Etnaphele said:

In my view, it’s pretty ridiculous, because such a small change improves handling a lot making those “flagship” cameras usable - still subpar but I don’t see any significant cost implications in the shape difference:

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That is exactly the point. Why leave our features that imrove the camera if they don't const much, if anything to implement them? If you have a customer base that is locked into your ecosystem (again think Apple) then you roll out those updates as slowly as possible.

So for the A7V they gave them the 4 axis screen but not the better grip. When the A7VI comes out the better grip will be an additional minor upgrade that when added to others is part of their argument to get another new camera.

A large part of the Sony customer base isn't hobbyist like what you see here. Their base is comprized of content creators and Youtuber's using their cameras to try and make a living. You have a smaller group of people buying and selling camera over and over again. Before the main reason to upgrade was video features as this was the main content people are making money from. Now that video specs have hit a plataeu, they have to find other ways to play the game.

Walrus said:

They'll probably re-dress the 45 STM because it's perfect as a retro lens and it's cheap for what it is, maybe the 24 STM, possibly the 85 F2, I don't see many other options, they will give us at best a 24-45-85 STM retro "classic" triad, and they'll be done with it.

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Even the underlying code for an aperture ring is available, thanks to the Z and VCM lenses.

CJaurelius said:

This is a bit tricky. Simply buying a compnay doesn't make it "Chinese". They are still designed and made in Sweden. If the Chinese were to switch production to China they'd lose quality and the Luxury label.

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Sorry, my bad: I wasn't aware that Hasselblad is actually manufactured in Sweden, I thought the new designs (X series) were a Chinese product line using the branding - pretty big oversight on my part!

Although the marketing is for sure in Chinese hands, the website is riddled with nonsensical sentences

David_B said:

Well the rumor talks about excluding modern features, so obviously Canon are thinking "retro" will be more than just look-and-feel

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Without modern features nobody is going to buy it; Canon is not that stupid.

There will be limitation, like probably no 6k/7k (assumed they really would use the R6III sensor), will be likely limited to 4k30 likely with heavy crop, maybe just mic input but no headphones output, no full size hdmi, single card that's for sure, I guess LP-E17 battery, AF will be full potential in calculations but with some config limitations that will make it less flexible then the std bodies, screen might be fixed (that's tough and risky call, but using a low res fix screen may save them some money to make the whole thing cheaper to manufacture - but that doesn't mean cheaper to buy... -), EVF will be on the low pixel count.

Basically I expects something like R8 on hardware level, with retro dress and some crippling in the software, but not crippled to a point of being less able then a RP, which is btw a pretty able camera.

They'll probably re-dress the 45 STM because it's perfect as a retro lens and it's cheap for what it is, maybe the 24 STM, possibly the 85 F2, I don't see many other options, they will give us at best a 24-45-85 STM retro "classic" triad, and they'll be done with it.

EOS 4 Life said:

Not if your business is selling lenses.

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That is part of my argument. We are essentially at the point where multiple companies are making cameras that are reaching the limit of what the majority people need. Concurrently the Chinese are increasing their capabilities of making quality lenses (and lower tier cameras) that are more affordable than first party. Both are greatly reducing the potential profitability moving into the future.

If Camera makes slow down advancements and convince people to upgrade more to newer bodies with minimal advancements that extends that runway. Similar to Apple trying to sell a new iphone every year.

The Sony A7V is a great example of this. The sensor does 7k, the can easily do open gate and it make the grip similar to the A1II. OR they can update the A7V to just enough to get by, charge $100 more than Canon and then add those features to the A7VI as a reason to uprade then.

Canon went from the R6 at $2500 to the R6mii also at $2500 to now the R6miii at $2800. During the same time Sony went from the A7III priced at $2000 when they were ahead in specs, up to match canon at $2500 for the A7IV when they were still slightly ahead and now are charging more at $2800 when Canon now has better specs.

See my previous comments on Canon and Sony. Canon is more focused on leading the Camera industy, protecting market share as the premeir make of said cameras. Sony is looking to maximize profits and position themselves as the premium option ahead of the potential headwinds.

Maximilian said:

Don't mix up "retro" with "retro design" camera.
If you want a real retro camera, you can get am original AE-1 in mint conditions for less than $/€150

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Well the rumor talks about excluding modern features, so obviously Canon are thinking "retro" will be more than just look-and-feel

Etnaphele said:

I mostly agree, whereas I would never define anything by Sony as luxury, as they target high tech feature and not image (like Leica or Hasselblad) and they seem to disregard attractive design completely.

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Premium may be a better description.

Etnaphele said:

As for Chinese luxury, Hasselblad is already here to stay.

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This is a bit tricky. Simply buying a compnay doesn't make it "Chinese". They are still designed and made in Sweden. If the Chinese were to switch production to China they'd lose quality and the Luxury label. At that price you are paying for perceived craftmenship. Even if they were able to the Chinese to learn the skill over a period of time most Hasselblad owners wouldn't pay for a Chinese made Hasselblad.

More than likely they'll use the info learned to compete with another midrange brand.

Uneternal said:

Great news, if this really turns out to be lower than $2000, it's going to be an automatic buy from me. Currently, I'm a bit skeptical. This price would mean it gets a huge cripple hammer. I suspect 1 card slot and a very basic video mode. Or maybe a fixed screen (which would be horrible).

I hope Canon doesn't forget that one of Fuji's pillars of success is their film simulations. A Canon retro camera should also offer something similar, a step up from the lame picture styles, including film noise and maybe even halation. If this camera had different Kodak simulations (Kodak Gold, Kodak Portra, etc.), I'd have a total nerdgasm. Canon, if you read this, make it happen!

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different Kodak simulations (Kodak Gold, Kodak Portra, etc.),

allready are existing, they can be loaded to every Canon "R" camera.. => https://www.camera-profiles.com/kodak-film-simulation-picture-styles

jimim said:

Hey guys. I noticed my battery went down pretty fast but I was really digging with menus and settings. I think I’m going to have to buy a new flash. My old flash is just too hot and miss on the shoe.

I chickened out with the lens again. I just have in the back of my head my trailer for the boat needed some work in spring. They don’t make axles like they used to. My wrangler is going on 6 years now and 100k so I got to do spark plugs, belt and all the fluids in a month or so. I’m a hobbiest so I’m still gun shy. May latest cause my daughter will be back outside training 6 days a week for tennis. We are inside for winter and hot and miss outside of lessons and I don’t like to bother them during her lessons.

Bla bla bla. I know.

All I know is having updated auto focus and this whole sticking to your focus point is nuts. I sound like I’m 100years old and just saw my first cell phone. lol

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So far, I think battery power will be the achille's heel of this camera. And with the camera not giving a percent pf battery remaining read out, I bet there will be a lot of batteries crashing out at a bad time. I love the files with the camera.....but! Time will tell.

I'm curious if it'll be better to use oil/liquid cool. The fluid itself can dampen the sensor, and wouldn't the cooling be more effective as there's more surface to conduct the heat away from CMOS.

I hope there coming more compact camera's with a good sensor and raw and evf and zoom around 300/400 that would be awesome travel buddy's.
Still hoping that camera companies will make more compact camera's next year

I was always envious of the Nikon Zf, even though it's not perfectly "analog."

An AE-1 as R replaces three cameras for me. Finally, a replacement for my PEN F, R6 Mark II and Sony A7R II.

The PEN F is retro and I like to take it on vacation (and it's getting a bit old), the R6 Mark II was previously my second camera alongside the R5 Mark II and the A7R II holds my old Nikon F lenses from the 60's.

Let's hope there's some truth to the rumor.

DBounce said:

The A9III and A1II are Sony flagships. That body is one of the signature features of the flagsships... Similar to how to the R1 has a larger "Pro" body.

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I mean, a couple of mm of width and the hump under the shutter button don’t seem to be remotely comparable to a gripped big body like the R1. The R5II is the camera stacking up to the A1II and has the same proportions as the R6 line.

In my view, it’s pretty ridiculous, because such a small change improves handling a lot making those “flagship” cameras usable - still subpar but I don’t see any significant cost implications in the shape difference:

Ozarker said:

Why would Canon make an asp-c Supertelephoto??? The dang regular Supertelephoto lenses work.

Many birders pair their crop sensor cameras with existing Supertelephoto lenses. Why tf does Canon need asp-c supers????

You are starting to come across as irrational.

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I didn't mean APS-C supertelephotos. There aren't any 3rd party APS-C supertelephotos for any mount by any brand except the Tamron and Sigma 300mm superzooms, so I don't know what you might think I'd be talking about. I meant only that Canon isn't allowing 3rd party lenses that would encroach on their own lens sales. RF or RF-S. And defnitely no supertelephotos.

My fault for bad wording, but that's no reason to be a prick about it.

I bet when this comes out we will get the usual "This has sold out due to unexpected demand"

Planterz said:

The lack of Canon's interest in making their own RF-S lenses became fact and not suspicion when they "opened" up the mount to 3rd party manufacturers. Now there's a handful of Sigmas and Tamrons (one Tamron?). Still a mediocre selection, and it's evident they're only allowing certain lenses that won't cannibalize Canon's own lenses (no big supertelephotos, for example), but at least the RF-S mount has options other than kit lenses and expensive Canons.

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Why would Canon make an asp-c Supertelephoto??? The dang regular Supertelephoto lenses work.

Many birders pair their crop sensor cameras with existing Supertelephoto lenses. Why tf does Canon need asp-c supers????

You are starting to come across as irrational.

Great news, if this really turns out to be lower than $2000, it's going to be an automatic buy from me. Currently, I'm a bit skeptical. This price would mean it gets a huge cripple hammer. I suspect 1 card slot and a very basic video mode. Or maybe a fixed screen (which would be horrible).

I hope Canon doesn't forget that one of Fuji's pillars of success is their film simulations. A Canon retro camera should also offer something similar, a step up from the lame picture styles, including film noise and maybe even halation. If this camera had different Kodak simulations (Kodak Gold, Kodak Portra, etc.), I'd have a total nerdgasm. Canon, if you read this, make it happen!

I'm looking forward to see the RE-1 if and when it arises. I'm looking for travel body from Canon. Yes the R8 meets my criteria.

I really like your shots. Well done, Norman.

The Rainbow-bearded Thornbill is a hummingbird found at the higher elevations of the Andes from central Colombia to northern Peru. I photographed this individual high in the páramo above treeline in Parque Nacional Natural Los Nevados, Colombia.

R5MkII RF200-800mm

ISv said:

Last Tuesday I spent ~2.5h looking for the Orange-cheeked Waxbill and didn't find it... To look for this bird between hundreds of Common Waxbills is like looking for a needle in big pile of straw. The differences are more than obvious but if the bird is not flashing orange cheeks or red rump between the grass it's almost impossible to figure out who is who from several meters! The bird is of the size of the Eurasian Wren mostly because of the longer tail!
Today: I just entered the park and there was a tight flock of 30-50 Waxbills. In ~ 20-30 sec suddenly RED RUMP (Click, I didn't ask you for jumping/dancing emoji because the chance to find that single bird was really miserable...) !!!!!!!!!!
I saved about 50 photos, here are the once where one can see the most important differences from the Common Waxbill (last posted photos of that one on page 1624 - for comparison).
After that took a burst of nicely posing White Eye and rushed home to see what I have done on big screen. To say that I'm happy now like a mice in Cheddar is like nothing to say ! Bird in the grass/shade hardly can make photos like the bird in light and colorful background but the star here is that bird in the grass!!!

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Congratulations on finding and photographing your target species! And kudos on sticking with it.
Beautiful portrait of the White-eye as well.

Got the RF 45mm F1.2 last week. I had bought a used EF 50mm F1.2 a few weeks before the 45mm was announced (lucky me).

So I decided to do a bit of comparing the two. I used my R5 II (all in electronic shutter) fo comparing. Every time I try to do this, I gaine renewed respect for folks who do reviews online. Doing these comparisons is hard and labor intensive!!

My comparison is only loosely controlled and somewhat ad-hoc. However, for what it's worth, my overall feeling is:

- These lenses are much more similar than they are different.
- The RF 45mm F1.2 is sharper
- The EF 50mm F1.2 has smoother bokeh

The AF feels different, with the 50 feeling "EFy" and the 45mm "RFy". That is the EF sometimes feels a bit more jerky and the 45mm a bit smoother. However, in terms of focus speed and accuracy, I couldn't really identify one I'd say is better. I shot mostly static subjects, though.

In case someone is interested, here is a link to some CRAW files (44 images, 22 each lens with same settings, handheld approximate framing).


EF 50


RF 45


EF 50


RF 45


EF 50


RF 45

Click said:

Beautiful series, ISv.

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Thanks Click: I still can't believe I found it!

The lack of Canon's interest in making their own RF-S lenses became fact and not suspicion when they "opened" up the mount to 3rd party manufacturers. Now there's a handful of Sigmas and Tamrons (one Tamron?). Still a mediocre selection, and it's evident they're only allowing certain lenses that won't cannibalize Canon's own lenses (no big supertelephotos, for example), but at least the RF-S mount has options other than kit lenses and expensive Canons.