After almost 30 years, Canon is ending the “Kiss” branding in Japan

[neuroanatomist]

I agree that the purpose of different names was initially to reduce grey marketing - an American male would I think definitely prefer to pay full whack for a "Rebel" rather than save a few dollars and have the humiliation of having "Kiss" plastered across the front of his camera.

Not my point. I doubt an intention to reduce gray marketing had anything to do with these names. Rebel was the brand in the US, Kiss in Japan, and just a number/letter in the rest of the world, because they wanted specific branding to promote sales in the two largest markets, and didn't bother with any specificity for European countries or elsewhere. They could have marketed it as the Lascaux in France and the Azulejo in Portugal, but those markets weren't worth the effort.

I also agree that the non-homogenous nature of Europe could be a reason why acronyms are used instead of names. The *choice* of the actual names "Kiss" and "Rebel" was I think as I stated, i.e. based on perceptions of the national psyche of Japan and the US.

That part, I agree with.

 

[AlanF]

The *choice* of the actual names "Kiss" and "Rebel" was I think as I stated, i.e. based on perceptions of the national psyche of Japan and the US.

I am out of my depth here so perhaps a Japanese expert can explain. According to the internet: "Kissing, hugging, and hand-holding aren't technically forbidden in Japan, they're just deeply frowned upon. Japanese culture prizes emotional reservation, and anyone engaging in icha-icha (a blanket term meaning anything from a kiss on the cheek to heavy petting) is likely to shock those around them." So, why does Canon use "Kiss"?

 

[entoman]

I am out of my depth here so perhaps a Japanese expert can explain. According to the internet: "Kissing, hugging, and hand-holding aren't technically forbidden in Japan, they're just deeply frowned upon. Japanese culture prizes emotional reservation, and anyone engaging in icha-icha (a blanket term meaning anything from a kiss on the cheek to heavy petting) is likely to shock those around them." So, why does Canon use "Kiss"?

Haha! .... to be REBELlious?

 

[entoman]

From JapanToday, dated 08 Sept 2012"

"There are all kinds of kissing all over the world, but traditionally, in Japan there has only been two kinds and they are the romantic kissing done by couples or kissing babies. Public displays of affection have always been frowned upon, and still generally are: a kiss on the lips is serious business.

The moment for a romantic kiss on any Japanese TV drama looks excruciatingly uncomfortable, especially in comparison to the ”eat each other up” passion of Western dramas. The "jidaigeki," or Japanese period dramas, feature absolutely no kissing. With this in mind, SK Planet Japan did a survey on 400 20 to 30-year-old men and women to find out young Japanese people’s views on kissing — which is actually pretty interesting considering that kissing has always been an almost taboo subject.

It was found that 60% of the women polled had only kissed up to five people, signifying that experience in this arena is on the low side. By asking the question, “Have all your kisses led to a dating relationship?” it was found that 90% of the women questioned said “no.” In other words, more Japanese women are willing to kiss for no other reason but that they want to. The casual kiss has taken hold in Japan."

The state of kissing in Japan

There are all kinds of kissing all over the world, but traditionally, in Japan there has only been two kinds and they are the romantic kissing done by couples or kissing babies. Public displays of affection have always been frowned upon, and still generally are: a kiss on the lips…

japantoday.com

 

[CanonGrunt]

Right before Valentine’s Day? Awe…

 

[eosuser1234]

Developed in the bubble era of Japan, the kiss was to appeal to Japanese house wives who were given by society child rearing duty. Husbands were largely working hard to bring home the bacon, and spending the evenings at hostess bars of roppongi and ginza trying to work their way up the corporate ladder. Someone in Canon marketing, thought to ask Japanese middle age women the thing they wanted most. First, they said to feel love, and second to raise their kids well. Well, a kiss signifies love from their husband and also an affectionate kiss from their children.

 

[mimbu]

"Mirrorless SLR"? The "R" in SLR is refers to the mirror mechanism inside the camera, the part that no longer exists in a camera without mirrors.

 

[dolina]

Kiss & Rebel are consumer dSLRs...

The low-end and consumer cameras are essentially dead.

​

Year​	2019​	2020​	2021​	2022​
Total Cameras​	15,216,957​	8,886,292​	8,361,521​	8,011,598​
Point & Shoot​	6,755,467​	3,578,643​	3,013,250​	2,084,865​
Total SLR & Mirrorless​	8,461,490​	5,307,649​	5,348,271​	5,926,733​
SLR​	4,504,987​	2,374,569​	2,241,772​	1,853,222​
Mirrorless​	3,956,503​	2,933,080​	3,106,499​	4,073,511​
% of Point & Shoots​	44.39%​	40.27%​	36.04%​	26.02%​
% of SLR & Mirrorless​	55.61%​	59.73%​	63.96%​	73.98%​
Worldwide population​	7.673 billion​	7.753 billion​	7.9 billion​	8 billion​

 

[John Wilde]

The low-end and consumer cameras are essentially dead.

Last year, in Japan (BCN), the best selling mirrorless camera was the Canon M50/KissM. That role will now be filled by the R50.

 

[dolina]

Last year, in Japan (BCN), the best selling mirrorless camera was the Canon M50/KissM. That role will now be filled by the R50.

Font size... .mine for emphasis.

Going forward I'd expect

- <6 million mirrorless
- <1 million p&s and dSLR

 

[John Wilde]

Font size... .mine for emphasis.

Going forward I'd expect

- <6 million mirrorless
- <1 million p&s and dSLR

Huh? The size of the total market doesn't mean that the entry-level R50 won't sell well. If Canon's market research showed that "the low-end and consumer cameras are essentially dead", they wouldn't have released the R50.

 

[dolina]

Huh? The size of the total market doesn't mean that the entry-level R50 won't sell well. If Canon's market research showed that "the low-end and consumer cameras are essentially dead", they wouldn't have released the R50.

Count number of APS-C vs FF body SKUs of Canon or even Sony. It's an indicator which image sensor size sells more and price points.

 

[EOS 4 Life]

Count number of APS-C vs FF body SKUs of Canon or even Sony. It's an indicator which image sensor size sells more and price points.

True but the RP, R, and R8 are full-frame cameras with APS-C price points.

 

[dolina]

True but the RP, R, and R8 are full-frame cameras with APS-C price points.

I agree so here they are

11 RF Bodies

- 8 full frame priced between $999-5,599
- 3 APS-C priced between $679-1,499

 

[neuroanatomist]

Count number of APS-C vs FF body SKUs of Canon or even Sony. It's an indicator which image sensor size sells more and price points.

11 RF Bodies
- 8 full frame priced between $999-5,599
- 3 APS-C priced between $679-1,499

Your implication is that FF sensor cameras sell more units than APS-C sensor cameras. Do you believe that to be true?

 

[dolina]

I agree so here they are

11 RF Bodies

- 8 full frame priced between $999-5,599
- 3 APS-C priced between $679-1,499

Price groups

Low
- $679 R50
- $879 R10

Medium
- $999 RP
- $1399 R
- $1499 R7
- $1499 R8

High
- $2099 R6
- $2499 R6 Mark II
- $3499 R5
- $4399 R5 C
- $5599 R3

 

[koenkooi]

Price groups

Low
- $679 R50
- $879 R10

Medium
- $999 RP
- $1399 R
- $1499 R7
- $1499 R8

High
- $2099 R6
- $2499 R6 Mark II
- $3499 R5
- $4399 R5 C
- $5599 R3

Since you have the R5C in there, where does the C70 fit into the above?

 

[dolina]

Since you have the R5C in there, where does the C70 fit into the above?

I used BH photo as reference. I was listing the RF digital still cameras on their website.

I am trying to do a pseudo-venn circle on where the overlaps occurs.

So if you've been using 1-Series and 5-Series EF bodies then the only future replacement are the R5 Mark II and R3 Mark II that will be out before July 2024.

 

[dolina]

Since you have the R5C in there, where does the C70 fit into the above?

I also like looking at that groupings. It is somewhat relaxing to eyeball.

 

[SwissFrank]

I am an old King Crimson/Robert Fripp fan...

I was actually signed up for the Fripp master class in Tokyo in fall '94 but my company transferred me to Zurich. I was ROYALLY pissed but looking back it was for the best. I like how my style evolved by itself, free of Fripp's influence.

https://soundcloud.com/frank-sheeran%2Ftracks

I'm pretty sure that class turned into the League of Crafty Guitarists.