Canon EOS-1D X Mark II to Shoot 4K Video [CR2]

[Canon Rumors]

We’re told that the upcoming Canon EOS-1D X Mark II (if that’s the name) will indeed shoot 4K video, which sounds like good news. However, we’re told not to expect a very video orientated product, as the camera’s primary focus will be on the still photographer. We’re also told that this will be the only next generation DSLR in the lineup that will shoot 4K video at launch.</p>
<p>There will likely be another EF mount product some time in the next 18 months that will shoot 4K, but it won’t be a DSLR.</p>
<p>Not much else is being said about the next iteration of Canon’s flagship DSLR.</p>

 

[Haydn1971]

There will likely be another EF mount product some time in the next 18 months that will shoot 4K, but it won’t be a DSLR.

Full frame mirrorless in a 5D style body with EVF ?

CR that one ;-) haha

 

[PureClassA]

I wish we had a better idea of what Canon is seeing that makes them think they can't make a play in the $2500-$3500 DSLR Video market for 4K. At least that's what this rumor reads like if we assume it completely accurate for argument sake.

1DX2 with 4k is great, but if they don't plan on putting the video bells and whistles of the 1DC, then seems even more critical to create a 5ish body for cinema/video or something of that sort, with EF mount. A 5 body with the mirror removed perhaps? Wouldn't be a bad idea. Most people love the ergonomics of that body and it balances so well with L glass.

I'm trying to add video to my repertoire and I keep hoping Canon develops something competitive that isn't $7k or $15k. We are now well beyond the point of having those prices as a floor for 4K.

 

[privatebydesign]

We’re told that the upcoming Canon EOS-1D X Mark II (if that’s the name) will indeed shoot 4K video, which sounds like good news. However, we’re told not to expect a very video orientated product, as the camera’s primary focus will be on the still photographer. We’re also told that this will be the only next generation DSLR in the lineup that will shoot 4K video at launch.</p>
<p>There will likely be another EF mount product some time in the next 18 months that will shoot 4K, but it won’t be a DSLR.</p>
<p>Not much else is being said about the next iteration of Canon’s flagship DSLR.</p>

I said all that weeks ago in relation to the clamouring that the 5D MkIV "must have 4K or it is DOA" bull.

The 1DX MkII will get at least the video capability of the 1DC, and the 5D MkIV will not have 4K, it will have very good 1080 or slightly larger.

 

[rs]

This sounds like good news. This indicates the hardware supports high speed - sensor readout, processing, throughput and storage - all of which bode well for a high speed stills camera.

 

[leGreve]

In other words.... hybrid people or slightly video heavy people will not care one bit about neither the 1D-X or the 5D4.... Canon are really playing their cards wrong.

At the same time you could get a shoot ready Ursa 4.6k camera for just a little more than what the 1Dx costs, and you would be able to framegrab stills if needed off that footage.

I really had high hopes for the 5D4, but not anymore.

 

[midluk]

We’re also told that this will be the only next generation DSLR in the lineup that will shoot 4K video at launch

Does that mean they plan to do some small upgrade (like 5D mark IV B) to enable 4K Video on one of the next generation DSLRs without launching a complete new product?

 

[ahsanford]

We’re also told that this will be the only next generation DSLR in the lineup that will shoot 4K video at launch.

Oof. If I have this right, this would mean:

• If you are a 5D3/5DS/5DS R user and want 4K capable stills rig, Canon says: "Go buy a 1DX II. Say goodbye to a lot of money."
  
  
• If you are a 1DX owner (or more likely, an old 1Ds3 owner) and want a 50 MP sensor, Canon says: "Go buy a 5DS/5DS R. Say goodbye to your integral grip and exclusive 1-series features."

Neither of those statements should warm our hearts.

It's possible the 'won't shoot 4K video at launch' comment gets to a theory myself and others have had before: perhaps 4k will work on the 5D4 natively but Canon won't let anyone know. It could be launched with a defeat in the firmware that blocks 4K recording -- we'd be none the wiser as the official specs and menus wouldn't have a 4K option listed. Canon would keep 4k relegated to the priciest rigs and then -- if and only if 5D4 sales tank without 4K -- voila, a firmware change is pushed out that unlocks it for us.

- A

 

[ahsanford]

My 4K rambling notwithstanding, this is leading to a very odd segmentation of the FF SLR rigs:

1D-level:

• Sports, wildlife, action --> 1DX / 1DX II
• Events, videographers, reportage, etc. --> 1DC / 1DC II someday?
• Landscape, studio --> SOL (there is no high MP studio/tripod rig coming with the 5DS sensor that I've heard of)

5D-level:

• General all-around workhorse --> 5D4
• Videographers --> SOL (No 4K option -- use the 5D4, I guess?)
• Landscape, studio --> 5DS / 5DS R

Seems to me that there are two major missing pieces in the SLR pipeline -- high MP in a 1D body and 4K at the 5D level. I'm not arguing for 6 rigs for the two brand levels, but all the various segmentation calls they've already made (5DS, 1DC, etc.) are building expectations that there will be specialized bodies at each level.

- A

 

[WeekendWarrior]

lol Canon is running dead last in a marathon while still choosing to stop and take water breaks..

IMO, they are is screwed if they decide not to put 4K in the 5D Mark 4..

 

[rs]

At the same time you could get a shoot ready Ursa 4.6k camera for just a little more than what the 1Dx costs, and you would be able to framegrab stills if needed off that footage.

That's not in the same market. The 1D X replacement is rumoured to remain firmly a stills camera above anything else, and no-one who is planning on buying the ultimate fast stills camera would consider a video camera instead.

If you choose an Ursa, forget about fairly standard stills camera features such as AF, metering optimised for each frame, an OVF, and a full frame sensor. The existing 1D X has all of these features very near to perfection.

 

[rs]

lol Canon is running dead last in a marathon while still choosing to stop and take water breaks..

IMO, they are is screwed if they decide not to put 4K in the 5D Mark 4..

Strange, I was under the impression that Canon were years ahead of the competition when it came to putting 4K video in a stills camera.

Anyway, regarding Canon being screwed for not putting 4K in the 5D series, it depends upon which market you are talking about. If you're talking about the market of purchasers who prioritise high resolution video over everything else in a stills camera, then yes, they'll quite clearly Canon will be screwed as they will not retain that particular market with this one model.

 

[ahsanford]

At the same time you could get a shoot ready Ursa 4.6k camera for just a little more than what the 1Dx costs, and you would be able to framegrab stills if needed off that footage.

That's not in the same market. The 1D X replacement is rumoured to remain firmly a stills camera above anything else, and no-one who is planning on buying the ultimate fast stills camera would consider a video camera instead.

If you choose an Ursa, forget about fairly standard stills camera features such as AF, metering optimised for each frame, an OVF, and a full frame sensor. The existing 1D X has all of these features very near to perfection.

+1.

We are so far off from the days of only shooting video and just pulling stills from video. The technology to capture stills from video is there and is happening right now, but not at the same quality, flexibility, speed, and control of taking stills on a stills rig. AF and using the whole (waaay bigger than 4K) sensor are the killer apps on the stills side, but yes, OVF, metering per frame, etc. all matter as well. All good points from rs.

So until that time comes, videographers should buy dedicated video rigs and stills folks who do occasional video work will buy 1D and 5D rigs. Those markets and their needs are still very different and require different products.

- A

 

[Nininini]

Canon are clearly ignoring where the market is going, likely to protect the Cinema EOS line.

Or to put it more simply, the 1DXII can have 4K because it is more expensive than the C100MarkII and because other DSLRs are cheaper than the C100II, they "forbidden" from having 4K.

If I wasn't pissed at Canon as a DSLR manufacturer before, I surely am now.

It's not that simple, canon explained it before and it has been asked many times.

"My smartphone X,Y,Z can shoot in 4k, why can't canon product X,Y,Z do the same??".

The problem is heat, anything APS-C and above shooting in 4k produces a massive amount of heat. Look at Sony, their cameras are actually shutting down to protect the internals from melting during 4k recording.

It's not the case that Canon wants to "protect their EOS line", they're entirely different markets, it's a technological problem.

It is far more complex than just a firmware update.

 

[SwnSng]

It's funny to see all the folks that also want 4k for the 5dMkIV scream that the sky is falling if they don't get this feature. This is how I see it...if you are stills person who shoots video from time to time, you won't really care all that much about getting 4K other than the typical Gear Heads who wants all the bells and whistles but really never uses them. If you were really invested into Video and doing PAID work shelling out the extra dough for a 1DXMKII seems reasonable enough. All the people who shoot stills and think of video as an after thought which probably make the bulk of 5D sales won't be crying a river if 4k doesn't make it.

 

[CarlMillerPhoto]

The super low-budget video market is not a money maker. Pure and simple. Canon isn't losing much money by not catering to that crowd. I use to cry outrage over Canon's seemingly dormant state compared to Sony and Panasonic in regards to video features. But the fact of the matter is they've been producing incredible pieces of video equipment all along, only at a much higher premium. I've shot with everything and would not trade my C100 for any of it while filming a wedding. My clients don't want 4k. Hell, they order more DVD's than blu-rays even.

Everything's a compromise. Panasonic you get poor low light performance. Sony you get poor battery life, world's worst menu/software, and overheating issues. Canon you have a smaller bank account after.

 

[gunship01]

Don't want it to have video. Would rather have a $4,000 to $5,000 killer camera to shoot well in low light and write as fast as it can to the CF card. 24-30MB will work. Don't need GPS built-in. Keep whistles to minimum.

I know it will not happen but hey, optimism reigns supreme.

 

[ahsanford]

It's not that simple, canon explained it before and it has been asked many times.

"My smartphone X,Y,Z can shoot in 4k, why can't canon product X,Y,Z do the same??".

The problem is heat, anything APS-C and above shooting in 4k produces a massive amount of heat. Look at Sony, their cameras are actually shutting down to protect the internals from melting during 4k recording.

It's not the case that Canon wants to "protect their EOS line", they're entirely different markets, it's a technological problem.

It is far more complex than just a firmware update.

I agree, but didn't they figure out FF 4K video with the 1D C*, some three years ago? That rig wasn't packing a boatload of additional heat sinks or something -- wasn't it basically a stock 1DX internally?

(*I don't understand video recording onboard vs. with an external recorder and all that -- please explain it to me. I very well may be missing an obvious distinction at play here.)

Unless I've misunderstood the quality / compression / style of 4K people wish to record -- which is entirely possible as I am a stills guy -- it would seem reasonable to bring that feature set downmarket to the 5D line.

- A

 

[jeffa4444]

We’re told that the upcoming Canon EOS-1D X Mark II (if that’s the name) will indeed shoot 4K video, which sounds like good news. However, we’re told not to expect a very video orientated product, as the camera’s primary focus will be on the still photographer. We’re also told that this will be the only next generation DSLR in the lineup that will shoot 4K video at launch.</p>
<p>There will likely be another EF mount product some time in the next 18 months that will shoot 4K, but it won’t be a DSLR.</p>
<p>Not much else is being said about the next iteration of Canon’s flagship DSLR.</p>

Maybe its in the words "that will shoot 4K video at launch". Conceivably Canon could launch a 5D MKIV and retrospectively apply 4K in a firmware upgrade. Arri have steadily improved the Alexa from 2.8K to 3.6K since launch through hardware & software changes with the latest incarnation upresizing to UHD for instance. 36x24mm has a diagonal of 43.26mm which is Vistavision in cinema terms or twice the area of the Alexa sensor. Canon are developing the 8K cinema camera but thats 16x9 cinema i.e. half frame effectively and will charge arms & legs for it and the pictures will be oversampled to 4K long into the conceivable future.
Not all 4K is equal just as not all 6K is equal or 8K for that matter for instance Red Weapon 8K camera is Vistavision yet Arri Alexa 65 6.5K actually has a sensor larger than 70mm big pixels vs smaller pixels, full frame stills lenses verses Hasselblad Fujinon lenses with totally different DOF.
In TV and motion picture your virtually never see a DSLR any longer not with so many purpose built 4K, 6K and soon to be 8K video cameras DSLRs are a compromise just as video cameras dont make great stills cameras.

 

[ahsanford]

Maybe its in the words "that will shoot 4K video at launch". Conceivably Canon could launch a 5D MKIV and retrospectively apply 4K in a firmware upgrade. Arri have steadily improved the Alexa from 2.8K to 3.6K since launch through hardware & software changes with the latest incarnation upresizing to UHD for instance. 36x24mm has a diagonal of 43.26mm which is Vistavision in cinema terms or twice the area of the Alexa sensor. Canon are developing the 8K cinema camera but thats 16x9 cinema i.e. half frame effectively and will charge arms & legs for it and the pictures will be oversampled to 4K long into the conceivable future.
Not all 4K is equal just as not all 6K is equal or 8K for that matter for instance Red Weapon 8K camera is Vistavision yet Arri Alexa 65 6.5K actually has a sensor larger than 70mm big pixels vs smaller pixels, full frame stills lenses verses Hasselblad Fujinon lenses with totally different DOF.
In TV and motion picture your virtually never see a DSLR any longer not with so many purpose built 4K, 6K and soon to be 8K video cameras DSLRs are a compromise just as video cameras dont make great stills cameras.

Number of people on this thread that have implied that "at launch" means that Canon is holding out 4K on the 5D4 and might release it post-launch via firmware = 3.

We might be on to something here. :

- A