EOS R first impressions - post your hands-on impressions here

[SereneSpeed]

Oh and as good and Canon's owner's manuals usually are, I need someone to help me understand just what they are saying in the section about 'Silent LV Shoot.'

I get that the shutter sounds different, but what is the purpose and what are they saying with their (vague to me) explanations?

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

Oh and as good and Canon's owner's manuals usually are, I need someone to help me understand just what they are saying in the section about 'Silent LV Shoot.'

I get that the shutter sounds different, but what is the purpose and what are they saying with their (vague to me) explanations?

I believe it has a electronic first curtain but the shutter closes when you release the shutter button. The shutter stays open in the full silent mode which can cause the banding under certain pulsating lighting, because the sensor readout is sequential and is going on with the shutter open.

 

[SereneSpeed]

I believe it has a electronic first curtain but the shutter closes when you release the shutter button. The shutter stays open in the full silent mode which can cause the banding under certain pulsating lighting, because the sensor readout is sequential and is going on with the shutter open.

Just to be clear - I'm not talking about forgoing the mechanical shutter to use the electronic shutter. I'm talking about the three distinct settings for the mechanical shutter.

"Silent Live View Shooting" (p150) vs. "Silent Shooting" (p151). I understand silent shooting with just the electronic shutter. And I understand how the sequential readout causes rolling shutter and banding.

Where I am unclear is what is happening in 'Mode 1' and 'Disable' of 'Silent Live View Shooting'. The first of which causes banding in images shot with Canon Speedlights in HSS mode and the latter, which causes a blown highlight on the bottom of the image at 1/8000th (using HSS Canon Speedlights).

I have not tested 'Mode 2'. Yet.

 

[Viggo]

The EOS R has two types of silent shooting settings.

A 'Silent Shutter' and 'Silent LV Shoot'. 'Silent LV Shoot' is set to 'mode 1' as default.

I just discovered that that is what's causing the banding with flash! I was wracking my brain!

Set that to "Silent LV Shoot.' to disable and the banding goes away.

However, At 1/8000th with a Canon EX600RT and 'Silent LV Shoot' set to 'Disable' you will get a line of blown out highlight at the bottom of your image. It looks like the exact opposite of exceeding your x-sync. At 1/4000th, nothing.





Viggo, I'm dying to know what your 'Silent LV Shoot' was set to? And if it wasn't set to disable... I wonder if Tony was using the default setting of 'Mode 1' when he got the banding... ?

I cannot remember where, but in one of the threads here, someone mentioned banding under a type of LED of fluorescent tube. I wonder if that had anything to do with 'Silent LV Shoot."?

Yes, I also used Mode 1 default, I’m charging my flash now, but will try it as soon as possible! Thanks for the added info.

 

[Viggo]

Electronic shutter can’t be used with flash, so that leaves Mode 2 as the only option to possibly get rid of the banding? I haven’t tried yet, has anyone?

 

[Viggo]

The other day I got a red (perhaps) circle I could move around and choose which subject to track, but I can’t get it back, does anyone know where and how to find it?

 

[Kit Lens Jockey]

Did it look like this?

In all honesty, I think I saw that too once. I think it was when I had it set to face detection AF.

 

[Viggo]

Did it look like this?View attachment 181100

In all honesty, I think I saw that too once. I think it was when I had it set to face detection AF.

Yeah, and I tried setting it to face detect, but it wouldn't come back...

 

[Viggo]

BTW, I tried "mode 2" silent shooting with flash, and the banding is basically the same. So that means they HAVE to fix it. I use flash a lot, and this isn't acceptable...

Furthermore, just by placing the trigger in the hotshoe without having the flash on, it's also banding, perhaps not as bad. And having the trigger in the hotshoe turned off, shows even slightly less banding. Interference?

 

[dak723]

BTW, I tried "mode 2" silent shooting with flash, and the banding is basically the same. So that means they HAVE to fix it. I use flash a lot, and this isn't acceptable...

Furthermore, just by placing the trigger in the hotshoe without having the flash on, it's also banding, perhaps not as bad. And having the trigger in the hotshoe turned off, shows even slightly less banding. Interference?

Has anyone actually contacted Canon support? Perhaps they know - and if not, will be informed about the issue.

 

[Viggo]

Has anyone actually contacted Canon support? Perhaps they know - and if not, will be informed about the issue.

I could do it, but to be very honest, I don’t think it will get past messenger on fb, it’s impossible to get in touch with Canon, at least the people that actually know what I’m talking about and don’t dismiss it as “whatever”.

Tried also to deactivate silent shooting completely, also tried with anti-flickering off, didn’t make a difference. Anything in the hot shoe = bad banding, remove it and you remove the problem. +5 stops and +100 shadow from a very dark shots gets you noise, but absolutely no banding....

 

[Deleted member 7828]

Wow, sounds bad. Is this an isolated issue or a fundamental flaw with the camera?

 

[SereneSpeed]

As I wrote above, you can get rid of banding with flash. Just set 'Silent LV shoot.' to 'Disable'.

The only issue (I'm aware of) with having it set to 'Disable' is at 1/8000th, using a Canon EX600RT speedlight - you get a highlight strip on the bottom of the image. This does not happen with Godox speedlights.

If you want to use flash without banding, set 'Silent LV Shoot.' to 'Disable'.

 

[RGF]

I have just started to use the R along with my 1Dx M2. The R is similar in some ways but different enough that it is not a slam dunk. It will take me some time to learn the new camera. Hoping that my ring adapter comes soon - I plan on putting ISO on that dial.

More as I gain additional experience

 

[Viggo]

As I wrote above, you can get rid of banding with flash. Just set 'Silent LV shoot.' to 'Disable'.

The only issue (I'm aware of) with having it set to 'Disable' is at 1/8000th, using a Canon EX600RT speedlight - you get a highlight strip on the bottom of the image. This does not happen with Godox speedlights.

If you want to use flash without banding, set 'Silent LV Shoot.' to 'Disable'.

Didn’t work for me I’m afraid....

 

[Viggo]

Well, well, I just pulled out a VERY old basic, basic "eBay" trigger for flash, and tried, the banding is gone, or at least ver much reduced to almost nothing... I'm confident this is solvable with firmware, it must be interference when using different triggers.

 

[Kit Lens Jockey]

I'm still very impressed by this camera's ability to focus in low light. It locks on in situations where I don't think the 5DIV would even have a chance. I was able to focus on peoples' very dark faces with direct lights behind them. It was a situation where I couldn't even physically see them with my eyes because of the harsh backlighting, and the camera still got focus. I think it might have taken two half-presses of the shutter to coax it into getting focus, but still, amazing.

The other thing I like is that it doesn't seem to struggle with getting focus the way the 5DIV does. Sometimes in very low light the 5DIV will just kind of twitch the lens back and forth for a couple seconds trying to lock in focus. The EOS R either immediately gets focus, or the focus point pretty much immediately turns orange/red, indicating that it can't get focus. It's much more decisive about the way it focuses in low light than the 5DIV.

 

[Deleted member 7828]

I had a second play with the camera this past weekend. I will admit it is growing on me, but there are still elements of the camera that make it slower to operate than a 5D4. Mostly it is the lack of dedicated buttons for functions like drive mode, WB, etc. And like I said earlier, the EVF experience (to me) can’t quite match the OVF one in terms of fluidity, even with its inherent advantages. One function I did like, though, was the ability to customize the M Fn button to quickly switch to custom mode. Definitely give them props there. The eye detection feature I messed around with, mostly with mixed results. It seemed to do an ok job following a face in camera store lighting, although I found it lagged behind by about a half-second or so. Sometimes it would jump faces or not recognize a face at all, particularly if it was a profile. I feel that the simplest way to shoot with this camera is in live view mode with the screen...

As a stills shooter (don’t use or care for video much), I see the flip screen and the silent shooting mode as the R’s two biggest advantages over a 5D body (at least from my experience). I guess it’s a little smaller too, but it’s still a substantial camera, particularly with the 24-105. Everything else, I feel the 5D is just easier to operate and “get the shot” with. The R, at least with this model, I feel that accommodations were made for video folks somewhat at the expense of still photographers.

 

[Kit Lens Jockey]

Yeah, the EVF is silky smooth when you're just composing a shot, but it seems to get a little laggy when taking a photo or sometimes even just focusing. This does make it a little harder to get shots than with the nice old school reliability of an OVF.

 

[SereneSpeed]

I think it's only fair that I report back on my AF selection bickering... I've found some settings that made a lot of difference -when enabled together.

'Touch and drag AF' active touch area is set to full screen - this gets rid of the horrible lag you get when you use part of the screen (when set to 'relative').

'Touch and drag AF' positioning method is set to relative - with absolute, I needed to release (a suitable) grip on the camera while moving the AF point to the left.

'Touch control' is set to sensitive - anything less than sensitive and I found the AF point movement to be inconsistent.


I will reiterate one thing from my first posts about this camera - Mirrorless is very different. There is a learning curve. One perfect example; I am used to selecting the AF point closest to my subject, based on composition and then adjusting the camera/lens to line the AF point up perfectly. That action is/was muscle memory. It is very strange when using mirrorless to be able to move the AF point to an EXACT position. I often forget that I can move it to 95%+ accuracy and then shift the camera/lens. My mind wants me to get the AF point positioning JUST right - without moving. Which is a waste of time.

The camera has grown on me. I cannot believe the AF accuracy. WYSIWYG is incredible, but the histogram on top of that makes for precise exposures.

When the pro version comes out, I'm going to have a horrible time deciding what to with my EOS R. My plan was to sell it and keep my 5D4 to be backup for a pro version of the EOS R. But the two systems are so different, I'm not sure I'm going to want a DSLR around anymore. My future is definitely mirrorless. But, for now, my professional work is still on my 5D4.