50mp Cameras Coming in March [CR1]

[raptor3x]

For my purposes I need clean pictures and the quality I want I get up to ISO 1600 on 5D mark III. The 7D mark II comes upto ISO 800 at that quality. I need ISO 1600 regularly at the dances I shoot for the spot lighted sequences. I am going to rent the 7d mark II this year to test it myself before making a decision.

If you compared images taken at ISO 1600 with a FF'd version of the 7D2 sensor and a 5D3 with both downsampled to the same resolution, the FF'd 7D2 sensor would almost certainly be cleaner due to the significantly higher QE.

 

[Freddie]

It will depend on the image dynamic range and shadow detail.

If Canon will produce a sensor with the dynamic range and relatively noiseless shadows of the Sony sensor, I will consider it. I did consider buying the Nikon D800 when it was first available. That was not because of the resolution which is excessive for most usage but for the quality of the image shadow details.
I really don't have much use for such high-resolution image files although I could change my mind if the dynamic range is an improvement.

 

[Joey]

Thanks all for filter explanation. I understand the concept of an anti-aliasing filter now. Still a bit puzzled about the low pass filter. Several have said the low pass filter is an anti-aliasing filter - but if it passes low frequencies and not high ones, how does that help - and why doesn't it mess with the colour balance of the image?

 

[Lee Jay]

Thanks all for filter explanation. I understand the concept of an anti-aliasing filter now. Still a bit puzzled about the low pass filter. Several have said the low pass filter is an anti-aliasing filter - but if it passes low frequencies and not high ones, how does that help - and why doesn't it mess with the colour balance of the image?

AA filter = low pass filter. In fact, they're often called OLPF (Optical Low Pass Filter).

The corner frequency is set somewhere near the nyquist frequency. The idea is to filter out the spacial frequencies those the sensor can capture.

 

[Famateur]

It will be overpriced for sure...

Possibly, but the introductory prices of the 70D and 7DII, as well as some of the recent lens releases, might point to the possibility of a pleasant surprise for the price point. Add in the weak yen, and (at least in North America), we might see a very reasonable price.

That said, this will be a huge jump in resolution for Canon, so I won't be surprised at high intro price...

 

[jeffa4444]

If it's March and given the Canon 5d MKiIII was launched in Birmingham, England at Focus on Imaging the show successor The Photography Show is a good bet because Canon is already promoting their presence their in January and the show is expanding this year. I expect they will not be the only ones as all the main manufacturers are all attending.
I'm going to visit for the first two days and the Canon stand will be my first port of call.

 

[Famateur]

If it is the same as the quality of the 7D mark II then I will pass on it.

For my purposes I need clean pictures...

I don't believe pixel density is the reason the 5DIII produces cleaner images at a stop higher ISO than the 7DII. It's about the fact that the full frame sensor gathers so much more light. With the improvements in quantum efficiency others have mentioned, I would expect a full frame sensor scaled up from the 7DII to be quite clean (at least as good as what the 5DIII can do, and perhaps a bit better.

I'm not an expert on this, though, so I'll let Lee Jay, jrista, Don, Nancy, Neuro and others chime in if they feel so inclined...

 

[Gary Irwin]

As the owner of a 36MP (D800) I think 50MP is getting into overkill territory for most folks. Consider all of the threads about soft images and "AF" problems from the 7DII...and I'll bet 99% of the complaints can be traced back to poor technique/mishandling of the camera. I predict you're going to see a lot of similar threads for this 50MP body too.

 

[Famateur]

Explanation please? What is a low pass filter in this context? What is it for and if it's necessary, why build a camera without one? Is it the same as an anti-aliasing filter (another term I don't understand...)

A low pass filter is often used as a anti-aliasing filter. Its the simplest.

A low pass filter allows lower light frequencies to go thru, but blocks higher ones. Kinda like a UV filter that blocks UV light.

The high frequencies cause Moiré in the final image which is difficult to eliminate. As pixel count increases, the need for a optical low pass filter is reduced.

A low pass filter can be done in the electronics or optically, but its typically done both optically and electronically. We are talking elimination of the optical low pass filter, not the electronic one.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-aliasing_filter

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nyquist_frequency

Several years ago, Panasonic produced a video called Demystifying Digital Cinema Camera Specifications

It covers many common questions and is reasonably easy to understand.

There are seven parts, and its worth while to view them all. It gives you a appreciation for the compromises that go into designing digital cameras, and explains why no one system is the best at everything.

The link is to part one, its easy to find all seven parts.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqq8QKMmtYg

Thanks for the links!

 

[Jeffrey]

I'm not excited about 50 megapixels in that my 1D-X does everything and more than I need. I suppose if I were to determine I needed a monster file size I'd go rent the camera for a day or two. I'm more interested in increasing my glass arsenal with a the newest Canon 600mm lens and if Zeiss comes out with something new in the wide angle arena for my 1D-X I'll be keenly interested.

I have to wonder how many people actually need huge files as compared to the megapixel marketing war that is taking place. If you really want file sizes that will choke your computer, go rent a Phase One IQ280 back that shoots 80 megapixel files!

 

[SwampYankee]

Always the next show

 

[Lee Jay]

If it is the same as the quality of the 7D mark II then I will pass on it.

For my purposes I need clean pictures...

I don't believe pixel density is the reason the 5DIII produces cleaner images at a stop higher ISO than the 7DII. It's about the fact that the full frame sensor gathers so much more light.

You are correct.

In fact, the 7DII's sensor is better than the 5DIII sensor. It's just under 1 stop behind, but the size difference should make it 1 1/3 stops behind. Scale that sensor up and it will automatically be 1 1/3 stops better.

 

[canonvoir]

Why wait until March and not CP+?? At this point, a month shouldn't make a difference.

 

[Loswr]

Why wait until March and not CP+?? At this point, a month shouldn't make a difference.

A month means greater ROI on the existing model.

 

[Omni Images]

I'm excited ! .. even though I just dropped AU$15K on a second hand Phase One 645DF+ with a P45+ back and two lenses 35mm and 80mm.
I want to print my images big to go onto peoples walls. I have been able to do that with stitching, but more and more I am taking images that are just one image shots with moving subjects. I shoot a lot of beach/ocean with moving waves, and stitching is really hard to do with moving lines of water, or shots from the water into moving waves such as shots like Clark Little's images.
I also like to shoot wildlife, so a longer lens is needed, and you can't get the reach needed using medium format.
So for me yes a larger file size is needed to print big.
Looking forward to seeing what Canon brings.

 

[Famateur]

If it is the same as the quality of the 7D mark II then I will pass on it.

For my purposes I need clean pictures...

I don't believe pixel density is the reason the 5DIII produces cleaner images at a stop higher ISO than the 7DII. It's about the fact that the full frame sensor gathers so much more light.

You are correct.

In fact, the 7DII's sensor is better than the 5DIII sensor. It's just under 1 stop behind, but the size difference should make it 1 1/3 stops behind. Scale that sensor up and it will automatically be 1 1/3 stops better.

That sounds suspiciously like a sensor to look forward to. :-X

 

[takesome1]

Why wait until March and not CP+?? At this point, a month shouldn't make a difference.

A month means greater ROI on the existing model.

Or possibly this; (cut from Wikipedia)

"The Canon EOS 5D Mark III is a professional full-frame digital single-lens reflex (DSLR) camera made by Canon. It has a 22.3 megapixel CMOS image sensor. Succeeding the EOS 5D Mark II, it was announced on 2 March 2012,[2] the 25th anniversary of the announcement of the first camera in the EOS line, the EOS 650. It was also Canon's 75th anniversary."

What better way to mark the 28th and 78th anniversary than by releasing another new body with a sensor that out specs the competition.

 

[Loswr]

Why wait until March and not CP+?? At this point, a month shouldn't make a difference.

A month means greater ROI on the existing model.

Or possibly this; (cut from Wikipedia)

"The Canon EOS 5D Mark III is a professional full-frame digital single-lens reflex (DSLR) camera made by Canon. It has a 22.3 megapixel CMOS image sensor. Succeeding the EOS 5D Mark II, it was announced on 2 March 2012,[2] the 25th anniversary of the announcement of the first camera in the EOS line, the EOS 650. It was also Canon's 75th anniversary."

What better way to mark the 28th and 78th anniversary than by releasing another new body with a sensor that out specs the competition.

Yeah, anniversaries are nice and all...but shareholders prefer ¥.

 

[fish_shooter]

If it is the same as the quality of the 7D mark II then I will pass on it.

For my purposes I need clean pictures...

I don't believe pixel density is the reason the 5DIII produces cleaner images at a stop higher ISO than the 7DII. It's about the fact that the full frame sensor gathers so much more light.

You are correct.

In fact, the 7DII's sensor is better than the 5DIII sensor. It's just under 1 stop behind, but the size difference should make it 1 1/3 stops behind. Scale that sensor up and it will automatically be 1 1/3 stops better.

Roger that! Another way of looking at it would be to put a (hypothetical) 1.6x teleconverter on the 5D3 to compensate for the crop factor of the 7D2. The exposure factor would ~ wipe out the 5D3's ISO advantage.

 

[tphillips63]

As the owner of a 36MP (D800) I think 50MP is getting into overkill territory for most folks. Consider all of the threads about soft images and "AF" problems from the 7DII...and I'll bet 99% of the complaints can be traced back to poor technique/mishandling of the camera. I predict you're going to see a lot of similar threads for this 50MP body too.

I had this happen to me too when I first used the 7D Mk II, a lot of soft images VS 1DX on the same shoot. I figured it was me. I've not read other posts about it yet but will have to use it some more and determine where I'm messing up. I'll still get a higher MP full frame body when it comes out though.