Scratched Sensor

[bjd]

Am I wrong in thinking that the sensor data is taken upside down and reversed as the light comes through the lens? If so, a scratch on the top of the sensor would actually show up on the bottom of the image. Not that I can see anything in the picture that you showed.

Logic says to me the image must be reversed on the sensor, so the mark should be at the bottom of a pcture.

Cheers Brian

 

[neuroanatomist]

Just for orientation clarity, when looking at a picture taken with the camera and comparing it to looking directly at the sensor, the top of the picture is the bottom of the sensor, and the left side of the picture is the left side of the sensor (i.e. flipped vertically but not horizontally).

 

[tpatana]

Just for orientation clarity, when looking at a picture taken with the camera and comparing it to looking directly at the sensor, the top of the picture is the bottom of the sensor, and the left side of the picture is the left side of the sensor (i.e. flipped vertically but not horizontally).

Left side of the sensor looking from behind the camera, or from the front?

 

[neuroanatomist]

Just for orientation clarity, when looking at a picture taken with the camera and comparing it to looking directly at the sensor, the top of the picture is the bottom of the sensor, and the left side of the picture is the left side of the sensor (i.e. flipped vertically but not horizontally).

Left side of the sensor looking from behind the camera, or from the front?

Short of disassembling the camera, smashing it to bits and digging through the pieces to find the sensor, or being born on Krypton and traveling to Earth where the yellow sun gives you the power of X-Ray vision, do you know of a way to look directly at the back side of the sensor?

 

[tpatana]

Just for orientation clarity, when looking at a picture taken with the camera and comparing it to looking directly at the sensor, the top of the picture is the bottom of the sensor, and the left side of the picture is the left side of the sensor (i.e. flipped vertically but not horizontally).

Left side of the sensor looking from behind the camera, or from the front?

Short of disassembling the camera, smashing it to bits and digging through the pieces to find the sensor, or being born on Krypton and traveling to Earth where the yellow sun gives you the power of X-Ray vision, do you know of a way to look directly at the back side of the sensor?

Either I have X-ray vision or there's something wrong with your profile picture ;D

Working (mostly) in the field of electronics testing, items like left/right must be defined so that there's zero possibility of wrong reading when next person checks the message. So I can be bit anal when making sure how to read the description

 

[zim]

Well looking from the bright side, I still don't see a line anywhere

 

[rfdesigner]

For the record, yes it's the filter in front of the sensor where a scratch may or may not exist and it CAN be replaced for FAR less than the cost of a new sensor, but apparently (according to Roger at Lensrentals) Canon always replaces the whole unit.. which includes the sensor and a much larger bill. So just chaning the filter means not going directly to Canon.

Just something to keep in mind.

 

[rs]

see, there he goes again.
Really, I don't know why he does it.

Indeed, why bother offering advice only to be heckled by Aglet? Probably because the opinion of rubes like him is irrelevant.

if you consider what you supplied in this thread to be useful advice you need to conduct some introspection with professional external guidance. Your tone and attitude are often not constructive. OR funny.

I see. So, in a discussion of a scratched sensor, where the issue of where a scratch might appear on a picture vs. when examining the sensor by direct inspection, the initial suggestion to directly inspect followed by clarification of where to look would not constitute useful advice. Right.

Please grow up, get a sense of humor, or at the very least slink back to your troll cave.

And to think I was expecting Filluppa to attack with this sort of useful factual guidance from you...

 

[fugu82]

LifePixel will repair a scratched sensor for a base price of $250. I have used them for infrared conversions, and can recommend their services. http://www.lifepixel.com/product-category/our-services/scratched-sensor-repair

 

[neuroanatomist]

Fair point. I should have simply ignored Aglet's inflammatory remarks, and will endeavor to do so in the future.

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

Hi,
my weekend was slightly ruined on Saturday. Canon does free Cleaning and Checking at a local Wildlife Photo Annual Meeting, and as usual I handed in my 5D MK3 to be cleaned. When I got it back I was told it had not been cleaned as the sensor is scratched. Putting fluid on it could make the damage worse. Apparently its a straight line across parallel to the top edge of the sensor. When asked how that could happen the tech thought some dirt may have been on the curtain.
I have never cleaned the sensor myself, only Canon has been near it. Does the explanation sound plausible?

I guess the Camera will go to Canon to let them have a look at it.

Up till now I can't see a problem in my pictures thought.

Cheers Brian

Brian, after reading your posts about the issue, I'd be inclined to believe that Canon scratched the sensor during the previous cleanings they did for you , unless someone else has been working on it after that.


I'd ask them to take care of it and see what they say. Give them the history, the times they have cleaned it, etc. A person should not have to put up with someone scratching the sensor during cleaning, it seems unlikely that the shutter could have done it due to the orientation of the scratch. Canon does not like to do wet cleaning, they use dry pec pads, but a grain of sand on the sensor can scratch it when wiped with a pad.

 

[bjd]

Hi,
my weekend was slightly ruined on Saturday. Canon does free Cleaning and Checking at a local Wildlife Photo Annual Meeting, and as usual I handed in my 5D MK3 to be cleaned. When I got it back I was told it had not been cleaned as the sensor is scratched. Putting fluid on it could make the damage worse. Apparently its a straight line across parallel to the top edge of the sensor. When asked how that could happen the tech thought some dirt may have been on the curtain.
I have never cleaned the sensor myself, only Canon has been near it. Does the explanation sound plausible?

I guess the Camera will go to Canon to let them have a look at it.

Up till now I can't see a problem in my pictures thought.

Cheers Brian

Brian, after reading your posts about the issue, I'd be inclined to believe that Canon scratched the sensor during the previous cleanings they did for you , unless someone else has been working on it after that.


I'd ask them to take care of it and see what they say. Give them the history, the times they have cleaned it, etc. A person should not have to put up with someone scratching the sensor during cleaning, it seems unlikely that the shutter could have done it due to the orientation of the scratch. Canon does not like to do wet cleaning, they use dry pec pads, but a grain of sand on the sensor can scratch it when wiped with a pad.

Hi,
I wrote a long email with some example shots to the Service Dept. of Calumet whom I bought the Camera from, and who employed Canon to do the sensor cleaning. Lets see how they answer?

Problem will be ( I assume) that I cannot prove that no one else has cleaned the sensor.


FWIW, If I saw it correctly, when the Techs clean a sensor here they have a metallic looking pointed tool and
wrap a small square piece of paper/material around it, then they wet that and clean the sensor with it.
So it is done wet here.

Just wondering if that tool is metal, and if it can push through the paper?

Cheers Brian


som

 

[bjd]

Hi,
my weekend was slightly ruined on Saturday. Canon does free Cleaning and Checking at a local Wildlife Photo Annual Meeting, and as usual I handed in my 5D MK3 to be cleaned. When I got it back I was told it had not been cleaned as the sensor is scratched. Putting fluid on it could make the damage worse. Apparently its a straight line across parallel to the top edge of the sensor. When asked how that could happen the tech thought some dirt may have been on the curtain.
I have never cleaned the sensor myself, only Canon has been near it. Does the explanation sound plausible?

I guess the Camera will go to Canon to let them have a look at it.

Up till now I can't see a problem in my pictures thought.

Cheers Brian

Brian, after reading your posts about the issue, I'd be inclined to believe that Canon scratched the sensor during the previous cleanings they did for you , unless someone else has been working on it after that.


I'd ask them to take care of it and see what they say. Give them the history, the times they have cleaned it, etc. A person should not have to put up with someone scratching the sensor during cleaning, it seems unlikely that the shutter could have done it due to the orientation of the scratch. Canon does not like to do wet cleaning, they use dry pec pads, but a grain of sand on the sensor can scratch it when wiped with a pad.

Hi,
I wrote a long email with some example shots to the Service Dept. of Calumet whom I bought the Camera from, and who employed Canon to do the sensor cleaning. Lets see how they answer?

Problem will be ( I assume) that I cannot prove that no one else has cleaned the sensor.


FWIW, If I saw it correctly, when the Techs clean a sensor here they have a metallic looking pointed tool and
wrap a small square piece of paper/material around it, then they wet that and clean the sensor with it.
So it is done wet here.

Just wondering if that tool is metal, and if it can push through the paper?

Cheers Brian

Hi, I contacted Calumet, whom I have bought about 95% of my equipment from, and they will
take care of having Canon inspect the Camera to determine what the damage is, and how it can
be repaired (if required). So I'll be taking the Camera to them next week.

The guy I talked to confirmed what I said about how the sensor is cleaned. Apparently
this is the standard procedure for Canon and Nikon here in Europe. And, yes, it is a
metal tweezer that is used to grasp a piece of cleaning paper, which is then wrapped around
the tweezer, so scratching the sensor while cleaning would theoretically be possible.

I'll keep you informed of the outcome.

Cheers Brian

 

[neuroanatomist]

Thanks for the update!

 

[bjd]

Thanks for the update!

I'm taking the Camera to Calumet in person tomorrow, they are sending it to Canon.

Meanwhile I talked to a (seemingly) very knowledgeable person today about sensor cleaning.
He cannot believe that they are still wet-cleaned by anyone. He does all sorts of Conversions and
actually just recommended that I do nothing, and never have the sensor cleaned by Canon again.
Probably what I will do.

If I want a new Filter glass he will replace it, cheapest solution is with IR but minus the anti-aliasing filter,
would cost me about half of what I expect the estimate from Canon will be (around 1200 €).

Check out his site, he seems to know what he is talking about:

http://www.optic-makario.de/kameraumbau/

Sorry but it is all in German. Here some of the other stuff he does:

http://www.optic-makario.de/instrumentenoptik/

Cheers Brian

 

[bjd]

Hi everyone,
so I now have my 5D MK3 back in my grubby little fingers, unrepaired.

Canon wanted around 930€ to replace the sensor.

They accept no responsibility whatsoever and say I must have cleaned and scratched the sensor,
as there is no way that could happen at their "clean and check service" !!!!!!!!

"Clean and check" is done at the owners risk anyway, and there is no way that I can see for me to
prove that I have never cleaned the sensor.

So I guess I am screwed.

Does anyone have any ideas of how to proceed? The only way I can see is to write directly to
Canon, customer relations maybe, and complain to them. Maybe get a Lawyer to write me a letter
to Canon.

Calumet was very supportive through the whole thing and managed to avoid me having to pay
Canon for a repair estimate, but they can't seem to help further either.

Having said that, the scratch is still not visible, and I will not be having the sensor cleaned again by Canon.

Roll on the 5D MK4! Then the 5D MK3 will have to go.

BTW: I also sent my 100-400 MKII with the Camera and had the two adjusted together, or at least
checked that they work together OK.

Cheers Brian

 

[Sporgon]

I wonder how many of us have got scratched sensors and don't know about it ? If you are going to have sensors cleaned by mechanical methods it's likely inevitable that it will eventually be marked one way or another.

I don't even bother cleaning mine now. I just spot any visible dust marks out later.

 

[bjd]

I wonder how many of us have got scratched sensors and don't know about it ? If you are going to have sensors cleaned by mechanical methods it's likely inevitable that it will eventually be marked one way or another.

I don't even bother cleaning mine now. I just spot any visible dust marks out later.

I wish you had told me that earlier.......... :-[
Thats my strategy too now.

Cheers Brian

 

[tron]

I too was thinking that this must have happened by them. I do not have my cameras cleaned but I am a hobbyist who doesn't shoot so many thousands of pics. I had my 5D2 cleaned when ... I sold it!

Now I have two 5D3 cameras which will be cleaned a few months or one year after ... 5D4 is introduced

 

[Maximilian]

Hi Brian!

I feel with you. 930€ is a lot of money.

I'd personally talk to a lawyer and if a statement on oath ("Eidesstattliche Erklärung") would help you here.
Of course legal action is always stress and costs...