Canon Announces That The Powerful Professional Full-Frame EOS R3 Mirrorless Camera Is On Its Way

H. Jones

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I‘m thinking the same thing: a stacked variant of the R5.

I do think, though, that Canon might have just made the new sensor 50 megapixels just to add a bump while developing the tech more, since it is a different sensor. I know it will have incredible video, but it seemed to me like the R5's sensor was designed around having full frame 8K raw, whereas Canon barely mentioned video once in this development announcement. If I'm not mistaken, 50 megapixels on the A1 left that camera with a 1.13x crop other than downsampled 8K. Not being 100% full-frame wouldn't be a show-stopper for the R3, whereas any crop would have defeated the R5's marketing as a full-frame 8K 30 fps raw full-AF camera.
 
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Fletchahh

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I'd love to have the R3 but probably too expensive and I can't afford the superteles , maybe the R7 could be a budget version with smaller body with built-in grip and stacked crop senser - I can but dream and wait to see what magic Canon comes up with

I could take or leave the integrated grip, but I hope that the R7 is released, or at least announced this year. I don't know the technical hurldes or added cost associated, but maybe they could add quad pixel autofocus if it comes out after or around the same time as the R1.
 
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SteveC

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The R5 cropped is only 17mp which is less than my 7Dii and a high mp full frame RF camera will be even more expensive than the R5 and will create huge files which will be a problem to handle.
A modified R6 with perhaps the 90D's 32mp sensor would be very easy to make and be perfect for Bird photography enthusiasts like myself and I would buy one for sure if it's a similar price to the R6
Bizarre how many people have an objection to any crop sensor RF as if it's spoiling things somehow and no we don't want RF-s lenses only full frame EF and RF telephoto lenses
Canon can easily (and probably will) make a crop sensor version of the R6 and it should be a big seller.

Actually when you run the R5 in cropped mode, it reduces the file sizes accordingly.

Though that doesn't negate your point about the expense of the camera!

It might be hard for some people to gain sympathy for that complaint if they own some of those $>10K primes, however!

On a not entirely unrelated topic, I've spotted what I believe to be an eagle's nest by the highway I commute on, so I might just set up tripod and M6-II and the 100-400 L II in a nearby turnout someday to see what comes of that--it'd be my first attempt at birding. Crop sensor camera and a full frame tele.
 

H. Jones

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I could take or leave the integrated grip, but I hope that the R7 is released, or at least announced this year. I don't know the technical hurldes or added cost associated, but maybe they could add quad pixel autofocus if it comes out after or around the same time as the R1.

The APS-C EOS 70D was the camera that introduced Dual-Pixel AF, followed shortly after by the 7D Mark II. I could totally see Canon introduce Quad-Pixel AF on the R7.

Although I'd love the R7 to be a crop version of whatever crazy global-shutter quad pixel sensor Canon might have for the R1, I think it's more likely to be something like a quad-pixel stacked sensor. Clearly with the R3 Canon believes the stacked-sensor design is going to be great for sports, and I can't imagine any global shutter will be cheap, even in crop. I'm more inclined to believe a global shutter will be reserved for the top of the line for the near future, and that 3-4 years from now the R5 Mark II will still be a stacked-sensor QPAF design vs global shutter.
 

canonnews

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7Dii fans like me don't want to "upgrade" to full frame we want a crop sensor RF camera similar to the R6 for higher pixel density.
The R5 cropped is only 17mp which is less than my 7Dii and a high mp full frame RF camera will be even more expensive than the R5 and will create huge files which will be a problem to handle.
A modified R6 with perhaps the 90D's 32mp sensor would be very easy to make and be perfect for Bird photography enthusiasts like myself and I would buy one for sure if it's a similar price to the R6
Bizarre how many people have an objection to any crop sensor RF as if it's spoiling things somehow and no we don't want RF-s lenses only full frame EF and RF telephoto lenses
Canon can easily (and probably will) make a crop sensor version of the R6 and it should be a big seller.
I don't think many people have a problem with a R birder camera. I think people just don't think that Canon is going to make an APS-C camera outside of that, so if you buy it.. good .. buy 2 or 3 because it may never get a Mark II.

unfortunately it's a pretty low volume camera, and is going to be considerably more expensive than you think, because without any RF-S lenses, it's ONLY for birders and telephoto starved people.

The 7D and the 90D series were never that, so, no, it will never be a big seller.
 
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canonnews

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Well, that's why I wrote it. Most people think opposite, but that doesn't make much sense to me.

First of all, this is following very close to the release of the 1DXIII, and it doesn't sound like it is meant to replace that.

Secondly, with the R5, Canon has demonstrated they have technology for very fast sensor-readout now, even using non-stacked design. The readout speed from R5's 45MP sensor is actually very similar to the 12MP sensor in Sony A7S3 and to the 24MP stacked sensors in the A9II (and much much faster than the 20MP sensor in R6/1DXIII). So why waste stacked sensor design on a low megapixel sensor, unless it is for a completely insane fast camera? And yes, the promised 30fps is really fast, but not insane fast.

My guess is R3 could be using a stacked variant of R5's 45MP sensor design.



Yes, we are all guessing and speculating :)
that's a little impossible.
the reason you stack is that you split the sensor in half essentially. the top substrate is the photodiodes, the second substrate is the electronic guts.
the R5 has all that on one substrate, it's design is inherently much different than a stacked sensor. a stacked sensor because you can use different design rules on the bottom substrate is usually packed more denser with electronics, and also allows for more electronics to be included, then you ever could on a single substrate.

here's a cross section of a stacked sensor from one of Canon's patents.. as you can see it's a pretty complex beast.
650650p953EDNmainJPA_430014519_000004.gif
 

Fletchahh

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I don't think many people have a problem with a R birder camera. I think people just don't think that Canon is going to make an APS-C camera outside of that, so if you buy it.. good .. buy 2 or 3 because it may never get a Mark II.

unfortunately it's a pretty low volume camera, and is going to be considerably more expensive than you think, because without any RF-S lenses, it's ONLY for birders and telephoto starved people.

The 7D and the 90D series were never that, so, no, it will never be a big seller.
I don't expect an R7 to cost as low as the 7D2 (even adjusting for inflation), but unless it's something like $3k I'll preorder it. And even then.... who knows.

I'll be happy to continue solely using my EF lenses for a while, the only RF lens that would tempt me would be a lens that compete with either Sony's 200-600mm or Nikon's 500mm f5.6.

Also, for QPAF on the R7 I think it also depends on how close to the R3 it's released. If they're both released at a similar time and the R7 has QPAF, then why wouldn't have the speedy and expensive R3 got it as well?
 
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privatebydesign

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Gordon Laing, in his video reveal of the R3's announcement, wondered aloud, "I wonder if there's some kind of physical spec limiting all three manufacturers to state 30 fps?"

As it happens, that spec looks like it's the read/write speed of CF Express cards...which are pretty much maxed out by shooting raw 30 FPS at 45 megapixels, depending on the exact file size.

It's such a small sidenote in the video, and I doubt he knows more than we do, but I suddenly really do believe that this camera is 45-ish megapixels. If Canon went for 24 megapixels, why not blow up the FPS even higher as a statement if CF express can handle 60 FPS at 24 megapixels?
That doesn’t really make sense. The fps is not limited to the card write speed but the buffer capabilities, put in a bigger buffer and it will, well, buffer.

If Canon are capable of 40fps, or whatever higher number than 30, they might well be saving that for the R1 if there is one. Canon are saying the R3 is between the R5 and the 1DX III, that implies they will make an ‘R1’. That R1 will have higher fps than the R3.
 
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vladk

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That doesn’t really make sense. The fps is not limited to the card write speed but the buffer capabilities, put in a bigger buffer and it will, well, buffer.
Or use fast enough card with fast interface and you do not need a buffer.
 

EOS 4 Life

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They know they can't compete with Sony's A1 on price/features
I know you are just throwing things out there but R5 with 2 CFX cards and a heatsink or active cooling would mop the floor with A1.
Canon could easily beat A1 at that price if they wanted to.
 

EOS 4 Life

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The APS-C EOS 70D was the camera that introduced Dual-Pixel AF, followed shortly after by the 7D Mark II. I could totally see Canon introduce Quad-Pixel AF on the R7.
Also, RED Komodo is a Super 35 20 MP global shutter and Canon also has Super 35 global shutters in production.
It would not shock me to see a global shutter first appear on an APS-C sensor camera.
 
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I 100% expect Canon to talk about "infinite shutter life" when the R1 gets announced with a global shutter some day. It's a big selling point that the camera would have absolutely 0 moving parts and (basically) just can't break on its own.
It is almost certain to have IBIS so they would have to use at least one or two moving parts for
That unfortunately
 

H. Jones

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It is almost certain to have IBIS so they would have to use at least one or two moving parts for
That unfortunately
True, though it is entirely possible they might leave IBIS out of the R1 simply for durability, and let the R3 be an option for those who want it. It's not unheard of, considering the C70 avoided IBIS. That said, I think a lot of people will be more excited about infinite shutterlife over the possibility of IBIS failures.

Under ideal conditions you could very well see a camera with several dozen million images taken on it and no failures, whereas I've had the rare unfortune of having my 1DX shutter replaced at 400,000 before.
 
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scyrene

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Not random, but arbitrary based on their market segmentations and production capacity & investment.

Who knows, if they actually produced a camera based on thorough market research they might sell even more! I was ready to buy into the Canon MILC range three years ago and... still haven't seen a camera from them that is compelling enough.

Amongst my group of Canon-shooting colleagues, only one has bought an RF camera. One out of twenty is a poor ratio and is simply the result of wilfully ignoring what photographers actually want.

And look at the chorus of shooters crying out for DO lenses. Response? Silence. But here are some non-DO telephotos on which we stuck an RF adapter, be a good consumer and buy them.

Are you honestly claiming they don't do thorough market research? Really??

The rest is just anecdote. One out of twenty of the people you know is meaningless.

The chorus of shooters crying out for DO? A few vocal people on forums, you mean? Funny how you castigate Canon for inadequate research then substitute in something far inferior. There must be a reason why DO hasn't taken off the way some expected or wanted, or perhaps it will when new supertele designs come out - the 600 and 800 f/11 lenses use it, I believe?
 

navastronia

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True, though it is entirely possible they might leave IBIS out of the R1 simply for durability, and let the R3 be an option for those who want it. It's not unheard of, considering the C70 avoided IBIS. That said, I think a lot of people will be more excited about infinite shutterlife over the possibility of IBIS failures.

Under ideal conditions you could very well see a camera with several dozen million images taken on it and no failures, whereas I've had the rare unfortune of having my 1DX shutter replaced at 400,000 before.

I wouldn't be surprised if there's no IBIS in the R3 nor the R1, since Canon could justify dis-including it from both, due to durability. I hope the opposite happens, of course. Global shutter and IBIS in an eventual R1 would be glorious.
 
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scyrene

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Traveler was talking about marketing, not market research.

As far as I can tell, they were saying people want smaller cameras, and none of Canon's current mirrorless (FF?) lineup is small enough. My point is, that person is projecting their personal desire onto "people", and that Canon has done plenty research to determine what the market really wants.