Are These The EOS 7D Mark II Specifications?

[LetTheRightLensIn]

a foveon sensor does not need an AA filter because it does not use a bayer pattern.

Of course a foveon sensor needs an AA filter (unless it's like say maybe 60MP+ APS-C or something).

Wikipedia disagrees ;D

I was under the impression that the Foveon sensors shipped without AA filters, though I wouldn't swear to it.

Why would foveon not need AA filters? It doesn't make sense. Take a black and white LCD and make it 24" and draw black lines on white. Make it have 800x600 resolution. You don't think you'd see jaggies all over unless you applied AA?

Sure some foveon ship without AA filters, so do some Bayer, it doesn't mean it's ideal.

 

[CarlMillerPhoto]

As others have said....yawn. I'll be so disappointed in Canon if they use the same sensor as the 70D.

 

[MichaelHodges]

But your backtracking now. Your switching the problem your complaining about. Now it's the lower keeper rate, instead of the supposed waxy appearance. I will happily agree that the 7D had AF problems. It had inconsistent lock-on rates, and had an inherent jitter. But that is an entirely different argument, and has nothing to do with the supposed "waxy" appearance that the 7D, based on your otherwise unqualified statements, simply has...period. (It only sometimes gets waxy at really high ISO...however I think LTRLI has a better explanation for it...split green CFA.)

It's all part of the same package: a lower keeper rate compared to my other DSLR's with the same lens set.

I don't want to share RAWs for some of my better works, these are photos I'm working on selling these days

Good luck.

however my entire point is that out of camera IQ isn't the end-all-be-all here.

Within the context of these tech discussions, it most certainly is. All of these posts, all of these feature-craving threads are a hive-mind arch meant to cheer on the ultimate goal: the elimination of post processing.

I've been explicitly making the argument that regardless of what impact an AA filter might have, it doesn't matter in the end. Apply a little sharpening...and bam, any softness attributed to the AA filter is simply gone.

That can be said about every IQ deficiency ever known to photography: Why improve DR when you can shoot brackets? Why improve noise in RAW when there are so many software programs? Why have IS when you can use a tripod?

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

There is nothing wrong with having more points.

For me, there is. It makes the viewfinder too fussy for my tastes.

For me.

For me.

For me.

If you find different great. You are not absolutely correct.

Broad church and all that.

If the 7D 2 has a dedicated AF processor like the 7D, then swell. If the VF overlays can mimick the 19 point array then great. We are all happy happy bunnies.

Neither you or I are correct or wrong. This is why I prefer photography forums to gear forums.

The 7D had too low AF point density. They were all spaced far apart so for soccer you'd use one point and it would be harder to get it tracked perfectly, but then you'd add helpers but they be too far out, farther out than one 1 series or even the 5D2 and they'd be too grabby and prone to grab stuff too far out of the actual target.

The 7D2 if it has all these points shoul dhave much better AI Servo just from the density alone.

 

[Lee Jay]

a foveon sensor does not need an AA filter because it does not use a bayer pattern.

Of course a foveon sensor needs an AA filter (unless it's like say maybe 60MP+ APS-C or something).

Wikipedia disagrees ;D

I was under the impression that the Foveon sensors shipped without AA filters, though I wouldn't swear to it.

They are. That's part of why they produce lousy images full of artifacts.

 

[dtaylor]

??? Where are you getting these numbers????

Imaging Resource tested the 70D using Imatest before they decided to cut costs by quoting DxO for DR measurements. The 70D has 13 stops of DR in RAW.

Naturally it's going to have more shadow noise then Exmor and therefore less latitude (ability to push the shadows up), though it's not that dramatic if you actually use the NR sliders in ACR.

I am deeply disappointed that Imaging Resource is abandoning Imatest for DxO. It leaves us without a reviewer who performs consistent, valid, photographic DR tests. (DPReview has basically dropped their "ACR best" testing and reports JPEG.) Future comments based on DxO SNR nonsense are going to be 10x what they are now.

 

[pablo]

The 7D had too low AF point density. They were all spaced far apart so for soccer you'd use one point and it would be harder to get it tracked perfectly, but then you'd add helpers but they be too far out, farther out than one 1 series or even the 5D2 and they'd be too grabby and prone to grab stuff too far out of the actual target.

The 7D2 if it has all these points shoul dhave much better AI Servo just from the density alone.

But thats where the AF behaviour controls come in. I spent about three weeks worth of shoots getting my 7D to play nice to the point where I knew that for most scenarios with the right behaviour on my part it would give me a pretty much 100% focus hit rate (composition, exposure, facial experessions not so much)

Ok let it have 65 af points thats great. just so long as it also has a dedicated af processor and isn't slowing things down elsewhere.

Still not sure where the film analogy came in. Petulance I think.

 

[dtaylor]

Why would foveon not need AA filters?

"Shipping" and "needing" are two different things. I haven't had enough time with a Foveon sensor to know whether or not they need an AA filter, but I believe they do not ship with them.

 

[weixing]

Hi,
The specification look good to me:
1) No GPS - fine with me... I already had an external GPS unit which capture GPS signal way faster than 6D GPS and got map function.
2) No wifi - not importance to me... may be they got built in radio trigger, that's why cannot put wifi??
3) No 4K - no problem... running out of hard disk space, 1080p is good enough for my use... 1080p file size is already too large for me, but I do hope they had 1080p 1:1 video crop mode.
4) 20.2MP - enough for me, but I do hope they can improve the high ISO performance by at least half a stop compare to 70D and I might change my 6D to it.
5) Hope 7D2 had a silent shutter mode... very useful for shooting shy birds.

Hope the pricing will be close to 6D, so I can just sell my 6D and get this one without spending too much...

Have a nice day.

 

[dtaylor]

But thats where the AF behaviour controls come in. I spent about three weeks worth of shoots getting my 7D to play nice to the point where I knew that for most scenarios with the right behaviour on my part it would give me a pretty much 100% focus hit rate (composition, exposure, facial experessions not so much)

This was the issue with the 7D on two fronts. Processing required some learning as well. It seems like everyone I knew in person who initially complained about IQ wanted to carry over settings from their 20D or 5D/5D2, as if the ACR sliders were locked.

I had a similar experience with AF. You had to have the right settings for the subject.

Ok let it have 65 af points thats great. just so long as it also has a dedicated af processor and isn't slowing things down elsewhere.

The 7D had a dedicated AF CPU. I can pretty much guarantee that the 7D2 does as well, or that the dual Digic 6 processors have enough bandwidth that handling AF is not an issue.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

??? Where are you getting these numbers????

Imaging Resource tested the 70D using Imatest before they decided to cut costs by quoting DxO for DR measurements. The 70D has 13 stops of DR in RAW.

Naturally it's going to have more shadow noise then Exmor and therefore less latitude (ability to push the shadows up), though it's not that dramatic if you actually use the NR sliders in ACR.

I am deeply disappointed that Imaging Resource is abandoning Imatest for DxO. It leaves us without a reviewer who performs consistent, valid, photographic DR tests. (DPReview has basically dropped their "ACR best" testing and reports JPEG.) Future comments based on DxO SNR nonsense are going to be 10x what they are now.

I think the IR tests are the nonsense. Unless they were normalizing to 5MP or something.
Even for their regular tests there scenes and lighting have changed again and again.

 

[c.d.embrey]

Canon seems to just no get it. ??? It's not 2004 any more. Many Pro Editorial and Advertising Photographers, don't just want WiFi, in many cases they Can'T Do Their Job without WiFi.

With so much Professional Photography going direct-to-web-site, speed isn't the main thing, it's the only thing.-

 

[pablo]

Canon seems to just no get it. ??? It's not 2004 any more. Many Pro Editorial and Advertising Photographers, don't just want WiFi, in many cases they Can'T Do Their Job without WiFi.

With so much Professional Photography going direct-to-web-site, speed isn't the main thing, it's the only thing.-

Straight from the camera? You want to run lightroom on a 3.2 inch screen?

Most sports togs run everything through a laptop, and most of the software isn't adobe. And laptops have usb ports for cards and wifi chips.

I'd pay less for a good camera that just takes photos thanks.

 

[Lee Jay]

In the past, it was said this would have some special video features. Seems like servo mode for video is something that the 70D already has, at least in part, and 1080p60 is certainly nothing close to "special" as it exists on earlier Canon compacts, so where are the special video features?

 

[dtaylor]

I think the IR tests are the nonsense. Unless they were normalizing to 5MP or something.
Even for their regular tests there scenes and lighting have changed again and again.

Oh boy here we go...

* The Imatest DR test is performed using a step chart. It has nothing to do with Imaging Resource's scene tests.

* "Normalizing" has nothing to do with photographic DR and does not change it in the least.

* You, I, or anyone else can personally verify Imatest results by simply looking at a transmission step wedge shot.

* DxO measures SNR which does NOT directly translate to photographic dynamic range.

* We cannot verify DxO's results because they are run through a 'black box' algorithm.

* DxO's results generally do not correspond to results obtained using a transmission step wedge. Put another way: you can see with your own two eyes that a 70D yields more DR then they claim, and that an Exmor sensor yields less.

 

[Steve]

Straight from the camera? You want to run lightroom on a 3.2 inch screen?

Most sports togs run everything through a laptop, and most of the software isn't adobe. And laptops have usb ports for cards and wifi chips.

Do they carry their laptops on the sidelines, pull their cards and upload in between plays? Because, personally, I think it would be pretty rad to have the ability to tap a menu item on the display and have that upload a photo/photos to a laptop or straight to the editing desk rather than waiting for a timeout to rush back to the computer, pull the card, copy the files and then upload to the editing desk and risk missing action.

I'd pay less for a good camera that just takes photos thanks.

This is just absurd. How much of the cost of any modern electronic device is tied up in wifi in this The Year of Our Lord Two Thousand and Fourteen? Please.

 

[Zv]

Does make you wonder though, if these end up being the final specs, why didn't they bang out a 7D replacement right after the 70D was announced? Why did we have to wait (still waiting) for a 2fps bump from the previous model and what seems like the exact same sensor from the 70D? There is nothing groundbreaking here, which is prob the reason a lot of people are feeling a bit peeved. It's the lowest end of what we expected. The bare minimum. Still, it'll more than likely be an awesome camera for sports and wildlife.

But will it still be awesome in 5 years time?? ???

 

[Lee Jay]

* DxO measures SNR which does NOT directly translate to photographic dynamic range.

DxO measures, but does not directly report, well capacity and SnR.

The method of determining DR from that is shown here:

http://sensorgen.info/Calculations.html

 

[dtaylor]

In the past, it was said this would have some special video features. Seems like servo mode for video is something that the 70D already has, at least in part, and 1080p60 is certainly nothing close to "special" as it exists on earlier Canon compacts, so where are the special video features?

I'm a stills photographer so I don't really care either way, but...if Canon hopes to gain rather then lose market share in this segment of the video market they really need to have 4k. And stop relying on hackers to put in critical features (no offense to the amazing ML team).

This is more of a shock to me then the sensor. I would have loved to see a multilayer sensor leap, but I'm not one of the people who is going to shed a tear if the 7D2 "only" has a 70D or moderately improved 70D sensor. I'm not mesmerized by DxO and I know most of what people fight over online is meaningless in the real world.

With apologies to Ansel Adams: There is nothing worse than a slightly higher DR image with slightly less shadow noise of a fuzzy concept.

That said...if these are the specs I will likely spend my money on other things and not upgrade my 7D for a while. The specs are solid, just not enough above what I have right now for what I do.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

In the past, it was said this would have some special video features. Seems like servo mode for video is something that the 70D already has, at least in part, and 1080p60 is certainly nothing close to "special" as it exists on earlier Canon compacts, so where are the special video features?

apparently the new ultra fast dual pixel video af mark ii (perhaps it will have built-in focusing aids and zebra and such too?)


seems a bit lame to leave out 4k though considering the product shelf life of the 7 series and the current competition