end DSLR cameras.
Poor you.
SDXC is coming…
SD-Cards are cheaper (in production too) and a lot of ppl have them.
true.
for now however CF still is the top choice.
SDXC is coming but when?? and how much?? At the current time the highest transfer rate for sd is 20mb/s Panasonic cards and the current highest in the market CF is 45mb/s. SD to me is not the way to go so far. Until those SDXC cards come, I would want CF.
if a hobby coder can get movies from an old 40D I’m sure the techs a Canon can pull off something much better.
I’ll keep shooting with my old film slrs until I actually get a feature that’s worth updating my gear for.
http://www.kenrockwell.com/olympus/trip-35.htm
Another vote for sticking with Compact Flash on the 60D!
Well it pretty much looks it will be called a 60D
Found this at B&H
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/621748-REG/Nimar_NI303D1607_UNDERWATER_HOUSING_f_CANON_EOS.html
Another vote to keep CF, I don’t like SD!
I’m happy with my 40D. It’s capable of some incredible photos. Who cares about a new body right now? Not me, unless it’s the 1DsIII in a small form factor. I’d rather spend $900 ($1500-$600 I’d get for my 40D) on new lenses and filters.
A 1DsIII in a small form factor? Don’t you mean a 5D Mark II??
Well I pulled the trigger and paid $1000 for a 50D body. I don’t see any sense in waiting 6 months, pay $300 more, and no real gain to IQ really. Video, SD, and VF – all sound like gimmicks to me. It’ll be my first dSLR, so no argument there saying I should’ve kept a 40D, or purchase a 40D instead. $1000 + shipping = win. No sales tax @ Robertsimaging.
#1 HD video – don’t care. Canon, if possible please manufacture two versions of this camera 60D HDV (High Definition Video) and plain 60D. I’ll happily pay $50 less for no video capability that I don’t want, don’t need and will not use.
#2 SD cards – oh well, bye, bye CF cards. I still prefer bigger, more robust and more difficult to lose CF but I guess it had to come to this sooner or later.
#3 bigger VF – please do it, 100% one.
What I’d like to see:
* ISO range from 50 without any loss in dynamic range
* more focus points
* swivel, articulated screen
Hey people, do not think in technology but in ideas … and in future. There are a lot of cameras for different tasks. Taking pictures can be so different. Sometimes i take my Hasselblad with me, loaded with an outdated film …. and i am coming home happily, without taking any picture at all. This is like the silence in the musik from John Cage. The world does not be better with more focus segments, more frames pr. second, more pixels. Do you need the resolution and dynamic range to tell the story? A 16 mm camera can in many cases deliver pictures with more emotional intensity then any digital camera can today. Minimalism rules.
PS: This is a personal statement
PPS: Forgive my engish writing, ich komme aus Deutschland, men jeg taler ogsÃ¥ dansk …
PPPS: Diversity ++
I did the same thing for the same reason at Murphy’s Camera in Kentucky. I bought locally so had to pay sales tax. The camera was advertised in our newspapers, $999.99 good through May 31. See the ad here: http://www.facebook.com/ext/share.php?sid=83457762122&h=-40Bj&u=qalzI&ref=mf
Agreed on Canon being a follower on many features issues over the last several years. Lame.
Best thing about this rumor is larger viewfinder. Come on 100%. ONE HUNDRED PERCENT!!
Well, well, well… now that the 5D2 offers FULL MANUAL EXPOSURE control in VIDEO mode, all this talk about intentional protection of their camcorders has just been blown to bits…
Canon is starting to be like Micro Soft, what they think are features I consider to be bugs. SD cards are a total deal breaker. Canon goes to SD card, I go to Nikon.
Cameras are tools, not a religion. If Nikon makes better tools, it’s a no-brain-er to switch to Nikon!
BTW another no-brain-er is using Sony Video. I work in the pro video world and even Canon’s best video camera is a joke.
I have a Digital Rebel XT (350D). It is an outstanding camera. I have no compelling reason to upgrade my body. If Canon wants to sell me a new body, they have to improve core SLR functions such as autofocus, better performance in low light and image quality. Gimmicks like video and 15 megapixel sensors are not appealing to me. I have a lot of CF and a switch to SD would make the upgrade more expensive and so less appealing.
yeah, you know they weren’t the first to implement live-view in a true SLR, the first with ‘my menu settings’ or self cleaning sensors, or weather sealed flashes, or 1080P in an SLR, or, oh yeah, full HD video control in an SLR, (look they even listen, every now and again)
I hope they offer sdxc compatability if they moove to sd cards
I do the same with my Pentax 6×7 and my Konica Hexar RF. No question asked, film photography is a pure pleasure.
BUT! Here we are discussing what a 60D body should integrate to have a chance in the competition against Nikon D400, the new Pentax K-7 (100% viewfinder here!), Sony’s latests, Panasonic GH1, etc.
And my feeling is that there are so many things to be fixed that Canon should directly start working on the 70D !!
KPK.. any camera you can buy that has come out after your 350d DOES improve on every single one of those things you mentioned, especially if you go to the 50d or now the 1000d.
So, when you upgrading?
I can agree with the Video being a bit of a gimmick.. but 15mp over your camera is a huge upgrade, but then again, means nothing if you don’t print large. I do, so it’s a huge difference.
No aperture control? Why the hell that??? Will there be at least manual shutter speed control?
In my opinion, for the vast majority of users, 15mp is a gimmick – “mine is bigger than yours”. I would rather have a 12mp camera with better IQ and low light performance than a 15mp camera.
I am going to upgrade when my present camera breaks, or when a new body is sufficiently compelling. Because I am very, very pleased with my current camera and have no reason to buy a new one.
I’ve got both CF and SD cards. If using SD cards can bring about a reduction in camera size (not smaller than the Nikon D90 please), I am all for SD cards. :D
I think all of you have been deceived by DPReview and the Nikon/Sony fan club. More pixels can render image noise more pleasing… when printed on the same scale as a lower pixel count camera.
Oh, well… wait till Nikon rolls out a 16 to 18 MP APS-C D400, then all this talk about detrimental high pixel density sensors will end abruptly. The same way people stopped whining about vignetting on FF cameras once the D3/D700 were released. ;)
100% agreed!
I guess the reason why they added this functionality to the 5D Mk II is due to the release of the Canon 60D soon.
The next 60D will most likely have the video specs the 5D MK II have currently before the update and this will be the method of differentiating both of them (video-wise).
The important thing will be whether somebody will be able to hack the current patch to the Mk II for the 60D.
then the 70D will feature manual aperture control? ;-) not my cup of tea. I do photography, that’s all.
interesting find, I suspect it is a housing for the much much older D60, (canon) and just a typo on B&H’s part.
It appears to me as a relative novice to DSLR photography but not a relative novice to life, as I am turned 60 years that perhaps the marketing departments of camera manufacturers have little courage but plenty of arrogance! Why do camera producers stay with outdated confusing icons such as Av for Aperture Priority when surely Ap is more logical! Why is it that as aperture openings get smaller the opening is refered to by a larger number? Has no one the courage to turn things on there head and communicate camera features sensibly? Is there really a need to increase mega pixel numbers for the sake of a few people in a marketing department? If a clear and simple description in the screen at the rear of cameras described the effect that various settings have on an image taken it would no doubt encourage more people to purchase what are now cameras with a diverse number of confusing settings. Why is there an apparent desire to include flippable screens that are just waiting to be snapped off – why not a fixed glass screen that will not scratch? Why not include video with adjustable focus and standard res’ of 720 with 24 frames, modern televisions will upgrade the signal to virtually HD when played. Why the need for smaller and smaller camera bodies the Canon 40D body is so comfortable to handle. Not meeting the needs of people and arrogance has historically damaged organisations, governments and whole civilisations. I may be wrong but I believe there is a massive market that will not get involved with the pleasure of more ambitious photography simply because the marketing departments have convinced themselves arrogantly that they can dictate to potential customers – which is why they will most likely stay “potential customers” and not become “actual customers”
Should you wish to respond to my notes regarding the “arrogance” of marketing departments creating “potential customers” rather than “actual customers” it may be more succesful to reply via this note as I made an “error of judgement” as politicians say and mispelt my e-mail address – Whoops!
OK, the aperture stuff is not marketing at all. thats convention established well before you were born.
Av stands for Aperture Value. since you specify the value, not giving priority or some such term which is not accurate.
the f/stop (number) is a ratio between the the maximum aperture of the lens and its focal. Thus they’re most formally written 1:##, if you look at your EF or EF-S lenses they will be thusly marked. we simply drop the 1: for convenience, so in fact the smaller number does mean smaller value, you’re just forgetting that you’re dealing with a ratio with a leading value of 1, and therefore a fraction.
I understand that that is initially confusing, but think about it for a while, It actually makes a lot of sense.
Creative Automatic mode addresses the simple display to tell people what the stuff does.
the 40D does have a nice size, but there are people who have smaller hands and prefer smaller cameras, or decreased size for increased portability, it is unwise to not cover a range of camera sizes.
Canon has not included a flippable LCD in a DSLR to date, and their most recent ones are all but unscratchable.
I know nothing about video, so I will not comment.
I totally agree with the megapixels comment, but I think a lot of what you’re saying is a bit misinformed.
Thank you for your informative reply Zac, I did admit to being a relative novice!
It still appears to me though that magazines etc refer to Aperture Priority when talking of Aperture Value which does appear rather odd and uneccessarily confusing.
I will have to sit down quietly and get my head around the aperture ratio issue but hopefully it will make sense once decifered.
I refered to the flippable screen as a discouraging comment to manufacturers who I often feel follow trends rather than consider the true worth or practicality of an addition to cameras.
I appreciate your response to my comment on camera dimensions, I have picked up a lot of cameras in recent weeks and a great deal of them do not feel comfortable to hold and dare I say my hands are not particularly big.
Once again thank you for your reply Zac – I will have to focus on the focus issue a bit more, before rambling on again!
Nobody is talking about BURST FRAME SPEED. I hope it will
be at least 8 F.P.S. in a size bigger than 1080 by 1920.
This way you get a series of stills with short interval, and
a video clip if the action is “newsworthy” for sports or
online video. I have a 5D Mark 2, and a 40D, but something
in between would be cool that uses the 1.6 smaller format, and
my 40D lenses.