6D Mark-II in response to the D750

[StudentOfLight]

Will the 6D Mark-II be a response to the D750 much like the 6D was a response to the D600. As the 6D is Canon's budget FF camera it is possibly due for an update. By giving it a 70D form factor it would provide even more differentiation from the 5D line from an ergonomics perspective. What would you think are some potential specs that will keep it relevant for the next two years?

18-22MP DPAF, 6fps
41pt AF system
Pop-up flash
Articulated touch LCD
1080@60p, 4K@24p
Mic-in + Headphone-out
Built-in Wifi & GPS

 

[Marsu42]

Will the 6D Mark-II be a response to the D750 much like the 6D was a response to the D600.

Given the laughable af system of the 6d, the model wasn't a "response" in terms of specs, but simply of positioning a ff (any ff) in the same price range.

Simply dropping the price of the more expensive produced 5d2 with legacy parts wasn't an option, so they simply created the 6d with more recent parts and some gimmicks. That's why I don't think there will be a 6d2 anytime soon as long as the 6d1 keeps creating profit for Canon.

 

[Maximilian]

Seeing your "potential specs" (and not even discussing them in detail) there has to be a 5D4 release first. Otherwise Canon is cannibalizing their FF cash cow 5D3.
IMHO this won't happen untill mid to late 2015 and then there has to be some additional 3 to 5 month until a 6D2 would be released.
Conclusion: I'd say +1 to marsu's statement.

 

[StudentOfLight]

Will the 6D Mark-II be a response to the D750 much like the 6D was a response to the D600.

Given the laughable af system of the 6d, the model wasn't a "response" in terms of specs, but simply of positioning a ff (any ff) in the same price range.

Simply dropping the price of the more expensive produced 5d2 with legacy parts wasn't an option, so they simply created the 6d with more recent parts and some gimmicks. That's why I don't think there will be a 6d2 anytime soon as long as the 6d1 keeps creating profit for Canon.

A "6D-II" or "8D" could sell in parallel if it had a different form factor. Anyway, to jumble your words, simply dropping the price of the already cheap 6D isn't an option, so they'll simply create a ~6D-II/8D~ with more recent parts and some gimmicks and with proven legacy parts.

 

[Coldhands]

I really don't think there's a need for Canon to introduce a anything in the short-term to defend against the D750. This section of the market has too much "inertia", by which I mean owners are too invested in the system to commit knee-jerk reactions and switch brands just because of a perceived technological advantage of one body.

More likely would be a minor price drop of the 6D and/or 5DIII, but even that's probably being optimistic.

 

[tron]

An update of 5DMkIII is the proper response. D750 is not an entry level FF.

 

[StudentOfLight]

Seeing your "potential specs" (and not even discussing them in detail) there has to be a 5D4 release first. Otherwise Canon is cannibalizing their FF cash cow 5D3.
IMHO this won't happen untill mid to late 2015 and then there has to be some additional 3 to 5 month until a 6D2 would be released.
Conclusion: I'd say +1 to marsu's statement.

I never thought the 7D-II would have both 10fps and a better AF-system (on paper at least) than the 1D-X. It does and it will not cannibalize 1D-X sales. Canon knows how to tactically differentiate (cripple) products so if they do not want it to cannibalize 5D-III sales then they can control it:

• Better high ISO ... but lower resolution
• 4K ...but can only record compressed .mp5
• Dual SD card slots ...but only slot 1 is UHS-1 compatible
• Mic-in ...but no Headphone-out
• 6fps... but only rated to 100,000 cycles
• ...1/4000s max shutter speed
• ...1/180s sync speed

 

[Marsu42]

I never thought the 7D-II would have both 10fps and a better AF-system (on paper at least) than the 1D-X.

There you are. Hardware specs mean nothing w/o the firmware, and Canon will a) make sure the 1dx isn't cannibalized (see the removal of spot af 7d->70d) and b) generally the 1d systems get much more fine-tuning and customizations.

 

[StudentOfLight]

I really don't think there's a need for Canon to introduce a anything in the short-term to defend against the D750. This section of the market has too much "inertia", by which I mean owners are too invested in the system to commit knee-jerk reactions and switch brands just because of a perceived technological advantage of one body.

More likely would be a minor price drop of the 6D and/or 5DIII, but even that's probably being optimistic.

Not every photographer is too invested in a system. According to some data shared in other threads, most DSLR owners only use the kit lens. There is a big market out there that would be using an APS-C body with only one (DX or EF-S) kit-lens so moving to full frame they would need to buy new lens(es) anyway for full frame coverage. These people could all be considering moving to consumer oriented full frame body (with Kit lens) and maybe supplementing that with a couple of cheap f/1.8 primes.

I agree the 6D is unlikely to move much in price as it already is at the budget end of the spectrum and offers great value for money. OTOH, there is still a lot of room for the 5D-III to drop in my country. I bought mine last year for R29,500 (equiv to $2,800) and today it's retailing for R37,000 (equiv to $3,300).

 

[cosmopotter]

I love the 6D as it is. It's a stripped down, simpler 5D3 with the benefits of GPS, wi-fi, accurate focusing down to -3EV and better high ISO performance than the 5D3, it's why I bought it in the first place. If the 6DII turned into a budget FF shooter primarily aimed at video shooters, like your specs suggest, then there's no way I'd be interested in such a camera. Not interested in cameras that are full of features I'll never use.

I have a 70D and I'm going to add a 6D shortly. I want to use them for different things so I'm going to have 2 bodies. I want the 6D for portraits and landscapes and will continue to use my 70D for sports and video. I do have to say that I would feel much better about the 6D if it didn't have such a limited AF system. Just adding the 19CP system similar to the 70D would would make me feel better about it and that ONE feature wouldn't cannibalize the 5DIII. The AF system from an old Rebel doesn't make me feel good about buying a FF but it is my only option right now.

I also won't be surprised if there is a 1D upgrade next month in NY. All this talk about the 7DII having better AF than the 1D can't be left alone for too long. They also need to keep up with or ahead of the D4s, so I expect change. That will trickle down to a 5D4 perhaps at Photokina 2015.

Big ships turn slowly.

 

[mrzero]

The 5DIII came out before the 6D, so it seems likely that we'll get a 5DIV before a 6DII. Regardless, the 6D fills a niche between 5D- and 7D- series, and they aren't going to change it much. Probably upgrade the AF system a bit since everybody complains about it. It would be nice if all the points were cross-type. Adding DPAF would be cool, but I'm not holding my breath. I doubt that it will get more AF points. Agreed that there is no reason to change the form factor. No flip screen necessary. I would like to see the dual card slots like the 5DIII and 7DII have, though.

A real dream would be adding an RT controller since it lacks the pop-up flash. But that won't happen, because it would be too damn cool.

Regardless, if you're a crop shooter with some full-frame glass, when the 6DII gets announced you should pick up the original 6D at the bargain prices. For the fun of it.

 

[andrewflo]

Highly doubt the 6D, 5D, or any other Canon DSLR will be getting 4K before the C100 and C300.

 

[zlatko]

I love the 6D as it is. It's a stripped down, simpler 5D3 with the benefits of GPS, wi-fi, accurate focusing down to -3EV and better high ISO performance than the 5D3, it's why I bought it in the first place. If the 6DII turned into a budget FF shooter primarily aimed at video shooters, like your specs suggest, then there's no way I'd be interested in such a camera. Not interested in cameras that are full of features I'll never use.

Same here. The 6D works for me as is. The AF is not the top of the line, but it works and it's very, very accurate on the center point. In fact, I'm continually amazed by the center point accuracy with lenses like the 50/1.2L shot at or near 1.2. It's definitely a new level of accuracy, above what the 5D2 offered.

Cameras are not a "response" to other cameras. They're conceived and in development long before their announcement. These companies compete, but they're not "responding" to each other's announcement from the month before.

 

[StudentOfLight]

Seeing your "potential specs" (and not even discussing them in detail) there has to be a 5D4 release first. Otherwise Canon is cannibalizing their FF cash cow 5D3.
IMHO this won't happen untill mid to late 2015 and then there has to be some additional 3 to 5 month until a 6D2 would be released.
Conclusion: I'd say +1 to marsu's statement.

Some people suggest that the semi/pro 5D-line has a longer update cycle (4-5yr) whereas the 6D, which is more consumer oriented, could have a shorter update cycle (2-3yr).

 

[StudentOfLight]

Highly doubt the 6D, 5D, or any other Canon DSLR will be getting 4K before the C100 and C300.

The 1D-C has 4K unless we ignore that one.

DSLR-video and Cine are not really the same markets. The people that are willing to shoot video on DSLR are not the ones who are gonna buy/rent into the C100/C300/C500 system.The C-xxx cameras offer better audio options, ergonomics and features (some of which can be gotten through ML) for cinematography C100/C300. At the moment Canon DSC only take 3.5mm Mic-in, I mean the 1D-X doesn't even have headphone-out. And as I mentioned in another reply, 4K capability could easily be limited (e.g. Compressed-only), so suitable for casual video but not great for more serious videography.

 

[Sabaki]

My opinion is that the 6Dii will take more from what the 5Div turns out to be.

Canon will no doubt put something 'best of class' into it, like it did with the lowlight focussing of the 6D, then do a 5Div tear down to define which camera is for the higher and lower segments

I would ask for just three improvements:

1. AF system needs to be clearly better than the XXXD line. Something in the 40 AF point region would suffice.
2. Build quality. 6D feels too cheap after you've handled a 7D, 5Dii or 5Diii.
3. Built in RF communicator with Canon putting a touch screen interface that's identical to the ST-E3. I mean, wouldn't it be just beautiful if the MR-24EX mkii was just the lighting mechanism and the control unit built into the camera?

 

[StudentOfLight]

I have a 70D and I'm going to add a 6D shortly. I want to use them for different things so I'm going to have 2 bodies. I want the 6D for portraits and landscapes and will continue to use my 70D for sports and video. I do have to say that I would feel much better about the 6D if it didn't have such a limited AF system. Just adding the 19CP system similar to the 70D would would make me feel better about it and that ONE feature wouldn't cannibalize the 5DIII. The AF system from an old Rebel doesn't make me feel good about buying a FF but it is my only option right now.

Yeah for me the AF is the only glaring issue on the 6D spec sheet.

I also won't be surprised if there is a 1D upgrade next month in NY. All this talk about the 7DII having better AF than the 1D can't be left alone for too long. They also need to keep up with or ahead of the D4s, so I expect change. That will trickle down to a 5D4 perhaps at Photokina 2015.

We'll have to see real performance reviews but I'm pleasantly surprised by what Canon's put on the table. But 1D-X offer significantly better low-light IQ and 20% fast FPS. In a fast-action continuous-burst sequence that could mean the difference between having 2 selectable shots vs just 1. I am also eager to see a "big MP" announcement next month, not that I can afford it. :'(

P.S. I think you you made a typo, next Photokina will be 2016.

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

Consider that you can get a 6D from a authorized Dealer for $1440, while a D750 costs $2300, almost $860 more. I would not want to pay $2300 for a 6D MK II. I can buy a 5D MK III for near $2300 if I wanted another one.

They are not competitors. The Nikon D6XX series is the competition.

 

[StudentOfLight]

My opinion is that the 6Dii will take more from what the 5Div turns out to be.

Canon will no doubt put something 'best of class' into it, like it did with the lowlight focussing of the 6D, then do a 5Div tear down to define which camera is for the higher and lower segments

I would ask for just three improvements:

1. AF system needs to be clearly better than the XXXD line. Something in the 40 AF point region would suffice.
2. Build quality. 6D feels too cheap after you've handled a 7D, 5Dii or 5Diii.
3. Built in RF communicator with Canon putting a touch screen interface that's identical to the ST-E3. I mean, wouldn't it be just beautiful if the MR-24EX mkii was just the lighting mechanism and the control unit built into the camera?

On your points:
1. Agree 100%
2. The 6D is cheap. I consider it a consumer grade product that offers top-notch IQ. I have no issue with it feeling cheap (from a durability perspective) as long as the main controls hold up and it delivers beautiful files. If I want more durability I'm willing to pay for it.
3. For the countries where ST-E3 is already allowed I say why not? Canon says "We have an amazing radio flash system (ST-E3-RT sold separately)"

(P.S. Don't tell anyone, but I've dropped my 6D... TWICE. Metal resists crushing, so for slow application of high pressure, metal construction is good. Plastic and rubber are good shock absorbers. So for me I don't mind rubber/plastic exterior covers. My cameras to be more likely to suffer moderate shock/impact than to take heavy pressure which is applied more slowly.)

 

[StudentOfLight]

Consider that you can get a 6D from a authorized Dealer for $1440, while a D750 costs $2300, almost $860 more. I would not want to pay $2300 for a 6D MK II. I can buy a 5D MK III for near $2300 if I wanted another one.

They are not competitors. The Nikon D6XX series is the competition.

Unfortunately not everyone lives in the US so that pricing structure does not apply to me.

The launch price in South Africa for a D750 is R30,000 ($2,700 equiv), whereas the 5D-III is R37,000 ($3,360 equiv) and the 6D is R21,000 ($1,850 equiv). The 5D-III is almost 2x more than the 6D so there is a gaping hole that the D750 fills. There is room for a reasonable Canon offer to undercut the D750 on price or a differently-abled Canon body (better low-light / DPAF) to compete at the same price point.

I am interested in the D750 form factor but hopefully at a lower price.