Any word on the 50mm with Image Stabilzation?

[Renaissance]

I've been enjoying my 35mm so much (made me sell my Sigma 35 Art), especially since I do plenty of video work as well as photography

I'm also having fun with my friends' 24 and 28 IS, so I definitely want to try a 50mm, if it's as good as the 35 I'll buy one!

 

[Ruined]

Canon is likely saving up for a big showing at Photokina in the fall, would not be surprised if that is one of the lenses announced.

 

[Marsu42]

Canon is likely saving up for a big showing at Photokina in the fall, would not be surprised if that is one of the lenses announced.

I would also not be surprised if this is not announced, if the outdated 50/1.8 and 50/1.4 have been selling so far they will continue to do so. The 50/1.2 is a unique prestige cash cow not to be easily endangered by a faster 50mm with IS and good bokeh.

 

[e17paul]

Canon is likely saving up for a big showing at Photokina in the fall, would not be surprised if that is one of the lenses announced.

I would also not be surprised if this is not announced, if the outdated 50/1.8 and 50/1.4 have been selling so far they will continue to do so. The 50/1.2 is a unique prestige cash cow not to be easily endangered by a faster 50mm with IS and good bokeh.

If Canon are afraid to endanger their existing products, they will lose out to third party manufacturers. I'm already thinking of a switch to Sigma or more likely Zeiss in the absence of a 50 macro with the build and IS of my 24.

Worse still, Canon risk losing those customers buying into a first DSLR or trading up from crop sensor kit. Nikon have a tempting range of primes, and Sony will have a fast growing selection of quality FE lenses coming this year and next. If those buyers invest in Nikon or Sony kit instead, they will be difficult to pull back.

Canon have proved they are not afraid by introducing the IS primes against L primes. Does the 35L stand head an shoulders above the 35 IS? (I'm suspecting the 35L II must be coming soon)

The 24 IS makes me feel glad I committed to Canon, if a better 50 prime or two is announced then I will be convinced. All 4 of Canon's 50 primes have been neglected for far too long. It's time to bring the 50 and 85 primes up to modern standards. The manual focus on the 50/1.8 ii gives a poor impression of Canon, though the optics are commendable for the money - it's the only lens I have ever felt moved to sell, even after cheap third party OM lenses in my student days.

The kit lenses with wobbly focus rings are slowly being phased out in favour of STM lenses with better build and positive reviews. The more affordable full frame lenses will follow (I hope) with USM and IS, as has already happened at 24, 28 and 35.

If the 50/1.4 has a place, it is as an entry level lens below an IS model with ring USM. That is the path already taken by the 28/1.8 which now exists as a cheap alternative to the 28 IS.

I'm crossing my fingers for new primes this year. Canon already have an outstanding range of telephoto zooms, a strong range of mid range zooms, and an inceasing range of wide zooms.

 

[brad-man]

Canon is likely saving up for a big showing at Photokina in the fall, would not be surprised if that is one of the lenses announced.

I would also not be surprised if this is not announced, if the outdated 50/1.8 and 50/1.4 have been selling so far they will continue to do so. The 50/1.2 is a unique prestige cash cow not to be easily endangered by a faster 50mm with IS and good bokeh.

The 50/1.2 is threatened by the Sigma 50A, not the EF 50/x IS. I hope Sigma can ramp up production enough to fulfill demand for the 18-35A and the 50A, so that when they release my new 85A I won't have to wait too long to get it. I am also very interested in the presumably soon-to-be-released 50 IS. I wonder if it's going to have a silly high release price like that of its siblings, or more in line with current prices.

 

[drmikeinpdx]

Add me to the list of photographers waiting for a stabilized 50mm prime. Until then I'll just keep using my Sigma 50 1.4 non-Art lens. It's a good value for $500. It would not focus very consistently on my old 5D classic, but my 5D3 makes it focus like a champion.

 

[ahsanford]

For the 87th time, Canon is working on an EF 50mm F/(no one knows) IS USM. Going to happen. Done deal. (An 85 as well, surely.)

It will be exactly like the other non-L IS refreshes that the 24/28/35mm focal lengths got in the last two years:

• Far far sharper. As good or better than Canon's large aperture L in the same FL.
• Modern, fast USM
• Size on par with the current 50 F/1.4 -- i.e. much much smaller and lighter than the L or the Sigma Art.
• 3-4 stops of IS
• Much better build quality: solid feel, higher quality plastics, etc.
• Internal focusing

...and it will be worth every penny. If you want a solid 50mm for all purposes including handholdability in low-light, video, etc., this will undoubtedly be it. The Sigma Art is a stellar lens at a great value, but a one stop advantage of speed is obliterated by 3-4 stops of IS depending on what you shoot. (For me, that's huge.) And we all know what a fickle diva the 50 F/1.2L is -- stellar draw/bokeh/feel but soft as a noodle in the corners and somewhat finnicky AF at wider apertures.

The only unknowns remaining are the max aperture and the cost.

All prior non-Ls that got this refresh treatment retained their prior max aperture (24 and 28 --> F/2.8, 35 --> F/2). However, in this segment, an F/1.4 IS might be big and heavy and perhaps Canon doesn't want to do that, so some folks have posited that it will be a segment-shaker-upper and be an F/1.8 IS. We shall see.

The cost will depend on a lot of things:

• Is it replacing the Canon EF 50 F/1.4 USM or will it be sold alongside it?
• Will the max aperture be F/1.4? F/1.8? F/2?
• How sharp will it be? If it outpunches the 50 F/1.2L considerably (which not a high bar at all), will Canon enjoy people paying (say) $600 instead of $1500 for sharper lens? (Replace $600 with $949 and you can see why Sigma loves life right now.)

So my guess is that it will be 90% as sharp as the Sigma Art (at comparable apertures) and run high at first offering -- say $799 -- to gobble up every photog who has stuck with the Canon 50 F/1.4 because the L is lacking something that they need. Over time, the price might settle down around $600 like the other non-L IS refreshes.

- A

 

[pj1974]

For the 87th time, Canon is working on an EF 50mm F/(no one knows) IS USM. Going to happen. Done deal. (An 85 as well, surely.)

It will be exactly like the other non-L IS refreshes that the 24/28/35mm focal lengths got in the last two years:

• Far far sharper. As good or better than Canon's large aperture L in the same FL.
• Modern, fast USM
• Size on par with the current 50 F/1.4 -- i.e. much much smaller and lighter than the L or the Sigma Art.
• 3-4 stops of IS
• Much better build quality: solid feel, higher quality plastics, etc.
• Internal focusing

...and it will be worth every penny. If you want a solid 50mm for all purposes including handholdability in low-light, video, etc., this will undoubtedly be it. The Sigma Art is a stellar lens at a great value, but a one stop advantage of speed is obliterated by 3-4 stops of IS depending on what you shoot. (For me, that's huge.) And we all know what a fickle diva the 50 F/1.2L is -- stellar draw/bokeh/feel but soft as a noodle in the corners and somewhat finnicky AF at wider apertures.

The only unknowns remaining are the max aperture and the cost.

All prior non-Ls that got this refresh treatment retained their prior max aperture (24 and 28 --> F/2.8, 35 --> F/2). However, in this segment, an F/1.4 IS might be big and heavy and perhaps Canon doesn't want to do that, so some folks have posited that it will be a segment-shaker-upper and be an F/1.8 IS. We shall see.

The cost will depend on a lot of things:

• Is it replacing the Canon EF 50 F/1.4 USM or will it be sold alongside it?
• Will the max aperture be F/1.4? F/1.8? F/2?
• How sharp will it be? If it outpunches the 50 F/1.2L considerably (which not a high bar at all), will Canon enjoy people paying (say) $600 instead of $1500 for sharper lens? (Replace $600 with $949 and you can see why Sigma loves life right now.)

So my guess is that it will be 90% as sharp as the Sigma Art (at comparable apertures) and run high at first offering -- say $799 -- to gobble up every photog who has stuck with the Canon 50 F/1.4 because the L is lacking something that they need. Over time, the price might settle down around $600 like the other non-L IS refreshes.

- A

+0.8 [that is, quite close to my thoughts about this matter.]

Edit - the main thing that I believe I'll stick with a Canon 50mm prime with (rather than a Sigma, or other 3rd party lens) is that there have been slight AF inconsistencies with 3rd party lenses, which is crucial for my style of 50mm shallow depth of field photography.....

Thanks for saving me some typing time, ahsanford

 

[Ruined]

Personally I believe the 50mm IS will be f/1.8... It would match the trend of the 24mm/28mm/35mm IS lenses.

And, a patent for a Canon 50mm f/1.8 IS actually exists (there is no f/1.4 IS patent I am aware of):
http://egami.blog.so-net.ne.jp/2013-07-24

Also, the 50mm f/1.8 IS will be a different beast than the Canon 50mm f/1.2L, but it will likely replace the Canon 50mm f/1.4 and/or f/1.8 II.

 

[Mr_Canuck]

No, but there's a 55-200 for the obscure M mount, not available in North America. Year of the lens.

(But if they do cough up a 50/1.8 or faster with IS, it might be the first item I've ever pre-ordered.)

 

[ahsanford]

(But if they do cough up a 50/1.8 or faster with IS, it might be the first item I've ever pre-ordered.)

They have to and they will. The question is when, at what max aperture, and how much it will cost.

Personally, I'm also a little curious to see which 50 they are replacing with this IS marvel. Before the refreshes started, there were roughly two prime price points below the L lenses:

Group 1: Squeaky Cheapo Simple

EF 24 F/2.8 (non-USM)
EF 28 F/2.8 (non-USM)
EF 35 F/2 (non-USM)
EF 50 F/1.8 (non-USM) and there were a few versions of this one if memory serves

Group 2: Better But Not Best

EF 20mm F/2.8 USM
EF 28mm F/1.8 USM
EF 50mm F/1.4 USM (not modern USM, but still way better than the AF speed of Group 1)
EF 85mm F/1.8 USM
EF 100mm F/2 USM

Red text = what was obsoleted as a result of the non-L IS refreshes.

So, Ruined is right, now that I look at it: F/1.8 is likely to be the aperture of the new 50mm IS lens if everything is held consistent with the other non-L IS refreshes.

But...

The nifty fifty for $125 has a valuable price point for the business, and most of the people screaming for this 50 IS lens want it as much for sharpness/AF/general improvement reasons as the IS crowd -- and it's logical to assume that those with this pent up demand have left the nifty fifty for either the Sigma F/1.4 or Canon F/1.4 a long time ago. So the logical lens it should replace is the 20 year old 50mm F/1.4 USM from Group 2, right?

- A

 

[Marsu42]

For the 87th time, Canon is working on an EF 50mm F/(no one knows) IS USM. Going to happen. Done deal.

Prey, where is your source of Canon insight? Or is it just logic that also says that the 35L2 is a done deal after they updated the 24L1? Or that a 24-70L-IS is bound to happen sooner or later?

Canon is working on a lot of things, patents and pre-production samples. But that doesn't mean at all that a timely release will be ack'ed by their marketing department. I agree that it sounds plausible that these prime IS holes are filled with products, but looking at [CR] rumors you really never know.

 

[Renaissance]

Thanks for all the replies guys, very insightful and entertaining!

I too am very curious as to see what Canon will do with their 50mm segment.
The 50mm 1.8 will probably remain the entry level lens of choice for low light / aperture shooting.

As it is, people buy the 50L when the 50 1.4 creates the same image / effects basically.
The 50L just has better build quality and weather sealing. (And 1.2) For those that want those extras.

If anything, it would be exciting to see Canon going up against the competition by making their 50mm IS a 1.4.
Then perhaps, down the line, they'll push for an even better update to the 50L (like another f1.0 maybe?)

 

[ahsanford]

For the 87th time, Canon is working on an EF 50mm F/(no one knows) IS USM. Going to happen. Done deal.

Prey, where is your source of Canon insight? Or is it just logic that also says that the 35L2 is a done deal after they updated the 24L1? Or that a 24-70L-IS is bound to happen sooner or later?

Disregard the CR ratings. These lenses are 20 years old and they are slowly being refreshed. First it was 24/28/35, and I expect the 50, 85 and 100 will get refreshed before too long.

Ruined's point about the Group 1 lenses getting the refresh treatment only has me certain of the 50 getting the refresh/modernization/IS green light as there is a 50 prime in that group. The 85 and 100 could use it but are not part of that uber cheapo group, and my confidence is lower on those.

But it's just my gut plus some patent listings plus the success of competitors in certain focal lengths. It's about as accurate as reading tea leaves, I admit.

- A

 

[mrzero]

I think the consensus here is correct, but I will say this -- I am almost certain that it will be a 50mm 1.8 IS, that the current 50mm 1.8 II will be discontinued (with its entry-level fast prime status handed off to the 40mm), and the current 50mm 1.4 will stay for now (like the 28mm 1.8 alongside the 28mm 2.8 IS).

The 85mm (and higher) IS options are a bit more puzzling. The 135mm 2.8 soft focus has basically been phased out, and that could be an excellent candidate for replacement with IS since it doesn't have USM and the only other 135mm is the non-IS L. There are no similar options at 85 or 100. Both of those non-L lenses are USM, seem to be popular. I could see Canon adding an 85mm IS option at a price point between the USM and the L, maybe at f/2 or f/2.8. I don't know about that for the 100mm, since that slot already has the fast 2 USM, the macro 2.8 USM, and the macro 2.8 IS USM L that is relatively affordable.

And I don't think anybody knows what Canon is going to do with their fast USM non-L primes (the "Group 2" in ahsanford's post above).

 

[ahsanford]

I think the consensus here is correct, but I will say this -- I am almost certain that it will be a 50mm 1.8 IS, that the current 50mm 1.8 II will be discontinued (with its entry-level fast prime status handed off to the 40mm), and the current 50mm 1.4 will stay for now (like the 28mm 1.8 alongside the 28mm 2.8 IS).

The 85mm (and higher) IS options are a bit more puzzling. The 135mm 2.8 soft focus has basically been phased out, and that could be an excellent candidate for replacement with IS since it doesn't have USM and the only other 135mm is the non-IS L. There are no similar options at 85 or 100. Both of those non-L lenses are USM, seem to be popular. I could see Canon adding an 85mm IS option at a price point between the USM and the L, maybe at f/2 or f/2.8. I don't know about that for the 100mm, since that slot already has the fast 2 USM, the macro 2.8 USM, and the macro 2.8 IS USM L that is relatively affordable.

And I don't think anybody knows what Canon is going to do with their fast USM non-L primes (the "Group 2" in ahsanford's post above).

Everything you said makes perfect sense except for obsoleting that nifty fifty. This new USM lens will be 4-5x the price of it, so I have to feel like it will pull the current 50 F/1.4 users much more strongly.

Just a gut feeling on my part, though -- you very well may be right.

- A

 

[Marsu42]

Everything you said makes perfect sense except for obsoleting that nifty fifty.

Absolutely, my guess that there's a long-term bet running between top Canon execs on how long they get away making any money with this and the current CEO guessed "at least until 2020" :->

 

[DRR]

The nifty fifty for $125 has a valuable price point for the business, and most of the people screaming for this 50 IS lens want it as much for sharpness/AF/general improvement reasons as the IS crowd -- and it's logical to assume that those with this pent up demand have left the nifty fifty for either the Sigma F/1.4 or Canon F/1.4 a long time ago. So the logical lens it should replace is the 20 year old 50mm F/1.4 USM from Group 2, right?

I would say a new 50mm would replace the 50mm 1.4.

They might replace it with a 50mm f/1.8 IS or a 50mm f/1.4 IS. I could see either happening. In the former, you lose 2/3 a stop at the expense of better build quality and IS. In the latter, you update the existing 1.4 and adds IS.

In either example... I don't think they ever obsolete the plastic fantastic. It's Canon's ultimate gateway drug. It's the first step in turning all those users T3's and XSi's with 18-55s they buy at Target, into people who post on gear forums and look at MTF charts all day. 50mm 1.8 was my first prime, I still use it to this day. It's a cheap and easy introduction into what you can do with a fast lens and how beautiful your shots can be.

 

[ahsanford]

I would say a new 50mm would replace the 50mm 1.4.

They might replace it with a 50mm f/1.8 IS or a 50mm f/1.4 IS. I could see either happening. In the former, you lose 2/3 a stop at the expense of better build quality and IS. In the latter, you update the existing 1.4 and adds IS.

In either example... I don't think they ever obsolete the plastic fantastic. It's Canon's ultimate gateway drug. It's the first step in turning all those users T3's and XSi's with 18-55s they buy at Target, into people who post on gear forums and look at MTF charts all day. 50mm 1.8 was my first prime, I still use it to this day. It's a cheap and easy introduction into what you can do with a fast lens and how beautiful your shots can be.

+1

That's spot on. Many will say 2/3 of a stop is a big deal to give up, but hell, I'd buy that 50 IS even if it was F/2.

- A

 

[mrzero]

Regarding the nifty fifty, I just think that Canon is showing a clear trend away from the wide aperture lenses as entry level. I'm not saying they are going to announce tomorrow that the current 1.8 is out of stock everywhere. I just think that production will quietly be stopped and once the current stock runs out, it will be gone. The 50mm 1.8 originally was meant to be used with film cameras where you sometimes couldn't get anything unless you had 1.8 light. Now we have comparatively insane ISO capabilities. You don't need 1.8 to get a viewable picture. The only reason to have 1.8 is the depth of field and bokeh. I think Canon would rather use the 40mm 2.8 as the "gateway" lens to that, because 1.8 is not easy to work with. After they've sold you the pancake at $150ish and you've figured out how depth of field and focusing works, then they sell you the 50mm 1.4 or the 1.8 IS at $350 or $550.

Seriously, this is Canon. Do you really believe they want to keep offering us a great deal on a cheap lens, when they can offer us a good deal on an affordable lens (the 40) and a rebate/MAP deal on a second (one of the 50s)? I would love to see a 50mm 1.4 with IS added, but I think that is wishful thinking. I just looked at B&H for the rest of the 50mm full-frame lenses with IS, and there aren't any. So Canon is going to do whatever the heck they want, because this is going to be a unique product. Because they can't add IS to a 1.4 and compete with the new Sigma Art or the Zeiss Otus on sharpenss and image quality, because it would cost too much. I would have also rather seen the 28mm IS at 1.8 rather than 2.8, but it didn't happen that way. They even went so far as to have the IS wide primes at 24mm 2.8 and 28mm 2.8, rather than create a meaningful distinction between the two (i.e. wider but slower, faster but less wide).

Which is just a long way of saying that I think they are going to cull the "Group 1" non-USM primes in this IS update, and then we'll see something else happen to the "Group 2" USM primes (good or bad, I don't know).

Also, I think that the Sigma Art 50, the Zeiss Otus, and Nikon's 58mm recent offerings have pushed Canon's IS update back here. Canon wants to let some of the hype die down before they get out there. Because people are clearly clamoring for this thing and complaining about the lack of qualify 50mm options in Canon's lineup.