70D and Dxomark... As far as I have learned here on this forum, their assessment is not the last verdict...;-)
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52066617
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52066617
70D and Dxomark....
- Thread starter pedro
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pedro said:
You are in violation of one of the 10 commandments of CR (and I probably am in violation of my own commandment for responding...)
Here is at least a link to their actual test results (instead of the not-very-meaningful numeric scores)
http://www.dxomark.com/index.php/Cameras/Compare-Camera-Sensors/Compare-cameras-side-by-side/%28appareil1%29/895|0/%28brand%29/Canon/%28appareil2%29/663|0/%28brand2%29/Canon
(Click on "measurements" then, e.g. "SNR 18%" or "tonal range" to see the results; you can of course add whatever other cameras you want to compare too.)
Looks like a small (not really noticeable) improvement over the 60d. Nothing groundbreaking as far as improvements in the image quality, but the 70d is all about the improved AF, which is outside the realm of what DxO tests. I don't see the big deal, or anything to make a fuss about.
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unfocused
Photos/Photo Book Reviews: www.thecuriouseye.com
I'm sure I'll get flamed for this and maybe I'm missing something here, but when I compare the D7100 to the 70D and 7D on the graphs there doesn't seem to be all that much difference.
I admit I'm not a dynamic range freak, and I'm more interested in ISO performance, but it doesn't seem like there is any real world difference between the Nikon and Canon sensors.
My conclusion: The 70D sensor offers an almost imperceptible improvement over the 7D and the D7100 might be an equally imperceptible improvement over both the Canon's but not enough to make buying a camera based on the sensor alone worthwhile.
For all the talk about how antiquated Canon's sensor tech is, I'm not seeing it in these results. Even their summary (if I read it correctly) says the Canon and Nikon sensors are only about a fifth of a stop different in ISO performance. One-fifth of a stop?
Okay...I'm waiting for the flaming to start.
I admit I'm not a dynamic range freak, and I'm more interested in ISO performance, but it doesn't seem like there is any real world difference between the Nikon and Canon sensors.
My conclusion: The 70D sensor offers an almost imperceptible improvement over the 7D and the D7100 might be an equally imperceptible improvement over both the Canon's but not enough to make buying a camera based on the sensor alone worthwhile.
For all the talk about how antiquated Canon's sensor tech is, I'm not seeing it in these results. Even their summary (if I read it correctly) says the Canon and Nikon sensors are only about a fifth of a stop different in ISO performance. One-fifth of a stop?
Okay...I'm waiting for the flaming to start.
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unfocused said:
There's a small real world difference in terms of IQ when you have to dig really deep into the shadows. It's blown up into a huge difference by...
* Shooting a wall in the dark.
* Shoving the exposure slider to +5 EV.
* Turning off all NR on the Canon sample.
If you normally shoot this way, Nikon is your first choice.
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Cognitive dissonance is very high with Canon customers who just shelled out a couple of Gs on their imaging equipment. They will try to justify by saying that "I always expose properly, so who cares about pulling shadows", "I shoot JPG anyway", "I like how Canon feels in my hands", or "Canon sells way more cameras".
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And some say that canon does X better while Nikon is better at Y, and since X is more important to me, I went with Canon.poias said:
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dtaylor said:
I was already on FF when 7d came out but through the years i had a chance to review files from assistants, friends & gfs from either 7d 60d or d7000 (have to find one with a pentax now ;D ).
The IQ difference isn't that tiny really. First you can get really nice files out of those sony sensors below 400. You can get FF quality easily, whereas 7d really has noise all over the spectrum. You can see a quantitative difference with local adjustments of about 1-2 stops and what happens to color and noise.
Obviously you can see a massive difference if you want to salvage shoots where flash or strobes didnt fire; basically those sony sensors are isoless, you could push an underexposed iso100 all the way to 3200 and there isnt much difference from a native 3200, plus the tonality will be actually greater.
From someone coming from compacts or cameraphones the difference is nonexistent but from someone who wants too squeeze every possible drop of quality from an apsc sensors, then you'll find canon isnt your best bet.
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Not exactly. I push and pull exposures as much as I ever need to with Canon cameras and never have a problem with shadows or anything else relating to sensor. And I have thousands of raw files from the D800, D7100 and D7000 and the color is never as good as Canon's.poias said:
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poias said:
Maybe. But after owning a 5DII for a while and thinking it might be nice to own a Nikon as well, I shelled out a few hundred and rented a D800e and D600 and 5DIII and 6D before buying a 5DIII and 6D and neither a D800e nor D600 - because, for my purposes, the photos I took with the Nikons didn't look any better than the photos I took with the Canons (not quite as good, if anything, but for the most part probably indistinguishable, allowing for lens differences), there's probably only one Nikon lens for which I have any sort of lens envy, and I dislike Nikon's ergonomics. I suspect one or two others have had similar experiences.
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poias said:
Cognitive dissonance is very high with Nikon customers who just shelled out (more than) a couple of Gs on their imaging equipment. They will try to justify by saying that, "I don't really focus on anything in the left side of the field," and, "The sharpness of my images isn't affected by the CA endemic to my lenses, that can be fixed in post," and, "I like lots of buttons," and, "A smaller, less successful, non market-leading company like Nikon treats me better (and no, I don't mind waiting almost a month for a service when needed)."
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neuroanatomist said:
That is often true, actually. In the audiophile world, big companies are not big, for example.
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zlatko said:
If by that you mean - shadow noise is there but I do not find it to be a problem, I can believe you. But if you are trying to say that you do not know what just about everybody else is talking about - I am skeptical.
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meli said:
I own a 7D and have shot tens of thousands of frames with it and made several hundred 16x20" prints. And you're wrong.
I've also in the past taken the time to put up 100% crop tests from FF and APS-C, Canon and Nikon bodies to see if FF or Nikon fanboys could reliably tell me which was which. They always fail, but it also always ends up a waste of my time since they continue to spout their nonsense no matter how many times they fail.
Sure you can...when you turn off NR on one camera and not the other.
Sure you can. You can also leave the lens cap on and get perfect images, or so a Nikon fan told me.
"ISOless"...priceless...thanks for the laugh.
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Pi said:
If by "everybody else" you mean "a couple people who frequent canonrumors and dpreview forums" then...yeah...I guess everybody else is talking about it.
DR, shadow noise, and color have never come up in a "Canon vs. Nikon" context in any conversation I've ever had with my friends who shoot both, or at local photo clubs, or with professionals I happen to meet who shoot one or the other. Weird...you would think more people would be part of the "shoot a wall in the dark and +5 EV the RAW file with no NR" art movement...
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dtaylor said:
Then, I guess, you do not know what "a couple people who frequent canonrumors and dpreview forums" talk about. Do you?
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dtaylor said:
That's because the professionals you talk to have probably never tried to shoot amateur drama productions with a crop body. That's the one situation in which I consistently run into problems trying to get decent shots because of insufficient dynamic range. Think curtain call with half the people in almost no light and half the people under massive floods.
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