Canon applies for WiFi certification for a number of cameras

dak723

EOS R
Oct 26, 2013
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ahsanford said:
jolyonralph said:
I think it's *highly* unlikely a 6D prosumer model will be the first released. I think it's far more likely to be a $3,000+ mark camera aimed purely at the professional market.

The fact that there are two models could simply be two different engineering tests that are being sent out on trials, but I wonder if it indicates two versions one with, and one without, AA filter. The AA filter thing does still seem to be a "marmite" type affair, with some people absolutely hating it, and some insisting on it.

Disagree. Can you name me the last time anyone started with the pro model?

I could see a pricey offering but not a professional one. They may make some RX1R / Leica Q kind of cash grab of one-percenters with a slick and expensive offering (so yes, perhaps a 5D4 sensor falls in there), but are you really expecting a comprehensive professional feature set? Right out of the gate?

- A

I agree with ahsanford. My guess (and it is just a guess) is the the big demand for mirrorless is with the enthusiast - not the professional. The professional knows that for most pro jobs, the mirrorless is still not on the same level as the DSLR - action shots and battery life to name just two important matters. Mirrorless's appeal seems to be with the more tech minded enthusiast who wants more video features and things like focus peaking, zebras, etc. I would expect to see the lowest end FF first (but priced higher than the 6D II) and then for the Olympic year, a more pro model.
 

jolyonralph

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dak723 said:
I agree with ahsanford. My guess (and it is just a guess) is the the big demand for mirrorless is with the enthusiast - not the professional.

As a non-professional myself I really hope you're right! I certainly can't justify spending $3K+ on a FF Canon mirrorless right now.

But Canon have one chance to enter the FF mirrorless market and they're doing so obviously with Sony and Nikon's yet-to-be-released products in their sights. Sorry, the existing Canon market isn't the issue here because you'll likely continue buying Canon cameras regardless. Canon's beancounters are only interested in how to extend their market share, not to pander to the existing share.

And to do that they have to concentrate on something that's going to have a significant advantage over the rivals.

Sure, price is one effective way of doing this, and a 30 megapixel FF mirrorless for the same cost or less as the Sony A7III would be a winner assuming they're competitive in other features.

But Canon aren't in this for the race to the bottom. I think they'll launch a premium camera first (to take on the A7RIII and maybe A9) and with a price to match.

And this will all need to be out and performing perfectly well before the 2020 Tokyo Olympics. By which time we'll probably see the lower-cost versions out too.
 

ahsanford

Particular Member
Aug 16, 2012
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jolyonralph said:
As a non-professional myself I really hope you're right! I certainly can't justify spending $3K+ on a FF Canon mirrorless right now.

Consider preparing yourself to decouple feature set from price. We may get a largely non-premium feature set and still get charged a premium price for this. It is a first for Canon users, after all.

For instance, we could get a relatively underweight-to-market 6D2 spec'd / control set sort of camera with perhaps 1-2 nice adds (on-chip sensor, 4K, etc.) and they still might hit us up with a 5D4 price tag.

- A
 

jolyonralph

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ahsanford said:
Consider preparing yourself to decouple feature set from price. We may get a largely non-premium feature set and still get charged a premium price for this. It is a first for Canon users, after all.

For instance, we could get a relatively underweight-to-market 6D2 spec'd / control set sort of camera with perhaps 1-2 nice adds (on-chip sensor, 4K, etc.) and they still might hit us up with a 5D4 price tag.

- A

It must be very much in Canon's mind that as the Sony mirrorless cameras get better and better the other thing that is significantly improving is the technology to adapt Canon EF lenses to the FE mount. With Sigma now producing a very good and inexpensive adaptor it actually becomes practical to use your EF lenses with Sony body. I'm using the A7RII with the Metabones IV, neither are the latest combination but I find the EF 24-70 2.8 II works great on it for the majority of photography I want to do - certainly enough that I don't need to pay out for the Sony FE 24-70 lens. And I'm told the latest body and adaptor work even better.

So, Canon shouldn't assume that EF lens owners are stuck with them forever.
 

Talys

Canon 6DII
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Feb 16, 2017
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@jolyon - I'm glad your adapted lens combo is something you're happy with. Personally, the autofocus would drive me nuts on a lens that wasn't very casual use.

In my opinion, if you love Sony, you should just bite the bullet, sell your EF glass and get some workable Sony solution. The new Tamron sounds ideal for you as it is very small.
 

goldenhusky

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Dec 2, 2016
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Punio said:
Decisions decisions. I don't know whether to wait for a FF Mirrorless and have no camera till then. OR get the 5D4 till then and have to lose money on the resell and even worse possibly sell the EF lens if the FF Mirrorless is a new mount.

Unless you are intended to shoot sports or wildlife using 400mm, 500mm, 600mm & 800mm primes, assuming you do not have any Canon lenses or accessories, if I were in your position at this point I will buy in to Sony systems. I do not trust the Sony products completely so I would get Zeiss or sigma lenses. Just my 2 cents
 

jolyonralph

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Talys said:
@jolyon - I'm glad your adapted lens combo is something you're happy with. Personally, the autofocus would drive me nuts on a lens that wasn't very casual use.

I know it's not perfect, yet, but there's absolutely no technical reason why it couldn't be perfect. Autofocus is simply a matter of controlling the motors in the lens to adjust the lens based on focusing information from the camera.

Assuming you know the protocols for the EF lenses (which are pretty well understood now) and for the Sony mount (likewise) it's simply a software issue to adapt one to the other. The only remaining issue is whether the body can focus fast enough.

And generally I only use primes with the A7RII so I'm not really missing the 24-70 much.
 

Talys

Canon 6DII
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Feb 16, 2017
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jolyonralph said:
Talys said:
@jolyon - I'm glad your adapted lens combo is something you're happy with. Personally, the autofocus would drive me nuts on a lens that wasn't very casual use.

I know it's not perfect, yet, but there's absolutely no technical reason why it couldn't be perfect. Autofocus is simply a matter of controlling the motors in the lens to adjust the lens based on focusing information from the camera.

Assuming you know the protocols for the EF lenses (which are pretty well understood now) and for the Sony mount (likewise) it's simply a software issue to adapt one to the other. The only remaining issue is whether the body can focus fast enough.

And generally I only use primes with the A7RII so I'm not really missing the 24-70 much.

There ARE plausible reasons why the autofocus might not be perfect that isn't the fault of the adapters, such as the timing of communications protocols. It may be the case that the adapted lens is fixed to sending X signals at Y interval, but the camera body wants it at Z interval, without the possibility of change on either end. Then, the adapter has to make some electronics decisions, like throw some information out, perhaps resend some old buffered information, etc.

For example, if system #1 wants information at 0.07 seconds and #2 supplies information at 0.06 or 0.08 seconds, you can't square that. Even if it's faster, it is likely impossible for #2 to provide information at 0.06s, pause for 0.01s, and send another piece of information.

Obviously, it should be possible for the camera body manufacturer to fix that by making their body 100% compatible with another system in an emulation mode, but I can't really imagine that this is a priority for Sony.
 
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