Camera setup for dental clinic

[NancyP]

I have the 60D plus EF-S 60mm f/2.8, and this is a good combination for general macro (I am not a dentist, I am a pathologist, so my specimens are sitting on a copy stand - I don't need image stabilization: IS, OS, VC are the brand terms for stabilization). For hand-held, the Canon 100mm f/2.8 L IS ($1,050.00) may be a good choice due to the IS, and also consider third party dedicated 1:1-capable macro lenses with IS in the 90-150mm range, Sigma 105mm f/2.8 OS ($670.00) and Tamron 90mm f/2.8 VC($750.00). Do the patients object to flash? Your camera sensor will be 11 to 12 inches from the patient, with the lens being about 5" long, the front of the lens will be 6" to 7" from the patient's face for 1:1 image (you may not need 1:1 for an APS-C camera, 1:2 may be fine). If this is too cramped for you, go to the Sigma 150mm f/2.8 OS, wihich gives you 9" between front of lens and patient for 1:1. The 90-105mm lenses are lighter weight. By all means skip the 180 mm macros, which are quite heavy and rather intimidating - I have the Canon 180mm f/3.5L, and it is a beast.

For lighting, I shall defer to the dentists. A ring light would seem like the obvious choice. There's lots of different choices. The ceiling light or a headlamp would serve as a necessary angle fill light. Get a store-bought solution. Insect/flower/coin macrophotographers often custom build a flash diffuser from an existing hot-shoe flash , but you shouldn't, because you want a professional appearing flash rig, not one made out of a Pringles can.

 

[mackguyver]

By all means skip the 180 mm macros, which are quite heavy and rather intimidating - I have the Canon 180mm f/3.5L, and it is a beast.

Did you know that the 180mm f/3.5L was actually designed for dentists and supposedly is available in Japan as a kit with the lens, macro ring adapter, and MR-14EX II Macro Ring Lite?

From CPN:
"Originally designed for dentists, the 180mm focal length allows them to get life-size magnification of a patient’s teeth without having to get right into their mouth."

 

[Perio]

Thanks for all your suggestions, guys! I talked to current residents today, and most of them use crop Nikon bodies with Nikon 105 micro/macro lens and a macro ring flash. Sorry for a silly question, but would 100mm L macro lens fit into a Canon's crop body, like 7d or 70d?

Please let me know if anybody has a good copy of 100L.

 

[Perio]

I'm thinking maybe at some point we should vote for having a buy/sell forum for CR members, like on fredmiranda? Not sure whether admin would want that though

 

[Vivid Color]

Thanks for all your suggestions, guys! I talked to current residents today, and most of them use crop Nikon bodies with Nikon 105 micro/macro lens and a macro ring flash. Sorry for a silly question, but would 100mm L macro lens fit into a Canon's crop body, like 7d or 70d?

Please let me know if anybody has a good copy of 100L.

Yes, you may put a 100 mm L macro lens on a Canon crop body.

I have a fantastically sharp copy of the 100 mm L macro but it's not for sale.

 

[Daniel 78d]

The best choice will probably be the rebel t3i dental kit from b&h. It comes with a t3i that has an articulated screen, a 60mm macro and a ring flash. I can't find a way to connect a shortcut but I just looked at it.

 

[KitsVancouver]

Thanks for all your suggestions, guys! I talked to current residents today, and most of them use crop Nikon bodies with Nikon 105 micro/macro lens and a macro ring flash. Sorry for a silly question, but would 100mm L macro lens fit into a Canon's crop body, like 7d or 70d?

Please let me know if anybody has a good copy of 100L.

They probably have crop bodies because no one told them the difference between crop and FF.

Yes, the 100L will fit on any Canon body with an EF mount. It will fit on both the 7D and the 70D. The crop body does give you some more working distance.

If you are going to use the camera for photos other than dental, then you should consider a FF body.

I wouldn't look at cost too much as you can write off all this gear.

 

[tolusina]

...They probably have crop bodies because no one told them the difference between crop and FF....

.....I wouldn't look at cost too much as you can write off all this gear.

Yes, this ^^.
---
I'll start by stating that I know absolutely nothing about medical imaging.
I do know that I'd really prefer my medical professional not make surgical decisions based on photographs with fun house mirror type distortions.
To avoid visual compression or fish eye effects one must use a near normal or natural focal length, that natural or normal focal length being one that's as close as possible the sensor's (or film's) diagonal.

I looked up specs for a 7D that uses a typically sized Canon 1.6 crop factor sensor with dimensions of 22.3 x 14.9 mm, diagonal of that sensor is approximately 27mm.
I'm unaware of any macro lenses with a focal length near 27mm.

Diagonal of a full frame 36 x 24mm sensor is approximately 43mm.

On a B&H listing of Canon mount macro lenses

there is a Canon EF 50mm f/2.5 Compact Macro Lens

a Sigma Normal 50mm f/2.8 EX DG Macro Autofocus Lens

and a Canon MP-E 65mm f/2.8 1-5x Macro Photo Lens

All with focal lengths fairly close to the 43mm full frame diagonal, for sure a lot closer to the 43mm full frame diagonal than the 27mm crop diagonal.
- - -
Note that the Canon EF-S 60mm f/2.8 Macro USM Lens and the Tamron G005 SP AF60mm f/2.0 Di II LD 1:1 Macro Lens are both for APS-C crop sensor bodies and cannot be used on full frame bodies.
- - -
Regarding concerns about how close to a patient you'll need to be with these shorter focal lengths, um, you will soon be close enough as to be in the patient's mouth when actually working, is closeness of a camera really relevant?

Regarding LED ring lights, I've made and used several. As they were not real bright, a steady camera and subject are both helpful. They did indeed cast even and mostly shadowless light.
Being continuous light, you get a very good idea what your photo will look like through the finder or live view before triggering the shutter unlike with flash where you find out after.
This might be a consideration towards minimizing patient discomfort by avoiding multiple flash discharges as you dial in the exposure.
Then too, likely, once you've a small bit of experience you'll know what settings work and will need but a single flash exposure.

 

[Perio]

It's always like that let me ask you a question. I've heard that normally functioning 100L should not make any sound while IS is working. Is that true? Does your copy make any sound when you try to focus? Thanks!

Thanks for all your suggestions, guys! I talked to current residents today, and most of them use crop Nikon bodies with Nikon 105 micro/macro lens and a macro ring flash. Sorry for a silly question, but would 100mm L macro lens fit into a Canon's crop body, like 7d or 70d?

Please let me know if anybody has a good copy of 100L.

Yes, you may put a 100 mm L macro lens on a Canon crop body.

I have a fantastically sharp copy of the 100 mm L macro but it's not for sale.

 

[Perio]

Thanks for the info, mackguyver, I didn't know that. I just looked at the specs, and 180L is almost twice as heavy as 100L (~1100g vs. 650g). Do you know how much more bulky 180L is as compared to 100L?

By all means skip the 180 mm macros, which are quite heavy and rather intimidating - I have the Canon 180mm f/3.5L, and it is a beast.

Did you know that the 180mm f/3.5L was actually designed for dentists and supposedly is available in Japan as a kit with the lens, macro ring adapter, and MR-14EX II Macro Ring Lite?

From CPN:
"Originally designed for dentists, the 180mm focal length allows them to get life-size magnification of a patient’s teeth without having to get right into their mouth."

 

[wickidwombat]

i'd look at the eos m and ef adapter + 100 L macro due to the IS

eos m is dirt cheap great quality nice touch screen and with the IS on the macro its easily going to be hand holdable

 

[Vivid Color]

Thanks for the info, mackguyver, I didn't know that. I just looked at the specs, and 180L is almost twice as heavy as 100L (~1100g vs. 650g). Do you know how much more bulky 180L is as compared to 100L?

By all means skip the 180 mm macros, which are quite heavy and rather intimidating - I have the Canon 180mm f/3.5L, and it is a beast.

Did you know that the 180mm f/3.5L was actually designed for dentists and supposedly is available in Japan as a kit with the lens, macro ring adapter, and MR-14EX II Macro Ring Lite?

From CPN:
"Originally designed for dentists, the 180mm focal length allows them to get life-size magnification of a patient’s teeth without having to get right into their mouth."

I've photographed flowers with Canon's 180L macro and it is a fantastic lens. It is also VERY heavy. The 100mm L macro on a crop body will give you an effective reach of 160mm at a fraction of the weight and price.

 

[Vivid Color]

It's always like that let me ask you a question. I've heard that normally functioning 100L should not make any sound while IS is working. Is that true? Does your copy make any sound when you try to focus? Thanks!

Thanks for all your suggestions, guys! I talked to current residents today, and most of them use crop Nikon bodies with Nikon 105 micro/macro lens and a macro ring flash. Sorry for a silly question, but would 100mm L macro lens fit into a Canon's crop body, like 7d or 70d?

Please let me know if anybody has a good copy of 100L.

Yes, you may put a 100 mm L macro lens on a Canon crop body.

I have a fantastically sharp copy of the 100 mm L macro but it's not for sale.

First, I apologize for not getting back to you sooner. My copy of the 100L does make a very small sound when focusing. Whether this is the motor used for focusing or the IS, I really don't know. Would a patient hear this? Possibly to probably given their hearing. But, I would say it's a sound that isn't nearly as loud or as high pitched as the sounds of other dental equipment.

 

[IMG_0001]

Neither a dentist or a macro specialist, but I think that if you go below 100mm equivalent FL and getting some light in the mouth will be a challenge. Longer might result in too much compression and unnatural look. I'd say stay with something similar to what others do. Ther must be a reason why manufacturers made similar kits.

 

[Perio]

No apologies needed, thank you for your interest in the topic. The only reason I've asked about the IS sound is to know how loud is the good fully functional copy of 100L is. I've heard it should make only very little noise. I'm sure patients don't really care about that sound, while they are having surgery in their mouth.

Thank you all for your suggestions. I'll be getting 100L and a crop body. Not sure about flash though, I may get the newest Canon MR14-EX ii ($550) or a used MR14-EX i ($400).

It's always like that let me ask you a question. I've heard that normally functioning 100L should not make any sound while IS is working. Is that true? Does your copy make any sound when you try to focus? Thanks!

Thanks for all your suggestions, guys! I talked to current residents today, and most of them use crop Nikon bodies with Nikon 105 micro/macro lens and a macro ring flash. Sorry for a silly question, but would 100mm L macro lens fit into a Canon's crop body, like 7d or 70d?

Please let me know if anybody has a good copy of 100L.

Yes, you may put a 100 mm L macro lens on a Canon crop body.

I have a fantastically sharp copy of the 100 mm L macro but it's not for sale.

First, I apologize for not getting back to you sooner. My copy of the 100L does make a very small sound when focusing. Whether this is the motor used for focusing or the IS, I really don't know. Would a patient hear this? Possibly to probably given their hearing. But, I would say it's a sound that isn't nearly as loud or as high pitched as the sounds of other dental equipment.